I'm talking about our behavior. I don't actually care about breasts or cussing on tv, I can decide what I watch or don't watch. I'm talking about people having respect for each other. You're on a whole different subject.

No difference, unless someone is in danger. And kids' ears don't count as danger.

No, it is simply a reasonable expectation for all of us to have of each other.

Perhaps I find your saying the F word in front of my 5 year old daughter really, really offensive?

Is that the objective, to protect people from having to feel offended? In that case, we're going to need a LOT more laws about what you can say and do.

While I agree that people should have respect for each other, I also recognize that people shouldn't be FORCED to display respect nor should they be punished/reprimanded for lacking respect.

I believe certain things but I don't try to force my morals on others through legislation unless there is some sort of tangible harm induced if not regulated.

No, I'm not. It may be different than what you want to get at, but it applies to your previous statement.

As long as you are not putting others in danger (fire in a theatre) freedom of speech is covered. It doesn't say the speech can't be offensive. If you want that, go to Canada where they're having their hands full with hate speech laws so vague that it's absurd.

You don't have a right to be offended and have said offender persecuted.

That's my point. There is no danger. Kids' ears don't count as danger.

It seems the objective of the dissenters in this thread (your side) want to have this right of not being offended. You don't have it. People say offensive things. Period.

:clap:

So if you said "I'd like some ****ing fries with that" in front of a family, and one of the parents asked you politely to refrain from using foul language, would you oblige or continue to curse? Most people, yourself included, would have the decency to cut it out if asked respectively to do so.

I have asked people to watch their language on at least 10 occasions, mostly at sporting events, and not once has anybody had a problem or continued cursing. The most recent came at the Brigade season opener when 2 drunk guys were acting like they wanted to fight in the nosebleed seats in front of three of my friends and our young boys, and they were screaming F-you and P_ssy at each other. I went between them, pointed at the kids and asked them to tone it down or take it somewhere else. They were still both drink and mad, but it difused the situation.

This is beside the point. There is no law that mandates you have to be courteous.

Doesn't matter. There is no law that mandates you have to not be rude. Or a law that says you have the right not to be offended in public.

I was helping a guy pour a sidewalk a couple of days ago, and his douchebag neighbor began berating his own children using a plethora of curse words. The indivual I was helping had 2 small children outside and I wish I could remember what he said to the guy....but something about if he cussed in front of his kids again, turning his head into a jackolantern.


I cuss more than I should sometimes too....but I try not to do it in public, never at my children and will try to be aware of doing it in front of yours....

If someone was cursing like a trucker in a public place in front of my kids, I might say something.


There is no law that says you have to be courtious, but there is a man-code that trumps that that gives permission to punch a hole in one's head should they ignore 1 polite request to refrain from such activity.

Sure, most would have the decency to cut it out. However, just because someone chooses not to oblige doesn't mean they deserve to be fined/cited/arrested.

Was the person in this case yelling at someone?

I can't believe we want to give the government more authority to tell us what we can and cannot say. I don't wish for people to cuss in public but I also don't think it's the government's job to stop it. Big Government KCJ evidently feels differently.

Why do eyes count as danger but ears do not?

You've got soooo much to learn about life.

You know how many lawsuits happen each year because of words?

Call some random woman a C and see what happens. Get in an altercation with a ghey and use the word bundle of sticks....use a racial slur with a coworker and get back to me on the results on the field test of your hypothesis.

I could understand this if she was creating a fire hazard, but full police authority? Wow...that's a pretty wide scope for such a specific title.

This assistant fire marshall would fit right in with the morality police in places like Saudi Arabia. You know, those "religious" and 'holier than thou' type people in many arab countries that would rather see young school girls die in a burning building than let them escape because the girls are not properly dressed.

IMO, handcuffing and ticketing a person for saying a cuss-word is almost as drastic as letting little girls burn to death because their short skirts might be too much skin for some people.

We actually had a meeting about this at our office yesterday. There's a new group that has moved into our area and apparently they've been complaining about our use of foul language.

The meeting was our verbal warning. Anyone caught using foul language now is subject to immediate termination.

**** that.

Giving her a ticket was wrong.

He should have put her in a headlock and stuffed a bar of lava soap in her mouth....maybe a squirt or two of dawn.

Bob Dole was exposed to a number of the fine citizens of La Marque a few years ago when Liberty-Eylau High School played La Marque for the 4A football state championship. They were as a whole the most ill-mannered high school football fans Bob Dole has ever seen. They should just ticket the whole community.

You're confusing the difference between a 'slur' and a general curse word. The F-bomb is gender, race and sexual-orientation neutral. It's an equal-opportunity obscenity. :)

"just words" is the arguement.

That's the problem with Texas too many dipshit cops think they're modern day cowboys. I don't have a problem with somebody confronting her and telling her to watch her mouth around her kids. I just don't see how it's a ticketable offense for law enforcement. The manager of the store should have stepped in and gave the warning and then asked her to leave when she persisted. If she refused to leave and continued to be a disturbance then you get the cops involved.

I hope this is not a public thread, cause thats just fucked -up !!!!!

oops !!

I amend. Harder.

It's harder to offend someone verbally than visually.

I suspect the lady did a little more than just say a cuss word. And IMO your opinion on comparing this to letting little girls burn to death is ignorant.

In all seriousness, I have never heard an explanation as to why "f***" is even considered a curse word or a "bad word". What is so bad about it? Why do we shield our kids from it? Looking up the definition in the dictionary, there aren't any bad connotations from it. The only reason everyone on the board thinks its bad is because our parents or teachers told us that it was bad and we went along with it. There are a few other "curse" words that fall under this category and I have no idea why.

?

Almost all curse words are associated with bodily parts or functions, just like ****.

being that the fire marshall was there
she must have been in the returns dept
only so many allowed in that space at a time
"somebody just touched her wrong"

Anyone who is arguing that this is "okay" has now lost all right to ever accuse anyone of trying to make the world "politically correct." it's over. That term has no meaning to you at this point.


Also, I heard that what she actually said was, "Don't taze me, mother****er!"


This also reminds me of an old joke we've all heard or read... probably many times...

So why is "screwed" not a cuss word? Why is "crap" not a cuss word? They both refer to the bodily functions of the f-bomb and s*** in your example. So why are those words not censored and the other words are censored, even on Chiefsplanet?

Which part is "okay"? Writing the ticket or deserving punishment? Arguing this is freedom of speech?

No idea.

Why are boobies more dangerous than gunshots in films?

It's NOT okay to write someone a ticket for cursing. It's not okay for the government to punish them for offending them. Hell, it's not even okay for someone to take it into their own hands and puch someone for cussing.

However, it would've been perfectly okay for Wal Mart to ask this woman to leave their property, or for the Fire Chief to simply ask her, and when she said no, walked away. The lady is ****y either way, but I don't think anyone should have the authority to say, "That word is not okay to use," unless they own the property and plan to ask the person to leave.

Okay, we're on the same page. :)

There is no good answer for that. Small children see boobies quite a bit for nourishment.

Regarding the seemingly isomorphic words, I don't want my children to cuss because I don't want them viewed as "crass" or whatever by others in society. Our society often has little to no justification as to why some words are ok and others aren't, but that's the way it goes.

Absolutely. However, I still think we should deport ugly people. If we're really concerned with decency, let's do it right.

The seven words you can't say in Wal-Mart.

FAX

This is my first 100-post thread in a long time. The drought has ended!

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Since you were responding directly to me, yes, you were on a different subject. I wasn't talking about nipples on TV.

One day you'll understand where I'm coming from with this subject but it will be a few years. I'll give you credit for consistency, though. Your feelings on speech are the same as your feelings on dress codes.....basically, screw everyone else, if the rest of you don't like what I'm doing or wearing or saying you should leave. But I do think you'll see things a little different one day.

ROFL

You said we'd become an "anything goes" society. I provided many instances of this not being the case and you say that's changing the topic.

Nope. Not what I'm saying at all. I am merely pointing out that a) it is not illegal b) should not be illegal and c) we have become extremely pussified in America. Everyone is offended by something and we act like it's a right NOT to be offended. It's not.

As for the dress codes, private property is private property. I conceded that up front. But the Power and Light wasn't really private property. It was funded by the city for the city. Banning certain dress does create a nice atmosphere but it is also blatantly obvious as to who they are getting at. It's the same as saying "we don't serve your kind here" to blacks or gays.

In this case, it's protected under the first amendment. Free speech is free speech as long as it isn't putting someone in danger. How do you think Fred Phelps gets away with the shit he pulls?

This is a very unfortunate aspect of modern society. On the one hand, restricting speech is not advisable - even disagreeable speech. Who decides? On the other hand, a culture that allows anyone to say anything at anytime for any reason is not, in fact, a culture at all. Decency and courtesy are far too rare and are, actually, behaviors that young people, for the most part, are neither exposed to nor taught. Ms. KCJohnny is an example of this failure.

Still, if there ever were a location where the F-word seems most appropriate, it's Wal-Mart.

FAX

Some would say they are, just to a lesser degree, especially crap. Don't know too many parents of 3-year-olds that like seeing their kids run around yelling "crap." As to censorship, obviously society is far more liberal in this sense today. A long way from Lucy and Desi sleeping in different beds.

Why we have these distinctions? Tangential connotations that are accrued over a long period of time, and this speaks to our own insecurities as humans. But even historically speaking, curse words have been associated with bodily functions. When Chaucer writes about Damian "thronging" in the tree, that ain't clean fun. Linguistically speaking, then, there hasn't been much change with certain words. Of course, we've added to the inventory over time.

My comment that curse words are associated with the human body is a statement of fact, therefore.

"Welcome to Wal-Mart...get your shit and get out."

I gotta admit that many of the responses in this thread puzzle me. I just can't make the leap from a woman who got a ticket for using foul language in a public place and then continuing to make an ass of herself after she was told to stop - to censorship, political correctness, pussification, etc..

In short.....she was cussing loud enough for others to hear. She was asked to stop. She didn't. It turned out the guy who asked her to stop happened to be a fire marshal in the community and that in this community her behavior was against the law. She received a ticket.

BFD. This has nothing to do with civil rights, it has to do with civility.

This actually happened to me at a Taco Bell. A young kid was working the window. Took my money, returned the change, no big deal. Comes back to the window with the food, opens the window doors and says, "Here's your shit. " DeezNutz: "Whaa?" Taco Bell guy, again: "Here's your shit."

My last trip to that particular Taco Bell.

You are aware that the Supreme Court has expressly ruled that your EYES are not protected from the F word.

Google "Supreme Court" and "F@ck the Draft"

I see guns, I don't have an urge to kill.
I see bewbs, I wanna f@ck.

It does seem like a simple matter. But it could also be the beginning stages of one of those where-does-it-end? things as well.

Consider this:
Warning labels
No smoking on planes
No smoking in the workplace, go to the lounge
No smoking in the lounge, take it outside the building
No smoking outside the building, take it out in the street
No smoking in the street, take it home
You have neighbors and/or children at home! NO SMOKING EVAR!!!!!!!

Laws like this are like potato chips to extremists; they can't just stop at one.

When the hell can fire marshall write tickets for swearing in public?

I would have laughed in his face and ripped the ticket, flipped him the bird and walked off.

I empathize, Mr. RJ. Very much so. Perhaps the solution is that, we who appreciate proper and considerate behavior, make it a habit to carry with us a pocket full of fruit wheats. That way, when someone violates our sensibilities, we can peg them a couple of times. Believe you me, after a couple dozen fruit wheat peggings, a behavioral change can be expected.

FAX

Excellent thought. My aim is true.

Really? I wouldn't think that would be a wise choice.

But I think with this subject we've gone the opposite direction. I don't know it for a fact, but I'm going to hazard a guess that our laws concerning what is considered crude and vulgar behavior are probably considerable more tolerant today than they were a hundred years ago. You gotta think that a woman in a small Texas town in 1908 would have faced far greater wrath than a ticket for saying f*** while visiting the general store. She'd have most likely been run out of town.

This gun vs. tittah thing is troublesome, also.

The tittah is completely natural and a gift from God. Clearly, when the tittah was created, God did not anticipate that humans would devise the bra. However, the bra was, in fact, invented as a means to conceal the tittah. And, since the veiling of the tittah, the tittah has become off-limits in movies, whereas the bra may be shown and, in order to view the tittah, the bra must be removed. Removal of the bra in order to reveal the tittah requires time and time is money. Therefore, the bra is an unnecessary expense. This proves, undeniably, that the bra people did not consult God, nor did they, in all likelihood, fully appreciate either the tittah or fundamental economics. It follows then, that our problem is not with the tittah, but with the bra. As for guns, they exist to shoot the bra people.

FAX

And that is the right way to "police" this kind of issue. If you find someone offensive, stay away from them. Eventually they will get the message from everyone around them and either become lonely or change their behavior to fit with the rest of society.

I was thinking the same thing.....wtf? Makes you wonder what else he can write tickets for? Wow!

She should have the right to say whatever she pleases. That's a freedom we should all enjoy.


If the people at WalMart are offended by it, then they need to talk to a manager and have the manager ask her to leave the store. It's not against the law to swear or be rude. But it IS against the law to stay in a WalMart that you've been kicked out of. At such point, they have every right to call the police and have her arrested for trespassing.

This fire guy over stepped his bounds and I hope that ticket gets thrown out of court and the judge gives them both a really stern look and a little speach about the Constitution.

Cause there ain't no differnce tween runnin round ****in an killin a man.

That was suspended in 1939. Get with current events!!!

Or, since polite customer service is supposed to be part of his job, he'll get fired.

All true, Mr. mcan. The curious thing about this entire episode is that both Wal-Mart employees and Fire Marshalls are some of the cursingest people you'll ever know.

Just the other day, I had an elderly lady greet me with the words, "Welcome to fucking Wal-Mart, asshole".

FAX

ROFL

That would never happen in Texas. Walmart employees in Texas don't generally speak English.

Bienvenido a jodiendo Wal-Mart, asshole.


(Edited for kstater)

Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's just Wal-Mart in Mexican.

That's what happens when you use a free english-to-spanish online translator...

:D

I always suspected police and firemen were related. I don't trust either of them.

That's silly, Mr. Skip Towne. Firemen are good people when it comes to fires. But, just like every category of person or job, not all.

There was a guy in my home town who was on the volunteer fire department rolls. He was a valued member of the team because he was very lucky when it came to spotting fires. Anyhow, one day, he called in a fire at a barn on the outskirts of town and when the fireguys arrived at the scene with their trucks and hoses and ladders and stuff, they found an extinguished candle jammed in a bale of hay.

FAX

I wouldn't tell a fireman anything I didn't want the police to know.

It puzzles you because of the way you end this post. It has everything to do with censorship, political correctness, and pussification.

Who gets to decide what is and isn't rude or offensive? It's perhaps the slipperiest slope there is.

We have yet to hear if it was against the law. However, said law, if in place, is certainly unconstitutional.

It has everything to do with civil rights because it dictates what you can say where. In this case, it has nothing to do with endangering others. (Fire in theatre). THERE IS NO RIGHT NOT TO BE OFFENDED.

I agree with everyone else here about Wal-Mart asking her to leave because she's offending other customers. But a government official issuing a ticket makes it a civil liberties issue.

If you don't stand up for rights, they usually disappear.

There is a law called "Disturbing the peace" in Texas.

Disturbing the peace is a crime generally defined as the unsettling of proper order in a public space through one's actions.

This can include creating loud noise by fighting or challenging to fight, disturbing others by loud and unreasonable noise (including loud music or dog barking), or using offensive words likely to incite violence.

Disturbing the peace is typically considered a misdemeanor or an infraction depending on the jurisdiction and is often punishable by either a fine or brief term in jail.

It might fit that description but I don't believe that was what was written. And I don't think the fire marshall can give that. If so, that's pretty silly.

But then we still hit the slope with what constitutes "disturbing the peace". Is one fuck said aloud disturbing the peace? Some might argue it is.

Hmmm. Good debate, gentlemen. I'm very glad to see that you can discuss this matter without feeling the need for name-calling. There is hope for ChiefsPlanet, yet.

This raises a very interesting point, though. Obviously, in the USA, free speech is a protected right. However, does the owner of a particular property have the right to limit speech on his/her property? I mean, did Wal-Mart have the right to remove this lady from the premises based solely on her speech? If someone were to enter my place of business and use speech which I might find objectionable, do I have the right to remove that person for that reason and that reason only?

FAX

A fire marshal can give a ticket, since they are a "Civil service" worker. Sometimes, a fire marshal may be sworn in a law-enforcement officers as well.

Well, when she allegedly said the word, where the fire marshall came to her and politely told her that she shouldn't be swearing in public, the article allegedly says that she went on more profanity at the marshall, thus ignoring his warning.

He did give her a warning. If she was smart, and apologized for saying the bad word, she wouldn't even have a ticket.

Well, let's say you're a father or mother of kids, and you just happen to run across to somebody else who's been using foul language for a period of time. How would you handle it? Would you move away, or inform a Wal-Mart employee becuase of the distruptive behavior?

I don't see where it gives people the right to drop the f bomb at will. I don't think the founding fathers were walking down the street in tank tops and mullets yelling **** yeah!

Taken in the context that it was written - they were concerned with the right to express religious and political views and not be persecuted as had happened under British rule.

They had no idea that a couple hundred years later that the definitions of every word would be disected and argued over by a bunch of asshat lawyers.

Actually, I have (on more than one occasion) asked an individual to curb their excessive, foul language because my wife and young son were present, Mr. Coach. The last time was at a little league game, if you can believe that. Normally, it's something that I can handle myself without the need to involve an employee of the establishment at which I am present at the time. In every case so far, it's worked out without any sort of altercation. I suppose you never know when you're going to encounter a complete nutjob, though.

In this situation, I can't see that the fire marshall man did anything wrong. If he felt the need to give her a ticket, so be it. Let a judge figure it out.

However, that isn't really my question. My question has to do with the right of Wal-Mart (the owner of the property, in this case) to remove a person based solely on their speech. I honestly don't know the answer to this. I assume speech is viewed as a form of behavior ... maybe.

FAX