for me it's because he wasn't released.

Do you think qbs grow on trees or something? Did the qb truck drive by arrowhead and nobody came out to greet them?

At least we didn't get led on by Manning, sit around with our thumbs up our asses waiting for him to call us back, and drive our starting QB to demand a trade only to find out that Peyton Manning is not walking through that door.

That would really suck.

Ya lets release our starting qb and be left with only one qb on the roster who's never taken a snap. : facepalm :

it would have been awesome if Cassel got pissed and demanded a trade tho.

Manning is done people. Get over it.

we're still with one QB anywho, Cassel's worth to this team is Zero.

As opposed to whom, Manning? Cassel or Quinn will put up better numbers than Manning

actually i'd rather had Cassel released, Ortan for this season and draft a Franchise QB next season with our roster in place to make a run.

This poll asks the question about this free agency period.

I am not satisfied with the overall job that Piol has done as long as Matt Cassel remains the QB.

But my response is based strictly on the question posed.

At the end of the day, I believe the approach to building a team is to build your core through the draft, and to find role players in free agency.

The core was essentially built by the previous regime, with a couple of pieces added by Pioli in the draft in the last couple of years.

Overall, while I agree with the team building approach Pioli has taken, I haven't been overly impressed with the drfat selections he has made.

So, if this poll asks are you happy with the job that Pioli has done overall since he was hired, with Cassel and his drafts, and his prevuious forays into free agency, my answer is a resounding no.

But the question is, are you happy with what Pioli has done in this free agency.

That is what I am responding to, and my answer to that question is yes.

I know....you should go support another team. This agony must be crushing that you are dealing with. But, don't jump off a bridge...ok?

The Chiefs could have cut Cassel and signed Orton to a short-term contract at a cheaper price. Instead, they kept the worse QB and we're stuck with that clown for another year.

First of all orton signed a pretty big deal just to be the backup in Dallas. Second HES ****ING KYLE ORTON. WHO GIVES A SHIT?

Yes, he would. First, I would never as a fan feel like the Chiefs are being blindly loyal to a bad QB. If the Chiefs signed Orton, to me that means the team recognizes that finding Orton's replacement becomes a top priority in 2013. But yes, with Orton, you have a real outside chance of postseason success. Very outside chance, but at least it's a chance. With Cassel, you have no chance.

Blah. What?

He was given a $5M signing bonus. His contract in 2012 is worth $900,000. His contract next year is $1.4M. Matt Cassel's contract is worth $5.25M, $7.5M in 2013, and $9M in 2014.

Orton is $650,000 more expensive today and $6.1M cheaper next year. Let's face it, the only reason Orton isn't a Chief had nothing to do with money. It had nothing to do with Orton being uncomfortable getting into a QB competition with Cassel. Why? Because Orton signed a cheap contract on a team where he would become the backup. This move had everything to do with the Chiefs refusing to admit that their shitty QB is in fact shitty.

Your point was that Orton would be cheaper THIS season had we just cut cassel and signed orton. You were wrong and you're wrong about cassel.

We're tied to Cassell again this season, this I'm sure of. Maybe Tannehill, but why sign Quinn? They plan will be NT in the draft, lots more depth. I doubt Tannehill falls to us and I have to believe we'd take him if he did, but I don't see us making moves to get him.

One more year of Cassell. Almost there. This kinda sucks, but at the end of the day I actually have more hope for this season.

[quote=InChiefsHell;8467525]We're tied to Cassell again this season, this I'm sure of. Maybe Tannehill, but why sign Quinn? They plan will be NT in the draft, lots more depth. I doubt Tannehill falls to us and I have to believe we'd take him if he did, but I don't see us making moves to get him.

One more year of Cassell. Almost there. This kinda sucks, but at the end of the day I actually have more hope for this season.[/quote]

agree....

The signing of Quinn is not competition for Cassel. It is for Stanzi. If Quinn ends up #2 on the Chiefs....Stanzi will need to be replaced as playing behind Quinn will represent major suckage on his part.

We can afford $650,000 under our cap for 2012.

I voted yes even though we downgraded at CB. But that was just too much money for Carr IMO.

I really don't understand why people are so excited about the offseason. Let's face it, the good additions we made were for players you can find in the 2nd or 3rd round of the draft.

We downgraded at a first round position, who the **** knows why. And we go yet another offseason without an upgrade at the two most important positions in the game--NT and QB.

Why are people so excited about this offseason?

I disagree, Winston> Richardson, Hillis> Jones Battle, Boss> Pope, Quinn> Palko.

Not bad at all

[QUOTE=King_Chief_Fan;8467537]Sadly, this is true. I don't think any member of this board really believes we can ever win a SB with MC behind center. But QBs just don't grow on trees, so given what we had to choose from, Quinn is probably the best we could have hoped for this year.
What I am going to be pissed about is if Stanzi does not get a legit chance of being the #2 this season. Maybe you could justify with the work stoppage that Stanzi wasn't ready, but there's flat out no excuse for that this year. There really was no excuse for it 1 game into the Tyler Palko era other than Haley giving the finger to the Chiefs, their fans, and yes, Pioli. Either develop him or cut him and find someone you can develop.

Winston + Hillis + Boss + Quinn + Cassel + Routt < Richardson + Battle + Pope + Palko + Orton + Carr

Orton and Carr are top priority positions and carry the most weight in this discussion. We have to prove that this team is capable of not only finding support players, but core players too.

I will be the first to say I'm not a Cassel fan but with a legitimate WR corps and dual TEs plus the addition of a RT and Hillis he should be okay. All Cassel has to do is not lose the game with our defense. Pioli is doing a nice job of surrounding Cassel with pieces that make sure he won't look as bad as he really is.

SWING AND A MISS

No, not a success. We let go the best QB on the team. Even the Winston signing can't have an impact greater than that. We downgraded QB and CB. We upgraded RT, and slightly upgraded RB/TE.

Good Moves
Boss > Becht or Pope
Hillis > T. Jones
Winston > Richardson

Step Back or Not addressed
Routt < Carr
Quinn = Palko (neither is realistic competition for a starting position)
NT and S depth/starter still not addressed

Very slight improvement, but not by much in the big picture.

No mention of losing Orton? Our best QB? Quinn doesn't replace Palko. He replaces Orton.

You are getting your panties in a bunch over Kyle Ortan.

He's a medicre QB that isn't going to take you to a SB.

Who gives a rat's ass if he gives you slightly better opportunity to possibly win a playoff game if he doesn't give you any better opportunity to win a SB?

Get a ****ing grip.

I'd prefer to see how it ends and how the holes that aren't filled in FA are addressed in the draft.

In short, I want the team improved. If the 53rd player on the roster is better than last year's 53rd, that is a good thing.

Given that as my measuring tool, I think Quinn, while not awesome is a better QB than Tyler Palko....Winston is Ruth's Chris vs Sizzler that we had at RT last year, The white lightening RB is better than a washed up Thomas Jones if he's taking his crazy medicine, Boss is an upgrade over Pope, Route isn't probably as skilled as Carr but is faster and probably a suitable #2 corner.....so in short, I don't hate what I see at all. It's working on being a successful FA period.

Carr is not better than Routt. Not by 4 mil a season. I like carr but hes about to find out what matching up against #1 receiver for an entire season is like.

Umm...isn't that the point of this thread? I may not think Orton is a Superbowl-caliber quarterback, but he's better than any of the other ones we had on this team. So if I'm judging this offseason so far it's the biggest screw up that's been made. Keeping him doesn't make us great, but letting him walk absolutely makes us worse.

At the end of the day, I don't give a rat's ass who you bring in at QB if he isn't a guy that can lead you to the SB.

Ortan isn't that guy.
Quinn isn't that guy.
Cassel isn't that guy.

Until you repalce Cassel with a guy that can win you a SB, then you're just replacing shit with shit.

Who the **** is so stupid that they care about getting new shit to replace old shit?

Oh and Winston at 6 mil is a ****ING BARGAIN.

pioli is mind****ing people right now

no it doesnt. Kyle Orton is a piece of shit loser backup. Theres about 50 other dudes than can do his job. Get over it.

Orton was a FA and didn't want to be here. Can't do anything about that.

I don't necessarily call that a fail. I mean if you paid him a ton of money would he stay? Probably, money talks. But that would be a very stupid decision, we're talking about Kyle Orton here. That's how bad our QB situation is here in KC.

This team addressed a huge hole at RT, and replaced an ineffective RB and TE.

Kyle Ortan, with this roster, might win a game that Cassel would lose.

Big ****ing deal.

We are actually crying about losing out on a medicre QB?

Seriously?

Because in Orton, you get a few things. #1 - the assurance that the Chiefs are no longer married to Cassel. #2 - in future years, you get a cheap backup. Do you realize that beyond 2012, Orton's contract is $1-2M? That's chump change. #3 - better QB play. #4 - Yes, I do believe Orton can win us a playoff game, even if we can't make the Super Bowl. And this organization badly, badly needs to get that chip off their shoulder.

Matt Cassel has to be cut. His contract is reasonable this year, but there is no ****ing way he should be paid $9M in 2013. All we're doing right now is providing superior weapons for Cassel to look good to the Chiefs, when in fact it's the supporting cast that's going to win games for him.

Add in the fact that with Routt, we have a ton of cap space and we chose to go with a inferior 29 year old over a 26 year old. And it's not like we saved a ton of money either.

If Catt Massel is the starter, we has failed.

How is Carr better than Routt besides being younger? Carr is about to get owned.

Orton is just another guy.

After reading that time line about Quinn and doing more digging, I'm going to go with Pesti on this one (see I'm not dogmatic).

I want to see what Quinn can do if he gets a fair shot at competing for the job.

His situations may have been a bigger factor than I realized. Pesti and I don't agree much, but I'm going to side with him on this one and say if Quinn gets a fair shake he should beat out Cassel.

We'll see.........

Nobody is "actually crying" about losing Orton. Just saying the team as of now is less competitive than it was at end of 2011. We will start the 2012 season with a less effective QB than the one we ended 2011 with. That's all. I don't consider any offseason in which that happens to be a "success".

We saved 4 mil a year.

That's not chump change.

And the miniscule chance that Ortan could lead this team to a playoff win isn't worth the crying that you're doing.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y18...3182/0reCv.gif

I've been extremely critical of Pioli after Orton and Carr walked, but his moves since then more than make up for that. Credit where credit is due. The QB position is still a monumental ****-up, though. We agree on that.

NO

a legendary QB is available and we're not interested. The one player who would give us a legit chance at a Superbowl, the difference maker and we're staying with limp dick Cassel. So, NO, it's not a successful offseason.

They WERE interested and Manning told them to **** OFF. You, he told YOU to **** off. How does that make you feel man? To know that Manning thinks you suck.

I disagree.

While Ortan might be slightly better than Cassel, the additions we made at RT, RB and TE are bigger gains that the loss of Oratn.

These guys can create the illusion that was created in 2010, but do an even better job of it.

The only thing I can agree to here is that the illusion they create will effectively tie us to Cassel for another 2 or 3 years.

But since I have never believed we'd be moving away from Cassel in that time frame anyway, I just can't get too pissed about that anymore.

It makes me angry.

Because we are going nowhere with Cassel under center even with the FA acquisitions.

I feel the same.

I'm willing to hold off on judgement until he has a fair shot with our starters.

I am doubtful on him so I am not getting my hopes up. I hope I am wrong though...

it should. it should make you want to rape his bitch ass with a crow bar.

manning can eat a dick, i hope his neck explodes on the first hit of the season. but im not bitter or anything

that should say a lot about Pioli and Clark because this is the most ready team out of his options, maybe besides the 49ers.

I'm holding out hope that Crennel truly does not like Cassel, and will hold that bias through training camp when he's up against his "competition."

no it just means manning is dumb. he doesnt get it, just like the other 99% of the country who dont pay attention to the chiefs

it makes me angrier that he is inexplicably interested in Dungver.

Add in head coach and offensive coordinator.

So we've decided that we can win in spite of our head coach, offensive coordinator, quarterback, nose tackle. But we sure are good at geting premiere support players. Again yes we got great values and upgraded key positions. Buy this front office has yet to demonstrate that they have any ****ing clue how to get premiere players at core positions.

What we've seen this offseason is the same old shtick. Lets hire coaches based on the tree, lets build players who will make our qbbetter, lets build around support players while doing nothing to build the core. These players are good but we upgrades only in positions we could have easily upgraded in the second or third round of the draft.

JFC

How many drives were totally ****ed last year from Richardson?

If signing "premiere" free agents were the key to winning then the Redskins would have won multiple super bowls by now.

Please remove your head from your ass.

Bottom line in your thought process.

Let's replace shit with shit.

How is that a winning formula?

i see youre avoiding my question about carr vs routt

I liked the hiring of Romeo. The players played hard for him and it was evident after the Green Bay win that they were happy for HIM to get the win.

I really dislike the hiring of Daboll. He hasn't done anything to earn another OC gig.

Bottom line here.

The Chiefs with Matt Cassel, and without Jamaal Charles, have avreraged 13 points a game.

The Chiefs with Kyle Ortan averaged 13 points a game.

don't get me wrong. I plan to wait and see what happens in the draft and training camp before final judgement. But if we see no real competition at the QB position then this offseason is a fail in my book.

Unfortunately, I don't see Quinn as anything more than Cassel 2.0 and we still know nothing about Stanzi other than we want to see what he can do. At this point, I really hope we do draft Tennehill even though I don't like him either. In this situation it will at least show they know Cassel is no longer worth a shit.

he got us hillis. which in turn got us winston. we's gonna be runnin ovah fools!

Carr is younger and better than routt. You are naive if you think otherwise.

i said other than age. thanks for proving me right.

Pioli's moves are to provide as much ammunition as possible for shithead Cassell to succeed. It is worrisome because a QB is supposed to carry the offense and make clutch plays when needed, but here Pioli is protecting Cassell already.

I personally think this is a do or die year for MC. The caveat is that we might win this worthless division and get bounced out in the first round. But Pioli will give MC another year because he showed"progress".

He thinks the Chiefs suck, more specifically, their front office. Should be a wake up call. Four years of Cassel is a fail. Saying you will bring in competition for Cassel and then saying Brady Quinn is that competition is an outright lie.

Carr is better. Don't be a Homer.

No, you had it correct right there. Hes a dumbass. Obviously winning one more SB before he rides off into the sunset just isnt that important to him

How? Show me. Dont be a homer.

Chiefs fans are so desperate for anything "Not Cassel"they are willing to be sold a different flavor of the same sh*tty recipe. :facepalm:

That's true. Instead of being forced to spend our 2nd and 3rd (and possibly 1st in Winston's case) picks on them, we got them for nothing but money...Clark's money...and we are still in great shape wrt the salary cap.

If Clark had somehow purchased a couple of second round picks just for cash, you would be fired up about what a shrewd move he made. That's exactly what he did, and he hit on the picks to boot.

At this point in time, I would agree that Carr is better, and had he stayed in KC under the tutelage of Emmit Thomas, he still had potential to continue to improve.

However, I don't think the droppoff from Carr to Routt is significant, and under the tutelage of Thomas, his first really good coach, he also has the chance to improve.

I have suppported Carr from his first day as a Chief, and no one has been more of a fan.

The reality is, though, that the contract he signed with Dallas was just not practical in KC, and he isn't 4 mil better than Routt.

Here, let me help you out. Football Outsiders CB charting for 2011 up through week 13:


Top 12 CB in Success Rate, 2011 (through Week 13)
Player Team Passes Suc% Yd/Pass Avg Dist YAC
D.Revis NYJ 30 73% 3.0 17.1 2.2
J.Greer NO 63 71% 5.6 11.2 7.1
I.Taylor PIT 72 70% 4.9 13.7 2.6
R.Sherman SEA 49 69% 6.1 13.4 3.0
A.Samuel PHI 55 67% 4.5 14.8 2.2
S.Routt OAK 58 67% 4.8 10.9 2.7
D.Patterson CLE 34 67% 5.9 9.3 4.7
J.Wilson WAS 53 66% 5.9 12.5 3.3
C.Finnegan TEN 40 65% 4.0 7.2 2.9
R.Mathis JAC 34 65% 9.1 13.3 5.9
B.Grimes ATL 44 64% 6.5 14.8 5.2
C.Gamble CAR 35 63% 6.8 11.7 3.1

Essentially, Routt is the 6th best CB in the league and that's while covering the opposing teams #1. Notice who's NOT on the list?

Also interestingly the other guy whos on the list Finnegan just signed for $10 mil so we got a better CB for cheaper there as well.

Check out what PFF says about the Carr signing:

"Brandon Carr to DAL: Carr is a good cornerback, but the Cowboys have spent an awful lot of money on potential as opposed to production. He is an upgrade for their secondary, but one that may struggle to live up to the price tag."

Now again, tell me why Carr is SO MUCH BETTER than Routt?

The difference in salary between Carr and Routt was basically Winston.

Don't get me wrong. I love the moves.

But this front office has yet to prove they can make a good move at a core position. They continue to plug away at these support positions and they've done a great job at providing a supporting cast. But they are supports.

We can't stand here and applaud success at making support moves. We've been doing that for 4 years. We have to hit on a core position for us to consider this offseason a success.

There's your problem right there.

The Chiefs need to be drafting core positions, not trying to find those players in free agency.

Free agency should be used in exactly the manner in which the Chiefs have used it this offseason.

agreed. But we know the Chiefs won't draft a QB to build on. They will draft another ****ing project.

And I'm not arguing that.

This poll asks specifically about this free agency period.

I am answering based solely on that.