Is that the exception or the rule?

Ben Rothlisburger & Eli Manning.

Yep, somebody always has to mention Tom Brady like he's the norm or something. Him and Joe Montana come along every 30 years or so.

Thank You.

Yet both weren't taken in the 1st round

I called Bulger would be a good QB for the Rams too when he came up.

And?

Nice rebuttal

There is nothing to rebut. You claim expertise with nothing to back it up but "6 years ago I said he would be good". Your opinions are no more qualified than anyone else's, period.

Lets just keep drafting a QB in the 6th round every year. We are bound to hit on one every 20-30 years eventually!!

What do you want me to say? I called it, you want me to go on page long explanation and "findthdr it"? Back to the point of this whole thread, Ryan isn't a top QB, their's too many questions about his game if you are looking for top 5 draft pick QBs John Elway is the benchmark

If he was John Elway or this QB that everyone thinks he should be to get picked by the Chiefs then they'd have no shot at picking him because they aren't sitting with the 1st pick...

Like I said John Elway is the benchmark, a man who was an ace at everything for a top 5 QB pick anything less you are gambling with disaster.

FYP

No, my point still stands

Well shoot, lets just give up drafting a QB because we flopped with one 25 years ago.

Every draft pick is a gamble. Doesnt matter what position.

There is no point, unless it's "We should draft John Elway".

This idea that a QB has to be perfect is damn funny, alright I guess we should just wait for that and never win anything till one of those rare guys comes along...Roethlisberger was the 3rd QB taken in his draft with the 12th pick, guess he sucks.

You are not going to get a perfect prospect very often, you just aren't. The only thing Ryan doesn't have is a huge arm and frankly Brady and Manning don't even have huge arms.

a top 5 pick QB that busts is the perennial franchise killer, Ryan has too many flaws to be worthy of a top selection. Ryan will need help to succeed, and can't do everything himself like Elway. I don't want to take that chance with a pick THIS high.

Uh he doesn't have a big arm that's his flaw, you are acting like he's 6'1 been hurt a bunch of times and only does 1 thing well, oh wait....

Just for the record every pick is a risk and if any of them bust it will be a franchise killer type of pick....

True, but every top 10 pick in this draft has bust potential. You think Jake Long and Sedrick Ellis are sure things??

The man is mobile, but he places the ball that gets the WR killed or intercepted at times

Long is a solid top 10 prospect, IMO Ellis would be a better pick because the man can dominate and change or the face pick

I guess you better never speak of Dorsey again because he has question marks...

His injury status has been cleared :rockon:

Do you realize that every HOF QB had flaws in his game before he was drafted???

Lets take Keith Rivers then, he's safe!

I wish we would have never drafted Derrick Thomas. He never could tackle very well. :)

Yeah, but that ball placement issue scares the hell out of me. So I should just downgrade my thought process about top 5 picks and some say generational players? Nah, at Top 5 you are looking for near perfection at Top 10-15 I'd give him leeway

good God, I just watched a little bit of NFL Live and here comes Mel Kiper with his new mock. He now has us taking Branden Albert, passing up Ellis and gholston. That guy is a freaking moron. He also had Talib going #10, as much of a KU homer as I am, that's just stupid. Why do I even watch ESPN?

Okay debate setteled.

You're open to drafting a QB in the top 5 if only he's as talented as John Elway....

So basically you'd never be for drafting a QB in the top 5 ever again because one could easily make the case that nobody has ever had the tools like Elway did.

Yet is Elway the best of all time? Maybe... Maybe not. There's more to it than just the tools as I'm sure you'd agree.

Where does a guy like Ryan rank as far as smarts and decision making? How's he under pressure? Those are the questions to be asking.

Tough part is that's hard to measure.

Furthermore, if there ever was a QB who compares similarly to John Elway, better hope we have the #1 to get him. Good luck with that.

Roethlisberger is a horrible example, considering he was the 3rd QB taken in one of the best 1st round classes in the past 10-15 years.

Ryan being the 1st QB off the board in this miserable class doesn't excite me.

I'm fine if we take him, fine if we don't. I think he'll be average at best in this league.

See the issue I stated on ball placement

man I wish the draft would just hurry up!

Doesn't matter. Either way the Chiefs will make the wrong decision.

Wow. You're a glass is 1/2 empty kind of guy aren't ya.

Dwayne Bowe to this point looks like an outstanding pick. Cheer up.

This is the dumbest argument one could possibly make against drafting a top 5 QB.
Yeah, JR, we can't possibly consider taking a QB, cause there isn't any hope at all that the O-Line can't be fixed with later picks in this draft, and in the next draft.


David Carr is not a classic case.

That Houston O-Line, while pretty bad, was made to look worse than they were by David Carr.

The guy could never read defenses, and held on to the ball too long, something that was listed as a weakness for him when he was coming out of school.
He never learned.

I said before the '07 season that I thought the Texans would give up almost half as many sacks without Carr.

I haven't looked up the numbers, but I'd bet that was a pretty good guess.

They gave up 22 sacks last year.

Just goes to show that the QB is just as responsible for allowing a sack as the OLmen are.

Hell, the Chiefs were an example of that last year.

Damon Huard was sacked once per 9.22 attempts with the starting OL the majority of the time.

Brodie Croyle was sacked once per 13.17 attempts, with his action coming at the end of the year when they were playing backups such as Niswanger and Taylor, and McIntosh was out.

I would bet that almost all these "defensive homers" would be all for taking Michael Oher if he were in this draft and sitting at 5.

But that's only speculation on my part.

I am not opposed to taking Jake Long if Dorsey and Ellis are off the board, but I don't believe that Long is the prospect at LT that Dorsey/Ellis are at DT, or that Oher will be next year, or even Andre Smith from Alabama.

You bet your ass that I'd be up for taking Oher in this draft at 5.

The three names that I keep hearing as comparisons for Oher?

Orlando Pace, Walter Jones, Jonathan Ogden.

The two names that I keep hearing as comparisons for Jake Long?

Jon Runyan and Jeff Backus.

100% agree.

What I love even more about that argument is that there's not an O-linemen that will be available worthy of the 5th pick when we draft anyways. Long will be gone and everybody else IMO will be a reach at 5.

So we won't begin to rebuild the O-line until round 2 anyways... It's the same thing.

Excellent point...why take a chance when you can pick the number 4 rated player in the draft.

Are you saying we will have the top pick next year? I doubt we have a shot at Oher next year. I sure hope you are correct coz we need him but more impostantly .... it will mean we had a terrible upcoming season and just maybe Clark cleans house.

I think it is 99% sure that Tebow will not come out next year. He is only a Jr. His family is certainly not rich, I met his parents before he was born (have not met him), but he has the type of character that will keep him in school. Plus, I'm not sure he will be a great NFL QB. But, maybe after 2 more years he will be that "Elway" type of guy???

I don't!!! Too, many question marks about him. To me he smacks of the David Carr's of the draft ... and there have been a number of them lately.

It's already been said, but Croyle fell to the 3rd. because of injury concerns not his ability. Now, granted had he demostrated outstanding ability he would have been taken earlier even with the injuries.

I agree 100%. I'll put forth the disclaimer ... I'm a Croyle homer ... but, I'm hoping that with a true OC (who maybe able to talk a little sense into Herm about turning his offensiveless offense up a notch or 2) that Croyle will begin to make some positive progress this year. With our offensiveless game planning last year no QB could have been successful ... teams knew what we were going to do and thus it was easy to stop us. Now, in addition to being a Croyle homer ... I hope he is successful, coz that means we have that peice of the puzzle and can patch other holes.

I affirm what you wrote. I heard the same thing.

Hey, maybe we can draft him this year but only get him next year when he comes out??? Kinda like a deposit. If he is that good sounds like an excellent idea to me!!!!

What's your plan if Croyle doesn't make it? Oh yeah, I forgot, we're the Chiefs. We'll trade for some old guy again.

And your plan if Ryan doesn't work out???

I really wish people would stop throwing up names like David Carr, he and Ryan are so far apart from each other in the type of players and prospects they are. Every QB rated high is not like every other one...compare Ryan to guys he is actually like. He is not a guy with nothing but a cannon arm who vaulted up due to scouts loving that which is what many of the guys who busted he gets compared to were/are.

Also guess what, Croyle fell because of injury history and not talent? He's still getting injured..anyone have confidence that guy can play a whole season...I certainly don't.

You are on Matt Ryan's dick like a cougar on an 80 year old oil magnate.

Take another one a few years later.....the Colts missed on Jeff George at #1 guess they shouldn't have taken Manning some years later eh? QB is a very important position you fire till you get it right because that one position means that much to your team.

Well you have to have a QB and they are going to get harder and harder to find. Atleast in the NFL mold because more and more college teams continue to go to the spread option look which is awful for pro game development.

I still contend that if Matt Ryan had a big arm he'd be the lock #1 pick and well arm strength is an overrated category for a QB as long as he doesn't have a horrible girly Pennington arm.

If Ryan is there, you have to take him. It's time to give this another shot.

That is utter nonsense. I'd take Sedrick Ellis or Glenn Dorsey over Ryan. I also like Brian Brohm almost as much as Ryan. Try to pay attention to what is being said instead of what you think is being said, dumbshit.

I think you need to face the fact that the odds are very, very much against Brodie Croyle ever playing a complete season in the NFL. A guy like Ryan or Brohm or Henne would at least be able to take a beating, and probably play better overall too. I sort of like Croyle too, I'm sure he's a nice kid, but come on. He has done nothing - NOTHING - to keep the Chiefs from drafting a quarterback.

funny. I'm pretty damned sure he would've been a great SAINTS qb, seeing as they drafted him.

Tongue in cheek Milkman! You know I respect your opinion. Just tongue in cheek stuff from Coogs. ;)

http://www.nfl.com/players/marcbulge...e?id=BUL162264


semantics, I still thought he would be a good QB when came up from West Viginia