risk(money) - reward(playingtime) he is an upgrade aslong as he can play.
black and white sides to this coin.

if Mike Brown stays healthy, I assure you he is going to be a starter.

Never said he was going to have a probowl like season quit putting words in my mouth.

Skeeeert! Stop right there. If Mike Brown didn't have such obvious injury concerns, he would've been picked up already. Just because he ALMOST completed a whole season last year does not make him durable, and god knows what his injuries have done to his speed, and he was never fast in the first place. He will NOT replace Pollard. If anything, he may replace page on obvious running situations. He's just another role player until he can prove otherwise.

warren sapp is a dick. vince young is crazy.

Even if Brown doesn't actually play, he's going to help improve the Defense. The dude was a hell of a player when he was healthy and will be a good resource for players like Pollard, Page and Morgan.

Other teams were intrested him him and he's a much better player then Pollard. Look at the #'s of the 36 games he's played in compared to the # of games Pollard has played in. Brown is the better player.

Pollard never fit the cover 2, 3-4 fits him alot better

This. Im glad they signed him. But lets not get shit twisted, he's not a reliable starter.

Mike brown played on a good D, with good coaches. Pollard, not so much. Brown is slow and often injured. Pollard may not be blazing fast, but at least we can count on him being there on sunday. Pollard is ascending. Brown is descending.

Bad move. Your season is over.

That's also stuff that can be coached at a high level. Lets see what Pollard does without Gunther before we judge him. He obviously has the talent.

So when is the rest of your offense getting traded?

Thats true but i'm talking about overall skills Brown is a better player. Pollard is a good special teams thats when he makes plays. This is a win-win for the Chiefs

I agree that the Chiefs did no wrong with this signing. I just don't see him beating out Pollard is all. Depth, maybe some leadership and certain packages.

Well, thanks for putting words in my mouth there, Sporto.

You're such a welcome addition to this forum.

:shake:

What does your cousin think of this "Older player mentoring young players" business?

Has it ever been a topic of discussion?

I'm sure he'd have some interesting and accurate insight.

This is just the same old nonsense.

The Chiefs sign some over-the-hill player. Some fans on Chiefsplanet automatically assume that person will beat out the incumbent player and make an impact.

The truth of the matter is that it rarely, if ever, happens.

which cousin? I know gregg drags pierson prioleau around with him for mentoring. I know the skins players mentored each other and i know gregg has brought in players he coached on his staff to coach his LBs in washington.
Both my cousins were mentored by shawn taylor.
I think it depends on the teaching strength of the staff and it all comes down from the top.

The article was written last year, when Mayo was a rookie.

Whos your cousin Mohillbilly?

Thanks! :thumb:

A healthy Brown is the best safety on our team. A hurt Brown still brings more leadership to the sidelines than a healthy McGraw. If Brown gets hurt then the guy who would be starting if we hadn't signed him would start anyways. If he gets seriously hurt then we can just sign McGraw again because no other team in the NFL would pick him up. There really is nothing to lose in this move. Plus he started 15 games last year, looks like hes on the right track.

It's a good move. This should help push Morgan, Pollard and Page to up their game.

Competition is always a good thing.

So whos the odd man out? Mcgraw or Morgan? Haley said they will keep 2 guys for specail teams.

Mcgraw.

Is that a serious question?

:clap:

No way will it be Morgan.

Yea. I mean Pollard should be on special teams hes damn good at special teams. We just drafted Morgan last year he'd be like the 3rd or 4th guy from last years draft to be cut. McGraw only plays special teams so if you can get a guy who plays special teams and is a good backup he should be on the team.

I think so too.

Pollard is a ST's stand out where McGraw isn't, hes just a ST's player. Pollard isn't a cover two safety like McGraw is either. Pollard needs to be used like Adrian Wilson(I'm in no way saying his that good), and since we have the guy who coached Wilson I think its safe to assume he will use Pollard in that role also. Pollard blows McGraw away, I think Page would be the next to go before Pollard or Morgan even.

With the NFL printing money and us being nowhere near the salary cap "Risk/reward" doesn't actually exist.

There's NO risk here. If he busts completely, Clark Hunt spent a few bucks he didn't have to. Who cares? It's not your money and with the money that flows around the NFL these days, that money isn't going to effect your parking, concession or ticket prices one bit.

Maybe he stays healthy, tutors the young kids and makes some plays. If he does, he'll have been a great pickup. Maybe he blows out his ACL on the first day of training camp. If he does, who gives a crap?

It's a zero downside move, good on the Chiefs for making it.

I agree.

The Chiefs have boatloads to spend and this was a wise move.

I always made fun of my friends who are Bears fans because Mike Brown could NEVER stay healthy. He is (injury wise) the Brodie Croyle of safeties. The problem with him is that the Bears counted on him to be in their lineup every year with not much of a plan in place if he wasn't. If Brown does end up starting in KC, at least we have some young talent with starting experience behind him.

I like the move. I think he will bring some veteran and Super Bowl experience to KC. And he isn't ancient for a safety (31). If they count on him to hold up throughout an entire season...it won't happen. We would be lucky to see him make it through training camp/preseason without an injury.

Again, what the **** does wanting to start have anything to do with mentorship? Yes, Green wanted to start, but NOTHING indicates that this affected his relationship with Croyle. Everything I have seen indicates that the three were all pretty close to each other.

Did Green help Croyle? Yes. Did he teach Croyle things along the way? Undoubtedly. Did Croyle learn a lot by watching Green practice, play, and probably sit in the film room to learn from Green? Undoubtedly.

You are arguing an entirely different issue. The argument isn't about whether Green was an upstanding player. It was whether his presence on the Chiefs was a positive influence on young players. And to prove your point, you're completely fabricating these made-up stories about how Trent Green was this stubborn veteran that refused to help any young players and that young players refused to listen to him.

Mr. Verbose strikes again.

Apparently, you don't read any articles or digest anything that's said in the media or by Mr. Green himself. Someone else here quoted Green as saying "That's what coaches are for".

I'm sick of you. You're going on ignore. Bye-Bye.

Unless there was a signing bonus involved, Clark Hunt didn't spend a dime.

These guys don't get paid until the season starts and even then, it's a weekly game check.

They don't get paid 52 weeks out of the year.

Apparently, you aren't familiar with DaJuan Morgan.

I don't think there's anyway this guy is cut. Traded? Maybe. But cut?

No way.

And it pisses me off to no end that Erik Walden is impressing Bill Parcells, yet the Chiefs cut him during the season last year. He may turn into a very solid pass rusher.

Walden played very well on special teams last year. I was very surprised to see him cut by KC.

Yeah, that was a drag.

He would have been perfect as an outside 3-4 linebacker in this scheme. He was a fairly decent pass rusher at Middle Tennessee State and definitely has some speed.

And your entire argument hinges on an opinion made by Warren Sapp and about the followership of Vince Young.

You have stories about Tony G teaching receivers routes and sitting down with Tyler Thigpen VOLUNTARILY to tutor the kid. You have stories of Cassel shadowing Brady and developing the same work ethic. You have stories of young players shadowing Cassel's strong workout regimen. You have stories about LJ throwing a shit-fit after T-Rich was traded. Are you really going to suggest that good leaders don't affect young players? I take a lot more stock in these stories than one opinion by a player who has a reputation for being an asshole.

No, not all veterans are great leaders (Favre) and not all young players are great listeners (Young). But it's a really tough argument to make that solid veterans have no effect whatsoever in helping out young players.

The difference between Croyle and Brown is Brown actually makes plays. Yes he gets injured its becuz he goes all out and makes play. This is a damn good signing as everyone said we didn't really spend much on a guy who when he plays is awesome.

You mean where he runs behind the return guy for about 25 yards and then takes a dive about a foot behind his feet?

Super.

1) The Star is high as a kite.

2) Yes...another Safety. That's exactly what we needed.







































NOT!

That's why I put (injury wise) in my initial post.

I will have to disagree with you on the point about Mike Brown getting hurt because he goes all out. We are talking about the NFL here. Every player goes all out. You wouldn't make it through one game if you didn't. Mike Brown is INJURY PRONE. Nothing is going to change that.

It is still a good signing though.

Yea but didn't croyle miss a game because his back was sore? I mean theres a difference between a sore back and a torn ACL. Look at the Brown highlight tape he's a beast. Anyway understand why I love this signing i'm a Cornhusker fan and Brown was one of the best Husker players. Also I said before it'd be awesome if we'd sign Mike Brown. I also said we should trade for Cassel you can look it up. I will put my rep on this both will be very good players for the Chiefs.

Brown has missed 44 games over the last 5 seasons. That's 4 games less than 3 FULL seasons. Brown just can't stay healthy, it doesn't matter how big or small the injury is.

Good signing...but nothing to get too excited about. He won't hold up an entire season.

hey I like it! As long as it's not for too much. But we could definately use some quality experience back there.

Exactly.

Though I think sometimes players do take a liking to veterans and vice versa.
Ultimately... I'll take veterans who can lead by example. That can often be more influential than the "under the wing" approach.

Yeah, that Mike Vrabel's really set the tone for the youthful players.

:shake:

How do you know that? Because he didn't show up to optional workouts and because he said he was unhappy to be traded?

But did you hear from players that said he was inapproachable? Have there been any reports that he hasn't been working hard since going to camp? Have you heard any single player say that they are upset at him for not showing up?

You're speculating. Hines Ward held out several years ago from training camp. So did Tony Gonzalez. And these are two of the hardest working players in the game (and in the case of Tony G, we've seen specific cases of his mentourship). Players understand the difference between business and playing. I have yet to see any specific evidence to suggest that his skipping OTAs had any negative effect on the youth. In fact, it's probably a ridiculous suggestion to say so. We haven't seen any evidence of a positive influence either, but I guarantee that you will very soon.

Drafted players don't yet understand the politics or business of the NFL.
I'm sure no rookie working his way onto this roster will bat an eyelash at Vrabel exercising his right not to show up for voluntary OTA's.

Dude, it's June. Give it a rest. Are you really gonna hang your argument on statements from Sapp recounting his days with the Raiders? The Raiders. Losers. You can't say no veteran will mentor a rookie. Winning teams do, losing teams don't.

Thread over...

If he stays on the field he's better than both Page and Pollard......Page has become one of the most overrated Chiefs players, I'm not sure why.

Because he makes plays. Few others do.

But I agree. He probably is overrated by homers like myself.

I pictured alot of people losing their minds when EA put out it's roster update last year and Page went from a 78 to like a 72.

The "argument's" already been made. There are plenty (if not hundreds) of NFL players that flat out do not want anything to do with "mentoring".

And why the hell would they? So that after they mentor a younger player, they're out of a job?

That doesn't make much sense.

The argument hasn't been made. You're using one person's opinion (Sapp, a really awkward example in the first place) and generalizing across to "plenty" and potentially "hundreds" of players?

Why would they mentor other players? Oh, I don't know. Maybe because they want to win? Maybe because they know that coaches and front offices would much rather keep a leader around than a loner? Do you really think that an above average veteran who isn't on Brett Favre status can get away with shunning young players without the coach or front office noticing? Most players would get "fired" for not working hard and putting themselves above the team.

Yes, there are "plenty" of young players who shun advice and "plenty" of veterans who refuse to give it. But there are also plenty who follow by example (even if unadmittedly) and there are also plenty who lead (even if unintentionally).

I'll admit I ****in snapped :mad: :D

Excellent post.

(See: Ship, To da)

Good signing. He will definately create competition. No one will be handed starting jobs this year. I remember when the Chargers Front Office thought Rodney Harrison was washed up. He gave the Patriots some pretty good years...Brown could do the same in KC...

Oh for the love of ****:

Let's put Brown behind Krumrie's awesome front-four, ****her's All-Star LB Corps, and watch him run around like Sauto fetching Sake in a hail-storm!


I wrote a song in honor of your posts:

Problem with that comparison is the fact that Harrison had been relatively healthy throughout his career leading up to that point. Brown's always been plagued by injuries. I think it's a good signing nonetheless. Just an entirely different situation.

Blow me. The guy has had to cover half the field for 5 seconds with zero pass rush.

You know, I never took you for a lemming.

Guess I was wrong.

:eek:ROFL

I bet I was one of the five people that wasnt surprised by Pollards jump to a 87.

Page should be a 80-84, but isnt close to elite as some have suggested. If Brown ends up starting in this scheme, I would think he would take Pages spot. Pollard is a much better box safety, that is what he did at Purdue to get recognized.


Brown can teach one hell of alot in pass coverage to Pollard (by teaching, or example) and a shitton about the importance of good tackling and form tackling to both.

I see him as the third safety and see him taking over for Pollard on third and long situations.

If this holds true, Pollard might make the probowl as a special teamer. Dont forget, or discount, that Pollard is also in a contract year iirc.

good signing at the very least

i think brown will be a run stop specialist. He probably isnt fast enough to play cover anything. who gives a shit if he mentors anyone as long as he makes some plays to help the team win acouple games.

Kolby's 1st cousin, no wonder he can't stay healthy.

It actually does exist, but it's about players who are receptive to it. Sapp DID in fact try to teach those guys but they didn't care. And guess what? They sucked. Tony G often cited Ted Popson as a guy that mentored him and helped him tremendously when he was drafted. Grunny said that he learned more from Mike Webster than any coach. Cris Carter most certainly mentored Randy Moss. It does in fact exist, and the vets are willing to help the young guys but it's actually more about the young guys than the vets. You have to have young guys who want to learn and get better.

...

All of the shit I took for this very point...

He's an injury prone mother ****er, that's for sure...but he's always been a great player when on the field...the Bears didn't sign him because they have been drafting his replacement for years due to all of the injuries...the fact Mike Brown played 15 games last year was a shock to everyone in Chicago...that's for sure. The dude is an injury waiting to happen.

As Wendler gently weeps over the move, I too am not surprised. He's picking off Epic Fraud in practice, he'll be working the box and getting shit done.

Monster season ahead for BP.

I love it when people think Madden football has some relationship to what actually happens in real football.

Meh. It's just a game.

More fun is when people's fantasy teams take BIG dump due to star player getting mangled for rest of season.

Ohhhhh....Sankyou!:D

If Mike Brown stays healthy, he's gonna plant Pollard's ass on the bench.

Write it down.

You will rarely get laid in life.

Write THAT down, and sell it for $109.00.

:evil:

But in death, I'll be a playa.

Pimp 'O Hades

You're mentioning extraordinary players: Gonzalez, Chris Carter, Randy Moss. These guys are sure-fire Hall of Famers - Duh.

What about the non-Hall of Fame guys? The other 1,689 football players in the league? They're just hanging on to their jobs by a thread. The Chiefs are a perfect example of that. How would you like to be Pollard or Page or Morgan at this point after the Chiefs signed Brown? Personally if I were Brown, I wouldn't help them at all. This is probably his last chance to play football.

Again (for the 100th time), this mentoring business is highly overrated by the fans.

And pointing out HOFer's does nothing to support the fact that is does exist in spades.