As the current pics of coming in he does look bigger than before if it helps at all.

Croyle was good at driving the team down the field but he often failed to get them into the end zone. Of course if the Chiefs had receivers that could catch....

Any player drafted by head coach Herm Edwards is going to have problems. Croyle actually now has a chance to do something besides cushion the defensive end's fall. If .... Weis and Haley focus on developing the guy.

FAX

True. /Flowers, Charles, and every other even decent, let alone good, player on the team

Mr. FAX, no one can develop his body to withstand the rigors of the NFL. He's simply not built for it.

Okay ... there were exceptions ... a few exceptions.

As for Croyle's frame, I agree. He's ... breakable. From the very beginning I was hopeful the team would focus his first couple of years on building his strength while acclimating him to the NFL game. Apparently, however, that wasn't exactly a priority under Herm.

There will always be Croyle haters. I'm just not one of those. I honestly believe he has the necessary core skills to be a very fine NFL quarterback. Can he take the beating? I don't know. History says, no. Then again, some of his injuries have been pretty flukey.

FAX

I understand, and I'm definitely not a "hater"; Croyle has all the necessary tools to be outstanding.

But there are far too many flukes to account for his history. Given his laundry-list of injuries, I see his first injury with the team (when he tripped over an offensive lineman in an innocuous situation in camp) as less of a fluke and more of an apt microcosm. Unfortunately, that's Croyle's physicality in a nutshell.

And in no way do I think he's "soft." It takes tremendous courage for him to take the field. He's not stupid; he's self aware of his body.

He was worth the risk in the third round, but now we need to turn to different horizons.

And there's more!!!

Don't forget, Mr. DeezNutz, that it was under Herm's dynamic leadership that the players got so fat and out-of-shape that they were able to lose (as a team) the equivalent of 19 Rosie O'Donuts in one off-season. Then, there's that little matter of knowing what to do when the play is called.

I haven't heard of any franchises begging Herm to come out of retirement and help them develop their players. Have you?

FAX

Totally agree.

FAX

No. Absolutely not.

But I put little stock (certainly not stalk because fat bitches don't know this word) in losing Rosies, of either the metaphoric or literal variety. Coaches talk about those numbers when there's very little actual talent to speak of or in spite of glaring failings on their part.

Remember Vermeil's impressive list of "records" he proudly boasted of when he retired from the Chiefs? I don't seem to recall playoff victories being on that list of numbers...

Well, if I'm reading you correctly, I am compelled to urge you to balance your well-founded skepticism with a more comprehensive, objective view of this regime's efforts to get our team in shape.

We have been an organization in the poophole. Even as we speak, we have yet to fully emerge from that poophole. In fact we have, so far, merely, tentatively, sort of, kinda peeked out of the poophole with, maybe, one little eyeball, a finger, and perhaps half a poop-covered nose.

We all know that we've failed as an organization for years. It can be argued that there are very basic, elemental reasons for that chronic, continuing failure. Were I to make a brief list of the contributing shortcomings, I would begin with 1) Our legendary, pisspoor (often laughable) draft choices and 2) Our inherent inability to develop young players into professionals once they're on the team.

Presumably, we can correct the resulting decades-long problem of acute organizational imbalance we've seen (decent offense, crap defense, decent defense, crap offense, pick a year, rinse, repeat) if and when we begin to draft smarter and develop our young guys from marginal professionals into contributing role (and the occasional impact) players.

If that is true, that correction begins with organizational accountability that focuses on the players. It's that accountability (or the previous lack thereof) that makes the loss of our Rosies so important. With very few exceptions (such as the ones you've mentioned in this thread), we began last year's off-season as a fat, lazy, uninspired, ineffective group of whiny-ass, unmotivated, lardbutted, borderline professionals with no real direction and no true leadership. By requiring the off-season weight loss, at a minimum, expectations were extended to ensure that the players we field on Sunday are, at least, in football shape.

Although it's fair to say that it's all about the "W"s, the journey from the poophole to those "W"s begins with very basic steps like, for example, getting the team in condition and teaching them (from a physical standpoint) what is required to truly compete in this league. Uncle Dick's "records" have nothing to do with the team we field in 2010. Neither does Herm's famous rookie training camp donut runs. What does matter is that the players we have today recognize that they can, indeed, compete and win, but not without a focus and commitment to true professionalism - including the ability to compete on a purely physical level with anybody in the league.

In other words, once the body is trained, the mind will follow. Wax off.

FAX

Herm went through about 15 QBs in his 7 odd years
and arm hanging Chad was the cream of the crop
and he was inherited

What do you want to bet?

I was a big fan of Croyle...WAS...because he can't stay healthy. Period. He's blown both of his knees out, and one knee he has blown out twice. He could never stay healthy for a 16 game season.
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I applaud the thoughtfulness of this post and will mull over your points. Perhaps I should change my stance a bit...

Lets hope Croyle and Moeaki don't bump into each other in the lunch room

LMAO