^^^^^^^^^^

He freakin' sucks. No thank you.

I didn't say I wanted him. I said he would be better than Sam Bradford who OU fans still beat off too. Landry is who they blame no matter what happens. Even though they gave up over 48 points the last 2 weeks and still won. The fact is their coaching staff is highly overrated.

Ya I know what you were saying I was commenting generally about him didn't mean to imply I took your post otherwise

shutup

I only eat turkey bacon

Me Too !

BTW .I tried making some turkey bacon once but I couldn't get the Turkey to hold still long enough to get pregnant.

They wouldn't draft Jones in the Top Ten. No one would The whole point is that he may be available at the top of Round Two and would be a great value pick there. I would rather have Jones and a true #1 pick than Smith at #1 or 2.

Name me some "true" #1 picks in this year's draft.

There ARE none outside of the top QBs.

I still really like Aaron Murry but that's just me.

No player who isn't a lineman can ever be a "true" #1 pick.

lmfao

I couldn't disagree more. This isn't about value in a round. This is about the FUTURE OF THE FRANCHISE. Yeah, it is exactly that important and exactly that dramatic. You can't win without a great QB. Maybe your team can have 1 run here and there, but that's it. You get the best QB you believe is out there, period. You don't pass on them to take the "better player" because a decent QB is waiting later.

I would rather take the best QB in the draft and have a failure in round 2 then take the best player available with the first pick and Jones in round 2 due to value. The first one actually gives a chance of being a SB contender one day.

You want the best QB. Not the best bargain at QB. The Tom Brady's and Drew Brees' of the world are the exceptions that prove the rule. The only time you trade out of the top 5 is when you don't need a star QB. Teams that are already set can afford to gamble. But when you do need one, and you're sitting there in range to take your shot, you'd be ****ing insane to do anything else.

Back when I and many others were still trying to convince folks that Matt Cassel was ****ing dogshit, I made the comparison of QBs to watches. It still works.

If Andrew Luck is a gold-plated Rolex valued at $40,000 (or however much a brand new one goes for), then Matt Cassel is a $200 nickel-plated Seiko. Nothing against Seikos. They can be stylish, and they get the job done. But nobody is ever going to be impressed by one. They won't stick out. And they won't get you laid. Matt Cassel in particular was a Seiko that developed a faulty mechanism, the hands kept falling off, and wasn't water-proof. After two years it was evident the Chiefs had bought a piece of shit.

So what does this franchise (and its fans apparently) keep doing? They keep trying to find a "value" watch. This time they have an opportunity to get a nicer one, but they're still not looking at the ultra-expensive Rolexes. Even now they're looking at cheaper, not as high quality watches to see if they can find a bargain.

What the Chiefs need and have never had is a 24-karat gold monstrous ****er with diamonds, platinum, and a bunch of other expensive shit on it. Even now they're saying, "Gee, this knockoff Rolex brand has everything the more expensive real model does... well, at least it looks like it does from afar. And it's way less expensive!"

Or... what keg said.

Well said. Less wordy then my post. It doesn't matter where the QB ranks compared to the other players on the board. If you need a QB, no other position should matter until you find one.

You want a "true" #1 pick.

Who is he? Name him.

and i'd rather shoot your pets in the face

I see you already asked.

And you're still waiting.

I want to know who this "true" #1 is.

Is it Jarvis Jones, who has spinal stenosis?

Or maybe Luke Joeckel, who is being compared to Jake Long?

Maybe it's Star Lotulelei, who would be the THIRD 3-4 defensive lineman we've drafted in the last 6 years?

How about Manti Te'o, who is the highest-rated ILB prospect since Aaron Curry?

The simple fact is that, if you're going by the talking heads and looking for "value", THERE ISN'T ANY. Every single one of these guys have question marks that make them bad value at #1 overall.

The Chiefs have a VOLCANIC need for a QB. If they pick anything else, they're the dumbest franchise in the history of sports.

30 years without a QB, and Chiefs fans are still worried about 'value'....


but we can get a six pack of 16oz Bud light AND a sixer of Michelob instead of the Three Floyds Zombie Dust!

Luke Joeckel is nowhere close to Jake Long, who never should've gone anywhere close to #1. Talk about a team reaching for a position of need. But I guess that's only okay for left tackles and other impact positions who always have the ball in their hands.

There are no true number 1s in this draft. That is why the Chiefs need to just get the best QB with their pick.

So you think Luke Joeckel is worth the 1st overall pick?

He's not Orlando Pace or Joe Thomas. Not even close.

i think he actually said the opposite

It's hard to tell because of the way he worded it.

If Jake Long wasn't a #1 and Luke Joeckel is NOT Jake Long, does that mean he's worse or better than Long?

With the way he worded it, it could be EITHER, which is why I asked.

I was saying he isn't anywhere close to as good a prospect as Jake Long. Who himself shouldn't have gone #1. When I said the thing about a team reaching for a position of need, I meant Miami in 2008. How you could possibly pass on Matt Ryan (and the Lambs did it too) I have never understood, and that was under the old CBA.

My thinking is the same this year: how can you possibly - especially a team with as dire a need for quarterback as us - justify passing on Geno Smith, or Tyler Wilson, or even Matt freaking Barkley (who I don't like...) in favor of anybody else?

Anyway, I don't think much of the tackles this year. Matthews is okay but nothing I'd draft in the top half of the round. I've seen a lot of Taylor Lewan and he does absolutely nothing for me.

Makes sense. I just didn't know from your previous statement if you thought Joeckel was better or worse than Long.

I'm not sure if he's THAT much worse than Long but Long is about the only guy I can draw a real comparison to. And we see how the Long thing worked out (not only did they pass on Ryan but there's a ton of speculation now that his body is breaking down and he's done).

Bottom line: Luke Joeckel doesn't even COME CLOSE to being worth the #1 overall pick.

Yep. Joeckel is the best tackle in the draft and he's not top 5 material.

If we don't take a LT, then who? Damontre Moore doesn't really fit the defense, does he? Jarvis Jones has medical issues. Star? Are we really going to take ANOTHER defensive tackle? Those are about the only guys outside of the QBs that you can even rationally discuss being top 5 picks.

Was Hog Farmer drunk when he posted this thread?

Let's pretend that Jake Long IS breaking down, and that doctors will tell him to stop playing football as early as this year.

Then who was the last #1 overall pick to NOT be a giant bust and also a franchise player for their team for years to come? Meaning they have to play past their first contract.

Jake Long didn't (in this scenario). Mario Williams didn't. Courtney Brown didn't. Did Keyshawn Johnson?

This is it right here. The nail in the coffin for the idea of taking anything other than a QB.

The answer to my question, btw, is Orlando Pace in 1997.

These players who came before Pace did not receive 2nd contracts with the team that drafted them. Most of them were abject failures.

Yes, I realize this was a different era of football, but all that proves is that teams didn't value QBs as much as they do now. Drafting DTs and RBs if they were damn good was what you did. The number of non-QBs at the #1 overall spot shows this.

Keyshawn Johnson, 1996
Ki-Jana Carter, 1995
Dan Wilkinson, 1994
Steve Emtman, 1992
Russell Maryland, 1991

It isn't until you get into the 1980s that you see any kind of decent hit rate for non-QBs drafted #1 overall.

Aundray Brown, 1988 (bust)
Bo Jackson, 1986
Bruce Smith, 1985

So here's the next logical question:

Has any non-QB picked #1 overall won a Super Bowl with the team that drafted them, other than Orlando Pace?

I only see one that even played in a Super Bowl and that was Bruce Smith nearly THIRTY years ago.

Russell Maryland won three Super Bowls with the Cowboys.

RB Paul Hornung
DE Too Tall Jones

#1 QB's that won;

Bradshaw
Aikman
Plunkett (another team)
Elway
Eli
Peyton

Here's a list of #1's;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ue_draft_picks

I might be willing to call Maryland the only other "correct" pick the Cowboys could have made, actually. Sure, he only lasted one contract, so he was hardly a franchise player. But consider this: they already had a franchise QB (obviously), and the two guys who went in that draft's first round were Dan McGwuire at #16 to the Seahawks and Todd Marinovich to the Raiders at 24 (remember when teams in the AFC West drafted QBs? Yeah, me neither). Also, the only player I would be willing to call "good" in his career in the top 10 was Herman Moore, who went 10th overall to the Lions.

The problem was that the Cowboys had to trade UP to get the #1 overall pick. The Patriots couldn't sign Raghib Ismael, so they traded it to Dallas for Eugene Lockhart, Ron Francis, David Howard, a 1991 first round pick (#11 Pat Harlow) and a 1991 second round pick (#41 Jerome Henderson).

Ah yes, I missed his name on there.

Does he count, since he was playing with a QB that was also drafted #1 overall?

Sweet, merciful Jesus...:facepalm::drool:

lol that's so cheap for a first overall pick in '91 compared to now where you'd have to sell the ****ing farm for it.