SF wasn't ever gonna move Young.

Who knows? Maybe Alex is a late bloomer and we got a steal.

Wouldn't that be nice?

That would be one LATE blooming mother****er. He'll help win some regular season games, people will get excited, then the eventual shellacking in the postseason. This book has been written, adapted for screenplay, and shot on location several times already.

People are most definitely saying that, including the person I quoted and GoChiefs, among others.

Look, I'm not predicting that they're going to win a championship with this roster (although it would be nice!). But they've upgraded nearly every position nicely and added solid depth, which is something they've been lacking, in what seems like, forever.

Unlike Milkman, I'm positive that this coaching staff is the best we've seen seen Vermeil and it's likely to be the best since Marty's heyday. It won't take much to improve this defense and using an attacking scheme with the athletes on this roster should provide huge dividends.

This team had a 1,500 yard running back last year on a team that couldn't pass. The offensive line is a year older and the additions of Schwartz and Fisher should be serious upgrades (and if Stephenson or Allen beats out Schwartz, it's likely to help long term stability on the line).

The bottom line is that this team's roster has been upgraded and the coaching staff is a complete 180 in terms of past success. I believe in the old 10 year rule set by John Madden, so the only knock I have on Reid is that he stayed too long in Philly.

Rich Gannon
Steve Young
Trent Green

That's what we are hoping for. A guy that wasnt good until his late 20s...hopefully Alex continues to improve and gives us some fun years.

The plan of trading for a backup QB worked out well twice. Montana and Green were not failures.
Montana made us SB worthy. It was just bad luck that he got hurt. He was old though.

Trent was absolutely worth 2 1st round picks. Our offense was elite for a good 4 years with him. The reason the DV years were failures was because of King Carl and DV drafting horrible players most of the time.

Anyone remember the offseason when all we did was bring back Gunter and not sign any FA's to fix the defense? Enough said.

I know every single one of you would love it if Alex Smith turned out to be like Trent was in the early 2000's.

No

Do you mean the next Gunther in a negative or positive way?

Considering that 90% of what Milk posts these days is negative, I'd say negative.

In retrospect, Gunther was better than the last three coaches and IMO, by a wide margin.

Takes a chance on someone in the league, someone drafted high, or a free agent?

He was a disappointment but I still agree

Gunther's biggest mistake was signing Jon Baker. Had he signed Joe Nedney, he would coached a playoff team.

Green was the best QB this team has had. That trade was ok. Where Vermiel and Co. Went wrong was not grooming a guy behind Green.

Their drafts were god awful in general though. They were always better off trading picks for players then they were drafting.

I find it funny people think trading for Green was a failure. He did exactly what he was supposed to do, the defense wasn't good enough

Teams draft QB's all the time and dont win a SB with them but that's a success according to CP.

You trade for a QB and have a chance to win and its failure/CP.

We have done this before it didnt work/CP

I wonder what Brown's fans think about drafting QBs, they seem to have drafted about 5 first rounders and haven't done shit, by CP logic they need to trade for a QB because what they have done hasn't worked.

http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploa...t-eastwood.gif

Son of a...bitch. If I ever become like you two, I authorize Bugeater and Frazod to take me to the nearest landfill, put a bullet in my mother****ing head, and stuff me in an old refrigerator.

And I would imagine that most intelligent Browns fans feel like that they are least putting an effort forth, though probably not getting the best pick possible from the FO.

Trading that high of a first rounder for 5 years at quarterback is only deemed a good or bad trade in playoff wins.

That's nothing against Trent Green at all, it's gauging the trade and how it effected the teams success.

Sorry, but some of us still think the Chiefs should win playoff games...Green played in 1 playoff game in 5 years.

The right decision (as it almost always is) would have been to draft Drew Brees with that pick.

LMAO ****ing dumbass

Trent Green DID work out as planned.

Unfortunately, DV and Carl forgot that you need at least some semblance of a defense to win a championship.

You know what they say about hindsight.

Also, you know damn well that the Chiefs not winning in the post season had nothing to do with Green. 3 consecutive 4000 yrd seasons.

Two top 5 offenses is FAIL?...

1st No-punt playoff game in NFL history = QB's fault...

Trent Green is not the reason we didn't win any playoff games so that argument is not valid.

You are using the assumption that we draft Brees and then draft enough good players so that 3- 5 years later we have a contending team.

Knowing what you know now, yea that would have been the thing to do, at that time it ended up as a 4 year window where we had one of the best offenses in the league if not the best. We failed to win PO games because of Greg Robinson and Vermiel being too loyal to his guys.

The big mistake was not developing a guy behind Green. They were in win now mode and mortgage the future. It had nothing to do with being "scared" to draft a QB as people here like to imply.

The problem I had with Trent Green was the short window of opportunity he gave us. With the piss poor defense we had we never could get the pieces in place and then Trent Green went down and was never the same.

That is why I want to draft a quarterback so we can open up a long term duration of opportunity and build a team around that quarterback. Not build the team and squeeze life out of players on a two year chance the retread is who they say he is.

I think Alex Smith will really help to improve our defensive numbers, yet the defense will get the credit for bailing him out in games. It is really amazing what a "game manager" QB will do for defensive stats. The bottom line is that a "game manager" QB keeps your defense off the field--which in turn automatically helps your defensive stats. Our defense will be dramatically improved for four reasons: 1) Better coaching, 2) Better scheme, 3) Better players, 4) Better play by the QB.

I think the Chiefs will do really pretty well this year, but people will bitch and moan about ASmith saying, "Uh, well, just imagine what we could of done if we had drafted and groomed our own QB."

People don't seem to understand that this is a TEAM sport. Reid and Dorsey are finding the parts/players that fit their concept of how they want their team to play. QB is the most important position on the team but some QBs fit a team scheme better than others-- and yes, that means in certain schemes a dink and dunk game managing QB will be more effective than a sexy cannon armed QB in other schemes.

I think Reid's scheme will be methodical, surgical and time consuming--and Alex Smith is the perfect QB for that type of scheme. I don't think Reid and Dorsey were blowing smoke when they said they believe that ASmith can be a future Hall of Famer--in their particular scheme he may very well wind up with a bust in Canton. Is it a guarentee? No. Far from it. However, if there is one scheme where he has any chance at all, it will be under Reid.

Between our revamped O-line, our upgraded TEs, Bowe, and the ever dangerous Charles, our offense will be a force to be reckoned with over the next few years. ASmith is a cerebral QB; he understands the game and he knows how to get the ball to his playmakers and how to put them in a position to make plays. He doesn't have to do everything himself. There is nothing wrong with being a good manager; a good manager in business knows how to get the most out of the strengths of those people he hires and surrounds himself with-- in football, it is the same thing. A good game managing QB not only increases the productivity of those players on offense, but those on defense as well by keeping them rested, ready to attack and forcing the other team into a one dimensional offense because they are playing catch up both in time and points.

My anger in this area is directed, intensely, at Carl and DV. They made NO legit attempts to improve the defense.

I agree with the defense comments.

And as far as "game managers" they're called that not because of what they add but because of what they don't take away. It's because they're first job is to not **** up.

Smith is excellent at that...

How many quarterbacks did Will Shields have to protect and block for?

If he had one quarterback during his time that we drafted I bet we would have been in better shape to knock down the door in the playoffs.

Ryan Sims, Eddie Freeman, Junior Siavii, Shawn Barber and Patrick Surtain. Several first and second round draft choices, trades and free agents. They fired Robinson and replaced him with Gunther.

They made legitimate attempts. That cannot be contested. The problem is they never found the answer.

Such a great post. Thank you for it. :clap:

Props as well to folks like Marcellus, Dane McC, RunKC ( and even BossChief for at least keeping an open mind ) for keeping this place worthy of reading. :clap:

What? Do drafted quarterbacks play defense also?

Of course not on defense duh. They would have been able to put the team together better with consistency from the quarterback & build around him. We need a quarterback that is going be around more than 4-5 years that gets better with the team each year.

you and sorter can do lezbo things together

People keeping saying this.

Why?

He's bad on third down.

He doesn't put up points.

So...why?

Trent Green certainly didn't improve our defense. In fact one of our better defenses here during his time was during his first season.

How did alex smith, in any way shape or form **** this team? He hasn't done jack shit to this team yet, except from what every body on the TEAM,, and in the front office has said, bring nothing but POSITIVE to the team......So, epic fail, gonna fail?
Uh, except that Alex Smith never plays bad enough for his team to get BLOWN out. Hes not matt cassel. He has proven one thing. He is extremely clutch, and no, im not talking about the saints game. Im talking about the OTHER 6 come from behind victories he played a crucial part in that season.
Well, I assume that I can speak for the browns fans. We worshipped the drafting of Quinn. Fail, FAIL, FAIL. We hated the drafting of Weeden, I nearly threw up. But, most are cautiously optimistic, that after we realized what a poop bag that shurmur was, that if Chud can make Derek Anderson into a pro bowler, that he probably can get something useful out of Weeden, even if he is older than ALEX SMITH.
most browns fans, think that the Chiefs have really improved.
He doesn't put up points. Hmmmm, interesting. 70 percent completion percentage last year. Guess what that means. He doesn't turn the ball over. Which means that he keeps the chains moving. Also means that every possession ends in a kick, punt, which isn't a bad thing when you have COLQUITT, or a fg, or a touch down. Which means your defense is not on the field. If you win the time of possession, and the turn over battles, you will win far more often than you lose. I know you are functionally reeruned, but try not to let it show so often.

How can you even ask this question if you claim to have any fundamental idea about football?

No, he doesn't.

The 2011 49ers were:

30th in passing first downs
31st in third down conversion percentage

If that is what the 2013 Kansas City Chiefs can expect, **** Alex Smith.

People are going to be sorely disappointed when they find out Alex Smith is almost as bad as Matt Cassel on third down.

I mean ****, 2010 Matt Cassel BLEW AWAY 2011 Alex Smith in terms of third down conversion percentage and passing first downs.

He was brought here to immediately end the turnover-fest and be smart enough to know exactly which short target to throw to when open.

That's it.

He's a sell-able stop-gap they hope can be more than a stop-gap.

Dorsey picked the guy with the least downside...

Disagree. Brees at 12 or wherever they picked would have been a huge reach. The trade was a success because of the level of production Green provided.

The only upgrade Smith provides is that he's more accurate within 10 yards, more mobile, and doesn't turn it over.

Yes.

When properly used.

That said Andy wants to make him ****ing Brett Fah-ver-uh...

:shake:

You stated that Smith won't help the defense. That's complete nonsense. By not turning over the ball on their own side of the field constantly, he'll help the defense. By not throwing interception after interception, he'll help the defense. By not constantly fumbling in Chiefs territory, he'll help the defense.

You have absolutely no idea how well Alex Smith will perform under Reid, Ault, Childress or Pedersen, yet you're assuming the worst.

Why?

So? Cassel made mistakes at critical junctures time and time again. Alex Smith led his team to a playoff berth and win.

Stats do not tell the entire story, yet you're using them to create your own narrative.

I think they'll run a spread offense where Smith will make quick short passes. I can see him being somewhat productive between the 20's.

:rolleyes:

Yep Brees would have been a huge reach.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/foo...ckdraft_april/
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/foo...ckdraft_march/

Or the other mocks
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/foo...ckdraft_final/
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sport...draft/mock.htm

That's just a quick google search that all had Brees in the first round. Hell he went 32.

**** I hope not.

Quick decisions are NOT his thing.

I can see him protecting the 3...

glad you mention "sad" because every time you post cassel and smith are the same guy I get a lil sad at your lacking ability to recognize a QB from and idiot baseball player that was put into the role of NFL QB by a guy who was also lacking the ability to recognize a QB from and idiot baseball player.

Brees wasn't selected until the second round. Yes taking him at 12 was a huge reach. Trent Green was a top 10 possibly top 5 for most his time here. I know Chiefsplanet loves revisoonist history though. If yall want to bitch about not taking an elite QB Aaron Rogers makes the most sense. Again there was nothing wrong with the Green trade. If the Chiefs drafted Rogers or Croyle would have panned out we aren't even having this discussion.

:thumb:

I didn't say they were the same guy.

The similarities are scary as **** though.

No, I'm not.

I'm merely pointing out that Alex Smith doesn't help defenses like a top tier QB would.

He's not doing shit for our defense that Matt Cassel couldn't do in 2010.

That's all Matt did in 2010. He didn't turn it over. If that's all Alex is going to do, that's not enough. You want to help the defense? Own third down and extend drives.

That is something Alex Smith has shown time and time again that he can't do.

That's not what you said. You said you couldn't figure out why people think Smith would improve the defense.

That's speculation.

Regardless, this isn't the same team, personnel or coaching staff as 2010.

Extending drives will, of course, help the defense. Avoiding numerous costly fumbles and turnovers in their own territory will help them even more.

So, he was able to lead his team to the playoffs in 2011 and start 2012 with a winning record and the best QB rating in the league. But yet, he's unable to extend drives?

Why do you place the blame solely on his shoulders? Do you believe that he had the personnel to extend drives on third down? Do believe that he had the correct play calls in order to extend drives? Or did he butt-fumble himself into mistakes constantly and if so, how was his QB rating so high and his team successful the past two years?

You're taking stats and creating a narrative in which Alex Smith's play was the reason why they didn't go to the Super Bowl in 2011, why Alex Smith was traded and why Alex Smith won't improve or lead the Chiefs to the playoffs in Kansas City.

It's a false narrative.

You're being a homer, Dane. The 49ers have been at or near the bottom of the league in third down conversions Alex Smith's ENTIRE CAREER.

If it happens again here in KC, he's going to be a huge disappointment.

If you want to put your head in the sand, fine. Don't accuse those of us taking an objective view of this turd as being somehow ignorant of something, though.

Whatever you say, Mecca, Mr. Absolute.

Clearly, you do not understand the definition of the word "Homer".

I am merely pointing out the holes in the false narrative that you created and continue to propagate on this site.

This is laughable. "Objective view"? You haven't had an "objective view" of this team in years. You've acted like a jerkoff to anyone that's had an opposing view and labeled them as a "homer" or "True Fan", which is ironic considering that YOU were the very definition of those words for the first six years you spent on this website.

Again, you are taking statistics and creating your own narrative. You're not taking into account that the 49ers have had an average to below average receiving corp. You're not taking into account the plays that were called (and don't get me started on the final 49er's drive of the Super Bowl: I've never witnessed such pathetic play calling in my life) and you're not taking into consideration the opposition or what he was asked to do in those situations.

And furthermore, your assessment of Geno Smith, his value as perceived by the NFL, its scouts, GM's, etc., could not have been further off the mark. Yet, you're attempting to convince anyone and everyone that will listen to you that you're right about Alex Smith, based on PFF numbers?

It's a false narrative at best and disingenuous at worst.

Objective? LMAO

The only thing I see happening is you flip flopping mid season or sooner as usual.

I see this thread hasn't changed much...

There's nothing "false narrative" about poiniting out that Alex Smith sucks on third down.

That doesn't help a defense.

You're running away from your original quote.

And there is no way to ascertain whether or not Alex Smith has the same problem in Kansas City as he did in San Fran until there's actual data to analyze.

imagine a 900 post thread extolling the merits of Applebees....

Nope. Same handful of you whiny bitches complaining about something that has yet to occur.

Oh, sure. He's magically going to become a guy who can throw the ball down the field and get rid of the ball quickly.

After 8 years in the league.

Sure, Dane.

Ride on your steed of homerism!

http://irnub.com/content/wp-content/...rn-rainbow.jpg

I didn't realize that he'll be in the same offense with the same personnel and be asked to do the same exact things in KC as he was in San Francisco.

You're attention whoring is boring but at least you've got a follower in SweetDickWillie/ROR/DCS.

You must be proud.

In 2012 San Francisco was 14th in the league in the number of 1st down attempts. They were 30th in the league in the number of 3rd down attempts. Alex Smith owned third down by not needing them. He tended to get the first down on either the first or second down. I know as Chiefs fans that is a foreign concept, but some QBs can actually do that....

And you whiny bitches that are doing the same thing

LMAO

OK.

This is getting dumb. Every QB in the league has to convert on third down in every game 6 or 7 times at least.

Also, pointing to 2012 stats is weak since Alex didn't even finish the whole season. It paints an incomplete picture.

Who's whining?

Since when is taking an optimistic approach, whining?

You whine about the people being objective and pointing out undeniable truths.

Objective?

ROFL

I get it, I'm just a silly homer.

Yes, I'm being objective about Alex Smith.

If I was being unobjective I would say he completely sucks and he will kill this team.

He won't. He just won't do much for it beyond "hey thanks for not ****ing up the rest of the team bro."

You're whining about the negative people. Optimism (aka Homerism) doesn't make you right, although you seem to feel the need to stress that you are. Hence why I quit arguing with yous types, its a waste of time. October will be here soon enough to solve the argument. I'm just waiting with anticipation on what the excuses will be.

YESSSSSSS

You have said that he's the same as Cassel. I say that he will certainly kill the team if that is the case.

Incorrect.

Passing shot here, but isn't the trend in competitive avenues is to be naturally aggressive and then learn to be more guarded than the reverse?

This is the dumbest post I've read in a month.

Optimism does not equal "Homerism". That's ridiculous.

Was it "Homerism" to expect that Eric Berry, Jammal Charles and Tony Moeaki return to form in 2012? No, it was not. It was optimism.

I'm optimistic that Andy Reid and his talented offensive staff, along with the acquisition of Fisher, Schwartz, Avery, Fasano and Smith, can put together a solid Top 15 offense in 2013.

That does not make me, or anyone else that views it similarly, a "Homer". And if you believe that does, you're as dumb as SweetDickWillie, which I hope is not possible.

If the chiefs go to the super bowl, some on here will claim A. Smith rode the coat tails of "insert coach or players here". They look to argue no matter what and actually hope he falls flat on his face. Those are some real good fans.

Believe what you want. Just start stockpiling the excuses. You'll need them.

Some maybe tooge, but not me. Would I liketo see them go to the SB (and win of course), absolutely. And I'd be the first to admit I was wrong. We have seen this same story over and over again however, and know how its gonna end.

Thanks for addressing your own comment.

You're stupid. Thanks for confirming it.

Oh, and thanks for redefining the words "optimism" and "homer".

I'll be sure to alert Webster's.

Ooooh I'm stupid. Dane says so! Ooooh! :crybaby::sulk::ZZZ:

This is the shit I'm talking about.

What are you talking about?

All I see is nonsense and a person that lacks any semblance of cognitive ability.

You're worse than GoChiefs. At least he can formulate sentences.