Who do you MOST blame for the team's issues?

[DaFace]

Do we need another thread to gripe about last night? Of course we do! So here's one more.

Pick an option or add your own.

[DJJasonp]

INB4POLL: coaches/management are responsible for hiring and putting players in positions to make plays.

We did not see a whole hell of a lot of that on either side of the ball last night.

[rabblerouser]

They scored 38 points on us.

In fact...every team has scored 30 on us this season except Cleveland, who could "only' muster 29.

So, it's the defense. Specifically, the front four is getting buttfucked on almost every down.

[mr. tegu]

The unit to blame is the offense. No one, coaches included, was good except Kelce and I guess the line was fine.

[Chiefspants]

DEFENSE BABY

[rabblerouser]

INB4POLL: coaches/management are responsible for hiring and putting players in positions to make plays.

We did not see a whole hell of a lot of that on either side of the ball last night.

Oh don't criticize the coaching. Andy Reid is an offensive genius, sir.

[Red Dawg]

Same way we lost the other games. Defense is shit and we turn the ball over.

[The Franchise]

At this point it’s coaching.

Offensive staff failed to put together a competent gameplan. Defensive staff refuses to acknowledge the shit product they’re putting out on the field.

[Easy 6]

INB4POLL: coaches/management are responsible for hiring and putting players in positions to make plays.

We did not see a whole hell of a lot of that on either side of the ball last night.

Thats perfectly fair... its easy to fixate on the players, but when its THIS bad coaching/mgmt have to pay the piper as well

[rabblerouser]

The unit to blame is the offense. No one, coaches included, was good except Kelce and I guess the line was fine.

Again - every team has scored 30 on us this season except Cleveland, who could "only' muster 29.

So, it's the defense.

[rabblerouser]

At this point it’s coaching.

Offensive staff failed to put together a competent gameplan. Defensive staff refuses to acknowledge the shit product they’re putting out on the field.

:hmmm:

Okay, you've convinced me.

[DaFace]

Again - every team has scored 30 on us this season except Cleveland, who could "only' muster 29.

So, it's the defense.

While true, you're discounting the impact that being -7 in turnovers has on a defense's production.

[493rd]

Spagnuolo needs to go and so do many of our supposed playmakers. Guys like Reed, Jones, Mathieu, Sorenson, Hitchens, Nieman, etc. The Spags years got us 9 good games and a SB victory, but the experiment should be over after this season.

[Best22]

We need an option for “turnovers”

[Sassy Squatch]

Offense. The defense forced Buffalo into a 3 and out three straight drives effectively with one long play that was inconsequential to start the second half and the offense shit all over themselves in response.

[Rainbarrel]

Limelight exhaustion

[Prison Bitch]

In order:

1) Chrissy Jones. Pussy chickened out of even playing
2). Stank Clark. Don’t even need to explain
3) Derrick Naughty. I actually rewound several plays just to watch him pushed back 4 yards every run play
4) Dildo Dan. Self explanatory
5) Honey Badger. Has he made any plays last 3 games?
6) ref who called the BS roughing penalty. It was 31-20 and we had the ball at midfield. He should be beaten senseless for that garbage
7) ty. Dropped a goal line pass and let another three his hands for a touch

[kccrow]

I'd say the LBs running sideways and backward out of position and not being able to cover anything is the biggest issue on the defense. Lack of a pass rush would be a close #2 but no pass rush is getting home with everything else wide open.

[SuperBowl4]

The ticket sales department

[stevieray]

Pride

[DaFace]

We need an option for “turnovers”

I took the philosophy of "who" not "what."

[rabblerouser]

I picked :

EB sucks at calling plays (probably why he isn't a HC)
CJ needs to be at DT
and LBs can't stop anything

If the front seven weren't so god-awful, the secondary would be better.

[493rd]

Oh, and the offense, Andy Reid in particular deserves plenty of blame for its inability to solve the Cover 2 riddle. I think we were exposed and don’t have enough playmakers on offense to be consistently good when Hill is a non-factor. Notice the 2 victories we have this year - Hill has big games in both. All 3 losses - nothing. Reid should have a contingency plan for this every week but it doesn’t seem like it.

[rabblerouser]

While true, you're discounting the impact that being -7 in turnovers has on a defense's production.

yeah, the turnovers have been huge.

[Kman34]

Your Mom..

[ModSocks]

1. Sorenson
2. Spags
3. Dline
4. Beinemy
5. Mahomes

[Hammock Parties]

Spags. Terrible plan with the D this season. Should have left Jones alone, brought in one linebacker and moved on from Dan.

[mr. tegu]

Again - every team has scored 30 on us this season except Cleveland, who could "only' muster 29.

So, it's the defense.


When you are supposed to be the best offense in the league you can’t fail so completely in the second half when the other team is feeling some pressure. They started the second half with a three and out, pick six, and an INT at the eight yard line. In that time the Bills had three actual possessions and scored zero points on offense yet somehow managed to extend their lead. The offense put away the game in the third quarter in the wrong way.

[TwistedChief]

It's the defense. Entirely.

The offense is naturally going to press when they realize they have to be perfect for an entire game and it's made even more challenging that they're being forced to engineer long, sustained drives.

There is blame to be shared by literally all parties but Sorenson, our overpaid DL, and our bumbling linebackers are at the very, very top.

[The Franchise]

1. Sorenson
2. Spags
3. Dline
4. Beinemy
5. Mahomes

5 can include any WR/TE not named Kelce.

[Jerm]

I mean you could make a case for any of these...I think the biggest thing I see and the more I think about it, everything just feels stale for a lack of better terms. It's largely the same personnel, the same schemes, the same lack of accountability, etc.

Other teams are constantly evolving on both sides of the ball while we continue to do the same things...every week. Now when it works, boy does it work...the problem is, it's working less and less and we have no backup plan for the initial ideas don't work.

[RunKC]

They scored 38 points on us.

In fact...every team has scored 30 on us this season except Cleveland, who could "only' muster 29.

So, it's the defense. Specifically, the front four is getting butt****ed on almost every down.

It’s the entire team. We have 11 turnovers on offense in the last 13 quarters.

Mahomes isn’t playing well for his standard, Tyreek is turning the ball over and the defense is a sieve.

It’s not one thing. It’s the entire team.

[Red Dawg]

I chose DL for 3 reasons. They obviously do nothing right. Can't stop the run and can't pressure the QB. Also they are eating the cap up bad and not producing like it.

[mr. tegu]

I’m just surprised how many people are shrugging off the offense and giving them a pass from “pressure to score a lot.” When has that ever been a problem in the past? We are used to being in every game regardless of defensive performance. That didn’t happen last night because the offense sucked. There were plenty of plays to make. This wasn’t the Super Bowl where it was basically impossible to score.

[ChiliConCarnage]

I picked Reid & CYA. I don't think he's lost his touch but he's in charge and nearly nothing has worked consistently this year.

Even our great players are dropping passes and committing unexpected turnovers. The Defense is a disaster in nearly every aspect. It's hard to pick out much of anything good on D. Danna has flashed a bit

[notorious]

I blame me for watching.

[loochy]

1. Sorenson
2. Spags
3. Dline
4. Beinemy
5. Mahomes


But #1 is solved by #2, so just say #2. Quit putting Sorenson out there or stop using him in that way.


It reminds me of Matt Cassel...they just keep sticking with him even though he's obviously terrible. At some point you quit blaming the player because they shouldn't even be out there to begin with.

[Tribal Warfare]

The entire Defense plays with no urgency and discipline, expecting Patrick to bail them out each week

[CatfishBob2]

Can't blame any one particular thing. They're having breakdowns all over the place. Sorenson however is blowing more plays than he makes right now

[ChiliConCarnage]

I'd like to switch my vote to GEHA field.

[lcarus]

The defense is awful, but it seems like the few times the defense actually got stops, the offense doesn't cash it in. They stopped the Bills several times in the 2nd half, though they got screwed out of one of those stops, and the offense didn't come through.

[smithandrew051]

I’m not sure what you blame for this, but it’s a complete lack of focus.

The offense continually turns the ball over. Defenders make great plays sometimes, but so many of our turnovers are unforced. Passes going through hands to defenders, fumbles, dropped snap, bad snap, taking kicks out of the endzone….

Defense continually blows assignments. The defense is pretty much compromised of the same players from last season, but they can’t even get lined up correctly half the time.

Again, no idea what to blame this on. Maybe coaching? Maybe a lack of competition for spots to keep players hungry?

[Kman34]

I mean you could make a case for any of these...I think the biggest thing I see and the more I think about it, everything just feels stale for a lack of better terms. It's largely the same personnel, the same schemes, the same lack of accountability, etc.

Other teams are constantly evolving on both sides of the ball while we continue to do the same things...every week. Now when it works, boy does it work...the problem is, it's working less and less and we have no backup plan for the initial ideas don't work.

Teams are now being built to stop us and use our strengths against us in the AFC… Andy should have seen it coming.. Cover 2 is nothing new, but why are we struggling against it? Because teams have found a way to get pressure with four down Dlinemen..

The Bills seemed like they had 10 guys rotating in and out fresh.. Making Patrick make quicker throws to short routes.. He’s Running to get first downs more..

Buffalo has built their defense to beat the Chiefs because we are or were the biggest threat in the AFC..

[notorious]

Special teams have gained -3 yards bring the ball out of the end zone vs taking the touchback. Jesus

[DJJasonp]

For the record, I think there is something not right with big red, and while they all still respect him, I think discipline and focus is severely lacking.

Who knows, maybe our entire down slide can be tied back to Britt Reid


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[fan4ever]

I think this whole team needs a good old fashion ass chewing...not that it's going to happen.

I think of the glaring differences between our D and the defenses we've faced so far this year is that their D's fly to the ball, hit you hard and don't wait for the play to come to them.

If we're going to get smoked each week at least put some hurt on the other guy.

[DRM08]

Oh, and the offense, Andy Reid in particular deserves plenty of blame for its inability to solve the Cover 2 riddle. I think we were exposed and don’t have enough playmakers on offense to be consistently good when Hill is a non-factor. Notice the 2 victories we have this year - Hill has big games in both. All 3 losses - nothing. Reid should have a contingency plan for this every week but it doesn’t seem like it.

You have to hope Josh Gordon will end up being an impact player. If they are lucky and he can be a really good 3rd option in the passing game, that will make a huge impact. They dearly miss the healthy version of Sammy Watkins and obviously Kareem Hunt.

[mkp785]

I picked :

EB sucks at calling plays (probably why he isn't a HC)
CJ needs to be at DT
and LBs can't stop anything

If the front seven weren't so god-awful, the secondary would be better.

EB can't get the blame when Fat Andy has been known as the mastermind of all of this. The whole reason we heard that EB can't get a job is Andy calls all the plays. OK, then. So Andy needs to take the blame for not being able to design plays that work.

He hasn't been the same since his POS son(who I hope gets the maximum jail time possible) acted a fool super bowl weekend.

[Rain Man]

1. Our DE play has been abysmal. Can't hold the edge, can't rush the passer. The move turned Chris Jones into Tanoh Kpassagnon.
2. We're "taking what the defense gives us" instead of letting our stars rape and pillage at will.
3. I'm not positive that we have linebackers on the field on most plays. I'm going to start counting players before the snap to see if there are 11 players.

[rabblerouser]

I’m just surprised how many people are shrugging off the offense and giving them a pass from “pressure to score a lot.” When has that ever been a problem in the past? We are used to being in every game regardless of defensive performance. That didn’t happen last night because the offense sucked. There were plenty of plays to make. This wasn’t the Super Bowl where it was basically impossible to score.

I think Reid is great at what he does, and when he's in a rhythm with things running well, then it's GREAT.

Man, he just does not adjust well. Like in the Super Bowl, just keep throwing into 2 deep zones, Cover 2 Chief Killer, doesn't keep anyone in to block, doesn't call shorter routes with shorter steps for Patrick...

Reid and EB must've gotten complacent or something.

I'll tell you this - it's not just the stalking/harassing women and DWIs that have kept EB from getting a top job, we can see that clearly now.

[wazu]

Need a “Britt Reid” option.

[TLO]

I blame X-Factor

[Easy 6]

I think Reid is great at what he does, and when he's in a rhythm with things running well, then it's GREAT.

Man, he just does not adjust well. Like in the Super Bowl, just keep throwing into 2 deep zones, Cover 2 Chief Killer, doesn't keep anyone in to block, doesn't call shorter routes with shorter steps for Patrick...

Reid and EB must've gotten complacent or something.

I'll tell you this - it's not just the stalking/harassing women and DWIs that have kept EB from getting a top job, we can see that clearly now.

I DEFINITELY smell the work of a former RB on this staff when it comes to all these run calls on first down, and other critical junctures when the ball should be in Mahomes hands...

[Graystoke]

The Meltdown Lounge. Classic

[cosmo20002]

No Refs/NFL is rigged choice


I don't think that, but it's generally a CP favorite excuse.

[The Franchise]

I DEFINITELY smell the work of a former RB on this staff when it comes to all these run calls on first down, and other critical junctures when the ball should be in Mahomes hands...

The last 4 games have been a “we’re going to prove that CEH was a first round pick” gameplan.

[Easy 6]

The Meltdown Lounge. Classic

Don't get all preachy man, we're on pace to be the 7th worst defense ever recorded... if that isn't bitch worthy, nothing is

[DJ's left nut]

I went with the DL sucks.

But at the same time - it's hard to know if they actually suck this bad. There are times they are winning their rep but the back end is breaking down so frequently and so fast that the QB can get the ball out before the rush can get there.

[T-post Tom]

Lots of reasons cited here that are valid. As bad as he’s been in the past, Peter King brought up a valid point that has been covered repeatedly here at CP:

“And that Kansas City defense. Frighteningly bad. I go back to draft day 2020 and think of the Clyde Edwards-Helaire pick. He’s been a B player. Imagine if that pick had been at a defensive need spot—at safety, maybe, where Antoine Winfield Jr., went 13 picks after Edwards-Helaire, or at corner, where Trevon Diggs went 19 picks after the runner. The Edwards-Helaire pick sounded great at the time, but needs were glaring elsewhere, and those needs really showed up all over the field Sunday night—and in the team’s 2-3 start.”

CEH should not have been drafted in Rd 1. Seems like many poor personnel decisions have been made on the defensive side of the ball. This defense is woefully short on talent. Lighting candles that someone at 1 Arrowhead Drive figures this out soon.

[cosmo20002]

Don't get all preachy man, we're on pace to be the 7th worst defense ever recorded... if that isn't bitch worthy, nothing is

I agree...we're (probably) not going 2-15, and I think we'll probably make the playoffs (but it ain't a sure thing)...and considering that legit expectations were at least a SB appearance...a little meltdown seems warranted at this point.

[DJ's left nut]

Lots of reasons cited here that are valid. As bad as he’s been in the past, Peter King brought up a valid point that has been covered repeatedly here at CP:

Go back to draft day 2020 and think of the Clyde Edwards-Helaire pick. He’s been a B player. Imagine if that pick had been...Trevon Diggs

No...I don't believe I will.

Oof.

Diggs looks absolutely unreal out there right now. I've really not see a stretch like this since peak Revis. He's probably not that good, but he's playing out of his damn mind at the moment.

[Dunerdr]

Its a perfect storm of all of the above if were being honest.

[crayzkirk]

I think it's easier for defenses to adjust to an offense than for an offense to constantly innovate and dominate defenses.

[FloridaMan88]

With so many problems, Andy and the coaching staff need to be looked at as the primary issue.

Opposing teams/coaches have been actively developing schemes and acquiring personnel to beat the Chiefs and Andy and his coaching staff have not being able to adjust or respond at this point.

This is especially true on offense with the inability to effectively counter the Cover 2 looks designed to make the Chiefs drive the field rather than giving up big plays.

Mahomes also deserves some of the blame with the offense's struggles against the two deep safety defenses because he's giving up on plays too quickly and reverting to backyard ball which messes up the timing of the intermediate passing game.

[Gary Cooper]

Nobody blaming Joe Biden? This team has sucked since he became President.

[Molitoth]

Fucking idiots are actually voting for/blaming Mahomes.

God you pathetic Patriot fan douchebags.

Mahomes is NOT the reason this team sucks.

[Chiefnj2]

****ing idiots are actually voting for/blaming Mahomes.

God you pathetic Patriot fan douchebags.

Mahomes is NOT the reason this team sucks.

Do you think Mahomes looked comfortable last night?

[ShowtimeSBMVP]

Andy

[rabblerouser]

https://es.pn/3AuXI1g

[Molitoth]

Do you think Mahomes looked comfortable last night?

No, but I think Mahomes is being dragged down by his shitty team-mates.

Mahomes 1 bad game is not a top 3 reason why this team sucks.

[MAG]

Jackson.

[The Franchise]

Everyone had it all wrong when they said that running the ball and keeping Mahomes on the sideline was the way to beat them. It’s making the Chiefs offense take 12 plays to drive down the field. More chances for mistakes and less drives overall.

[Papi]

Mahomes definitely. We win with Mahomes magic or lose without it. Simple as that. That's what this team is made to do with the limited defensive talent we have.

[FAX]

All of the above is a winning choice, IMO.

However, if I were forced to place the blame in one place and one place only, I would have to accuse the coaching staff (primarily the coordinators) of borderline incompetence.

They are paid to scheme against specific teams ... and that scheme is supposed to be designed to achieve victory. They are not paid to embarrass the organization with doofus tactics and goofball plays ... at least, they're not supposed to be paid for that.

FAX

[Gary Cooper]

Everyone had it all wrong when they said that running the ball and keeping Mahomes on the sideline was the way to beat them. It’s making the Chiefs offense take 12 plays to drive down the field. More chances for mistakes and less drives overall.

The Eagles didn't do very well with that strategy. I guess you could argue Baltimore and the Chargers did because of the turnovers. The Bills just played better than these other defenses. They actually stopped KC from progressing, even before the turnovers. The strategy itself is sound though. If this team learns discipline with penalties and ball security, they can adjust.

The Catch-22 for opposition is that longer drives means more time for Mahomes on the field. Before, teams wanted to keep the ball away from him. Not give him longer drives. The Chiefs yesterday ran many more plays than Buffalo. The execution was the issue.

[JakeF]

The team wasn't ready .... again.

Slow start ....... again

Sloppy play .... again

Not playing the best players

Needs not filled, even though the needs were pretty obvious

Play calling was sketchy, on both sides of the ball. Just like before.


How many times does the exact same shit have to happen before we hold the people in charge, responsible. If the players suck, then why are those players still here? We're having the same issues, can't or won't fix them. We keep letting the same players do the same crappy things. Either coach the mistakes out of them or cut them.

This team has been sloppy, softy and undisciplined for a long time. We just have had enough elite talent to make up for it. I guess we don't have enough talent to make up for it anymore. That's disturbing.

[gblowfish]

No sacks, no fumbles forced, no picks.
Reed does not show up on the stat sheet.
Frank Clark had one tackle.

No Big Macs today. God Damnit!!!

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

You will like this! Sorensen played every single defensive snap last night. Thornhill played less than 50%

[tyecopeland]

Wheres the refs option? I would have clicked it too.

[tyecopeland]

No, but I think Mahomes is being dragged down by his shitty team-mates.

Mahomes 1 bad game is not a top 3 reason why this team sucks.

Good thing I picked way more than three then

[TEX]

I voted DL and LB's and JAG RB's.

[DRM08]

Mahomes definitely. We win with Mahomes magic or lose without it. Simple as that. That's what this team is made to do with the limited defensive talent we have.

You have $70M of cap hits for 5 worthless players on defense. How is that Mahomes’ fault? His cap hit is under $8M. Maybe that $70M money should have been spent on RB/WR, since it’s been a total waste on ineffective defensive players.

[FloridaMan88]

Marcus Kemp having more tackles this season than Frank Clark basically is everything that is wrong with this team.

[LongSufferingToady]

The unit to blame is the offense. No one, coaches included, was good except Kelce and I guess the line was fine.

You've got to be kidding. Any defense that allows 38 points just makes things damn near impossible for the offense.

And yes, last night the offense was inept, mistake-riddled, and lacked confidence.

[Sassy Squatch]

You've got to be kidding. Any defense that allows 38 points just makes things damn near impossible for the offense.

And yes, last night the offense was inept, mistake-riddled, and lacked confidence.
God Damn. We're blaming the pick 6 on the defense too? Poor bastards.

[EPodolak]

I didn't see a straight Spags option. Other teams "solving the defense" isn't what feels true, it's just a bad defense. I think a different DC could make that unit at least average. Seems to me a lot of offense problems come from pressure to be perfect every drive.

[JakeF]

Mahomes did not play well against Buffalo. That probably validates that Buffalo's defense is one of the best. They have corners that can really cover.

Buffalo is everything we aren't

Josh Allen would be our best Running Back. ROFL


I think our coaches stink.

[The Franchise]

God Damn. We're blaming the pick 6 on the defense too? Poor bastards.

They fucking deserve it.

[Megatron96]

It’s actually a combination of several issues, a few of which are listed in the OP, but the number 1 problem isn’t even listed: our offensive skill players. KC is ranked 31st in T/O ratio, ahead of only JAC. Think about that for a minute.

And Mahomes is responsible for half of those.

The defense, play-calling, etc., Yes, those are real problems, but if they don’t stop turning the ball over 2+ times/game fixing the other stuff won’t matter anyway.

[blake1771]

1. defensive line. We get zero push and zero pressure without blitzing.

2. turnovers, but the offense in general if you can't gash a team by running the ball against 2 deep safety look, you're in trouble. You're forced to dink and dunk down the filed and this team isn't disciplined enough to either not commit penalties or not turn it over.

3. coaching all the way around. Pringle running kicks back out of the end zone. Defense not knowing the calls and getting calls in too late and perhaps an overly complicated scheme. Defense is often out of position through a lack of execution (players) but also having Sorenson on Diggs for example (scheme). Andy failing to coach like he has the best QB in the league and the worst defense in the league.

[treeguy27]

I absolutely believe there is some validity to the notion that the Britt Reid thing has affected the team. The team we saw take the field in the SB was not the same team we watched all year. It was way more than the poor O-line play. The entire team had no energy and no fire. I think it's possible that there is some disconnect between the players and coaches now. The coaches preach to the players constantly to be smart and stay out of trouble that can affect the team. Then one of the coaches goes out and does something incredibly stupid right before the SB. It's not a stretch to think the events of last season and how the SB went could be an issue in the building. The focus and attention to detail just isn't there this year.

[jd1020]

Well since the question is MOST, meaning singular, then I can't blame the offense or anything to do with the play calling. And I can't single out a single player on defense because its fucking everyone. So I guess that just leaves me with Spags can go fuck himself.

[dirk digler]

For me it is definitely the defense specifically the D-Line. I get their strategy of paying the D-Line more money to get better players and spending less on the DB group as a whole. But if the players you are choosing\paying on the DLine aren't getting pressure your less quality DB's are going to look like shit. Which is exactly what is happening

[JakeF]

I absolutely believe there is some validity to the notion that the Britt Reid thing has affected the team. The team we saw take the field in the SB was not the same team we watched all year. It was way more than the poor O-line play. The entire team had no energy and no fire. I think it's possible that there is some disconnect between the players and coaches now. The coaches preach to the players constantly to be smart and stay out of trouble that can affect the team. Then one of the coaches goes out and does something incredibly stupid right before the SB. It's not a stretch to think the events of last season and how the SB went could be an issue in the building. The focus and attention to detail just isn't there this year.
What? I don't think the team gives a single fuck about Britt Reid. The team has been sloppy this entire time. We've been coming from behind and winning by 6 points for a long time now. Mahomes has been making the 6 point difference. We have dumped so much on the shoulders of Mahomes that it's started to not be enough anymore.

There is only so much Mahomes can save Andy Reid from.

A few years ago the league was talking about KC as a Dynasty.

I still think it was a major mistake to fire John Dorsey. We went from 3 (Dorsey,Reid,Veach) guys making decisions to just 2 (Reid,Veach)guys. Reid has too much power, we need someone with a different perspective than Reid. Someone to stand up to Reid and tell him when he's wrong. Dorsey did and got fired for it. Veach is not doing that. We need a true GM, let Veach just do the Personnel dept.

There's a reason why most teams don't have the Head Coach deciding everything.

[Otter]

x-factor

[dirk digler]

I am also not discounting how bad our defensive coaching has been. Maybe some that is because we lack talent on that side of the ball.

But you ever noticed why Wade Phillips only lasts like 3 yrs as a D-Coordinator? It is because teams figure out his scheme and then it becomes useless. I think 3 years is probably the life span of a D-coordinator except for guys named Belichick.

[DJ's left nut]

The Chiefs problems are essentially my golf game at this point.

On every single play it's something different. And if you have one problem under control on this play, something else goes wrong.

If you have a consistent slice, you can play the slice and be okay. I feel like that's largely what the Chiefs defenses have done under Reid - understand their biggest issue and then scheme in a way to minimize it as best you can.

But right now there is no consistent slice. They'll slice the first one, hook the second, hit the third too thin and the 4th too thick. Then they'll overthink their mis-hit, select too much club and carry the green. Then the next time they'll try to adjust and use too little club and end up in the front bunker. Finally they'll try to play a slice, it hit razor straight OOB, break their driver in frustration and spend the rest of the day drinking in the cart.....I've said too much....

They're chasing everything right now and trying to correct so many variables simultaneously is just leading to new breakdowns on every play. They don't have a single firm, fixed variable they can try to work around because it's a different failure on every play.

They need at least a single reliable unit out there before they can begin to get a handle on this. The secondary, LBs or DL has to firm up and give them a starting point to address the other weaknesses. When the whole thing is built on shifting sands, there's just not much they can do to fix it.

[louie aguiar]

I blame a few factors:
1) Spags and the coaching - when people are running wide open and players aren't getting lined up, the coaching is responsible
2) missed draft picks - picks like Kpass, Speaks, DOD, Thornhill, Hardman and CEH were big misses
3) the trade of Frank Clark not only cost us a first-round pick but an enormous contract and he's giving us nothing
4) FA signings like Anthony Hitchens and Jarran Reed have backfired

[Red Dawg]

I blame a few factors:
1) Spags and the coaching - when people are running wide open and players aren't getting lined up, the coaching is responsible
2) missed draft picks - picks like Kpass, Speaks, DOD, Thornhill, Hardman and CEH were big misses
3) the trade of Frank Clark not only cost us a first-round pick but an enormous contract and he's giving us nothing
4) FA signings like Anthony Hitchens and Jarran Reed have backfired

Coaching? Players are more important than coaches and coaches are not on the field. Spags has three rings from being a DC so he is not some shit coach.
The rest is correct. Bad roster decisions and poor draft picks have caught up with us.

[ChiTown]

The Chiefs problems are essentially my golf game at this point.

On every single play it's something different. And if you have one problem under control on this play, something else goes wrong.

If you have a consistent slice, you can play the slice and be okay. I feel like that's largely what the Chiefs defenses have done under Reid - understand their biggest issue and then scheme in a way to minimize it as best you can.

But right now there is no consistent slice. They'll slice the first one, hook the second, hit the third too thin and the 4th too thick. Then they'll overthink their mis-hit, select too much club and carry the green. Then the next time they'll try to adjust and use too little club and end up in the front bunker. Finally they'll try to play a slice, it hit razor straight OOB, break their driver in frustration and spend the rest of the day drinking in the cart.....I've said too much....

They're chasing everything right now and trying to correct so many variables simultaneously is just leading to new breakdowns on every play. They don't have a single firm, fixed variable they can try to work around because it's a different failure on every play.

They need at least a single reliable unit out there before they can begin to get a handle on this. The secondary, LBs or DL has to firm up and give them a starting point to address the other weaknesses. When the whole thing is built on shifting sands, there's just not much they can do to fix it.

This is the correct answer

[The Franchise]

The Chiefs problems are essentially my golf game at this point.

On every single play it's something different. And if you have one problem under control on this play, something else goes wrong.

If you have a consistent slice, you can play the slice and be okay. I feel like that's largely what the Chiefs defenses have done under Reid - understand their biggest issue and then scheme in a way to minimize it as best you can.

But right now there is no consistent slice. They'll slice the first one, hook the second, hit the third too thin and the 4th too thick. Then they'll overthink their mis-hit, select too much club and carry the green. Then the next time they'll try to adjust and use too little club and end up in the front bunker. Finally they'll try to play a slice, it hit razor straight OOB, break their driver in frustration and spend the rest of the day drinking in the cart.....I've said too much....

They're chasing everything right now and trying to correct so many variables simultaneously is just leading to new breakdowns on every play. They don't have a single firm, fixed variable they can try to work around because it's a different failure on every play.

They need at least a single reliable unit out there before they can begin to get a handle on this. The secondary, LBs or DL has to firm up and give them a starting point to address the other weaknesses. When the whole thing is built on shifting sands, there's just not much they can do to fix it.

I just don’t know how you fix this any more this season.

The defensive line has the talent…it’s just underperforming. I guess you hope that they figure it out.

The linebackers might get better with Gay starting over Niemann but even then…if the line is shit…the LBs aren’t going to stay clean.

The DBs are better off than the other two groups if they could get rid of Sorenson and his mistakes.

[louie aguiar]

What happened to Tershawn Wharton? I bought into the hype that he was going to be a good player. Is he just undersized to hold up in the NFL?

[dirk digler]

Petro talking today that teams are bracketing Hill (duh) but putting their best DB's on Kelce because we don't have a reliable #2-#3 WR. Is anyone else seeing that? I never noticed that....

This is what Belichick did to us.

[Sassy Squatch]

Petro talking today that teams are bracketing Hill (duh) but putting their best DB's on Kelce because we don't have a reliable #2-#3 WR. Is anyone else seeing that? I never noticed that....

This is what Belichick did to us.
That's why Watkins was so important. Just wish we would've gotten Robinson back then instead but eh, doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. If Gordon actually pans out that'd be nice.

[Fishpicker]

I chose DL, CBs, LBs.

although I think the problem should be labelled DL, DBs, LBs

so all 3 layers of the defense are at fault. Spags must take his share of the blame. Jones should never have been moved to DE. Other teams that have hired Spags have experienced this improvement/devolution phenomena. Our D personnel are underperforming. Spags is the coach with too cute a scheme. Reid/Bienemy can right the ship for our O. they aren't dumb. Spags, on the other hand, needs to become more aggressive. It doesn't matter if our dropback coverage is disguised when we never pressure the opp QB. If Spags insists on playing Sorenson, then he should be utilized as a coverage linebacker. Sorenson can be a playmaker so long as he isn't playing coverage on a WR 20+ yards deep.

I really want to see more Mathieu/Thornhill

[DJ's left nut]

I just don’t know how you fix this any more this season.

The defensive line has the talent…it’s just underperforming. I guess you hope that they figure it out.

The linebackers might get better with Gay starting over Niemann but even then…if the line is shit…the LBs aren’t going to stay clean.

The DBs are better off than the other two groups if they could get rid of Sorenson and his mistakes.

You ever play fantasy baseball? More specifically, H2H leagues. Sometimes getting rid of a bad player and replacing him with merely average is a greater benefit than adding a good player over an average one.

That's where we find ourselves with Sorensen. But it's a good news/bad news situation - the good news is all we need to do is locate average. The bad news is that we may not have average on the roster right now. I guess you just send Thornhill out there and hope.

As for what else you do - you have to put it on the players to trust themselves and their teammates. I think the Diggs pass was a result of Thornhill trying to do too much and cover for lost coverage on the left side. He turned a bad play into a worse one. When our run defense fails it's almost always because someone is out there trying to make the play instead of just doing their job and creating a play for someone else.

These guys have GOT to focus on doing their own job and trusting that their teammates will do theirs and the play will get made.

Of course that would be a lot easier if, y'know, their teammates weren't breaking down somewhere on seemingly every snap.

I think your best hope is that Jones and Clark get back in there and get you average play at DE, allowing the DTs to focus on gap control. That would free the 'backers up to flow/fill as needed while adding Gay's athleticism will take some burden off Bolton. Replace Sorensen with Thornhill to free up Mathieu a little bit more as well.

But I think if it is going to come together, its going to have to start at the DL. So long as it remains the problem it's been to this point, they're going to continue to play from behind the sticks and the Yakety Saks defense will continue...

[DJ's left nut]

What happened to Tershawn Wharton? I bought into the hype that he was going to be a good player. Is he just undersized to hold up in the NFL?

At least prior to last week, Wharton had one of the best pass-rush win rates among interior lineman in the entire NFL.

It gets to the complementary failures thing I keep falling back on. Even when the DL does its job, the secondary tends to fall apart somewhere before it matters.

SOMEONE has to stand up taller to make any of this work.

[The Franchise]

You ever play fantasy baseball? More specifically, H2H leagues. Sometimes getting rid of a bad player and replacing him with merely average is a greater benefit than adding a good player over an average one.

That's where we find ourselves with Sorensen. But it's a good news/bad news situation - the good news is all we need to do is locate average. The bad news is that we may not have average on the roster right now. I guess you just send Thornhill out there and hope.

As for what else you do - you have to put it on the players to trust themselves and their teammates. I think the Diggs pass was a result of Thornhill trying to do too much and cover for lost coverage on the left side. He turned a bad play into a worse one. When our run defense fails it's almost always because someone is out there trying to make the play instead of just doing their job and creating a play for someone else.

These guys have GOT to focus on doing their own job and trusting that their teammates will do theirs and the play will get made.

Of course that would be a lot easier if, y'know, their teammates weren't breaking down somewhere on seemingly every snap.

I think your best hope is that Jones and Clark get back in there and get you average play at DE, allowing the DTs to focus on gap control. That would free the 'backers up to flow/fill as needed while adding Gay's athleticism will take some burden off Bolton. Replace Sorensen with Thornhill to free up Mathieu a little bit more as well.

But I think if it is going to come together, its going to have to start at the DL. So long as it remains the problem it's been to this point, they're going to continue to play from behind the sticks and the Yakety Saks defense will continue...

At this point, you pull Sorenson and out Thornhill put there. You need to at least know if he’s going to be an answer moving forward.

Then you move Jones inside. Put Danna on the edge with Clark and find another DE for the rotation.

[Sassy Squatch]

Vernon

[louie aguiar]

Coaching? Players are more important than coaches and coaches are not on the field. Spags has three rings from being a DC so he is not some shit coach.
The rest is correct. Bad roster decisions and poor draft picks have caught up with us.

I don't think he's a shit coach. For whatever reason, though, the players don't seem to be understanding the scheme or responding well to the coaching. People are being left uncovered and are wide open, they weren't prepared at all for the RPO schemes they played (we know that's Lamar Jackson's bread and butter and we looked like we didn't prepare at all for those looks). I blame that on coaching.

Ultimately the defensive coordinator has to bear some of the blame for one of the worst defenses in NFL history through 5 weeks.

[comochiefsfan]

The biggest problems are easily:

1. Veach utterly failing to build this roster and defense in particular.

2. The D-Line sucking absolute ass while absorbing the vast majority of our cap. (Again, thanks Veach.)

3. The running game being such a non threat that teams are able to comfortably drop everyone back into coverage and take away the passing game. (Good job on that CEH pick Veach)

[crayzkirk]

It's the fans. We aren't fanny enough...

[DJ's left nut]

At this point, you pull Sorenson and out Thornhill put there. You need to at least know if he’s going to be an answer moving forward.

Then you move Jones inside. Put Danna on the edge with Clark and find another DE for the rotation.

Danna for 3-downs isn't the answer.

The answer is getting consistent effort from Reed and Nnadi inside (because that's who you're taking off the field by moving Jones inside) and having Danna rotate in for Clark on pass-rushing downs.

Danna isn't a starting DE. Too small, too green, not polished or explosive enough. He's a fine fill-in who can make things happen with fresh legs and a high motor, but he's not a 50+ snap/gm player.

[FloridaMan88]

On the subject of Chris Jones underachieving… he can’t play or practice with a wrist injury but Thuney played the entire game last night with a broken hand?

[DJ's left nut]

I don't think he's a shit coach. For whatever reason, though, the players don't seem to be understanding the scheme or responding well to the coaching. People are being left uncovered and are wide open, they weren't prepared at all for the RPO schemes they played (we know that's Lamar Jackson's bread and butter and we looked like we didn't prepare at all for those looks). I blame that on coaching.

Ultimately the defensive coordinator has to bear some of the blame for one of the worst defenses in NFL history through 5 weeks.

Spags has fielded two of the worst defenses in NFL history. And he's routinely been at the top of genuinely bad defenses.

The 2009 Rams, 2012 Saints, 2015 Giants, 2017 Giants and 2011 Rams were genuinely atrocious defenses.

It's the same concern I had when we hired him - there's more bad than good on his resume. Those 2007/2008 Giants squads that made his name in the league are an awfully long time ago.

I don't know that it's fair to say he IS a bad coach...but it's fair to ask the question...

[comochiefsfan]

Fellas,

Spags can only work with who he has.

Frank Clark is injury prone and sucks. Chris Jones appears to be nursing an injured spirit this year. The rest of the line is garbage. Sorensen, garbage. Niemann, garbage. Corners, burnt toast. Linebackers, young and or injury prone.

This defensive roster is ATROCIOUS. I'm not sure Buddy Ryan could make it a competent unit. Veach has given Spags a pile of shit and asked him to make salad.

[KCJake]

Same way we lost the other games. Defense is shit and we turn the ball over.

It's 100% this. The defense is so bad. So bad that there's very little room for error. Turnovers are costing us games. And am I the only one that isn't seeing this "improved offensive line" ??? Mahomes is running for his life on nearly every passing down. Just like last season

[comochiefsfan]

It's 100% this. The defense is so bad. So bad that there's very little room for error. Turnovers are costing us games. And am I the only one that isn't seeing this "improved offensive line" ??? Mahomes is running for his life on nearly every passing down. Just like last seasonThe line seems better to me.

The problem is that Mahomes' pocket presence is not good.

[DJ's left nut]

Fellas,

Spags can only work with who he has.

Frank Clark is injury prone and sucks. Chris Jones appears to be nursing an injured spirit this year. The rest of the line is garbage. Sorensen, garbage. Niemann, garbage. Corners, burnt toast. Linebackers, young and or injury prone.

This defensive roster is ATROCIOUS. I'm not sure Buddy Ryan could make it a competent unit. Veach has given Spags a pile of shit and asked him to make salad.

And that's all well and good.

But even before Spags was formally hired I got a lot of excuses as to why he failed and very few demonstrations of where/when he actually succeeded. And those times he succeeded he had probably the best pass-rushing DL in the league. As I said then - I don't need to hear why a person failed at his last stop, I need to know why he'll succeed at this one.

If all he can do is be successful when he has great players...what's he actually good for? I believe I called him Gunther 2.0 at the time and to date I've seen little to change that opinion.

I do think he's actually quite good at coaching up a secondary, but when I see coverages blown time and time and time again, it makes me wonder if the message is being lost. It's unlikely to be a teaching thing because there's very little changover on the roster. Something has the coordination in the defensive backfield a far cry from where it was a season ago.

So if the message is being lost and he's mostly a product of his players anyway...well maybe it's time for a change in the messenger...

[SupDock]

And that's all well and good.

But even before Spags was formally hired I got a lot of excuses as to why he failed and very few demonstrations of where/when he actually succeeded. And those times he succeeded he had probably the best pass-rushing DL in the league. As I said then - I don't need to hear why a person failed at his last stop, I need to know why he'll succeed at this one.

If all he can do is be successful when he has great players...what's he actually good for? I believe I called him Gunther 2.0 at the time and to date I've seen little to change that opinion.

I do think he's actually quite good at coaching up a secondary, but when I see coverages blown time and time and time again, it makes me wonder if the message is being lost. It's unlikely to be a teaching thing because there's very little changover on the roster. Something has the coordination in the defensive backfield a far cry from where it was a season ago.

So if the message is being lost and he's mostly a product of his players anyway...well maybe it's time for a change in the messenger...


Completely agree, when this mini NFL players are failing to execute, you have to think there is a systemic issue going on.

Can’t cover, can’t run stop, can’t rush the QB.

[Why Not?]

It's 100% this. The defense is so bad. So bad that there's very little room for error. Turnovers are costing us games. And am I the only one that isn't seeing this "improved offensive line" ??? Mahomes is running for his life on nearly every passing down. Just like last season

I am not really seeing it either. I guess I defer to those here that seem to study or focus on offensive line play more than I do, but they don't look really good to me.

[DJ's left nut]

Completely agree, when this mini NFL players are failing to execute, you have to think there is a systemic issue going on.

Can’t cover, can’t run stop, can’t rush the QB.

And to even buy that line of reasoning you have to presume that the roster isn't presently underperforming it's talent level.

I don't know how you can look at the regression of the secondary as well as guys on the DL like Reed and Nnadi (setting aside Clark or even the performance of Jones to this point) and say that's the case.

Yes, this unit is absolutely underperforming its talent level. Is it a top 5 talented defense? No? Top 10 even? Probably not. Is it top 20? Well yeah, and even if you don't think it is, it's not the worst defensive roster in NFL history.

And that's the performance we're getting right now. That's a real indictment on the staff.

[Molitoth]

It's 100% this. The defense is so bad. So bad that there's very little room for error. Turnovers are costing us games. And am I the only one that isn't seeing this "improved offensive line" ??? Mahomes is running for his life on nearly every passing down. Just like last season

I think the Oline just kinda plays like the rest of the team when things are good/bad.

When your ST return guy fumbles the ball early in the game... it hurts.
When your best WR doinks a ball off his facemask for a pick-6... it hurts.
When your defense gives you little to no help and you know you can't make the mistakes listed above... it hurts.

These mental bruises will effect the people around you and that's why you see momentum swings in sports.


If you are BOWLING (haha yes... ) and your buddy has 3 strikes through the first 3 frames, and you haven't even a Spare... how hard are you going to compete through the rest of the game? I know I'm going to focus more on my beer, and come prepared for round 2.

Sometimes I think sports can be like that... you get deflated and you come back the next game fresh.


The ironic part about this post is that the Chiefs came back through the entirety of their playoff wins and Superbowl.
For some reason they have lost the confidence to do it.

Which is fine... because it's not a sustainable trait to keep playing through 3 quarters of trash football to flip a switch in the 4th.

[DJ's left nut]

I am not really seeing it either. I guess I defer to those here that seem to study or focus on offensive line play more than I do, but they don't look really good to me.

It just depends on what version you're thinking about.

Has it improved over the atrophy riddled pile of smashed assholes that ended the season? Oh hell yes - by orders of magnitude.

Is it obviously better than the Fisher - Osemele - Reiter - Wylie - Schwartz? No, not really. It's different, but I wouldn't say it's clearly better either.

But it's early. The OL is well down my list of concerns. The talent is there, the mindset is there. That can be a good line and potentially even a great one.

[Sure-Oz]

Cdot going off on Veach and how he's been good at resigning Dorsey players. Doesn't appear to look at fixing multiple issues and only addresses one need each off-season. CEH looks like a bad pick too

[crayzkirk]

The line seems better to me.

The problem is that Mahomes' pocket presence is not good.

So, are defensive coordinators making Patrick's strength a weakness? Attacking his ability to improvise by showing him what he wants to see and then taking it away?

Combine this with the lack of running game and skill players and the result is the offense is limited and predictable.

[dirk digler]

And that's all well and good.

But even before Spags was formally hired I got a lot of excuses as to why he failed and very few demonstrations of where/when he actually succeeded. And those times he succeeded he had probably the best pass-rushing DL in the league. As I said then - I don't need to hear why a person failed at his last stop, I need to know why he'll succeed at this one.

If all he can do is be successful when he has great players...what's he actually good for? I believe I called him Gunther 2.0 at the time and to date I've seen little to change that opinion.

I do think he's actually quite good at coaching up a secondary, but when I see coverages blown time and time and time again, it makes me wonder if the message is being lost. It's unlikely to be a teaching thing because there's very little changover on the roster. Something has the coordination in the defensive backfield a far cry from where it was a season ago.

So if the message is being lost and he's mostly a product of his players anyway...well maybe it's time for a change in the messenger...

I wouldn't call him Gunther 2.0, Gunther never won anything. Spags has coached 2 SB winning defenses. Gunther also coached some of the best defenses in NFL history and didn't win. And before anyone starts blaming the Marty offenses did any of those defenses make a game winning play in the playoffs? I went to many of those playoff losses and I don't remember any.

And before anyone gets it twisted I am not defending Spags this season or any of the shitty Marty offenses. But we had great defenses back then and guys like DT didn't show up alot of the time.

[Red Dawg]

Cdot going off on Veach and how he's been good at resigning Dorsey players. Doesn't appear to look at fixing multiple issues and only addresses one need each off-season. CEH looks like a bad pick too

CEH is a bad pick. RB is always a bad pick in round 1.

[Red Dawg]

I wouldn't call him Gunther 2.0, Gunther never won anything. Spags has coached 2 SB winning defenses. Gunther also coached some of the best defenses in NFL history and didn't win. And before anyone starts blaming the Marty offenses did any of those defenses make a game winning play in the playoffs? I went to many of those playoff losses and I don't remember any.

Really? Blaming the Marty defenses? If Mahomes had a Marty defense we would be damn near unbeatable.

[dirk digler]

Really? Blaming the Marty defenses? If Mahomes had a Marty defense we would be damn near unbeatable.

.


And before anyone gets it twisted I am not defending Spags this season or any of the shitty Marty offenses. But we had great defenses back then and guys like DT didn't show up alot of the time.

[MahomesMagic]

CEH is a bad pick. RB is always a bad pick in round 1.

If we had Austin Ekeler or Christian McCaffrey at RB I would have been quite happy with the pick.

If you draft a RB it better be a weapon that scares people.

CEH is not that.

[dirk digler]

If we had Austin Ekeler or Christian McCaffrey at RB I would have been quite happy with the pick.

If you draft a RB it better be a weapon that scares people.

CEH is not that.

So McCaffrey over Mahomes then? :p

[ChiefsCountry]

Lack of a pass rush is the main problem. Most of the defense problems is caused by this.

[MahomesMagic]

So McCaffrey over Mahomes then? :p

No.

Obviously not. I wanted to grab a pass-rusher the year we took CEH but if we had gotten a real weapon there no one would be complaining.

[Red Dawg]

If we had Austin Ekeler or Christian McCaffrey at RB I would have been quite happy with the pick.

If you draft a RB it better be a weapon that scares people.

CEH is not that.

Ed is already a broke dick that makes too much money. RB's don't win you shit. We won with an RB that that got cut from 3 other teams.

[dirk digler]

No.

Obviously not. I wanted to grab a pass-rusher the year we took CEH but if we had gotten a real weapon there no one would be complaining.

I actually wanted CEH after watching him play great in the CFB playoffs. Thought he would be a perfect fit but it obviously hasn't worked out that way.

[jd1020]

I actually wanted CEH after watching him play great in the CFB playoffs. Thought he would be a perfect fit but it obviously hasn't worked out that way.

I just don't understand why he gets virtually no looks in the passing game. I thought that was one of the main reasons we drafted him. And yet he's getting 2 targets a game.

[DJ's left nut]

Lack of a pass rush is the main problem. Most of the defense problems is caused by this.

But again - how do we even know?

I cite Wharton again for my point - Wharton's actually winning a lot of pass rush reps. He's getting free fairly quickly. And the coverage is so bad that nobody has noticed it an in fact many are criticizing his play thus far (fair in the run game, but not so much as a rusher).

Watch the Eagles game again, Jones was actually doing a nice job of beating his man. He just couldn't get home because the ball came out so quickly.

Now that's not to say that I think this is a premier pass rush or will be. It's to say that I don't think it's as bad as it appears at first glance. But back to where I started - when the rush gets home, the coverage fails. When the coverage holds up, the rush fails. It's just been a series of complementary failures on seemingly every drive.

They need consistency somewhere and if they get it, it will help everywhere.

[Marcellus]

Read this before you vote, its pretty jaw dropping.

Kansas City has now lost four of its past six games with Patrick Mahomes in the lineup, after winning 12 in a row and 25 of its previous 26. How is that possible? Here is how: As a general rule, the Chiefs lose when their defense is not just bad, but off-the-charts bad. Bad, as in Allen completing 15 passes for 315 yards on the night.

By the way, Joe Namath holds the record for yardage in a game on 15 or fewer passes, because of course he does. Broadway Joe completed 15 for 496 yards and six touchdowns against the Baltimore Colts in 1972. Johnny Unitas passed for 376 yards, leading the New York Daily News to report that “Joe and old master John Unitas put on an aerial display that hasn’t been matched in this city since Francis Scott Key blew his mind over the rockets’ red glare.”

Are the Chiefs history, too?

If we stack all 59 Mahomes starts according to the Chiefs’ defensive EPA in those games, we see that Kansas City is 22-0 when its defense is average or better, according to TruMedia. The rest of the league is 586-262-5 (.690) in those games. Advantage, Chiefs.

We see that Kansas City is 15-2 in games when its defense is below average, but not off-the-charts bad. The rest of the league is 202-346-2 (.371) in those games. Advantage, Chiefs.

Finally, we see that Kansas City is 9-11 in the games when its defense is at its worst. The rest of the league is 70-281-1 (.200) in those games. Big, huge, Tier 1 quarterback advantage, Chiefs, except that 9-11 is not a good record in isolation. Unfortunately for Kansas City, all five Chiefs games this season fall into the “worst defensive games” category. That is reflected in the team’s record, which might not improve unless the defense does.

[dirk digler]

I just don't understand why he gets virtually no looks in the passing game. I thought that was one of the main reasons we drafted him. And yet he's getting 2 targets a game.

Me either. Same with McKinnon, he should be getting some looks as well as he can break it for a TD. Maybe Mahomes doesn't like throwing to the RB's..I don't know.

[JPH83]

It just depends on what version you're thinking about.

Has it improved over the atrophy riddled pile of smashed assholes that ended the season? Oh hell yes - by orders of magnitude.

Is it obviously better than the Fisher - Osemele - Reiter - Wylie - Schwartz? No, not really. It's different, but I wouldn't say it's clearly better either.

But it's early. The OL is well down my list of concerns. The talent is there, the mindset is there. That can be a good line and potentially even a great one.

The IOL is, I think, definitely better, the OTs worse. For all the talk of the incredible job Veach has done on OL I think at present you're right - it's not that much improved. I still probably have more faith it it's improvement than any level of the defence.

It does feel like getting average across the OL and looking to improve at DE and CB, or even another WR, might have been the better overall strategy. But in fairness I've no idea what that might have looked like. Plus it's hard to feel bad about the Creed and Smith picks or the focus on protecting Mahomes first and foremost.

[Sassy Squatch]

I just don't understand why he gets virtually no looks in the passing game. I thought that was one of the main reasons we drafted him. And yet he's getting 2 targets a game.
Who knows. Seemingly none of the traits have translated to the NFL, injury has robbed him of what little speed he had, and Reid seems absolutely determined to use him as nothing but an early down churner. Why in the fuck would you draft CEH to have him do that?

[MahomesMagic]

I actually wanted CEH after watching him play great in the CFB playoffs. Thought he would be a perfect fit but it obviously hasn't worked out that way.

I liked him a lot too coming out of college and also thought he would be a good fit.

I did like Swift better but with CEH I thought his pass pro was better than it appears now in the NFL.

That is limiting his chances to make a difference as a receiver.

[DJ's left nut]

The IOL is, I think, definitely better, the OTs worse. For all the talk of the incredible job Veach has done on OL I think at present you're right - it's not that much improved. I still probably have more faith it it's improvement than any level of the defence.

It does feel like getting average across the OL and looking to improve at DE and CB, or even another WR, might have been the better overall strategy. But in fairness I've no idea what that might have looked like. Plus it's hard to feel bad about the Creed and Smith picks or the focus on protecting Mahomes first and foremost.

I think ultimately it's not terribly fair to judge the job he did in the offseason based on the 'starting' line from 2020 to now. Because Osemele, Fisher and Schwartz broke and they just weren't available in 2021.

So a fair point of comparison given the severity of the injuries to 3 key starters probably is the attrition riddled pile of smashed assholes we ended the season with. Fair or not, that was our throughput and it wasn't of Veach's doing.

And yeah, Veach did a great job with that rebuild, IMO. I just think we got a little ahead of ourselves (and said so) when we talked about how awful the 2020 line was - it really wasn't THAT bad until the end. So our memory of what the line WAS is clouded and that colored our perceived impact of the new line.

I never really expected this OL to be a massive upgrade over the regular season 2020 line. But I respect what Veach was able to to in really tough circumstance to ensure that there would be no real decline and a real possibility of substantial improvement over time.

I'll still shit on a great deal many things Veach has done, but I think he handled the OL rebuild as well as it could have possibly been handled.

[dirk digler]

As far as the offense goes Reid talked about the coverage comment Mahomes made last night.

Reid described how defenses are currently playing the Chiefs offense — and how it might overcome the change in looks.

As to be expected, defenses have made adjustments in 2021 to counteract the Chiefs' explosive offense.

"When Pat was on his first few years, we saw a lot of man coverage," remembered Reid. “They challenged us with man, and then we started to get pretty good with that. But we went through a phase where — like we are now, man — we struggled with a little bit. We pounded through that, and now we're seeing zone. We're seeing the shell zone, whether it's two-deep, or whether it's quarters, palms, which is kind of a mixture of Cover-4 — the quarters look and 2."

By playing more zone, teams are doing a better job eliminating the explosive plays we had become used to seeing from the Chiefs offense.

"They're making you kind of work your way down the field, so we're putting these drives together," said Reid. "We're having hiccups within the drive, where you're having turnovers or penalties, and those things — they kill you. So it's not that you're not racking up the yards. It's not that you're not moving the ball. You just got to be more consistent with it and be able to sustain these drives. They're not going to give up the big shot there necessarily."

Still, the Chiefs won't abandon the deep shots completely. But they do need to build to them.

"There's a time and a place for that," said Reid. "You got to be able to run the ball. You got to be able to throw the ball. You got to have a short-to-intermediate game. You've got to have the whole package. You've got to be able to move the quarterback around, but most of all, you've got to be able to sustain that. So does it take a certain concentration level to do that? Yeah, it's tough to drive the length of the field. But we've done it before and been successful with it.

"We did it the week before this week (against the Eagles) and were very successful with it. So it's a matter of letting everything play for you as you go, sometimes you got to pump the brakes a little bit, and just take what's given and you roll with it. It doesn't matter if it's the run game or the pass game. It's the same thing, and it's not just one position. It's everybody. It's everybody doing their job, coaches included, all got a part of it."

[Marcellus]

As far as the offense goes Reid talked about the coverage comment Mahomes made last night.

Yea when you look at his comment about the longer drives and more plays there are more chances for error., its exactly what's happening.

1st INT, off the hands of Hill, never should have happened.

2ND INT- Niang doesn't hold his block well enough and the DE makes an just incredible play to knock the ball up and catch it. Very very rare play.

Then you have Hill dropping a pass on 3rd down that him in the facemask and Mahomes missing Kelce on a TD. Its just errors compounded by the limited number of drives the defense is giving them on top of the pressure mounting because the defense keeps giving up TD's.

Big old snowball.

[Fat Elvis]

https://scontent.fmci1-3.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/245466598_4537292342999903_6981730399376704578_n.jpg?_nc_cat=106&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=T6xYkUvcUm0AX-TGSPJ&_nc_ht=scontent.fmci1-3.fna&oh=3c4d994d1619f2196ceff48fec2ee009&oe=616A1E80

[Mecca]

I actually wanted CEH after watching him play great in the CFB playoffs. Thought he would be a perfect fit but it obviously hasn't worked out that way.

Unless it's a designed RB pass, the back has to figure out if they need to stay in for blitz pickup or release if no one's coming...the Chiefs do not trust Helaire to pickup a blitz at all.

[dirk digler]

Yea when you look at his comment about the longer drives and more plays there are more chances for error., its exactly what's happening.

1st INT, off the hands of Hill, never should have happened.

2ND INT- Niang doesn't hold his block well enough and the DE makes an just incredible play to knock the ball up and catch it. Very very rare play.

Then you have Hill dropping a pass on 3rd down that him in the facemask and Mahomes missing Kelce on a TD. Its just errors compounded by the limited number of drives the defense is giving them on top of the pressure mounting because the defense keeps giving up TD's.

Big old snowball.

Yep. Lack of running game is really hurting us.

[Mecca]

Yep. Lack of running game is really hurting us.

There probably isn't a team with a worse RB group.

[The Franchise]

The Lions fucking suck and have Jamaal Williams. Offer them something for Swift. And then when CEH is healthy….call up the Bengals and see what they want to get him back with Burrow.

[Easy 6]

The Lions fucking suck and have Jamaal Williams. Offer them something for Swift. And then when CEH is healthy….call up the Bengals and see what they want to get him back with Burrow.

:hmmm:

[scho63]

29, 36, 30, 30, 38

That's points allowed from our fucking pathetic offensive defense

[ljmhawk]

29, 36, 30, 30, 38

That's points allowed from our ****ing pathetic offensive defense

can’t blame a pick 6 and blocked punt on the defense

[Sassy Squatch]

29, 36, 30, 30, 38

That's points allowed from our fucking pathetic offensive defense
STILL blaming the defense for the pick six? It's okay, the point is easily provable that they're an all time historically bad unit, we don't need to fudge the numbers.

[KChiefs1]

They scored 38 points on us.

In fact...every team has scored 30 on us this season except Cleveland, who could "only' muster 29.

So, it's the defense. Specifically, the front four is getting buttfucked on almost every down.


EVERYONE knows we have a shitty defense so the offense has to be super efficient to compensate & they haven’t been with turnovers, penalties & poor execution.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[KChiefs1]

CEH is a bad pick. RB is always a bad pick in round 1.


What a waste of a first rounder.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[burt]

With so many problems, Andy and the coaching staff need to be looked at as the primary issue.

Opposing teams/coaches have been actively developing schemes and acquiring personnel to beat the Chiefs and Andy and his coaching staff have not being able to adjust or respond at this point.

This is especially true on offense with the inability to effectively counter the Cover 2 looks designed to make the Chiefs drive the field rather than giving up big plays.

Mahomes also deserves some of the blame with the offense's struggles against the two deep safety defenses because he's giving up on plays too quickly and reverting to backyard ball which messes up the timing of the intermediate passing game.

My take for what it's worth.

1)Mahomes is off kilter. Several times he has flat out missed the pass to open receivers this season. Combine that with turn overs, disaster.

2) Defense flat out sucks. But I agree, last year, though, we'd just outscore them, this ain't last year.

3) The coaches are still ultimately to blame. THEY need to find out what is wrong with Mahomes. Find out what plays work in the 2 deep safety defenses. Figure out our defense.

Andy is a great coach, Beinemy is a great coach. I trust them...they gotta fix it.

[KC_Connection]

Mahomes leads the league in QBR this season. If there's something wrong with him, what the hell does that make the other QBs in the NFL?

[Rain Man]

Yea when you look at his comment about the longer drives and more plays there are more chances for error., its exactly what's happening.

1st INT, off the hands of Hill, never should have happened.

2ND INT- Niang doesn't hold his block well enough and the DE makes an just incredible play to knock the ball up and catch it. Very very rare play.

Then you have Hill dropping a pass on 3rd down that him in the facemask and Mahomes missing Kelce on a TD. Its just errors compounded by the limited number of drives the defense is giving them on top of the pressure mounting because the defense keeps giving up TD's.

Big old snowball.

And let's not forget fumbling a kickoff return.

[Shiver Me Timbers]

The D needs to find some direction- That is on the coach. In Spags "semi defense"- He has a dozen and half "professionals" who really suck ass.
Frank Clark needs to.......... you can fill that in
The Offense seems like they are a 500 team just waiting for the season to end
Andy/EB game prep is way off and the play calling is pitiful.
Give the ball away 2 or three times a game- big problem
The Chiefs have a target on their backs every game. They are not playing at a level to even come close to meeting the challenge.

[MahomesMagic]

Mahomes leads the league in QBR this season. If there's something wrong with him, what the hell does that make the other QBs in the NFL?

I blame Andy for last night's offensive performance.

Buffalo middle of the field was wide open past the RPO passing points and he didn't get our guys in there.

[DRM08]

Mahomes leads the league in QBR this season. If there's something wrong with him, what the hell does that make the other QBs in the NFL?

I would say it’s evidence that the QBR stat is flawed. He has looked pretty shaky overall this year. Guess we will see if he can get into a better groove over the coming weeks.

[burt]

Mahomes leads the league in QBR this season. If there's something wrong with him, what the hell does that make the other QBs in the NFL?

QBR matters to OTHER QB's. Yes, he leads QBR. No, he isn't playing as well as last year. He is missing his targets. He is a generational talent so great that he can play poorly FOR HIM and still be amazing in comparison.

[Baby Lee]

It's not a who, it's a what.

Football is an intricate team game with small battles all over the place that are overshadowed by QB performance. Given our history, we were in this philosophical space that a franchise QB would solve every problem forever.

Well we got the best QB in history, and promptly decided that it was OK to suck everywhere else. Not that they're trying to suck, but . . . if they mess up even atrociously 'every once in a while' it would be OK because Mahomes will come storming in and fix everything.

It's intoxicating when it works, that feeling of invincibility even when you are a 98lb weakling because your big brother will kick all the bullies asses eventually.

But the opposition stays hungry, and they gameplan, and they figure out weaknesses. . . and eventually when your ONLY fortification against sucking across the board is one player, they figure out how to neutralize that one aspect and maximize their advantage in all other aspects.

The dominance of the Patriots wasn't because of Brady. It was knowing they had Brady and KEEPING THEIR FOOT ON THE ACCELERATOR in every picayune and trifling aspect of the game. Teaching WRs to be pro bowl CBs, top 5 defenses year after year, clutch kickers, etc.

[crispystl]

I am not really seeing it either. I guess I defer to those here that seem to study or focus on offensive line play more than I do, but they don't look really good to me.

IMOP the IOL looks great. The tackles...not so much

[mr. tegu]

I know the defense is bad but I still can’t just forget the offense is the ultimate reason we lost the first two games with a good case for this last loss as well.

Obviously the end of the Ravens game included a bad INT but even worse the ridiculous end of game management and fumble. That was completely self inflicted. Now they gave up some plays in that game (1st & 24 to a TD) and yards but also scored 7 points. At the end of it all though we were in a golden position. If we could sign up for that situation at the end of the super bowl we do that right now.

And how different does the defensive effort look if we are up 17-3 on the Chargers instead of all the consecutive turnovers putting us in a hole? Just bad complimentary football and the lackadaisical attitude showing through on offense.

Second half of Bills game after getting shredded we adjusted and forced three straight three and outs and give up no points. And what happens? We are actual MINUS 7 points after those possessions by each team.

Clearly the defense is playing bad but we have made our bed on being an offensive team and the offense at all levels from players to coaching has repeatedly failed in critical moments in each loss. Let’s not forget against the Browns we couldn’t get a first down at the end to ice the game.

If the offense was playing the way they can and honestly should be based on moving the ball at will we would be at minimum 4-1 and waiting on the defense to continue getting better and getting lighter competition to improve their numbers.

[Iconic]

Coaching staff. Problem is systemic more than anything else. It's not like we downgraded substantially with regards to talent from the past two years. Guys simply do not look prepared at all, it's a lot of new faces on the team and besides them needing time to adjust they also need the right support to get there.

Talent is really not the story here, there's plenty of shitter teams in the NFL putting together better games than us. It's a story of execution, especially on offense. We were made to be an offensive threat and haven't been thus far at all.

[Megatron96]

Coaching staff. Problem is systemic more than anything else. It's not like we downgraded substantially with regards to talent from the past two years. Guys simply do not look prepared at all, it's a lot of new faces on the team and besides them needing time to adjust they also need the right support to get there.

Talent is really not the story here, there's plenty of shitter teams in the NFL putting together better games than us. It's a story of execution, especially on offense. We were made to be an offensive threat and haven't been thus far at all.

Wtf are you talking about?

Did the coaching staff throw a bunch of INTs or fumble the ball multiple times?

Instead of going on a multi-paragraph rant, I'll just leave this here: at some point in the real world an individual has to be responsible for their own actions. Andy/Spags/EB/whoever can only do so much to get their players ready for a game. It's ultimately up to the players to prepare themselves and execute the gameplan, whatever it is. Overthrows, INTs, fumbles, miscommunications, etc. are directly attributable to the players themselves.

They should all take a long look in the mirror. Most of them, Mahomes, Hill and Kelce included, have not played up to their abilities. It's on them and all the other players (with the exception of the IOL and ST for the most part) to own their failings and just simply do fucking better.

Sooner rather than later would be nice.

[Baby Lee]

Wtf are you talking about?

Did the coaching staff throw a bunch of INTs or fumble the ball multiple times?

Instead of going on a multi-paragraph rant, I'll just leave this here: at some point in the real world an individual has to be responsible for their own actions. Andy/Spags/EB/whoever can only do so much to get their players ready for a game. It's ultimately up to the players to prepare themselves and execute the gameplan, whatever it is. Overthrows, INTs, fumbles, miscommunications, etc. are directly attributable to the players themselves.

They should all take a long look in the mirror. Most of them, Mahomes, Hill and Kelce included, have not played up to their abilities. It's on them and all the other players (with the exception of the IOL and ST for the most part) to own their failings and just simply do fucking better.

Sooner rather than later would be nice.

I can kind of see your point, but at the professional level, this suggests that coaching is utterly irrelevant, . . . like completely.

I mean, these are professional athletes who have played every day of their life at a high level. Why on earth do they need some fat lard on the sidelines to tell them how to play?

More accurately though, coaches and FO perform tasks just as vital as play on the field, just not as visible. Cohesion, mentality, discipline, philosophy, demeanor, preparedness, etc.

[Megatron96]

I can kind of see your point, but at the professional level, this suggests that coaching is utterly irrelevant, . . . like completely.

I mean, these are professional athletes who have played every day of their life at a high level. Why on earth do they need some fat lard on the sidelines to tell them how to play?

More accurately though, coaches and FO perform tasks just as vital as play on the field, just not as visible. Cohesion, mentality, discipline, philosophy, demeanor, preparedness, etc.

:facepalm:
Why does everything have to be an absolute with you people? Can there really not be levels or shades or layers or meaning?

Look, coaches are responsible for many things, including to a certain extent off-the-field matters. But execution on gameday is a player thing, not a coach thing. Coaches install schemes and gameplans, tweak and refine issues for players, things like that.

But when players don't execute, when they play sloppy, or just damned stupid, that's on them. And it should be. I mean i get the whole "the captain is responsible for the actions o his crew," hell, that's exactly the life I live in aviation, and I wouldn't have it any other way. Last thing anyone wants is for the legal 'experts' and the bean counters (or God forbid the HR people) to have any real say in what happens in my airplane.

But players should be held accountable if and when they shit the bed on gameday.

To wit, the defense has been terrible, but the players need to communicate better and adjust when the other team tries to outpace them. Coaches can help with that through their experience and football acumen, but the players have to commit themselves to rectifying those issues.

And the offense simply must secure the ball much better. It won't mean a tinker's damn if the defense wakes up and plays like they did the last 9 weeks of 2019 (and the first 8 weeks or so of 2020) if the offense gives the ball away 2.2 times a game.

And have you seen Spags? He's hardly a tub of lard.

[chiefzilla1501]

Wtf are you talking about?

Did the coaching staff throw a bunch of INTs or fumble the ball multiple times?

Instead of going on a multi-paragraph rant, I'll just leave this here: at some point in the real world an individual has to be responsible for their own actions. Andy/Spags/EB/whoever can only do so much to get their players ready for a game. It's ultimately up to the players to prepare themselves and execute the gameplan, whatever it is. Overthrows, INTs, fumbles, miscommunications, etc. are directly attributable to the players themselves.

They should all take a long look in the mirror. Most of them, Mahomes, Hill and Kelce included, have not played up to their abilities. It's on them and all the other players (with the exception of the IOL and ST for the most part) to own their failings and just simply do ****ing better.

Sooner rather than later would be nice.

I think there's a lot to be said for "the mentals." something is off. I think the locker room is really challenged because Clark and mathieu are distracted.

Its kind of a perfect storm of distraction...
Britt reid
Clark's dui
Mathieu contract dispute
Mahomes first child
Andy Reid's health
Willie gay and CEH getting down on themselves

Our defense lacks leadership. Clark's minds elsewhere. HB is finger pointing. Even mahomes seems frustrated with his receivers running wrong routes. And how long before tyreek gets sick of double coverage. And how long can kelce endure getting clobbered in coverage.

For a team that hasn't seen adversity for a while behind a coach who is undoubtedly distracted as well.

This team isn't just playing sloppy. There just seems like a noticeable lack of fire. We know Reid will eventually turn it around. But the mental stuff on defense will be a hard thing to shake.

[Baby Lee]

Point is, while ACTUAL execution on game day is largely a function of individual performance, . . EXPECTATIONS of and PREPARATION for execution on game day is the domain of coaching.

[Imon Yourside]

Team hasn't been the same since we lost Colquitt

[Halfcan]

I can't believe so many voted Mahomes.

[Marcellus]

I would say it’s evidence that the QBR stat is flawed. He has looked pretty shaky overall this year. Guess we will see if he can get into a better groove over the coming weeks.

This is nonsense. He has had a few bad passes. Prior to last night his completion % was 5% above his career average with his second best YPA.

[Marcellus]

I can't believe so many voted Mahomes.

It’s dumb people who think Mahomes has to win every game himself doing hero shit or else he sucks.

[Megatron96]

This is nonsense. He has had a few bad passes. Prior to last night his completion % was 5% above his career average with his second best YPA.

Most of the time I'd agree with this statement. But it's not just the bad passes. Mahomes is not reading the field well for stretches. Simms on PFT analyzed a few plays last week (from week 3) where Mahomes doesn't even look at one side of the field (where guys were WIDE OPEN in the EZ), or just holds the ball with a guy open, with room to run ahead of him (presumably to air it out downfield instead).

He's off. Call it trying too hard to play hero ball, uncomfortable in the pocket, whatever you want. Not going to bring that up here. But he's not right, and he needs to figure it out soon.

[JakeF]

Entire team lacks discipline, intensity, and focus.

You can have lousy players, but still give 100%, be focused and know your assignments. Even when we win, we are sloppy. Mahomes has never fixed his basics. Reid talked about working on his footwork etc when he came out of college, never happened. Mahomes has been sandlot the entire time.

I'm NOT blaming Mahomes.

I'm just saying that our coaches have not instilled any real discipline on this team. It shows in every game. Our defense lacks commitment and it shows.

I'm sorry, but the core of the problem is our coaching staff. Every team takes after its head coach. This team is just like Andy Reid.

[mr. tegu]

Most of the time I'd agree with this statement. But it's not just the bad passes. Mahomes is not reading the field well for stretches. Simms on PFT analyzed a few plays last week (from week 3) where Mahomes doesn't even look at one side of the field (where guys were WIDE OPEN in the EZ), or just holds the ball with a guy open, with room to run ahead of him (presumably to air it out downfield instead).

He's off. Call it trying too hard to play hero ball, uncomfortable in the pocket, whatever you want. Not going to bring that up here. But he's not right, and he needs to figure it out soon.


I’ve been talking about the apparent lack of reading the field for a few weeks as well. He’s just bailing the pocket too quick at times or other times I think he’s expecting things to be open and determining where he’s going more than he should. Just doesn’t look comfortable sitting in the pocket for longer than a few seconds consistently right now.

[kcclone]

Veach has destroyed our defense..... Every position group. He's done nothing to add offensive skill players. Thankfully we have Tyreek, Kelce and Mahomes from the Dorsey era.

He did find Butker and he rebuilt our OL as well as he could have given that we lost two pro bowl caliber tackles within a year.

[Delano]

Veach has destroyed our defense..... Every position group. He's done nothing to add offensive skill players. Thankfully we have Tyreek, Kelce and Mahomes from the Dorsey era.

He did find Butker and he rebuilt our OL as well as he could have given that we lost two pro bowl caliber tackles within a year.


He's built tremendous depth across the offensive line. Not just the starters.

[TEX]

Entire team lacks discipline, intensity, and focus.

You can have lousy players, but still give 100%, be focused and know your assignments. Even when we win, we are sloppy. Mahomes has never fixed his basics. Reid talked about working on his footwork etc when he came out of college, never happened. Mahomes has been sandlot the entire time.

I'm NOT blaming Mahomes.

I'm just saying that our coaches have not instilled any real discipline on this team. It shows in every game. Our defense lacks commitment and it shows.

I'm sorry, but the core of the problem is our coaching staff. Every team takes after its head coach. This team is just like Andy Reid.

Dumb... The problem is lack of talent on defense.

[New World Order]

On offense it’s our running backs. There are holes and safeties are playing high. They should be able to bust some big plays.

On d it’s a culmination of things: lack of pass rush, horrible coverage linebacking and Dan Sorensen

[TEX]

DL, LB's, RB's

[Wallcrawler]

Defense.

They dont know where to line up.

They don't know who they're covering.

They dont understand their role in most given plays.

Bolton is the only guy on the field willing or able to tackle.

Our best D lineman is playing out of position and is completely worthless.

The defense is so bad the offense now has to press.

Randy often shows up on important 3rd downs to call asinine drive killing plays, as if under the impression his defense is going to get a stop if this run up the center's ass fails. Ever.

So yeah. Forget 2018, forget 2003. This is all time bad defense.

Now we are trying to tame Patrick Mahomes, just take what's there, its okay not to be able to score in under 11 plays, lets start throwing parrallell to the line of scrimmage next.

Our only hope is we unleash the beast wearing 15. Point him in the right direction, and get the fuck out of his way. He's our only shot at ANYTHING good happening with a defense this pathetic.

[JPH83]

He's built tremendous depth across the offensive line. Not just the starters.

Not sure you can say that about our tackles. Hard to replace what we had, and frankly we haven't. I think that's a big reason for Mahomes bailing early and not seeing open recievers, he doesn't trust that line yet.

[carcosa]

I’m not sure what you blame for this, but it’s a complete lack of focus.

The offense continually turns the ball over. Defenders make great plays sometimes, but so many of our turnovers are unforced. Passes going through hands to defenders, fumbles, dropped snap, bad snap, taking kicks out of the endzone….

Defense continually blows assignments. The defense is pretty much compromised of the same players from last season, but they can’t even get lined up correctly half the time.

Again, no idea what to blame this on. Maybe coaching? Maybe a lack of competition for spots to keep players hungry?

The team feels like a zombie version of itself, it's so odd

[Ming the Merciless]

we have no LBs

we have no DL

no weapons for Mahomes other than hill & kelce

[Marcellus]

Most of the time I'd agree with this statement. But it's not just the bad passes. Mahomes is not reading the field well for stretches. Simms on PFT analyzed a few plays last week (from week 3) where Mahomes doesn't even look at one side of the field (where guys were WIDE OPEN in the EZ), or just holds the ball with a guy open, with room to run ahead of him (presumably to air it out downfield instead).

He's off. Call it trying too hard to play hero ball, uncomfortable in the pocket, whatever you want. Not going to bring that up here. But he's not right, and he needs to figure it out soon.

How can you be off while having your highest completion % by 5 pts and your second highest YPA (only .2 off your career high) while leading the league in TDs? That's where he was going into Sunday night.

The expectations are just other worldly is the biggest issue.

[FloridaMan88]

All of the talk about the Chiefs new TE depth this offseason... there hasn't been much usage or production from the non-Kelce TE's to this point.

[comochiefsfan]

All of the talk about the Chiefs new TE depth this offseason... there hasn't been much usage or production from the non-Kelce TE's to this point.Remember when Noah Gray was supposed to be a badass in training camp?

I guess Andy is saving him for later in the year because he's nowhere to be found.

[OnTheWarpath15]

I blame Andy for last night's offensive performance.

Buffalo middle of the field was wide open past the RPO passing points and he didn't get our guys in there.

I was wondering if I was the only one seeing this, at one point I mentioned to Clay that there was a 15 yard hole in the middle of the field - and our routes were all running deep and outside the hash marks.

It was maddening.

[comochiefsfan]

I was wondering if I was the only one seeing this, at one point I mentioned to Clay that there was a 15 yard hole in the middle of the field - and our routes were all running deep and outside the hash marks.

It was maddening.I'm convinced Andy is mailing it in this season. The last few years we've come out with new creative looks and different wrinkles that have befuddled opposing defenses.

This year its been all vanilla bullshit and stubbornly trying to run our base plays against defenses that are prepared for it. There's been little to no adjustments and the offense looks more out of sync than I've ever seen.

Not sure what's going on at Arrowhead drive, but something is definitely wrong with the scheme and play calling.

[DRM08]

I'm convinced Andy is mailing it in this season. The last few years we've come out with new creative looks and different wrinkles that have befuddled opposing defenses.

This year its been all vanilla bullshit and stubbornly trying to run our base plays against defenses that are prepared for it. There's been little to no adjustments and the offense looks more out of sync than I've ever seen.

Not sure what's going on at Arrowhead drive, but something is definitely wrong with the scheme and play calling.

Won’t be surprised if he retires at the end of the year. Probably not a bad idea for his health and whatever else in his life.

[crayzkirk]

I'm going to blame the success of the team on the problems. Years of drafting at the bottom, trading draft picks, missing on picks, etc. I watched some of the Bengals/Packers game and others; a lot of teams have some really good players. Watching the Colts/Ravens just makes me sad to see teams with so many playmakers when my Chiefs only seem to have three.

As far as Andy goes; he has nothing left to prove. He's given so much to football and, in my opinion, his family life has suffered.

Football is a great escape from the daily grind; I can imagine being one of the linebackers and laying a hit on an idiot co-worker.

I just hope none of the big three on the team gets injured; other players really need to start picking up the slack, Kelce isn't getting any younger and he gets beat up on every play.

[PAChiefsGuy]

Won’t be surprised if he retires at the end of the year. Probably not a bad idea for his health and whatever else in his life.

I seriously doubt that. Reid loves coaching, he'll do it until he physically or mentally can't anymore.

[Hammock Parties]

Clyde Edwards Helaire. Rest of the team is good enough to be 4-1.

[TEX]

Clyde Edwards Helaire. Rest of the team is good enough to be 4-1.

Not with this defense. Maybe 3-2.

[TEX]

I'm convinced Andy is mailing it in this season. The last few years we've come out with new creative looks and different wrinkles that have befuddled opposing defenses.

This year its been all vanilla bullshit and stubbornly trying to run our base plays against defenses that are prepared for it. There's been little to no adjustments and the offense looks more out of sync than I've ever seen.

Not sure what's going on at Arrowhead drive, but something is definitely wrong with the scheme and play calling.

The only thing wrong is they don't have a RB on the roster that can make teams pay for playing to take away the down field stuff.

[Hammock Parties]

Not with this defense. Maybe 3-2.

One less turnover against LAC and we take that game.

[Chief Pote]

Could have picked 5...or 10

[KCTitus]

I find it humorous that people post 'hey that one turnover could have meant a win', or 'had the chiefs done this they would have won'...

it's the same thing we ALL used to say about the Chiefs ad nauseum for the better part of 20 years. And yet, we're doing it today as a way of propping up a shit team.

I dont know what happened, but I do know this team is going nowhere because of the defense and the offense cannot execute. The only prayer this team has is a major attitude and mental adjustment and the defense gets a couple of stops a game and the offense is pristine.

Mahomes looked like ass last Sunday...like ass. I think he's got a confidence problem because I've seen him play better in lesser games.

Maybe they've bought into their own press clippings...a good humbling might go a long way to get back to the Superbowl.

[JakeF]

I'm going to blame the success of the team on the problems. Years of drafting at the bottom, trading draft picks, missing on picks, etc. I watched some of the Bengals/Packers game and others; a lot of teams have some really good players. Watching the Colts/Ravens just makes me sad to see teams with so many playmakers when my Chiefs only seem to have three.

As far as Andy goes; he has nothing left to prove. He's given so much to football and, in my opinion, his family life has suffered.

Football is a great escape from the daily grind; I can imagine being one of the linebackers and laying a hit on an idiot co-worker.

I just hope none of the big three on the team gets injured; other players really need to start picking up the slack, Kelce isn't getting any younger and he gets beat up on every play.
Dorsey didn't build the team that went to back-to-back Super Bowls while drafting at the top.
Kelce was a 3rd round pick
Chris Jones a 2nd round pick (6th pick?)
Tyreek Hill in the 5th round
Kareem Hunt in the 3rd round
Fisher was the high pick (People around here think he sucks)
Mahomes we traded up for

None of these guys were about picking high, they were about identifying talent.

[Megatron96]

How can you be off while having your highest completion % by 5 pts and your second highest YPA (only .2 off your career high) while leading the league in TDs? That's where he was going into Sunday night.

The expectations are just other worldly is the biggest issue.

Well, Mahomes does have nearly twice as many INTs this season through just 5 weeks as he did through the entire 2020 season. Little bit of a red flag there.

And he has just flat overthrown several receivers; throws that he ordinarily can drill between the numbers with his eyes closed, right?

And if we're really honest, he has made some poor decisions with the ball on more than a couple occasions, so I think it is fair to say that he's a little off.

If you want to just fly by the numbers, okay. Nothing necessarily wrong with that. But I've had several "Wtf is he thinking?" moments this season watching Chiefs games this season, and I'm 100% sure that I'm not alone.

[comochiefsfan]

Dorsey didn't build the team that went to back-to-back Super Bowls while drafting at the top.
Kelce was a 3rd round pick
Chris Jones a 2nd round pick (6th pick?)
Tyreek Hill in the 5th round
Kareem Hunt in the 3rd round
Fisher was the high pick (People around here think he sucks)
Mahomes we traded up for

None of these guys were about picking high, they were about identifying talent.Some people will never stop apologizing for Clark and Andy's yes man.

[JakeF]

I seriously doubt that. Reid loves coaching, he'll do it until he physically or mentally can't anymore.
He got his Super Bowl win and another appearance as a bonus. He is about having fun now. He does love to coach, but you need more than that to win. You need focus and determination. I'm not sure if he has that right now. It appears that his decisions right now are based on enjoyment of the process more than winning.

He has full control, nobody can touch him or tell him what to do. Clark would have to threaten to fire him to force any drastic change. We will have to stink for years before Clark will consider firing him. With Mahomes at QB, we will be in the media spotlight and have a decent team. The fans love Andy, they won't revolt against him. Reid knows he isn't getting fired.

[Hydrae]

I find it humorous that people post 'hey that one turnover could have meant a win', or 'had the chiefs done this they would have won'...

it's the same thing we ALL used to say about the Chiefs ad nauseum for the better part of 20 years. And yet, we're doing it today as a way of propping up a shit team.

I dont know what happened, but I do know this team is going nowhere because of the defense and the offense cannot execute. The only prayer this team has is a major attitude and mental adjustment and the defense gets a couple of stops a game and the offense is pristine.

Mahomes looked like ass last Sunday...like ass. I think he's got a confidence problem because I've seen him play better in lesser games.

Maybe they've bought into their own press clippings...a good humbling might go a long way to get back to the Superbowl.

I think that is a lot of it, right there. Things have been fairly easy the last couple of years. Now we will see how these guys respond to a little adversity. Do they still want it enough?

[KCTitus]

He got his Super Bowl win and another appearance as a bonus. He is about having fun now. He does love to coach, but you need more than that to win. You need focus and determination. I'm not sure if he has that right now. It appears that his decisions right now are based on enjoyment of the process more than winning.

He has full control, nobody can touch him or tell him what to do. Clark would have to threaten to fire him to force any drastic change. We will have to stink for years before Clark will consider firing him. With Mahomes at QB, we will be in the media spotlight and have a decent team. The fans love Andy, they won't revolt against him. Reid knows he isn't getting fired.

Im not sure I disagree...it's similar to Lamar. He had his SB in 69 and didnt care much about going back as much as putting on a good show. I sincerely hope that's not the case, KC has a lot of talent and it would be a shame to waste just because they got a SB win. We all want more than one win.

[KCTitus]

I think that is a lot of it, right there. Things have been fairly easy the last couple of years. Now we will see how these guys respond to a little adversity. Do they still want it enough?

Thanks Hydrae...is that what they call the SB hangover? Not sure, but I got to believe that this team does not like getting embarrassed like they have. Lets hope they respond.