Yea, I am Mecca...nobody understands me...nobody responds to my posts how I want them to respond.

Hopefully someday we will all be able to communicate on the same plane as you.

That's stating a case?

Looks like a bunch of ****ing excuses to me.

Would he be able to improve after 8 starts?

Don't be afraid to answer this question with a simple yes or no.

It's obviously hard to get an answer to a simple question that doesn't involve severe hyperbole.

/Headshot

Its not a bunch of excuses...it is big factors the guy had going against him...

Yet with all those things?

He moved the ball...and got the Chiefs in the endzone. He is a gamer.

This might be the single best post in WPI's history. At least someone over there gets it.

You're way out of line with this post.

I personally think we should draft Sanchez. I'm on record as saying as much. But to pretend that Thigpen has no future and is the worst QB in the history of the game is kind of ass-reeruned also.

Here's the deal. Herm enforced his suck on the offense. Croyle got dead, like Croyle does. Huard quit, like Huard does. Thigpen comes in. Thigpen sucks. Until someone tells Herm to stfu and see if Gailey can work some magic. We go to the pistol. We score a lot of points. Still lose.

Thiggy put up numbers in a non-pro style offense. He sucked in the second half. The offense sucked in the redzone.

But the kid made some plays. Draft Sanchez, see what you have in the kid with the offense that the coach wants to run. If he sucks, fine. If not, cool! We've got a battle on our hands for QB.

That's about the only case that can be made for him.

He is not the unequivocal QBOTF for this team.

He is also not complete ass.

The pro-Thigpen argument in this thread basically boils down to that it's possible that Thigpen might improve, so we should put our entire future on his shoulders. Oh, and math sucks, screw the odds.

And what question did you ask in your post about dropping back.

It is hard to get a simple post from you without you making commentary about how people should and shouldn't interact with you on this board.

So you feel the spread/pistol is the wave of the future in the NFL then?

Thats it. Thats fine...

If we get another QB and he does better than fine. He is our new QB.

But the idea that Thigpen can't get better is stupid and false...and the idea that these top QBs are sure things is ridiculous.

Did you happen to turn games off at halftime?

You want a gamer?

Ben Roethlisberger is a gamer.

He finds a way to WIN.

Need a 90 yard scoring drive with 2:30 left on the clock to win the Super Bowl? With broken ribs?

THAT'S a gamer.

Tyler Thigpen is a parlor trick, who needs a gimmick offense to have any success whatsoever. But only in the 1st half of games.

I feel Tyler Thigpen is a decent QB that moves the chains. As far as the offense goes I trust our new head coach and will trust the offense coaching staff to do whatever they need to put our QB and offense in a position to succeed.

Why can't he improve?

Why didn't anyone touch this one...looking for an answer...

Would a newly drafted QB have the ability to improve after 8 starts?

Love him, or hate him, anyone who says that a guy who was thrown to the wolves in his rookie season with ZERO first team pre-season snaps, who had played entirely against bush league competition, did not do an admirable job, is just a dumbass. I really want to draft a QB, but even if we do, I have no problem starting the season with Thigpen, and would actually prefer it, while the other QB gets up to speed. Considering the circumstance, Thigpen did a damn good job. Spread or not. The guy had absolutely no time at all to get ready for the pro game, and still put points on the board. I want him to stick around, I just don't think his ceiling is high enough, becuase of his accuracy issues. Those are hard to fix, bit I would feel comfortable with him standing next to Haley by week 10.

Why should we expect it? Why should we pass over drafting a QB for him?

Becuase he has had none of the support system other QBs get...

The whole offense he was a part of changed in the middle of the season...no training camp as a main part of the offense.

Had a suspect line and running game but still made things happen.

Young players improve.

Why?

Who in this thread has made a legitimate case for Thigpen?

No one is willing to, because they know at the end of the ledger, there will be more negatives than positives.

If you want to HOPE he'll be good, feel free.

But to expect him to is another story. He has almost everything working against him, and almost nothing working for him.

It's like L. Ron Hubbard made a bet with someone that he convince a whole fan base that Tyler Thigpen was an NFL starting QB.

So you're advocating passing on a QB BECAUSE of Thigpen?

You need to get you cat scanned.

Dude....the whole offense changed BECAUSE OF HIM. It changed because he proved that he couldn't run a normal offense. Quit using that as an excuse for him.

but it's worked for new england, huh?

Someone must have haxored your sarcasm meter. Mecca has a good track record of sticking to the subject and many of those on the other side of any argument just want to talk about Mecca.

No support system? They changed the entire offense just so he could run it. What the hell else do you want them to do?

WRONG lots of people say he cant get better

Yes. They have an abundance of high first and second round draft choices, along with a head coach who coordinated a Super Bowl win, a Hall of Fame QB and a possible HOF wide receiver.

It was ridiculous that it took that franchise this long to get to a Super Bowl.

In the 1st round? Sure...I am not that impressed with this batch of QBs.

I am not an armchair draft expert like all you folks though. Whatever the Chiefs decide is fine with me.

But if our guy is Thigpen I would look forward to it.

Because he's limited to operating in a gimmick offense.

Can he improve if we stay with the Pistol? Sure.

That would be career suicide for Haley and Pioli, but for sake of conversation.

Can he improve if he's expected to play in a pro style offense?

Over time, possibly, but very doubtful.

Even QB's who played in a pro style offense struggle making the transition to the pros. History and his talent level shows he has a very minimal chance of being a successful pro QB.

Is Tyler Thigpen capable of winning a SB?

I don't think so, and I don't know how anyone could answer yes to that question.

And that's the goal here. To win a championship.

Yay! He's decent and has some flaws. Woo-hoo!


JFC.

That is a logical question. I am not a Thigpen hater or fan but it seems to me he has a chance to improve alot.

What about Thigpen's successes can you separate from the scheme? His mobility, I suppose. But beyond that... it just seems to me that he is completely a product of the scheme. I fear his terrible accuracy wouldn't take him far in a drop back system.

You would have never told me that before the playoffs started. They were 9-7 going into the post season.

Its ok though, message board sports experts can be right after the fact. It is easy to do...

That last part isn't at you Dane.

Yeah, it's shot today.

Been fighting a headache that a bottle of Advil can't seem to touch.

how do we actually know that thigpen cant? our offensive line was horrible, any one would be skittish when taking a THREE step drop and having defenders in your face before setting up

Maybe you missed the part about how I want to draft a franchise QB?

JFC. (Now I'm cool like Dane!)

*cough*

THANK YOU

But one thing though. A lot of people shit on this "spread" thing, but aren't a lot of other teams basically running a variation of that? New England, Arizona, New Orleans, and even Indy at times?

This is just a question. No need to call me reeruned, or anything like that.

You don't risk our future on "we don't know." Even if we draft a QB Thigpen will still be on the roster, and maybe he can become something. But you don't skip over a potential franchise QB because a late round pick might somehow become a good NFL quarterback when you have little reason to believe he will do so.

He's the white Vince Young.

He was great in college when he didn't need to read a defense, and the scheme masked all his flaws, but once he hit the pros' it was obvious he's not capable of running a pro style offense.

Making one read and pulling the ball down and running if it's not there isn;t going to get you far in this league.

I posted this last week to your query but you didn't respond:

http://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showpost....&postcount=115

so a rookie will come in right off and blow away the league? he won't need to improve? it's possible that he wont either

And drafting someone like Sanchez isn't risking our future?

It was great seeing Leinart play for the Cards in the Superbowl.

I reference the abomination that was the first Raider game and the Falcon game.

This

You are aware that Sanchez and Leinart are nothing alike right?

And the Leinart thing has been covered a million times it's to bad you failed to notice.

No...but he'll at least know how to run a pro-style offense.

Everyone runs their offense in a spread from time to time. Three wideouts, shotgun, etc.

The difference is that those teams can also run their offense effectively with their QB under center. Why? Because the QB's that you mention (Warner, Brady, Brees & Manning) know how to read a defense.

Thigpen was horrendous under center against the Raiders, Falcons and Panthers. Furthermore, the Chiefs couldn't score in goal line situations when Thigpen was under center.

He's just not capable of running a Pro-Style offense at this time. Will he ever be capable? That's hard to say. But I wouldn't bank MY franchise on that risk.

I don't think there is any reason that giving decent coaching and an offseason\traning camp Thigpen couldn't have success in a system made for him by our new coach...even under center.

Nobody had success behind that line under center...even Huard who has shown he can do some good things at QB.

You mean the Falcon game where he was making his first NFL start?

ROFLROFLROFLROFLROFLROFLROFL

This is the best post in this thread.

Jumping down someone else's throat for failing to notice something that's been covered a million times.


Gold.

They are not alike...Leinart looked more impressive out of college.

I'll play Huckelberry.

Tough. Name me the last time the chiefs had healthy starter for eight games, let
alone a season. willing to block, willing to go for the qb draw on the goal. Strong arm, quick release.

Mobile. faster than he looks..runs for first downs, scrambles, throws well on the run.

Accurate. Bowe dropped alot of balls, yet still he and Tony had good seasons. this is the key area..as noted by zach, no OTA's, no TC..to deny this time with Wr's isn't vital is insane.

Adversity. this is huge for me...TG said he doesn't get down after a bad play...he ran the two minute drill pretty decent..the Jet's gaem comes to mind...

Smart. coming off the bench at number three and even scoring is positve. makes good decisions, needs work on reads etc...practice makes perfect

Cheifs...came into a cluster**** rebuild under Herm Edwards. Nuff said.

What I don't get is almost everyone on this board knew and expected to be pretty bad this last year, and then use the very thing they thought would happen and then flip it with high standards and then complain why someone isn't producing at a high level in his first gig on the fly.

potential=we dont know. draft a guy or thigpen it's the exact same- we dont know

That's untrue. Huard had a career game against the Broncos while under center.

Again, Thigpen may improve someday and have the ability to play under center.

But would you be willing to stake your reputation (and your franchise) on Tyler Thigpen if you were Haley, Pioli or Hunt?

I don't think so.

Drafting anyone is a risk. Drafting a quarterack may be riskier than drafting a linebacker, but they are also far more important to a team. To be a consistent contender in this league you need a franchise quarterback, and it is well worth the risk to draft one in the top 10 where you have the best chance of finding one. If you don't have a franchise quarterback, you don't pass one up in the draft.

Ironically, we didn't have anyone talented taking snaps behind that line under center.

Better than bad does not equal good.

yep IN COLLEGE

Untrue.

Stafford and Sanchez are bigger, taller and stronger than Thigpen. They've also been playing in a Pro-Style offense for at least three years (if not four).

Thigpen's been in the spread for the past three years because he can't read defenses.

I'm surprised it took 8 posts for someone to say "In Scott We Trust."

I see what you're saying, but I really have a hard time believing that just because Thigpen was under center that we couldn't get a yard on a handoff when we needed it, and we couldn't. Couldn't that be something more than Thigpen sucks from under center? Seems like there could be other factors like LJ/OLINE/Playcalling sucking.

Fine, draft Sanchez. I don't think he's that bad a prospect tbh. I just think Stafford is going to be an awful NFL QB.

Can a QB get improve after playing 8 games?

Anyone. Any single person is welcome to say yes or no.

Lets not forget that Chiefs defense....

maybe

I give you credit for carrying the water on this one.

However, you're pushing believability to claim that Thigpen is accurate and has a strong arm. His signature plays all year were to misfire badly on 15 yard passes and to under throw Bradley on sure touchdowns.

He's scrappy, no doubt, but he's a QB who lacks the fundamental skill set to build around. And this is the key point. It has nothing to do with impatient fans.

really 21-28 160 yards 1td= career game come on dane

well, Trent Green was pretty good, but when he had to start playing behind a weak line, he also turned to shit.

Why do you keep coming back to this? It's not a question of can, it's a question of whether or not we should expect enough improvement to pass on Stafford/Sanchez. And the answer to that in my opinion is a clear no.

I am sure you will be able to tell me after everything happens though Deberg. I look forward to that.

Not physically.

Tell that to the sorority sisters.

I knew that the Chiefs would be lucky to win more than three games in 2008 and said as much last April. While Thigpen's play greatly improved once the spread was implemented, his completion percentage in each game decreased dramatically as each game wore on.

In other words, he got worse, not better. He's not an accurate passer and doesn't particularly have a strong arm. If I were the new GM or coach, there's no way I'd pass on a possible franchise QB in Stafford or Sanchez because Thigpen was already on the roster.

I'm not advocating that the Chiefs cut him altogether. He may improve and learn how to quickly read defenses behind center but, I wouldn't take that bet.

no matter what you say dane we still dont know about them, both could EASILY BUST.

So what does THAT tell you, Doomy?

Because, contrary to your post people ARE saying he can't improve. Me? Not impressed with this years QB class. I would at least have some hope for Stafford but Sanchez is more overhyped USC bust action just waiting in the wings.

Did I just read that Thigpen is accurate, that must be a pretty low standard.