Traitor!

It's actually a pretty nice place to catch a game....and close to bars. :D

Be sure to remind them that their team is playing a basketball game that day.

There is no answer to the question, it's a ****ing crapshoot. A luck-filled single elimination tournament that is comprised of 68 teams that can lose a game at any time. Why any supposed knowledgeable NCAA fan would judge the strength of a conference solely based on that, I'm not exactly sure.

And now I know you're trolling for an argument. The fact is that the B12 is one of the strongest conferences in the country and has been for a long time now. If you're trying to diminish KU's accomplishments on that basis, you're simply being ridiculous.

Nobody can compete with our program.

Texas should be the one to test us year in and out with the insane amount of talent in that state.

Maybe Okie State or ISU can step up to the plate and beat us every third time we play or something. Doubtful.

Well, yeah.

There's been what, 50 non-KU tourney teams since our streak began? Bad luck I guess that zero made the FF. even Butler and VCU and George Mason made it during that time.


The critical point though is that we have no legit peer and that's why the streak has continued. It really doesn't matter that our #7 is better than the ACC #7 in a given year, since that's not our competitor.

Yes, I suppose it was. Such is the nature of a crapshoot.


We have no legit peer because Kansas basketball under Bill Self has been consistently the best program in the country for the last 11 years. Only Coach K and Duke could even claim to be anything close to what Self has done.

This is a bit like shitting on Tiger Woods for dominating his competition to the extent he has since 1997. Are his 14 majors somehow less impressive because Phil Mickelson only managed 5? Should he have brought his level down during his prime to even it up?

The Tiger comparison is pretty lame because he's competing against the whole field. Self doesn't win 10 straight NCAA titles by any stretch, in fact he's been mediocre in March. If you look at the probability chart by seed, Self is about average.


And if he's so-so in March....which he indisputably is.....what does that say about how good we really have been? The truth is KU & Duke have separated themselves from the pack but that margin is extremely narrow. Extremely. And winning the Big 12 isn't the signature achievement that Coach K's 11 Final Fours are, or Pitino's 9-0 record IN Sweet 16s is (or whatever the number is) or even Boeheim's 900+ wins.


Self has 2 final fours in 10 years at KU. That rate is lower than Roy and Larry at KU. Even Self admits: "You can't have a great season with a poor March"

FIRE SELF!!!

Derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp derp.

Derp.

And this is where I take my leave. I don't argue with idiots or trolls. That especially applies when dealing with a combination of the two.

Please do everyone a favor and reserve your nonsense spewing to the conference realignment thread going forward.

High five brah!

Lol, you must be new. The majority of us have been ignoring PB for months.

You can ignore me, but you can't ignore Bill's own quote. He understands the reality about perception even if you don't.

:LOL:

Perry Ellis sucks.

Don't be a ****ing idiot.

I bet they lose at least 4 more if you include the NCAA Tournament.

Prison flopper never disappoints.

Greg Anthony thinks Embiid should stay in school

NEW YORK — Joel Embiid is projected by many to be the top pick in the NBA Draft, but NBA analyst Greg Anthony believes the Kansas freshman should spend at least one more year on campus.

“The guy I would hope wouldn’t come out would be Embiid because I don’t think he’s ready, I don’t think he’s polished enough,” Anthony told SNY.tv Thursday night at Madison Square Garden where he was doing the Cavaliers-Knicks game.

“[His] instincts aren’t where you want them to be. At this level, they don’t teach, they coach.”

Both Chad Ford and DraftExpress.com have the 7-foot Embiid projected as the No. 1 pick — with both having his Kansas teammate Andrew Wiggins at No. 2 — meaning it would be very hard for Embiid to stay in school.

Sources close to the Kansas program believe that Embiid himself may prefer to stay in school, but the opportunity may be too great for him to pass up (which, in turn, could open things up for Myles Turner to pick Kansas).

But Anthony disagrees.

“There’s a lot of guys who would’ve been the No. 1 pick [who stayed],” the former Knick point guard said. “I played with a guy [Larry Johnson] who would’ve been the No. 1 pick as a junior, he didn’t come out. You don’t have to because what I tell a lot of these young kids is, this is not for your first contract, this is for your second and your third.

“Our league drafts potential, it doesn’t draft a polished, finished product. I think a lot of these kids are really, really good and really talented but a lot of them could use another year.”

Anthony said the same logic applies to fellow freshmen studs Wiggins, Jabari Parker, Julius Randle and Aaron Gordon.

“I would say that Jabari’s probably the most polished of all of them,” Anthony said. “And listen, it’s gonna be hard for them not to come out, I get that part. But it wouldn’t hurt any of them to come back to school.

“And listen, I’m a proponent of guys being able to come out of high school. I think these kids are more talented than the draft we had a year ago, but you want them to be a little bit more polished when they come here.

“You look at [Anthony] Bennett, you look at [Ben] McLemore, they weren’t all necessarily ready. Michael Carter-Williams had two years and didn’t play his freshman year. It’s not that some guys aren’t ready, it’s that some guys just need more time to refine their game to be ready to make an impact because remember all those guys are going to be going to teams that basically aren’t that good and they’re going to be expected to produce right away.”

Syracuse coach Jim Boeheim previously told SNY.tv that none of these freshmen are “transcendent” players the way LeBron James and Tim Duncan were, and Anthony agreed.

“In that respect, I don’t think the draft is as good as a lot of people are saying,” he said. “Look how good Kyrie Irving is, how many more games are they winning? And ultimately, that’s what you base it on is, can you come in and make my team better? Can we win because of you and that’s how I view it.”

Some teams, like the Boston Celtics and Philadelphia 76ers, appear to be tanking and have two first-round picks, but Anthony said even multiple picks won’t transform those teams by themselves.

“Trust me, they can get three first-round picks next year, those kids aren’t going to come in and make that kind of a difference,” Anthony said. “Michael Carter-Williams is having a great year, how good is Philly?

“To Coach Boeheim’s point, those kids are not transcendent talents. You can come in and have statistics, but you’re not necessarily going to have an impact in determining who wins and who loses.”

http://zagsblog.com/articles/greg-an...tay-in-school/

It would actually be pretty interesting to see how Duke, Kentucky, and KU would all be if no one lost anyone to the NBA.

Thoughts on our game tomorrow? They have a thick front court.

I think it really comes down to whether or not Wiggins has fully turned the corner. If he has, we might not lose another game.

Our back court is a lot better than their's. That'll probably be what decides the game. I'm anxious to see how Embiid does against Ridley. They rebound really well.

I believe…… …….that we will win.

I'd say by 5-6 points.

We could really use Black in this game.

Depends on the foul calls IMO. If they let them beat the shit out of us, it could be a long night.

I can provide you the NCAA tourney probability grid. He's perfectly average based on seed. He's 5-4 vs teams seeded equal or better to his. Yes we can say he's been more successful in March than the vast majority but vs peers (Cal, K, Pitino, Roy, Donovan etc) he's almost identical.


Don't get your panties in a wad. Math can be fun. We all like Bill Self.

He's identical to five of the best coaches in college (or history) and to win a championship in the last decade?

Yeah... That's ****ing "so-so" you twat.

Ya know...that guy shows up in flashes.

For being a 5th yr SR, he sure does get into foul trouble a lot, and many times they're stupid fouls. You'd think he'd be smarter than that considering the amount of experience he has.

So who would win this matchup?

An All-Roy vs. All-Self matchup:

All-Roy
PG-Jacques Vaughn
SG-Kirk Hinrich
SF-Paul Pierce
PF-Nick Collison
C-Raef LaFrentz

All-Self
PG-Mario Chalmers
SG-Ben McLemore
SF-Andrew Wiggins
PF-Thomas Robinson
C-Joel Embiid

It's a fun debate...and I'm bored. Would you go with the more experienced Roy team, or take Self's more athletic team, that while younger, could possibly hit a higher ceiling?

I know I'm not in this debate, but given the choices I'll take Self's team. But my God that'd be a great matchup to watch.

Are you sure thats Self's starting five?

Aldrich, Arthur, Rush, Tyshawn, EJ?

And then there's Simien, Langford, Boshee, Rex, Reed, Withey, Sheron Collins…

damn we've had a lot of great players...

Starters only, it's close (I'd want to wait a few years to see how everyone performs at the professional level), but I do believe Self's team has the edge if you include a bench.

Roy's Bench:
Jeff Boschee
Wayne Simien
Mark Randall
Drew Gooden
Scot Pollard

Self's Bench:
Sherron Collins
Brandon Rush
Darrell Arthur
Markieff Morris
Marcus Morris

With the two teams you present, I say they split a 10 game series.

My teams below would be better. But another fun thing is who would win a 10 game series between the 1997 team and the 2008 team? I think 2008 wins 6 out of 10, if not 7.

For the Self team, give me Sherron at point, Mario at the 2, Rush on the wing, Arthur at the 4, and JoJo at the 5. My guards would guard like mad and score inside and out at will, and facilitate for a team that could run Roys into the ground. My 2, 3, & 5 would be beasts on defense. My 1, 2 & 3 could shred from three. My 4 & 5 would be able to dominate physically down low, but would also have finesse to outplay bigger players when needed. Arthur was so much better than people remember. And Collins and Chalmers ripped the heart out of so many opponents. Rush was great defensively and was a deadly 3-point shooter. And Embiid would flourish with these four guys around him.

For Roy, the pg is a tricky position, because although you could say Vaughn was the best, woulf his style really fit with Kirk. Because you have to have him at the 2. So, I would probably take Miles over Vaughn for that reason. Miles may be better defensively too. Then give me PP on the wing, obviously. The 4 & 5 are tough as well. LaFrentz always seemed more like a 4 to me, and in my memory Pollard usually played the 5. So, I would go with the two best post players in LaFrentz and Collison and let them rotate at the 5 as needed.

With these two teams, I feel that Self wins 7 out of 10, if not more.

Or how about Browns team with Pritchard, Newton, Kellogg, Marshall and Manning? They definitely lead in the NBA GM category with 2. Ok, maybe Newton wasn't a GM, he is the VP for the Wizards.

The only real change I'd make to Self's starting 5 would be Rush over McLemore, just because Rush was a better defender, and he's a little more mature on the court and was the better overall player. McLemore is more athletic, but it's not by that much. Rush is no slouch when it comes to athleticism.

But when it comes to depth, Self beats Roy's bench by a mile, and that was done in 11 years compared to Roy's 15. Self has trumped Roy in terms of recruiting while being at KU, esp in the big man dept.

Roy's bench:

PG-Adonis Jordan
PG-Jeff Boschee
PG-Aaron Miles
SG-Billy Thomas
SG-Rex Walters
SG-Michael Lee
SF-Kenny Gregory
SF-Keith Langford
PF-Wayne Simien
PF-Scot Pollard
PF-Drew Gooden
C-Greg Ostertag

Self's bench:

PG-Russell Robinson
PG-Sherron Collins
PG-Tyshawn Taylor
SG-Brandon Rush (or McLemore)
SG-Josh Selby
SG-Tyrel Reed (one of the best shooter's I've ever seen, hopefully Frankamp takes that title away)
SF-Xavier Henry
SF-Wayne Selden
PF-Julian Wright
PF-Darrell Arthur
PF-Darnell Jackson
PF-Marcus Morris
PF-Markieff Morris
PF-Perry Ellis
C-Jeff Withey
C-Cole Aldrich

Unless I heard wrong I'm pretty sure Jalen Rose just said KU didn't have any expectations this year, they're playing above that and the rest of the B12 will catch up with them eventually by the end of conference play. Love college gameday lol.

Yeah, that's what he said.

The only opinion I give a shit about on Gameday is Bilas. That dude most always knows whats up. Reese isn't bad. Digger and Jalen..meh, just filler for the other two.

I don't see Embiid starting over Whithey. Comparing Whithey's senior season to Embiid's freshman year so far.

Jalen is excellent when it comes to the nba, but a lot of guys just aren't passionate enough about CBB to really get it.

They all kind of seem unprepared and don't do as much research as they used to. The teams and players they study you can tell, they give good analysis. But when Reese throws out some teams they haven't taken a good look at it shows lol. I'm not really faulting them for that, it's like every other pregame show. And the focus is on the two teams on primetime Saturday night anyway.

Lol

@CrimsonBlueKU: Oh, Doug... #kubball RT @EyeOnCBB: Who are the guys picking straight up and against @kenpomeroy’s spread? http://t.co/V1pvecka2j

Keep up the good fight. He might be right on this one finally.

He's coaching at a peer program to them, also. You twat.

In light of the discussion about Self and his NCAA Tournament resume, there was a good discussion about it over at Phog if anyone is interested.

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=172&f=2481&t=12642997

We've had a lot of great college players, but we need more NBA impact guys. We produce a lot of role players. I'd guess that the best NBA player we have out there now is probably Markieff Morris, with Paul's slip as he ages. We need another big name alum in the league, maybe it'll be Wiggins or Embiid.

Lzen you up for starting the game thread?

Already did. :thumb:

Whooooooops. You already did. :D

Not Mario or Xavier? You'd pick Kief at this point?

Yeah I'd say Mario is definitely an impact guy.

The end of this Wisconsin/tOSU game....LMAO

X was starting to really show how good he is but the injuries just never seem to go away. I'd say Kieff based on his versatility.

I agree with Markieff if were basing it off of this season. Hes has some really great games this year. Starting and coming off the bench.

Anyone watching Baylor/OSU?

Yeah. Baylor looking decent and OSU looking bad.

Osu has lived on the edge a few other games this year. They're not playing very well, but still winning games so there is that

55-48 Baylor on top right now. Smart has played like crap.

Knowing how the season has played out this far, wonder if smart wishes he would have entered the draft?

Smart plays like he weighs 95 pounds. What a flopping little bitch.

Really rooting for Baylor to pull this one out.

Baylor up 63-62 with 4:16 to go.

He'll be a top pick regardless. If he decided not to go out once, though, why wouldn't he make that same decision again this year?

Baylor is gonna win.

Not if Brown keeps hitting those.

My main worry at this point is when we have a game in March where shots don't fall, will our defense be able to keep us in the game?

Anyone enjoying rolling the league every year should turn on Syracuse and see what an awesome league is. When Lousiville joins too....I'm jealous.

Just for proper reference to the troll's post above me, the B12 is ranked higher in both KenPom and Sagarin this year than the ACC. It's a far more difficult conference this season.

Selden and Tharpe can't stop the drive. Gotta keep working at that.

Man, i thought you'd be happy after today... KU losing "makes the league better" and also gives you ammo to provoke the folks here.

ROFL PB is such a Sagarin guy this whole time and hasn't manage to refute the Sagarin argument one time. Didn't even try. I bet every time he reads it, he cusses like a sailor.

Facts don't lie: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/ncaab...14/conference/

Meh, it's a conference road loss to a Top 25 team. We've seen worse. Just flat on effort and execution in the first half, and the gulf was far too wide in the second.

Only starry-eyed lunatics expected a perfect conference record, and we aren't going to have too many nights when we shoot that poorly. Defense is kind of soft, but that's the beauty of playing so many young guys.

On to Monday.

Why? The topic is about wanting teams that can do something in March and I doubt anyone does this year. Like always.

Not to win, it ain't.

Quite a game here.

Crazy last minute or so. Jabari and Jefferson both have fouled out.

Cues is pissing it away. After Parker Jefferson and Dawkins got 4 with 10 left cuse should have laid it on them.

This might be the best NCAA game all year. Entertaining stuff.