"Does not have elite foot speed compared to previous top prospects."

The. End.

I'm pretty sure having elite foot speed is about the most important thing there is when it comes to LT.

While I agree with you, let's also remember that Jake Long was the first overall pick in the draft a couple of years ago, by the root of the tree.

And he is exactly what we said he was, a guy who run blocks very well that struggles with speed rushers and needs help.

If I'm using the #1 pick on a LT that guy better never need help ever.

Again, I agree, with everything you say here, both about Long and about foot speed for an LT.

I'm just pointing out that the root (Parcells) drafted a LT who lacks elite foot speed, so it's entirely possible the branch (Pioli) will do the same.

You know how I felt about Long, and I think even less highly of Okung, but I'm preparing for the worst.

Jesus dude.. don't continue to be a moron just because you were a moron a few years ago... regardless of your OPINION.. Long is a what he was picked to be.. an ELITE LT.

We had this argument a few years ago.. Long vs Dorsey.. you called me out for saying I would rather have Long... would you STILL rather take Dorsey?

Long is NOT the next coming of Roaf (nor did I ever say he would be) but he is a solid Pro Bowl LT that was WORTH the #1 pick that year.

Please man up and admit that.

reagrdles of facts you still have a hard on AGAINST Long... btw I agree about Okung... I may be dead wrong but he has never impressed me more than a top 15 pick MAYBE a top 10.. but definitely not a top 5...


...but seriously... do you not think Long was worth a top 5 pick... and if you don't... you need to take a step back.

Why do I need to take a step back?

I still see a guy that needs help against speed rushers.

If I use a top 5 pick on a LT, then that ****er better be able to work on an island.

Edit:
Oh, and what facts?
The fact that he's an outstanding run blocker, but not a great pass blocker.

You're saying he's elite, then that he's not Roaf, who was the definition of elite. He was not worth the number one pick, and there's no way Miami would make that pick again.

You don't like Long, who, as of last season, was one of the top three left tackles in the NFL, but you're completely happy with Brandon Albert's performance from the past two seasons?

You may not like the idea of a team taking an offensive lineman early - know that how some people are in terms of how they look at the draft. But the position is key in terms of building a better functioning team wherever/however those players are acquired, whether it be on the premiere left tackle in the draft of an undrafted free agent that slips through the cracks.

And you are wrong about Okung's feet. His footwork is very good and his foot speed is also very good. His feet are always moving to make sure that his center of balance and power are situated on a vertical centerline like you want from a top flight left tackle.

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You want to see bad feet? Here's some bad feet, and on a guy who some people think would be great as our high second rounder:

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You know who that reminds me of? Yep, Albert. Tries to use his power and bulk versus using his feet to work guys out and around. Reaches and lunges and pushes versus utilizing leverage and foot work.

Hell, Okung's footwork is substantially better than Bulaga's as well. It's not even close:

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I'd put up Davis and Campbell vids, but they make Bulaga's footwork look good in comparison.

The only guy that is close to Okung in terms of a legitimate left tackle is this dude, and he's got issues of getting overwhelmed when they go straight at him.

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Comparatively, Okung is closer to Joe Thomas than he is Jake Long. The guy that is like Jake Long is Jason Fox out of Miami. I agree with Mecca that Brown is similar to D'brickashaw Ferguson but needs to up his mass/strength.

You may not like the pick for the Chiefs because you are holding out hope that Albert finally clicks all the parts together or that you just don't think that it's necessary to take an offensive tackle that early in the draft, but it's pretty obvious that Okung is the best left tackle propect in this draft.

Pay the **** attention, dipshit.

I've said numerous times that Albert struggled.
I never once said that I was completely happy with Albert's performance.

All I've ever said is that he's a kid that is his second year, just learning technque, whose had to go through three scheme changes (four, when you consider the change to a spread last year after Thogpen took over the starting dutoes at QB), whose battled through injuries in his first season, and struggled with a substantial weight loss in a short peiod of time.

And with all of that, I still like his potential, and I don't believe you give up on that potential after only his second year.

And no, I don't like Jake Long, because he will never be a guy with the feet to handle speed rushers on an island.
He's always going to need help.

JFC, I never said I don't like the idea of taking OL early in the draft, if that OL is a LT with potential to be an elite LT in the NFL.
I don't believe that is Okung.

Yeah.
I'm wrong, and so is everyone else apparently, because that is one question that is raised by almost everyone.

But you're the only one with the vision to recognize that everyone is wrong.

Wow, imagine that, a college guard that some think has the athletic ability to play tackle being compared to a college guard that most thought had the athletic ability to make that transition.

Why, I just bet college guards practice OT technique non stop.

If it's so ****ing obvious, why is that even sites that you've used to support your whole Okung love affair question whether he's the best prospect.

JFC, why I am wasting keystrokes on your dumb ass?

I really don't think that the word "****" is appropriate as a noun determiner in that sentence.

Insert Matt Cassel, Rudy Niswanger, DaJuan Morgan, Dwayne Bowe, Maurice Leggett, Tyson Jackson and Glenn Dorsey for "Albert" in the above and you have the Chiefs current situation.

The point I'm trying to make is that there isn't anyone in this draft other than Suh who you can say that about from a position perspective. There is always going to be questions about a person/player. Hell, the teams in the league were pretty much split on who was going to be the better quarterback - Manning or Leaf. You think Albert is going to turn the corner and become a viable left tackle. I don't see him being anything more than mediocre at that position. Just a difference of opinions. You don't have to get so worked up about it.

That's my point. Albert was a project when he was drafted two years ago. There was no guarantee that he was going to end up as a competent left tackle because he never played the position. It was a reach pick by Carl/Herm for a team that needed players who had to contribute right then and there. If they had a top flight LT that was heading into the twilight of his professional career and wanted him to learn the position under the guy or groom him at RT with the hope of moving him over, then he would have been a decent pick. But they needed a LT immediately, threw him to the wolves and he's struggled.

Because draftniks love "potential." They love talking up Herculean type guys like Campbell and Iupati for the LT spot (*cough*Robert Gallery*cough*) because they look the part. They love combine numbers, the bench press and the 40. Because they don't take into account teams schemes and the types of players that would work best in those schemes but rather how much potential a guys has based on his raw physical attributes.

I don't know. Maybe you don't have anything better to do. I've got to go make some deviled eggs, so I'll have to excuse myself from this conversation for a bit.

Like I really give a rat's ass when and where **** is appropriately used.

No, you can't say the same about any of those guys.
Cassel has played QB for years.
Niswanger has played Center for years.
Legget, corner, years.

Jackson and Dorsey converting to 34 ends are as close to Albert in terms of transitioning, but still haven't gone through the same number of changes that Albert has been through.


Your point fails, cause when it comes to foot speed, that, or lack thereof, is the biggest red flag for a potential LT.

Fail again.
When Albert was drafted, this team was making a commitement to rebuilding, and they didn't need players who could come in and contribute right away.
They needed guys with potential to become the core group in three years, and Albert's potential and athletic ability was exactly the type to fill that bill.

No, they are questioning Okung's potential because of a lack of foot speed.

That was a rhetorical question, because in fact, the reason I waste keystokes is because, as Deetznuts so brilliantly stated, I feel it's my duty to bludgeon dumbassery.

And you, my friend, require a sound bludgeoning.

Well, kinda. He's been a QB for years. Played? Not so much.

Thanks, Scott!

LT's who need help against speed rushers aren't great. And if it weren't for his coaches recognizing that and giving him help that an elite LT shouldn't have then he wouldn't be a top LT or in any Pro Bowls because he wouldn't LOOK nearly as good. As of now sure hes the best pick of the draft, but only a complete ****ing idiot would judge a draft class after two years. Also being the top LT doesn't make you elite and if we are replacing Albert it better be with a HOF LT otherwise its a complete waste. You don't use a top five pick for a minimal upgrade. Hell I would be shocked if Okung was even an upgrade at all in our system, sure another position would be upgraded but those are positions that don't warrant top 5 picks. Jesus its crazy how draft reeruned the majority of Chiefs fans are.