You are BlackBob.

He was not paid $19M for just this year.

Yes he ****ing was.

Lacerated spleen.

That doesn't really sound like a good gig.

If you were a starting NFL QB, would you want to play behind the offensive line that the Chiefs had this past season?

Cap cost per year, and what that player does to earn it is all that matters.


You must be really stupid, if you can't process what I am saying here.

4.6 mil cap cost for Alex in 2014.

15.5 mil cap cost for Alex in 2015.

Obsessing about the money handed under the table is lame. Every big contract is going to have guaranteed dollars that have to be regarded in later years... but that is for later years. As of now, dude earned his 4.6, and any other monies earned is not affecting the Chiefs.

The time to bitch is in the future years, IF he is no longer worth what he costs against the KC cap.

Good Lord, you are dumb. He was paid $1M for this year plus $18M for this year and the next 4 years (1+4=5). The $18 mil was not for JUST THIS YEAR. It was for this year plus 4 years.

Who is Trent Green, I only remember TrINT

Alex never will be a gunslinger. With better protection though it gives the intermediate and longer routes more time to develop.

LMAOLMAOLMAOLMAOLMAO

And yes, I get the fact that he was actually paid that money up front.

Heh. Thought of that one the other day. Fans were flaming him pretty good his first couple of years.

I'll lacerate my spleen right now for $19M.

6 week recovery, $3,166,666 per week? Yes please.

No dumbass. I explained this already.

Relative to the rest of the league Trent was a top 10 QB. Alex was bottom 10. Trent's offense carried the team. Alex benefitted from a defense that carried the team. Their value is/was not the same.

I only remember that happening mainly in his first season. 24 INTs and 17 TDs, if memory serves. Of course, that was before Willie Roaf was on the team and his WRs were Snoop Minnis and ??? At least until they signed Kennison late in 2001.

so perhaps, all this is from you is bitter bitch jealousy.. that your life is shit while Alex has been swimming in millions since age 20... hmmm... :p

I would probably take Trent Green out of the booth today over Alex Smith. :)

My life is fine. I just don't make as much money as Alex and I would gladly switch places with him right now. Are you saying you wouldn't? Wait... that's a dumb question, you two switch places every 30 seconds.

That offense is a wet dream for Alex. I bet Priest Holmes would have 15 receiving TD's on passes to the flat, Tony would have 12 TD's with most of them being in the redzone and other players like Richardson and Dunn getting a few.

Wouldn't be that bad at all. The guy did have 27 TD's in 16 games last year with an offense nowhere as talented overall as the Vermeil Chiefs.

Fans were also stupid.

Trent always took the blame for his INT's, but half of those picks were well timed throws into exactly the window they should have been... but our idiot WR's didn't know where the **** they were supposed to be.

The WR corps from 2001 makes the crew KC is rolling with now look like the 99 rams. Our top WR was hurt most of the season and the rest of our guys were practice squad players we plucked from other teams. OH yeah, and Snoop Minnis. :facepalm:

What rating scale are you using to make this assertion, if I may ask? I believe it was settled on around 18th earlier in this thread. That would make him middle of the pack, not bottom 10. Again, I'm not really all that delighted with Alex Smith as the Chiefs QB. But why do people have to make up stuff to prove the point? If you want to say that he doesn't throw down the field and that he sucks in the 2 minute offense I don't think you would get much argument.

Yup. :thumb:

Dumfuq

Even Mav has finally hopped off Alice Smiff's dick, but here you are still making excuses. Keep ****ing that chicken.

If I remember right it wasn't 'fans' so much as it was Jason Whitlock, then a radio personality in town in addition to his work at the Star, who was as I recall upset that they didn't sign Jeff George and started calling him trINT at the earliest opportunity. There were a few followers of Whitlock here using the moniker, but I think most people understood the receiver situation (it was snoop minnis and chris thomas back in 2001, Kennison was a waiver wire pickup late in the season...).

At least that's how I think it was. Over a decade ago so the years may be fuzzing together.

I'm not using a scale, and I didn't actually rate QBs. I'm just talking out of my ass to make a point.

Lol, alright then. I respect your honesty.

Yeah, I remember all of that now. Good little trip down memory lane. Jeff George.....ROFL

And he something for the Donkeys' asses, that goes a long way ion my book.

;)

If I remember correctly someone here came up with TrInt and whitlock kiped it.

I'm not going to even talk about Mav at this point... though I'm sure he could figure out what I'd say.. but I'll leave that alone.

I'll stand strong until Alex shows me what he can do (again) with a decent OL and WR corps. If KC upgrades there, and he still plays small ball, 1 read, 3 yd per pass? Then, I will be done for sure. Not even worried about that. I have zero doubt that Alex will play well if KC can do what needs to be done.

I think what that really shows is just how fallacious the quarterback rating statistic really is, which was why they developed QBR in the first place. His rating was high basically because a bunch of short passes inflated his completion percentage. His QBR is probably a more honest representation of his actual value.

That does ring a bell now that you mention it.

And that would be a totally whitlock thing to do.

both are horribly flawed.. and simply a cheap shit way to spin an agenda...

Exactly.

QB rating is the most worthless statistic kept in pro football.

According to the NFL, this stat line is a great game:

14/18, 90 yards, 2TD, 0INT.

124.5 rating, in a game where said QB's team lost by 20 points.

The quickest way for me to devalue your football opinions is to use QB rating as an indicator of QB play.

Matt Cassel is a good QB

Comparing Green to Smith is nearly impossible.

As much as Smith sucked this season (and the offensive line is definitely part of the reason), Trent Green wouldn't have lasted two games with this line. In terms of being "injury prone", Trent Green needed three full years to fully recover from an ACL tear. He would have been knocked into retirement behind the 2014 offensive line.

The line doesn't exonerate Smith's poor play and lack of TD's to WR's or his inability to thread the needle. But if the Reid and Dorsey want to avoid sitting home in January for the remainder of their tenure, they'll need to fix this offensive line as quickly as possible.

Otherwise, they'll both be looking for work by 2017.

Edit: Oh, and find some guys that can catch the freakin' ball.

According to some here, he's just as good as Alex Smith.

One has a career 82.8 rating, the other has a career 80.1.

I'd put them both in the same category of QBs good enough to start for franchises that simply dont care.

LMAO
this part made me chuckle.

Can you imagine how much shit people would be giving another team (let's use Denver as an example) if their last two quarterbacks were Matt Cassel and Alex Smith.

We still get chuckles out of Tim Teblow and everybody's happy to hammer the last nail in Manning's coffin.

All while we spend years trying to rationalize being okay with Matt Cassel and Alex Smith.

Stockholm syndrome?

I wouldn't.

He started for Minnesota but they obviously "care" because they tried to replace him and did as quickly as possible.

Cassel's a nice "stop gap" guy. He's good in the locker room and knows his role. Unfortunately, Scott Pioli mistook that as him being a capable starter and of course, we all know the rest.

But he's not Alex Smith, as if that should be any kind of barometer, anyway.

Not "we", but your point stands.

Think of all the QB's (10? 12?) this place has tried to minimize over the last half-decade or so, (including SB winners) while propping up slapdicks like Cassel and Smith.

Smith and Cassel are cut from the same cloth. They're both stop gap quarterbacks at best.

I was using the royal "we" indicating all of (groan) Chiefs kingdom...

(I hated both trades, as you'll recall)

And Alex's line is nowhere bear as good as Trent's was at that time...

Matt Cassel doesn't have 1/2 the athletic ability of Alex Smith.

I agree with you. I believe Total QBR to be a much better metric. But you have folks like PB, who will use Passer Rating, and I'm sure Smith fans would rather believe they have the 13th best QB as opposed to the 23rd.

If you split the difference at 18th; I think any and everyone can agree that isn't franchise QB material and he's pretty much stealing paychecks relative to his ranking against his piers.

So what? What good is it for QB1 to have twice the athletic ability of QB2 if he is producing at a similar rate?

I said a long time ago that Alex was 15-20 and then made a list, at the request of 49er trolls, and I believe I ranked him 18.

Even agreeing that he's 18th, you'll still get a bunch of people acting like there's really not much difference between the 8th ranked QB and Alex Smith.

Part of that is Andy Reid's dogshit horizontal passing schemes, but I'd say that Alex Smith is a far more capable QB than Matt Cassel.

The improvement is tangible; it's quantifiable.

Going from explosive diarrhea to a runny shit is tangible improvement, too.

I suppose. Then you eat some cheese.

'Cheese' in this situation would be a couple of guards, a tackle, and something resembling an NFL WR corps.

Maybe then Reid would be able to call the odd downfield passing play without It being a wasted down.

It is the NFL equivalent of batting average.

It can tell you some things, but an "empty" average or QBR is easily achieved.

He'd still be Alex Smith, we'd still be wondering why he takes head-scratching sacks, never pushes the ball downfield and blaming everything he doesn't do on everybody around him.

I think it's pretty ridiculous people aren't allowed to say, "well our Chiefs line wasn't very good this year."

It wasn't. That isn't an excuse for Alex. Good QB's make their lines look better, and Alex certainly didn't help in that cause.

But our line was pure garbage. And anyone who suggests otherwise is a nimrod.

Dude, the KC offensive line and WR corps are substandard by ANY NFL teams standards.

Even Jacksonville has a better receiving corps than Alex Smith has.

If it were me making decisions, I don't throw deep to AJ Jenkins either. I don't trust him. While that happens, neither guard blocks their man and I'm buried under an avalanche of LBS and DLs.

The sacks aren't 'head-scratching'; The line is terrible and the wide receivers cant even make it to the end zone when there's nothing but green to 6 and ball in hand.

Alex + 2002-2005 Chiefs OL = Still topping out at just over 9 yards/completion.

Compared to Green's 12.9.

No way. Charles takes those screen passes 70 yards to the house just like Priest did.

and how would Trent have fared with the 2014 Chiefs line?

I bet we'd have won less games with Trent at QB this year than with Alex. As soon as Trent lost his line he lost his game. I said as much during the Huard/Green debate. Shit, Trent had a bit of Alex in him where towards the end he struggled throwing to guys unless they were wide open, whereas Huard would chuck it to TG or DB every time no questions asked and just hoped they'd make a play. And the Huard method was more effective.

Great point. KC loves their screen game, but really suffers in the screen game with a bad OL.

Green was done as soon as Roaf retired.

It was just the rainy afternoon against Cincy when his head flattened against the ground that made it final.

I was surprised that he ever took another NFL snap. That was disgusting, and horrifying.

It's a shame that some of us who are realistic about Alex Smith are no longer allowed to say "the Chiefs line sucked" or "our receivers weren't good enough" because then Clay and his band of reeruns will tell us we're making excuses for Alex Smith ... you know, even though Alex Smith also wasn't good enough.

We were a good offensive team if we had the lead and were able to mix plays up. Efficient. As soon as they took our run away or as soon as we had an obvious passing down, we sucked.

I'd be willing to bet we were one of the better 3rd and short teams in the NFL, and probably one of the worst 3rd & 8 or further teams.

The band of reeruns can keep on acting like Alex Smith was THE ONLY problem, but they are just dumb. He needs to be better, and our offense needs to be better, starting with the line.

We were a 4 win team with Derek Carr.
a 9 win team with Alex Smith.
A 10 win team with Matt Ryan.
A 12 win team win with Peyton Manning.
A 13-14 win team with Russell Wilson (perfect for a team with a struggling line).

To be fair, that was also a 36-year-old Trent Green whose brain was scrambled like a Shop-Vac'ed fetus and who played with different rules for hitting receivers.

When Roaf was out for long stretches in 2005 and Green was constantly harassed around the blind side he still had a number of performances that lay waste to Smith.

How are we a 10 win team with Matt Ryan, if he couldn't even get 6 or 7 games together to win the HORRENDOUS NFC South?? Dude has Julio and Roddy, and a running game, AND some semblance of a defense...in addition to half of last year's KC line, the parts we're supposedly missing (ie Schwartz & Asamoah)??

:LOL:

because it's FUN to wildly speculate with an agenda!

WE would have won at least 12 games had Catapano played!

We would have won all our games had TYler Bray played! Prove me wrong!

Like when he blew the 18 pt lead to Philly??

Or when when we lost at Buffalo to an inferior Bills team??

Don't kid yourself; Trent looked liked shit with Jordan Black at LT. It ended Priest's career in San Diego, and that's when we really saw that Trent alone would not get it done. You know it as well as I do. That whole team was built around a HOF O-line, a smart RB that could read and set up blocks, and a heady QB with average arm strength and mobility that would do exactly what his coaches tell him and doesn't make many mistakes...

Go ahead and give Alex the best line you can assemble in one offseason and find two starting caliber WRs to go along with Bowe and Kelce in that same span. Guarantee you Smith won't eclipse the numbers he put up in 2011-2013 (keeping in mind this is impossible due to the salary cap hit Smith has incurred as well as the two top 64 draft picks the Chiefs surrendered to get him in the first place).

Give Smith Roaf - Shields - Wiegmann - Waters - Tait in front of him with Bowe, Gonzalez, Kelce and Kennison on the perimeter and he doesn't eclipse what he did in 2011-2013.

He has no gumption to be the type of quarterback that is required of any team that intends to compete for championships.

He's the perfect guy to keep the seat warm for that kind of guy in an injury situation though. So there's that.

Because the Falcons defense is horrendous and they have less than no running game.

Outside of Trufant and Paul Worrilow, I don't think Atlanta has a single player who would start for the Chiefs defense,

Not even Tyson Jackson??

:D

(See what I did there??)

I'm as tired as everyone of mediocrity.

But you guys are trying to act like Alex Smith was a HORRIBLE QB this year. He wasn't. I don't like the brand of football we play, it's 2014, we have to throw the ball down the field.

But let's stop pretending like Alex is a bottom-tier QB. He isn't. He's just average. I, myself, am tired of average.

But this board constantly overreacts.

Trent ALWAYS had the same issues when our offense became obvious. Always. As soon as the defense knew we had to pass, Trent was ineffective. Trent Green is probably my 3rd or 4th favorite Chief ever ... but to act like he is HEAD AND SHOULDERS better than Alex Smith is hilarious to me.

Trent was good. Alex is good. Neither were good enough.

You're allowed to say the line sucked; or that our WR corps is sad. Those things are true.

It doesn't change the fact that Alex isn't worth his contract, isn't going to lead this team anywhere and is the face of this franchise. Your QB will always receive undue praise as well as undue criticism. It comes with the position and the salary. Alex cashed the checks. He knew what he was working with coming into this season and decided to take that pay-day. Now Chiefs fans expect him to produce. That isn't so crazy, is it?

Trent Green blew an 18 point lead? That's interesting; this whole time I figured it was a defense that gave up 368 passing yards.

I also seem to remember him leading a team that depantsed the Patriots and beat the Broncos (the #2 seed) and put up 37 on another AFC playoff team. Shit, the 2005 Chiefs played six games against playoff teams and won four of them.

Alex Smith has played six playoff teams this year and won twice.

In a vacuum Trent isn't remarkably better than Smith, no.

But Vermeil was spot on in knowing that Trent was the type of guy that could put an offense in position to win in the postseason. Had the '03 Chiefs had any semblance of a defense they could have at least wound up in the AFC title game playing the Patriots.

Smith, however, is a terrible fit as a starter in *any* system. He handicaps (what I strongly believe to be) the flawed Reid version of the WCO because defenses know he'll never present a downfield threat in an offense scheme that prefers short throws but still needs the ability to go deep to keep the secondary honest.

Alex Smith wouldn't start on a good 60% of NFL teams next season.

It's kind of like the ouroboros.

60% of 32 is what?

Here's the difference:

Alex is able to affect the appearance of mediocrity by not taking chances. That doesn't necessarily mean that he's even average, but that he never puts himself in positions to get exposed (and on the rare occasions it does happen, he's shitiful).

You can say that Green was exposed when he was forced to pass, but if you look at his ability to lead 4th quarter drives, that criticism doesn't hold up.

I can say that I'm an elite driver because I've never gotten in a wreck, but if I've never gotten on an interstate and take back streets everywhere while never going above 30, how good am I? I've avoided the potential of a wreck, but I can't get you to the destination before the doors close.

The most deceptive part of Smith is that you can look at his stats and claim that he's an average or above average QB, but to me that's like looking at Cassel's inflated 2010 TD stats and saying he's a gunslinger when the reality is everyone sold out to stop the run and he tossed a bunch of 1 yard PA TDs to Bowe.

Smith is a stat whore just like Peyton Manning. The only difference is that his stats are INTs and completion percentage rather than things that matter, like yards and touchdowns.

You're welcome to your opinion. I'm of the opinion that elements of his game make both the line and the receivers worse. That is not to say that the line is good. It's not. Or at least the left guard wasn't. But he doesn't help his line out in any way.

And the idea that Alex Smith doesn't have anybody to throw the ball is one of the worst long-running fallacies here. Dwayne Bowe starts on literally any team in the league, and is probably a 1000-yard receiver with 2/3 to 3/4 of the other starting quarterbacks. (And personally I think he's a better receiver than Eddie Kennison ever was.) Jamaal Charles is the discussion of best receiving back in the league. Travis Kelce just posted a 67 reception, 864 yard season, virtually identical to Tony Gonzalez in the year in question. DeAnthony Thomas should develop into a better offensive player than Dante Hall. Smith is missing a second starting receiver. Call it a one, call it a two, whatever. However you want to frame it that's pretty much it. The cupboard is no where close to bare.

The lineplay is an issue. There's no question about that. Brian Waters and Will Shields would make a huge difference now. Not to mention Willie Roaf. But this continued idea that Smith didn't have anybody to throw to needs to die. Enough already. They were trying to find one starter to replace the oft-injured Avery, not an entire crew of receivers.

Those two teams you mention are the #1 seeds in both conferences, correct??

Tomato/tomato, the end result has been the same.

I was a Trent Green fan, and I see Alex Smith as being very similar.

Trent didn't give up the 368 passing yards you mention in the Philly game...but, he did throw an INT that lead to a 14 point swing.

How much he relied on Priest became evident in Dallas, when Trent got blindsided by Scott Fajita after LJ whiffed on a block, Green doesn't see it, gets blinded, fumbles, 14 pt swing, we lose, no playoffs...why?? Because Chiefs.

New England
Miami
Baltimore
Cincinnati
Pittsburgh
Indianapolis
Denver
San Diego
Oakland
Dallas
Philadelphia
New York
Detroit
Green Bay
Minnesota
Atlanta
Carolina
New Orleans


He could start for:
KC (obviously)
Jacksonville
Tennessee
Tampa Bay
Chicago
Washington
New York
Buffalo
Cleveland
St. Louis
Arizona

But notice three of those teams listed latter will be picking in the top eighth of the draft this year, while Arizona, St. Louis, New York, Chicago and Washington have guys under contract that are hurt or aren't performing up to par in their current offensive schemes.

So sorry. Smith doesn't start for 56% of teams in the NFL next season.

Jason Avant came in off the street and started proving how shitty every other receiver on this team is.

Including Bowe.