They can't cut Schwartz without an injury settlement.

The can't cut Fisher without an injury settlement.

Both players have to AGREE to said settlement, the Chiefs can't unilaterally set the terms.

I don't get why people don't understand this.

Yep.

I don't expect this offseason to be like 2019, for example. They'll address the needs but it won't likely be "flashy".

As long as we can just stabalize the offensive line we have a qb who can buy time and make plays with anyone.

I said it WON'T be like 2019. ;)

I didn't edit the post on time!

That’s what I’ve said all along.

Maybe you were agreeing with me...

How quick did dj come back from his Achilles?

Well the first time was on opening day of the 2014 season. He came back to have one of his best seasons in 2015.

He ruptured his Achilles the 2nd time in the first week of December in 2016. He still started 15 games the next year.

Need some clarity here though: DJ was not good in 2017 but it was because:

A. He was 35
B. It was his 2nd Achilles injury
C. He was pretty well done anyway

All the Eric Fisher fear is a bit odd. I think he could definitely be back by mid season. I do think it’s odd that he hasn’t had surgery.

Did he not need it? Did he have the surgery and we weren’t told?

Maybe I missed that news

Restructures can be hampering IF the deal that's being restructured came with an initial big signing bonus. Because you have leftover prorated bonus as well as the new prorated bonus to account for.

But WHEN you plan for flexibility in restructuring - like the Chiefs clearly did with Jones and Mahomes, it just becomes a new feature of the contract.

Yes, restructuring Mahomes' 21 roster bonus moves cap dollars from 21 down the road, and yes, eventually you're going to have some really large cap hits with him.

But the whole point of that deal was to give the team flexibility year to year. In a year where they're in good shape against the cap, they can eat a bigger hit from him. In years where they need more, they can restructure his roster bonus and push it.

That's the beauty of the initial deal WITHOUT the signing bonus.

Same thing with Jones, except you're not pushing things as far down the line. He has practically no signing bonus, so if you restructure $20M of his base salary, you create $13M of cap room in 2021.

Between restructuring those $40M of roster bonuses into signing bonuses, the Chiefs are already under a projected $185M cap, with enough room to sign their rookie class. If the cap stays flat, they're in even better shape.

Extensions to Mathieu and Hill, even at rough market value, can create another $20M in room. An extension or injury settlement with Fisher would create room. If Schwartz retires, that creates room.

The Chiefs situation is not that of the Eagles and Saints, who were going to be in trouble against the cap BEFORE COVID, and who don't have a lot of flexibility.

The only thing I see that's an easy chunk for the Saints is cutting Kwon Alexander... but that only deals with like 1/4 of their cap issue (just to get under, let alone to sign rookies). They're going to have to do a lot of extensions on their big guys to try to move that money around.

Good luck.

I was. ;)

Veach actually even said in his pre-SB presser that they won’t be looking to sign a “$14-15m player” due to their increasing contracts already on the roster...

I don’t think an $8-10m type is out of the question though. WR, Edge, or OL.

Part of me thinks they will try to address WR by bringing Watkins back for pennies. I don’t love it but since Mahomes is rehabbing an injury, they may opt for continuity offensively.

**** Sammy Watkins. That dude is just robbing the team at this point.

There are some quality vet defensive ends who could be had in that 8-10 AAV threshold. I'm a fan of Carl Lawson and he could land in that range.

Watkins back on the same type of deal Robinson played under this season would be fine with me for continuity's sake, but you still need to make an investment in another option to prepare for Watkins' inevitable breakdown.

100%



I'd argue he's already reached the point of inevitable breakdown. The guy is never available. He can **** off. I'd rather have Robinson back than Watkins.

You just never know. That first year of the deal is always small. Let’s not forget that the man was trying to get Andrus Peat with $170 dollars in cap space last year LMAO

I mean if it’s for only a couple million and you also draft a WR... I could see bringing Watkins back. Might allow you to give a ‘bigger’ contract to a DE like Lawson or an OL rather than another WR.

But you can’t just bring Watkins back alone without adding another starting caliber WR on top of it.

I gotta say, I’m glad we didn’t get him too. Peat has been a major brokedick and not that great either.

I’d rather try to hit on an ascending free agent OL who isn’t going to cost us $10m+ AAV but might turn into that level of player once he gets here. Similar to Schwartz.

I know it’s a pipe dream but I’m still hoping Watt will take a $5m-ish deal to come win a ring and eat up 75%+ of our snaps at a DE spot next year.

Just incredibly hard to find guys who can be trusted to play on every single down and with him, we’d have two at DE. Not that he’s the only one available though. It’s actually a solid edge FA class currently, although Houston is not a real option. And I worry that some of the others are young enough that they will chase the money above all.

We made Schwartz one of the highest paid RTs at the time when he signed here.

Probably, but the deal was still super reasonable, like $30-35m over 5 years or something like that. Stupid good value before teams started recognizing that the RT is equally important to the LT.

It’s crazy.

Sammy Watkins has a span of a few games where he was a beast.

Other than that 4-5 game stretch to end 2019, hes been pretty much a non factor the rest of the way.

Well again I’m not gonna like it but I do think they’re bringing Sammy back. Can only hope that they get another WR in the draft + Calloway to fill in and do well when he inevitably gets hurt.

As for OL draft folks, your wish will be granted. Not sure if it will be an OT, but after next year only Niang, Allegretti and Durant are on payroll.

It’s a damn near gaurantee that these guys are taking one in the first 2 rds.

If Schwartz is done and it isn't looking promising Fish will be back in 2021 I think it makes a lot of sense to trade for Orlando Brown Jr. if Veach feels he is a franchise left tackle.

1.) Trade for Brown Jr.
2.) Draft a center with your 2nd rounder (Landon Dickerson)
3.) Resign Osemele if his health checks out
4.) Resign Remmers

Opener in 2021 your starting offensive line is Brown Jr., Osemele, Dickerson, LDT, Niang

Allegretti is depth on the interior and you have Remmers as your swing tackle. Brown Jr., Dickerson and Niang are your young core on the o-line moving forward.

Cap space saved moving on from Fish and Schwartz go after a legit WR #2 or another piece on the defensive line on a 1 year contract.

yep

I think they re-sign Sammy too.

If they’re going to make multiple changes on the OL, I can see them wanting continuity everywhere else.

As long as they still draft a WR in the first 4 rounds, I won’t hate it. I won’t really like it either.

Cant wait for them to bring Watkins back.

He’ll have his usual breakout game Week 1, disappear for the next 7 weeks and then get a nagging injury that keeps him out of the rest of the season.

At least we'll only be losing about $4M on the cap this time!

Silver linings...

:banghead:

I would rather they give Robinson a new deal, start him at the X and watch him run backwards 2 yards after a 10 yard gain.

I’m going to say this all offseason. **** Sammy Watkins. I appreciate the championship but the dude has no spot on this team.

Agreed.

I’d guess there will be a lot of incentive laden deals this year. So get Sammy on a cheap one I guess

I will be really pissed if that is all they do. This o-line needs a lot more work than that.

You should probably prepare yourself for some urine running down your back and leg.

I’m not happy with him at all either but if we’re talking strictly Watkins v. Robinson at the same price... at least I can trust Watkins to be capable of beating the man across from him IF he is ready to play in big games. I can trust him not to make boneheaded mistake after boneheaded mistake.

Among two meh options, I’ll take Watkins for his upside every time.

I think we see Tyreek extended, and Mathieu.

Reek has 2 years left on his current deal so there may be no better time to tack on a couple more. I’d rather extend him now at 27 y/o than at 28/29. Can open up some cap space that way.

Watkins is only 27? How is that possible

Who knows what he is in Reptilian years.

That is just like shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic.

Kansas City general manager Brett Veach said the team would "try" to re-sign unrestricted free agent Sammy Watkins.

Watkins could be a casualty of the league's decreased salary cap after he made $15.8 million in 2020, struggling through a range of injuries that cost him five games and parts of others. "Sammy is a big part of this offense and when he's healthy, we're better," Veach said. "If there's a way we can make it work again, we'll certainly try to do that." ESPN's Adam Teicher said the Chiefs re-signing Watkins this offseason would be a clear indication that the team does not see Mecole Hardman as an every-down wideout. Even if the Chiefs let Watkins walk, Hardman -- who ran costly incorrect routes at least twice in the team's Super Bowl loss -- wouldn't be guaranteed an every-down spot in the KC offense.

He’s just such a tease. When he’s healthy, the offense is at its best

He’s just not ever healthy

Not interested. Unreliable and played 19 snaps after taking a month off in the sb

If Sammy wants more than a case of Bud Light and a Subway gift card to come back, he can get 10 kinds of bent

Guys that aren’t elite aren’t getting paid much this off-season. It would be smart if him to take what he can here and try and stay healthy.

The Chiefs have paid Sammy over $42M over the past three years. He should play for them for the next three years at league minimum or he can leave.

To the best of my recollection he's been trying to stay healthy every since he was drafted. Me no want.

So, according to Teicher, Hardman ran AT LEAST two incorrect routes in the SB? Methinks we now know why he and Patrick are often not on the same page. The guy has speed, occasionally makes really big plays, but is simply not dependable.

On the other hand, we have Sammy, who has killer skills, but simply will not play through an injury. Ergo, not dependable.

Personally, I'm done with Sammy. I wouldn't sign him for free. I'm also very close to being done with Mecole. Receivers who run whatever routes they want, give up on balls, and are basically just dumb are not good material for professional football.

If we're gonna dump Sammie, then I suspect we've gotta keep Hardman for another year. But I'd look long and hard at FA WRs and would not have any problems drafting one...in any round.

How many times was Patrick running around because Mecole wasn't where he was supposed to be? Heck, one could argue that we need a WR worse than we need an OL guy. Take away Tyreek and what do you have in the way of a truly good, NFL, WR? Zilch. Nada. Zippo. 00. Goose eggs.

Year 3 is the make or break year for WRs in Andy’s offense. If Hardman doesn’t excel next season than he’s probably not going to be coming back.

If I were the Chiefs, I’d bring back Robinson on another 1 year deal and draft at least one.

Hill, Robinson, Rookie, Hardman and Pringle. Then you’ve got guys like Kemp or Fortson that you can bring up from the practice squad if you need too.

Yep.

People are expecting to devote most, if not all, of their resources to the offensive line.

That's not going to happen. They'll work on the line but they're not going to neglect other positions just to load up on one unit.

There's no upside AT ALL to a guy that can't suit up every week.

I don't care what he brings on the field - he's never ****ing ON it.

I’m really interested to see how they view certain players.

Is Allegretti a center? Is Niang a guard or tackle? Have they been holding onto Rankin to play him at guard?

I'm ready to move on from Sammy. He's just never available.

I don't think I'd look at WR higher than round 3 though, given the depth of this draft.

Hill, Kelce, CEH are a nice trio of weapons if you can block. We should invest some draft capital in better athletes for the line. This could be done at OT as late as round 2. C, OG as late as round 4.

A DE could make your front 4 elite, and your secondary already is. Impact pass rushers will be gone before we pick in the 2nd.

I think this is the way.

They're going to keep Hardman regardless, he's on a rookie contract.

They have him for 2 more years and then they can cut him if he doesn't step up.

And I agree on Watkins - I don't want him back regardless of the price. I don't want to give him one more cent.

And I’ll keep saying this. It doesn’t matter if you can block....if the defense can double Hill and hit Kelce off the snap. You HAVE to have weapons that can get open one on one. Does that mean that we need to go full on WR in the first? No. But just because we have Hill and Kelce....doesn’t mean that we still don’t need more weapons.

Obviously it depends on how the board falls but to me the needs are DE, WR, and OT, in that order. I know many people won't agree but one OT isn't going to overhaul this line and if Mahomes has nowhere to throw, he's going to get killed no matter who is blocking for him.

Yep.

Even a great offensive line can give up coverage sacks, especially the way Mahomes runs around. They can't hold up their blocks forever.

And just because I think we need more weapons....doesn’t mean I think that we don’t need offensive line. I fully expect them to get two of them out of this draft. And possibly one in FA....if they can pull it off.

They absolutely have to address the line, I don't think anybody thinks otherwise.

The question is how many resources they devote to the line and how much could those resources buy us by spreading them around?

I cant believe we have the desire to bring back Watkins, and I cant believe there are Chief fans advocating this.

Watkins yearly production can be matched by a 7th round pick or UDFA. I'm so tired of this guy. I wouldn't bring him back for $2M.

Sure.

We'd lost one game in a year and a half until we couldn't block anybody.

My assumption is that you’ve got three starters right now in Allegretti, LDT and Niang. People may not like that but I assume that’s how they go.

LDT is starting at RG.
Is Allegretti at LG or did they draft him to be the future at Center?
Is Niang going to be RT or did they envision him more as a OG?

Dude it’s not one or the other. They’re both mutually exclusive.

We brought in Watkins and you can see the difference in this offense when he doesn’t play versus when he does and he’s healthy.

You just admitted that this is all because of one game, then.

We wither lost one game in a year and a half with ALL of these warts or with none of them. ;)

I trust andy more to scheme up guys getting open vs scheming up blocking atleast.

They envisioned Niang to be an OT.

They figured he might play G in year 1, which to me says they thought he'd be one of their best 5, but unlikely to unseat Fisher or Schwartz.

I am hopeful that he's a long-term starter. I would like to hedge that bet with more talent.

Also, we lost that game because we had backups on the offensive line pretty much at every position. We aren’t fielding 10 starting offensive linemen next year.

We've got people in this very thread complaining the Hardman ran the wrong route on two different occasions.

If he doesn't, and he scores, we might win.

Which then suggests that maybe, just maybe, getting a WR is just as important as upgrading the line.

It's not black and white.

They could bring johnny manziel in for a look. I just saw he’s playing in some sub par arena football league now. Oof. That’s not a fall from grace more of a cliff dive.

I get it, I do.

But I don't think we're in a position to "hedge".

We should bring in starters, not backups. If you're "hedging" you're admitting from the get go that said draft pick is going to be a backup, at least for some time, under normal circumstances.

I just don't like it. Too many needs to be spending resources on contingency plans. For sure, draft volume for depth but not in the early rounds.

Ok. So that shores up the right side of the line. My guess is that unless they draft a LG high or sign one....Allegretti is your LG.

So we have to figure out how to hold down LT until Fisher gets back or try to replace him. That and center. I could see them drafting a center in the top 3 rounds and possibly finding a developmental LT later on. Get a stop gap until Fisher gets back.

That still allows you to take a DE or WR high if you still want one.

don't be disingenuous.

September '21 looks just like February. Fisher will not be in the line-up. Schwartz probably done.

We have zero proven offensive tackles that are healthy enough to play.

It's not so much about one game as it is about an injury situation that will not be solved without making moves.

I’ve just seen him do it with guys like Albert wilson and Jason avant- for years.

That’s not about getting high end weapons as much as it is about having polished smart ones.

I’d imagine they’ll bring in both not either or though in terms of ol and wr

My preference at this point if the draft shakes out the way the mocks are trending would be DE at #1, OT at #2, WR at #3.

And if we commit 1st, 2nd, and/or 3rd round draft resources to the offensive line, we STILL have zero proven offensive tackles that are healthy enough to play.

We just now have less resources to address other positions.

And where are you finding two starting tackles? Keep in mind that they aren’t drafting tackles in the first and second round and starting them.

Whoever they draft needs to start

I’m kinda tired of this “development” bullshit. If a guy needs that much development don’t take him that early

Mine are DE, OC and WR in the first three rounds. Doesn’t have to be in that order.

Go find an OT in FA that fits the system and can start for Fisher and not be Cam Erving level bad.

I could see them finding a center in FA though and taking a OT in the first three rounds.

I don't care if you draft Jesus Christ to play wide receiver, Hill and Kelce are your top two receivers. We've gotten perfectly respectable WR3 numbers out of Watkins/Robinson/Pringle/Hardman. Do we need to be working new talent in? Of course.

None of it's going to matter if the opponent has a stout front 4 that can get to Mahomes and can drop 7 in coverage. You're likely to run into that in the play-offs or a Super Bowl.

Now, injury problems are what made that happen; but again, in September you've got one decent starter in LDT coming back, and we're writing in Niang who hasn't played football in almost two years. And I think we've got MAYBE one guy in Alegretti that might be starter quality.

That's not going to get you to SB 56.

By that logic, neither is a draft pick.

I'm not sure why you keep coming back to drafting an OT when the nit you're picking is lack of experience.

A drafted OT hasn't started a game in the NFL, just like Niang. So something seems to be wrong here.

The sb left a bad ol taste in everyone’s mouth but they’ll have that figured out. They won’t have the same bad luck

again, you're making intellectually dishonest arguments, man.

What are the chances any draft pick becomes a success? Less than 50%.

What are the chances that one of two is a success? Much better odds.

You're just arguing to be an asshole.

**** it. I'm out of here. I'll see you guys in September.