This is a fresh start though, isn't it?

New Owner, new GM, new HC, new QB...

How can you blame them for the franchise being run into the ground? And sure, you may disagree with some personel decisions, but what's not to like about the "get in shape or GTFO" mantra?

I guess what I'm asking is, If you've been a chiefs fan your whole life... and hated seeing those "other guys" run the team into the ground....

How could you possibly not be hopeful now? They might not work out, but at least we're trying something different, right? This aint the same old Chiefs. (And I don't mean this season... long term)

It's not that simple.

Yes, I'm extremely happy that Carl's reign of terror is over.

But, like any rebuilding nation, it takes time to become a world power again. It's not going to happen overnight. It's not going to happen in a year. It's going to take a few years, if every move that is made is the right move.

I'm done criticizing personnel. I'll admit, I'm not happy with the 2009 draft overall and I'm not happy with the lack of free agent signings. But that doesn't matter now, as the team is gearing up for the upcoming season. My opinion doesn't matter (if it ever did). It's all about the guys on the field and to a much lessor extent, the man in the front office.

Only time will tell if their moves (or lack thereof) payoff.

But I can't unilaterally get excited about the death of one regime when the new regime, IMO, has missed more than a few opportunities to impress and improve upon its predecessors.

The long and short of it is...

We don't know how it will go. And when it comes to the Chiefs, I'm an optimist, and you're a pessimist.

Alright Bro, enjoy the season!

Will do. You too, man.

LMAO

You made it out of Pop Warner?

Long time lurker, first time poster.

I live in Baltimore, and have been a Chief's fan for many years. I will be going to the game Sunday wearing my red and gold, but i figured i would throw my few cents into our chances Sunday after reading some comments in this thread.

Homerism aside, we have a slim chance.

Ravens D versus Chiefs O - Advantage Ravens. The Ravens have a new DC but the scheme remains largely the game. They will blitz early and often. Their only real weak spot is their CB's. They are vulnerable to the double moves (if we even have time to run them) and always go for the big play (Pick-6) instead of making the tackle. If we are smart we will try to take advantage of this. We should pass to run, quick screens, bubbles and slants are how Pittsburgh beats Baltimore. When we run, have to hit the A gap. Counters won't work as their LBs are too quick.

Ravens O verus Chiefs O - Push. The Ravens are exploring passing the ball much more this pre-season and season. Its everywhere in the local papers. They can run with McGahee, Rice and McClain (in short yard situations). However, they want to make Flacco the next Roethlisburger. Flacco does not read zone coverage well. If we are smart we will throw a lot of different looks at him.

In the end, we cannot beat them, but I just hope we make it competitive. The Ravens are a good team, but they struggle with passing teams and IF we don't make any mistakes with the ball on offense, we will stay in the game. Here's hoping!

welcome to the planet

I played beyond JUCO. Just an FYI. I'll leave it at that.

Yeah I can be a jackass at times. And guys like Mecca and Hamas aren't? Yet the majority of the crap they post is baseless and uneducated. At least my insight has merit.

And no it's not out of the question for Hali to have 10 sacks. I mean for the love of God the guy had 8 as a rookie with his hand in the dirt. :shake:

You need to learn to put things in context.

This board lacks a lot of that ability. A comparison to a player, a great player, merely to emphasize a point, in no way equates the two players.

But, the point is that it is moronic to keep bringing up Hali's deficiency in something that he WON'T be freaking asked to do very often!

It's like slighting Joe Montana because he doesn't tackle well.

Hali will most likely put up more sacks this season by himself than the entire team had last year.

And, it's not like he isn't used to dropping into zone coverage already. Many zone blitzes drop the DE into the flat in coverage.

Good for you. And BTW, I've just been teasing you. My initial impression was that you had a sense of humor and would play along. Why so serious?

:p

That's not the issue. You really come across as angry and mean spirited. I mean really angry. We're all just here to have fun and sure, we bust each other's chops. But I'd have a beer with any of these guys (and have).


This is the problem with being new. Mecca isn't an asshole. He rarely, if ever, uses expletives to get his point across. He's a guy that spends most of his free watching college football, reading and scouting players and so on. He's opinionated but that's because he's studied. He's actually a really cool guy and very passionate about football.

Hamas is a genius. Literally. Genius. He's extremely funny and sarcastic and most of the time, new people don't "get" him (much like they don't get me at first, either). He's a totally cool dude and extremely sharp.

Well, this is where you'll have a difficult time in this forum unless you change your viewpoint. Everyone's insight has merit from time to time. You don't have a monopoly on "insight". People may have differing opinions based on their experience but that doesn't mean that their viewpoints are baseless.

You'll find that there are some pretty sharp minds around here.

It's possible, though unlikely, IMO. It's a different defense and he doesn't have a consistent, game-changing, sack machine on the opposite side.

I think the major difference with Pioli managing the franchise is that we'll do much better in free agency. One of his strengths that you heard about over and over again in NE was his ability to find players that fit well into Bill Belicheks system. I think that will serve the team well because then you're not as much under pressure to hit a home run in the draft when there isn't as much talent coming out of college.

:spock:

He's off to a rousing start so far.

It's way too early to cast any judgement.

Cool. My bad then.


Some viewpoints certainly have more merit than others. Would you ask a guy who has never driven or even seen a car to diagnose why yours won't start or a certified mechanic?

We'll see. I don't think that 10 sacks, if he can stay healthy, is out of reach.

So when exactly does he "go on the job" then? When does the time clock kick in?

That's what I was wondering.

I guess Mike Goff, Eric Ghiaciuc, Amani Toomer, Ashlie Lelie, Vince Redd, Zach Thomas and the re-signing of Rudy Niswanger doesn't count?

Apparently so.

Why focus on the negative? Why not say Cassel, Mays, Brown, possibly being able to make something of Dorsey and Hali in a 34?

The original comment was focusing specifically on how we will do better in FA.

On that note, I think Mays was an excellent find, and that Mike Brown will not perform any better than his predecessor, provided he can even stay healthy enough to play regularly.

Yep. One out of a dozen for the first year isn't bad I suppose.

Big deal those guys were minimum risk signing and bringing them in to camp. What did we lose by having them in camp? NE routinely signed and released players including one Eric Warfield as I recall. As soon as a better option becomes available I'm sure Niswanger will be replaced but that is one of the things I don't agree with. We've got a huge hole to get out of.

You're missing the point.

Those guys were supposed to be better than what we have. They were counted on to fill holes - not just be camp bodies.

Especially on the OL.

I thought that in most cases Haley said the guys were brought in to create competition.

The subsequent content of this post makes your initial criticism wonderfully ironic.

He gave them a chance it didn't work. Minimal risk no big loss. What's the problem? He found a replacement for sackintosh and now sackintosh is gone. Finding better people doesn't happen overnight or as fast as you would like it to be.

BTW when was it said that they were being counted on to fill holes? Were any of those guys offered huge contracts? A big part of TC is that it is a big tryout it's no different from the rest of the league.

Finding better players shouldn't be that difficult for the Executive of the Year, especially considering who he's looking to replace.

You guys can keep making excuses for him, but overall, he whiffed big time this offseason when it came to evaluating talent - especially on the OL.

If Carl had authored an offseason where our best FA signing was Corey ****ing Mays, this place would have been at DefCon 2.

If you think finding all these impact players is going to be done in one offseason your naive and don't understand how low this team has sunk.

If he had signed those guys to huge contracts then I would agree that he had whiffed big time. If Cassell flops I'm right there with you. Bringing in vets and cutting them in training camp is routinely done throughout the league.

Stop.

Right there.

No one is asking for impact players.

We could start with finding a center, RG, and RT that don't get abused on every play.

It took 6 months to find ONE GUY that might fit that description. (O'Callaghan)

Again, no one is asking to find ****ing Pro Bowlers.

But finding guys that are better than what we have really shouldn't be that difficult - especially with 6 months to do so.

Actually it's been more than one player what about those two guys from Miami? It's not as easy as it sounds what did you honestly expect to happen?

ROFL Newdookie has a fan...

I expected the Executive of the Decade to be able to be able to identify talent.

He thought Goff was the answer at RG. Wrong.

He brought in arguably the worst center in the league to "push" the next worst center in the league. Fail.

He spent 6 months thinking McIntosh was the answer at RT. Wrong.

Then he TRADED for a guy that is actually worse than McIntosh. Fail.


For someone that everyone seems to think can do no wrong, he sure is wrong a lot.

Again, no one is expecting the team to be rebuilt overnight.

But not being able to find players to upgrade the worst right side of an OL in the entire league is shameful for someone that gets the credit Pioli does.

I personally don't think we were as active as we needed to be. When we traded Gonzo and locked Cassel in, upgrading our OL became more urgent. At least with Gonzo the QB could just chuck it 20 yards down the field blindly and know that he had a better than 60% chance of seeing #88 catch it in quadruple coverage.

That said, at least we didn't just stay put with Macintosh. With Ndukwe we might have a big problem. With Macintosh we were certain that we did.

Does he look anywhere outside of his "buddy club"? I mean, all I'm sayin' is; his predecessor just WOULD NOT take talent from USC. I'm getting that same kind of vibe here, though in the FA market.

:shrug:

Who is out there? Who would you have gotten? I don't agree with all of Piolis decisions but I'm at least going to reserve judgement until a full season has been played. Call me crazy but I give the benefit of a doubt to people who come from organizations that have one multiple championships. I don't see how bringing guys into camp and cutting them before the season starts equates to whiffing. Signing underperformers like Kendrell Bell to big contracts is what I would call whiffing

shameful?


ROFL

you guys are ****ing hysterical

you beg for him to sign every piece of trash in the league (which is all there is at a certain point) ("why isn't he doing anything! any player is better than what we have!!!"), and then when he does you call him shameful, as if he were picking from a list of hall of famers during cut downs at training camp....

get over yourself, you ignorant fukwad....

GFY.

Had he not misdiagnosed the situation in ****ing MARCH, we wouldn't need to be combing through the waiver wire to come up with a solution for THREE positions on the OL.

Don't act like he had nothing to choose from.

He made his choices back in March and failed. Miserably. Leading us to this point, where we're trying to find other team's scraps that are better than our scraps.

If you don't want to hold him accountable for his mistakes from 6 months ago, that's your prerogative.

and the people who will never forgive pioli for one decision out of a hundred he's made since arriving are the same people who swore up and down that Hamon Meredith would solve our RT problem if only we had drafted him....but they're still genious-es apparently...


childish, dis-honest, assholes....

The same 5 or 6 people are always overly critical and it all seems to stem from one personnel decision that didn't go their way.

Excellent rebuttal, as always.

Is he not responsible for mistakenly thinking Goff was the answer at RG?

Is he not responsible for mistakenly thinking McIntosh was the answer at RT, and going 98% of the offseason without looking for a replacement?

Is he not responsible for thinking the worst center in the NFL could push the 2nd worst center in the league?

You act like he's made one bad decision. If you want to continue to bury your head in the sand and think that, go right ahead. For every decision he's made that appears it may work, there's 5 or more bad decisions that can be referenced.

Sorry, but I expect a bit more from the Executive of the Decade when it comes to talent evaluation.

You REALLY think this is about ONE decision?

I expect this type of BS from TTC. You're smarter than that.

I think people went from "lets wait and see... it's fair to give him some time" to being overly critical once he signed Cassel.

we haven't played one game...not a single game


and we already have someone with a sub-human intelligence declaring our GM "shameful"....


this passed for intelligence on the planet....this is what the smart people think

Who cares? Do you need to see a "game" before knowing whether or not this offensive line is awful?

Is that your point?

In ****ing March are you kidding me? He had just barely taken over the team,there's a million things going on at that point you're a month away from the draft. Nobodies above criticism including Pioli, but you're being a sandy vag on this one.

Last I checked, preseason games were used to EVALUATE players.

So are mini-camps and OTA's.

Oh, and this little thing called GAME FILM.

But golly gee! I guess we just had to wait until Scott Pioli himself cut Damion McIntosh before deciding that he was no good!

:shake:

I mean, come on. Who knew that McIntosh sucked?

The hirings came kind of late, so it is hard to judge this year. The team didn't even have their own scouts this past season. Was I happy with the draft, nope. Was I happy with free agency, nope. But it's still way too early in the process to waste my time complaining 24/7.

So instead, you choose to waste your time complaining about those that complain?

That's quite a noble gesture.

I'm not complaining, I just noted that a handful of people became a bunch of whining bitches ever since Cassel was signed.

God, it's the same dialog, over, and over, and over again.

exacccctly

Come on, there's much more to it than that.

Everyone, and I mean everyone was expecting the Pioli to make earth-shattering moves with this roster. Cassel appears to be a very good start and Vrabel's shown he's got another solid season in him.

But outside of those two, there's been virtually nothing to get excited about. It's as if the problems with the offensive line, wide receivers and linebacking corp didn't exist. Sure, Mays looks to be fine addition but he was initially added as a backup to of all people, 37 year-old Zach Thomas.

It's as if they lay all the blame on coaching, believing that the talent on the roster was sufficient. Just like someone else who said the roster was "85% there".

It's rather shocking to most people that closely follow the Chiefs, isn't it?

Bowe seems to be giving a greater effort to take it to the next step.
T. Jackson has been looking pretty darn good for a rookie.
Dorsey (who many thought would be a complete bust in the 34) seems to be making progress.
Hali (who many thought would be a complete bust in the 34) seems to be making progress.
Mays seems to be an excellent find.
The kicker seems to be reliable.
The running back situation seems to be pretty good.

The potential problem I see here is Haley having to take a fall for a lot of this shit in the eyes of the average fan, and I think that would be a HUGE long-term mistake.
As it stands right now, there's one half of the "Dynamic Duo" that in my opinion stands head and shoulders above the other.
I'll let you guess which one.:)

actually, that's not true...it's a straw man


any perceptive person realized the most he could in the short term with a roster he knew nothing about first hand was to cut losers and clean out the shit...which he has done a lot of....

if trading Gonzo and acquiring Cassel, a franchise QB, aren't big enough moves...well, sorry...

this season is about evaluation, always has been, and ive said so since the beginning...major repairs happen next year, when they no exactly what the need, and who is worth keeping, and when hopefully Clark will let them hit FA harder too...

it still boils down to people whining the sake of whining....there is no way they could remake this team in a few ****ing months...sorry they prioritized positions differently than the smart guys here wanted them too...


but the persistence, the repetition, the obsessiveness of the whining taking place about a regime that hasn't played a god damned snap of one real game is so out of proportion to merit...

i can only assume pioli had anal sex with all your mothers, sisters, wives, and girlfriends....

While those are all valid points, I was referring to new additions to the roster that would at least bring average play to positions that have been sore spots for the Chiefs for nearly 4 years, not existing players.

Center, right guard, right tackle, second WR, etc. I mentioned earlier that Mays was a nice find but he was intended to be a special teams player only. It's like Vermeil stating that Priest Holmes was a 3rd down back while Tony Richardson was the primary running back.

They quite possibly "backed into" a fine player, though that is truly yet to be determined.

Really? This is your opinion? Have you watched or seen the Chiefs offensive line since 2006? How many QB's need be injured and put on IR before it's adequately addressed?

Are you telling me that it takes a "Genius" nearly 6 months after he's been hired to cut Damion McIntosh? Really?

All I can say is "Wow".

I'd be bitching about not protecting our franchise QB had we drafted Sanchez, just like I am now.

This isn't a Cassel-Sanchez debate. It's about taking steps to protect your investment at the most important position.

It's okay, we've got a GREAT crop of QB's to choose from this year if Cassel dies.:rolleyes:

This is funny. When the team finds a player it becomes "luck" and they never intended for the player to succeed. When a player doesn't make the team, people like OTWP say that Pioli has failed in finding starting talent. The team can't win either way. If they find someone it's because they accidentally tripped over them. If they cut out some waste, they suck because they shouldn't have even bothered.

C'mon man, it's not like Pioli "found" him out of the blue. Like most of the FA wreckage we picked up this off season, there was history between the two.

I put Mays success and improvement from his prior stops SQUARELY on the shoulders of Corey Mays.

Apparently, not everyone had your take. Here are just a couple of examples......

And

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...0&postcount=90

Cassel
Vrabel
Brown
Engram
Goff
O'Callaghan
Ndukwe
Alleman
Gutierrez
Beisel
Mays

And those are just the veterans that made the team. This was talked at least as far back as February.

And outside of Cassel and maybe Vrabel, none of those guys would start for any other NFL team and in many cases, might not even make the roster.

Gimme a break.

Pioli didn't "find" 25 year-old Corey Mays. He bounced around the league for years like a hot potato between teams. The Chiefs signed him to be a special teams player. They had absolutely no faith in his ability to play ILB, which is why 37 year-old Zach Thomas was signed - a guy who couldn't even make it on the field in training camp.

If they had signed him and said "We project Mays to be the starting ILB", I'd be impressed.

But they didn't.

He was signed to be a special teamer. Nothing more.

So?

Tom Brady wasn't drafted to be a franchise quarterback.

(Edit)

I misread Dane's post.

The fault lies squarely on the bag of DeezNutz.

I don't agree with your assessment. Every one of those players, with the possible exception of Gutierrez, is good enough to make other rosters.

More to the point though, it doesn't matter. These are upgrades over last season and part of just the first stage in the rebuild, which is the point.

It's been amusing reading as the complaining began with "Doesn't Pioli know that anyone would be better than that ****ing guy!" and then transformed into "I can't believe they didn't get a better player than who they got to replace that ****ing guy!". The complaining hasn't stopped. The excuse for the complaining just changed.

They've done exactly what most people familiar with new england thought they would do. Bring in a bunch of coachable team-oriented guys that other teams might overlook in favor of more raw talent, and focus on building the d-line through the draft. They've said over and over it's about finding the 'right 53'. Why anybody would be surprised by this I have no idea.

You must be back on the pipe again.

Cassel and Vrabel were traded. They had no choice but to play for the Chiefs.

The other guys couldn't get a job anywhere else in the league. They're all playing for veteran league minimum.

Lay down the pipe.

Actually, if you read the book, yes, he was.

The point is that Mays was only signed to be a special teamer. He wasn't signed to be the starting linebacker.

Hence, Pioli was not aware of his value.

Pioli didn't find him? He wasn't a UFA signed by the Pats when Pioli was with NE? You just proved my point that Pioli can't win with some people.

Look at the # of guys we had shuffling in and out of camp. It may be that there just isn't that much talent out there that we can just plug into our line as bad as our current situation is. They brought Runyon in and I firmly believe they will be scouring through the recent TC cuts. A lot of these mediocre players are what they are which is a temporary fix.

They cut him, too.

I guess he wasn't all that.

Don't tell me that he was signed to be anything OTHER than a special teams guy.

Because that would be just plain false.

Sounds like revisionist history to me.

Pioli can go back and write a book saying how much he knew Mays was going to be a stud after the fact.