So Brady is the product of the system and talent... but Manning isn't?


ROFL

Then perhaps you should re-read it, because the entire point of that excerpt is that

1) The fans shouldn't turn on Brady (hence the Montreal Screwjob reference)

and

2) His dad said it.

You completely missed the point, and decided to rant about how Simmons compared Brady to Cassel.

Nothing could be further from the truth, but it didn't stop you from creating this stupid ****ing thread.

Why not?

He has the numbers to show for that are right up there with the best. The only thing thats missing are superbowl rings. I bet if he won a few championships he'd have more of a reputation.

Once he was introduced to the run and shoot offense in houston, he flourished and I think he may have very well re-defined the quarterback position in a lot of ways during that era.

Mechanically speaking, I think he was the most polished quarterback I've ever seen. Once you combine that with the numbers, thats good enough to easily place him at the top.

Like I said, the only thing thats missing are the rings. Thats pretty much the hole in this argument. But if you want to compare his numbers, and his overall mechanics or attributes to the other great quarterbacks he can easily match or surpass them making him a top 5 quarterback.

I don't think either are system guys, but Manning especially isn't.

The guy is a master. An absolute master.

And yet, he and his Houston Oilers pissed away playoff opportunities, including giving up the largest lead in playoff history.

Great QBs with 35 point leads, even if his defense is giving up points by the boat load find a way to rally the troops and secure that win.

greatness isn't measured by stats or pretty mechanics alone.

Moon threw the prettiest interceptions I've ever seen.

Umm, sorry but I don't think this is a fair statement simply because I believe football is a team game. It's always going to involve more than one guy. Now, are you trying to say, you don't view Moon as a "great" leader like the other great quarterbacks?

I think it's the teams responsibilty to get together rally, perform at a high level and make all the plays necessary to win the game. Moon did his share to help his team win games, unfortunately the other guys around him didn't.

*The bottom portion of your post I can agree with, which leads me to ask you this question, what else do you believe a quarterback has to do to prove greatness?

Make plays when the game is on the line, and lead their teams to Championships.

And yes, great QBs are leaders that teams rally around.

The Patriots lost to the Ravens last week because of Tom Brady.

Not Randy Moss, not Matt Light, not Bill Belichick - Tom Brady. He played absolutely horrific football, put his team in a massive hole and played right into Baltimore's hands.

Manning simply played a competent game against an elite defense and his team won fairly easily. And when I said Manning wouldn't have taken the sack/strip like Brady did - time the brady sack against the Manning dump at the end of the 2nd half right before the TD. The situations were virtually identical, with Suggs blowing untouched around the LT and closing in the QBs blind-side. Manning felt the pressure and got the ball out, Brady didn't.

Manning is a better quarterback. He's a damn quarterbacking robot. It's virtually impossible to play the position better than he does yet some people simply refuse to acknowledge it. Those people are spending their time harping on the guy instead of realizing that the history books will likely refer to him as the greatest quarterback in NFL history when all is said and done. It's a shame, really.

I don't see much merit in the historical argument either, Mannings been the better QB over the course of their respective careers. However, I'll set that aside and acknowledge the 3 SBs point (even if I think it's crap) for the sake of mere discussion. That said, there's no argument whatsoever that Manning is presently the better QB. And I see very little debating who will be the better QB over the course of the remainder of their careers.

You and however believes this is epically stupid.

Not really just top 3-5. Top 10-15 can be all-time.

Do you really wanna be held in the same light as Hootie? :spock:

Oops...:)

I'm a Patriots fan, and even I'm sick of reading this shit and seeing "Patriots, Patriots, Patriots" all over the place, LOL.

Cassel is decent.
Brady is excellent.
Hootie doesn't like Brady.
Some of you don't like Cassel, others want to give him more time.

I think that about covers it.

Josh McDaniels aka The QB GURU.