Or you can rewind the tape to his long career in SF and say we already know the answer to that question.

Alex Smith is going to take a ton of sacks, regardless how well the O-Line blocks for him.

And if he doesn't take a sack, what happens if he has more time?
He's still going to go to the checkdown. Especially in the red zone.

Don't agree with that.

Thats true. I'm just trying to figure out how Discuss thrower thinks.

I th8nk he's indecisive because of getting hit alot so he starts seeing ghosts not playing with confidence.

Yeah, that line was a mauling group in SF but they didn't pass block near as well, some probably due to Smith's indecisiveness no doubt.

Alex Smith's indecisiveness made that O-Line look worse in pass blocking than they actually were.

A new OL isn't going to make Alex more aggressive. His style will always be to stare down a primary read and only throw if the guy is wide open. If that's not available either check down or run the ball with no intention of throwing on the run. Buying him more time will limit the sacks which is good, but it's not going to stop Alex from being Alex. The only thing I've seen that changes Alex is the quality of the defense. When the defense sucks, Alex attacks. When the defense plays well, he goes into a shell.

Maybe. But as we've seen since he left, Harbaugh had a different type of gameplan than throwing it very much from a traditional drop back style. That offense was built to grind it out and run the play action game.

I saw a stat a few weeks back that Smith was pressured, in average, the fastest from the snap of any qb in the league.

I'll go ahead and put some of that in him for playing the way he do3s, but when you're getting hit like he has been this year, it's gonna mentally effect people.

Smith isn't a qb that can overcome that stuff, obviously, but as we've seen the last 2 weeks, if the offensive line can protect, we've got some really good skill guys that can get open.

So, I'd like to see what happens if that continues

The team isn't good enough to win now. Period.

They need two if not three new starting linebackers beyond the problem of just being shallow roster in general.

The Seahawks model shows you need a minimum of four years of drafting to field a balanced competitive roster. At best the Chiefs are two years away from that -and that's assuming you include the UDFA guys that have been picked up as draft picks.

Don't fall for the okeydoke that the team beating Houston, the Roethlisberger-less Steelers and the dumpster fire that is the Detroit Lions.

A rebuild is inevitable, and trading picks for vets hinders the rebuilding effort.

Chiefs traded for Willie Roaf at the age of 31 and he played 4 more seasons as a Chief. I don't recall people bitching about that move.

One playoff appearance and a bunch of rushing records. Yay.

I wonder what we could claim if they used the Roaf pick on a defensive depth player instead? Please let us all know.

They got a 1st for Trent Richardson. I'm skeptical that they'll let Thomas go for a 3rd.

You act like spending a not Day 1 draft pick for a HoF player keeps them from acquiring young players.

God shut up.

Problems for that team weren't on the offensive side of the ball and you know it. This team, now, they are.

I'm not advocating a 1st round pick for the guy. A 3rd, yeah. I don't think I'd do a 2nd at this stage of his career.

Yeah, don't think about the dearth of talent on the team after Vermeil departed. Had nothing to do with having fewer picks. Nope.

It sure can. If you put enough make-up on the pig that the Chiefs refuse to acknowledge the problem.

Making these trades would be awesome. But if it buys Alex Smith security to keep doing what he's doing, then **** that. The only reason people here are nervous is because it's been the Chiefs way to do it this way.

Chiefs gave up a 2nd and 3rd round pick just for Dick Vermeil. They gave a 4th conditional to a 3rd for Roaf. Which was the worse deal?

The worst part to me.... It's not like he said that we might have an off chance at finding a Jared Allen, or a Joe Horn(minus the trade). He said we can't trade for him because we need that pick for a defensive depth player.

So what you're saying is, if we didn't trade for Roaf then we would have gotten some random defensive depth player. And we still would have won 0 play off games, and we wouldn't have a bunch of rushing records?

Alex Mack wouldn't come to KC. Thomas would have personal reasons to be ok playing in KC.

team synergy is for everyone but Alex. His status is written in the heavens and the firmament, ever unchanging, ever unchanged. . . . And don't you dare trying improving anything around him in a FUTILE effort to disprove our forefather's and forefathers' forefather's proclamations!!!

I don't think trading for Thomas means they are handcuffed to Alex

A LT will not make up their minds.

This isn't also the Vermeil era you dolts. Doing a trade here and there for a great ass player is what smart teams do.

Trading for all your talent is when shit goes bad.

If that's the case, I'm very supportive of the trade.

But... Chiefs. Their history suggests otherwise.

He's had more time the last two weeks, and he has been more aggressive downfield.

I firmly believe the Chiefs will, for the first time in decades, draft a QB in the first two rounds in this next draft.

If they love Alex they will stick with him regardless of moves they make.

Me too. I can't believe it but for the first time in my life they will.

I don't care about being more aggressive downfield as much as I am him being more aggressive in general. We have a huge short field problem and that's because Alex won't throw into tight spots. We have a huge third down problem... some of that is drops, but we still see our QB throw well short of the sticks in most cases.

If we don't fix these problems, we aien't beating good teams. Hell, I thought Alex played brilliant against CIncy between the 20's. But he was absolutely terrible in scoring range. And the tough part we all see is, when this team is up or down by 14 points, we see Alex make the throws we wish he'd make in close games.

I mean I can't ****ing stand Alex Smith and Joe Thomas probably makes him look better and more healthy....but no way you sure turndown a sure thing HoF player in a firesale.

They need a LT and making thr move stops a team like Denver from doing this and getting better.

The concept is to get better as a team. Going from a pussy brokedick to Thomas is a no brainer. Our future QB needs blocking too.

This is for Discuss... This is the reason KC was devoid of talent when Dick Vermeil left. It isn't because of 1 trade. Its because KC traded top picks every single year he was involved. They then whiffed on several of the remaining picks. I blame King Carl more than anyone.

2001: Traded 1st for Trent Green (QB), Traded 2nd and 3rd for Dick Vermeil (HC)
2002: Traded 3rd to move up in Round 1 for Ryan Sims (DT)
2003: Traded 3rd for Willie Roaf (OT) that was conditional 4th
2004: Traded out of Round 1 to Detroit (picked DT Junior Siavii Round 2)
2005: Traded 2nd for Patrick Surtain, Traded 3rd for John Welbourn

Chiefs aren't drafting a QB. They build towards 8-8 to 10-6 type team. Might as well see what the Browns want for Thomas and Mack. It would make the line very solid at least. The excuses would keep getting smaller and smaller for Alex Smith.

The whole throwing short of the sticks on third down crowd is maddening.

The defense is playing to the first down marker. It's not an abysmal thing throwing short

Again, if we're building around a future QB, I LOVE the idea of surrounding this team with weapons.

But if this team is going to stubbornly stick behind Alex Smith, I've always contended that you need to build a top 5 defense, running game, and have elite tight ends. And spending $10M on a LT makes that really difficult when you have guys like Poe, Berry, and Kelce due huge pay days... not to mention you have to add guys on top of those guys on defense since we're still not good enough on defense.

Except that we statistically do this at a significantly higher rate than most teams do. And our 3rd down conversion rate has, apart from our 7-1 stretch last year, been a horrific 30% or lower.

I'm in on the Joe Thomas trade but wonder what they want.

This is idiotic. Getting Joe Thomas doesn't stop us from getting anybody or, hell, even drafting a quarterback any year. I don't understand why you wouldn't improve an important position for the next 4-5 years and work on the rest of the team including a QB in the meantime.

If this team is going to stick with Smith, ok, lets try to get him all the help we can cause he needs it. If this team is going to get a new QB next year or 2 years from now, cool, then he doesn't come in to a team that allows 60 sacks per year. What's the problem?

Not one chance in seven hells

Alex Smith.














What?
A man can dream.

ROFL

3rd for JT?

Nah, I think we need to have a shitty offensive line until Smith leaves. That will be a great spot for a rookie QB to step in.

LOL Amen !

If we're talking about any other team, sure. What makes people nervous is that a stellar cast props up Alex Smith's play (while not really fixing his weaknesses) and the Chiefs use a 9-7 team as proof that the QB position is fine. If your last sentence is true, then I'm all in. But we've been burned way too many times before on this.

If the team is going to stick with Smith, then you need the defense to carry him. And to close games that he can't finish. Again... I'm all in if the Chiefs do the smart thing and bring in legit competition at QB.

They need to just keep fisher at LT and hope he develops into the next Joe thomas

ROFL

So a stellar cast would prop up AS's play. But you've spent this whole thread talking about how Alex wouldn't improve even with a stellar cast.

I've said all thread long... Lipstick on a pig. Of course Alex would improve. But his fundamental weaknesses wouldn't change.

A stellar cast would improve the team, . . . until they lost, . . . clearly solely due to Alex's mother's failure to dip her entire son in the river Styx as an infant.

I trust that Dorsey sees what Smith really is. Right or wrong, that's what I am going with so I don't lose my mind. I think they get a QB and let Smith play next year.

Either way, discussing the Chiefs avoiding talent is pointless. If you are Dorsey you get what you can if you feel it's not giving up too much. He is going to want to help either Alex or the next QB, or both. The Chiefs aren't going to intentionally avoid talent(even if it seems that way at times) so hypothetically discussing it is going to drive us all nuts.

Not to mention that I want the next QB to come in with as good a line as possible. Blowing it up so we can start over AFTER we get a QB is asking for trouble.

Those weaknesses wouldn't be so magnified if we weren't put in shitty positions drive after drive. If you have a QB that isn't aggressive, don't you think keeping him out of 3rd and long situations is important?

improving the Oling helps every QB and RB

What happens is we actually draft a QB in the 1st round next year? A better Oline is going to help that rookie a ton.

i know, i know ... bitch,bitch,bitch ... can't stop bitching about Alex Smith no matter what.

I'm just gona be pissed if he goes to NE or DEN

Pretty much where I am.

A little pissed it took Reid 1/3 of a season to get the team's mind right after the Denver game.

I'd love to get Joe Thomas for something reasonable. It's pretty clear they will part ways with Fisher at the end of the year. So its Thomas or 1st round OL.

Why would he go to Denver? According to CP improving the Oline doesn't make any different to a shitty QB and Manning has been one of the worst this year.

Why is that pretty clear?

Not if Fisher stays healthy

He's playing solid now and if he stays healthy he should continue to do so.

Don't really care about the Alex stays hypothetical because **** him and they aren't winning dick with him.

They key to winning a Super Bowl is having a balanced team that's well coached. Only time this team is balanced is when they suck.

Get rid of the shit dick QB and build a well-rounded squad.

Id trade for Vontae Mack. Hell, he was a former #1 overall linebacker.

Alex Smith and Fisher were both #1 overalls.

I severely doubt they do this. He's been solid this year.

A team like Tennessee or Tampa could trade a 2nd that will essentially be a late first to put an all pro LT in front of their shiny new qb.

Not sure why you just wouldn't put Fisher back at RT, who has at least been serviceable.

From there you just need to sort out your shit Guard situation.

This is the most Cleveland thing ever. Joe Thomas has repeatedly said he has no interest in leaving so you put him on the trade block.

Mack makes total sense. He's leaving after the season anyway.

The Packers would if they were smart.

They will go to Denver for conditional 7th round picks

Not likely, but getting one would be cool. It's a dream though, won't happen.

He'll go to Denver watch. Meanwhile we'll settle with Fisher at LT lol

ROFL

@RapSheet: On the #Browns: I hear they want more than a 1st for Joe Thomas, wanted a 3rd for Alex Mack, want a 3rd for Mingo. Steep on all accounts.

Rumor is Denver has offered a 1st for Thomas, but Browns want more than that. At least from Denver, which obviously wont' be picking in the top 10 or anything...


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‏@ProFootballTalk
Report: Broncos offered Browns a first-round pick for Joe Thomas

http://wp.me/p4QSB-9TTp

Yeah there's no way in hell I'd give them Shaq Barrett. I wouldn't trade Shaq for Joe Thomas straight up, let alone Shaq+ a first round pick. Shaq is making like $500,000 a year and is under Denver's control until 2018. Joe Thomas is a HOF'er, but he's 30 years old (turns 31 in Dec) and he makes a lot of money.

They already blew a high 1st for a LT, do you really want them to blow another high 1st for one?

I trust they'll make the right call... don't like giving up young guys, but JT is a great add and still has 3-4 years left at least. Don't know that I'm too keen on subtracting from that defense though.

Yup.

If not for the steep price this is a no-brainer for us...

A first round pick, or more for Thomas seems like it would be moronic. That being said though, Elway is a great GM, so who am I to question him. But damn it seems like way too much value for a guy that old, even if he is going to the HOF.

Reading one of those Grossi articles from ESPN Cleveland... makes it sound like they talked earlier in the season about a R1, not necessarily any time recently.

"According to a source, the Browns had talks with the Denver Broncos early in the season after Denver lost left tackle Ryan Clady to injury in the preseason. The Broncos were willing to part with their first-round pick in 2016, but the Browns also asked for second-year linebacker Shaq Barrett, and that apparently killed the deal.

Coincidentally, Barrett had a big hand in Denver’s 26-23 overtime win over the Browns in Cleveland on Oct. 18. Playing in place of injured DeMarcus Ware, Barrett led the Broncos with nine tackles, had 1.5 sacks, forced a fumble, had three other tackles for loss, forced a fumble and defensed a pass."

I doubt anything happens ... sounds like a bunch of hype generated from online folks.

Which can be drafted in rounds 2-4.

Allowing us to go QB/WR in round 1...

Can we get rid of this 'Fisher is AIDS' narrative?

The guy has been solid if not good this year. Give credit when due.

By this year you mean 3 games?...