6 years also gives us a ton of cap flexibility.

Have you guys looked around at replacing your left tackle?

It’s early first rounders

Pay him and move on

Just look at last year's draft. We spent a couple of months deep-diving the tackle sin that draft and it turns out the only guys that were really good went way before we picked. We made the right move.

LT's (really good ones, which is what you'd want if you're not keeping Orlando) go in the top 10. Always.

He's not Willie Roaf so some people don't like him. I don't know. Whatever.

Sadly for us, it's usually the same with Pass Rushers.

Again, just since it got lost on the first page of the thread:

If the deal is 6/$145, there is NO WAY he's seeing the almost-certainly huge dollar figure on the last year of the deal. So that AAV of $24M+ is inflated.

The actual deal would be more like a 5/110 or something in that range (maybe with a guaranteed salary in year 6 that serves as a further extension of a signing bonus or something like that).

This definitely feels alot like last year with regards to LT and such.

We talk all offseason about the draft and they trade for someone.

I think they trade for a pass rusher. It makes to much sense.

Yep.

Is his trade value higher now or last offseason?

I would think now. He proved to still be a great run blocker and at least a competent pass protector in another scheme. Pro Bowls are dumb, but he has another one of those as well.

Depending on comp, I wouldn’t be opposed to trading him to get a younger LT with cheap control. Very risky strategy though. The comp would have to be really good.

Where is this younger cheaper LT coming from?

After the Frank Clark deal, I gotta think they're not keen on doing that again.

They're just so stuck at the end of the first. I like some of the rushers that will be there, but they may see it as a similar situation to LT last year.

He may not be Willie Roaf but he's about as damn close as you can get compared to what else is out there I've seen difference WR was much better at pass blocking but Orlando is still a mauler in the run game. If Any could conceive the notion too run when we need too our passing game would be better and take pressure off our quarterback and maybe he won't feel the need to do so much on every play?

The difference is that there seems to be a good amount of DEs that are available in the top 3 rounds this year. Last year...the OTs were all 1st rounders and then shit.

Slater went at 13 and Darrisaw went at 23. And only 1 tackle went in the top 10. And going back the previous few years, there actually aren't that many tackles taken in the top 10. Seems like the sweet spot has been the 10-20 range for them.

Yeah.

But the problem as you get deeper in last year's draft the more you get into question marks. Darrisaw got hurt and didn't actually even play until like week 5. He did well down the stretch but if you're trading away Brown, you need a guy that can go right away. Those guys just aren't easy to find outside the top 15 or so. It's not impossible but it seems like 1 step forward 2 steps back to get rid of OBJ at this point.

And the other two, I believe, were Jenkins (CHI) who had back issues and Sam Cosmi (WAS) who was athletic but pretty light for the position.

Oh and Eichenberg who was basically a RT.

And Walker Little who hadn't played football in over a year.

The Chiefs options at LT in the draft were basically nothing. Especially for a team with championship aspirations and a $500 million dollar QB.

Thuney was destroyed the first drive of the 2nd half in that game. He's not a LT, and I know we are spitballing, but that would be a disaster.

When Patrick quit dropping back 12 yards, Brown was fine. He is a top 1/3 LT.

okay, tell us how. What draft picks, FA money and or trades do you make for X player to replace him?

So top 15 ish. My bad. Way off.

Good luck trading to get up there and get one.

Fisher wasn't at age 25...and definitely isn't after an achilles repair in his Mid 30's...

The way Veach has been structuring contracts, I could absolutely see this. They have shown the tendency to give themselves flexibility with the contracts via signing bonuses and what not. So, I could see that cap number being high in the last year, but it being a restructurable signing bonus or someone other mechanism is definitely in play, as you mention.

He just turned 31 in January. So, not mid 30s quite yet but definitely some wear and tear going on

This happened early in the year not because of Brown but because of Mahomes. Brown was pushing rushers back and behind, as a LT is supposed to do, but Mahomes would move back in the pocket right into where Brown was pushing the rusher. Instead of moving back, then having to move outside Mahomes needed to move sideways from the beginning, or forward, which is what he did later in the year.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Staying there gets us an edge rusher for 5 years on the rookie contract. That matters a lot more than 2-3 years ago.

He is cheaper now than any other future option...

Yes.

This place is so ignorant when it comes to offensive line play it's maddening. No one can ever come up with a rebuttal to this point and just wanna say he is average and that Fisher is better than him, because Fisher allowed him to improvise. It's not true.

Patrick was terrible with his pocket presence early in the season and dating back to last year. It's because the interior sucked and he was running for his life. That's no longer the case and he seemed to have gotten rid of the happy feet.

Hoping he will be elite or he is an ascending LT is no reason to pay him him top 5 money. His feet and base are terrible in pass pro and its not good enough if all he can do is push the rusher around the edge

Pushing the rusher back and around is exactly what a LT is supposed to do.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Well then his replacement should be easy to find.

That's not true...

KC should squat on Brown for another year...that's a lot of long-term dough for potential.

They can always tag him again in a worst case scenario...I'd hedge on this one.

He's very good and he should be paid as such.

He's not the best in the NFL.

Hill was the best in the NFL.

I'm very curious to hear the argument for why a top 10 LT is worth no 1 money but the most dangerous WR in the NFL isn't worth no 1 money...

I can't think of a situation where a player was tagged twice and signed long term with the same team...

Well..the scenario is better than having a $140 mil tied up in an average LT.

I'd wait and see how the season plays out...it may cost KC some extra contract money but it's better than getting suck in a Clark type of scenario.

Obviously, the Chiefs are thinking along these lines as they could have already signed him and saved some dough.

I like Brown, I do. I think he's good and I want him here long term.

But if the choice is mine we have Hill and Brown walks. It's that simple. We draft a LT...

But then there is the optics of having just traded a first for Brown...

I dont think the Chiefs were as dependent on Hill as many think...for every drive that he made a splash play on...they could have just as easily driven down the field and scored.

He was awesome to watch...but KC scored 0 points in the second half of the ACFCG. By the way people are carrying on...you would think that would have been impossible... having someone with his talent on your team.

I think the draft capital is going to play out big in the future...just right now, it hasn't happened...so all people have to gauge is the loss of Hill.

This hits the nail on the head.

I have no problem with Brown, he is a pretty good LT. However, if they traded Hill with the intention of giving Brown this kind of contract, that's the issue for me. I just can't see how losing a generational WR is worth keeping a top 10 left tackle.

The total compensation was not a first.

It seems like way too much. Honestly what is this guy. An average to above average left tackle??? At best. Elite, no way. But like some people have said, what's the alternative

Lets face it, our starting tackles are average or below
I think that is why the AFC West is loading up on superstar pass rushers
They know this and they think they can make Pat see ghosts

True...and it worked out amazing. Creed was worth the pick they gave for Brown....it was the Creed selection tight?..I'll have to check.

I think they'll push it forward another year...that's the safe play.

I don't think Hill was even the best in the NFL last year when you factor in the drops, which just killed us in some games. But I agree he was a lot closer than Brown.

In general, this is why I'm opposed to trading for the right to pay someone. You are pot committed to the next contract, and it generally leads to a significant overpay, which costs the acquiring team both valuable draft capital and cap space instead of just one or the other.

I feel like that's a bit high though. But at this point you gotta pay him to stay here.

Veach probably weighing

keep Orlando Brown and gain a 1st and 2nd round pick

or

keep Tyreek Hill, lose Brown Jr and don't get the extra picks

he chose the former

Watch Veach trade Brown on draft day...

signing Geron Chrisitan to run block along with Brown and Ronald Jones might be an okey doke to the league

Maybe... but this was necessary and worked out marvelously. We don't make the trade, we would have drafted a LT, which turned out to be thin pickings, and we wouldn't have gotten either Bolton or Creed. If we pay OBJ around $20-23 mil for 3 to 4, on a wink wink 6 year deal worth $24-$27, I'm good with it, especially since I think Pat got better pocket presence and OBJ got better through the season last yera, and this year he will be even better. If so, this will be a steal with the cap numbers most likely increasing nicely in 23/24.

no offensive lineman is worth that much money, they should cap the positions in the NFL

What?... Teams are capped, free market decides everything else...

Armstead at LT and Brown at RT would have solidified this line

but I guess the Chiefs "promised Brown he could play left tackle

Hill is not the best WR. Adam's, Chase, Hopkins and DK are more threats in the red zone. They can go get the ball better.

Is Brown even a top 10 LT? Do you think he will be ever?

Turnstyle for speedrushers. He is what he is in spite of what we pay him. No better options I suppose. Hopefully we solve the right tackle spot somehow or we will have 2 turnstyles with a qb who does not love the pocket. It is what it is. We have got to adapt to short pass and :banghead: an effective running game :banghead: which will never happen with Reid.

I am a capitalist but these contracts are ridiculous


Personally I think salaries should be stat based on performance the prior year.

I voted no but it will probably happen. That's what teams pay for an LT. Even an average one.

As a Raider fan, I'm sure you do...LMAO

I agree 100%, but this is the Chiefs dilemma. All the top or best LT go in the first 20 picks and when you are in championship games 4 years in a row it's hard to dip down and pick a great prospect.


People have complained about Vrett Beach draft picks but each year he is drafting at the end of each round. Last couple drafts he seems to be doing much better but he is still having to take chances on guys other GMs would't. I think as each year he is our GM the better at working the draft and getting the best value out of each player. Acquiring Brown was mostly because he knew there wouldn't be a LT prospect available late in the draft that would have been better and now we are stuck like you said paying the bill.

It's ok I like Brown as a mauler especially running the ball that we rarely do but if he improves his pass blocking then he will be worth the money. He can go from above average to pretty good if he can improve his pass blocking.

He’s not.

No. Paying Hill that price would have choked us. Wrs are not worth that money. LT is more important and continuity is important. The longer Brown is here the better he will get. He has the talent.

Well that would do wonders for team chemistry and WR's that thought they weren't getting targeted enough.

Also give them workers comp like regular people to speed up the candy asses return.

Also if they signed a big contract and then sucked balls the next year then they have to be paid another year of their previous contract

This is actually a very capitalist mindset.

Your desire is for the earnings of the employees to be capped while the earnings of the owners is unchecked.

What’s more capitalist than that?

Without the owners you have no teams , plenty of players out there that will play for a million a year.

How long did it take Fisher to quit sucking? And he was in the same offense every year of his career (different position his rookie year, but still)

People longing for brokedick Fisher also probably weren’t patient with him for those couple of years.

Give Brown another season on the tag. It will be fine. We’ll be fine. Don’t burn your two 1sts on another fatty for the love of god

No one wants to pay to watch trash. That's why none of the other leagues do well. The best player in the XFL or whatever it's called isn't even capable of playing in the NFL.

The main reason why it makes sense to overpay Brown before fairly paying Tyreek Hill is Hill probably has around 3 times the trade value of Brown. If Chiefs sign Brown to a market rate contract, they could probably trade him for a late 2nd round pick or something like that. Chiefs paid more than that but only because they got Brown still on his rookie deal.

IMO Chiefs management made the right decision but if both players had roughly the same trade value and salary over the next 3 year, you get rid of Brown before Hill without even hesitating.

On the flip side, Brown likely has 3 times the effective career left, when you factor in age and position.

That also explains the WNBA.

So if you assume that Hill only has 4 effective years left and falls off at 32.... You think OBJ has 12 years left?

He could easily play to 35. It isn't exactly 3 times but close enough to be relevant to the 3 times he used as the benchmark for trade compensation.

It's so bad.

I love basketball. I just can't enjoy women's basketball, at all.

Just going to talk out my ass for a second here...

Seattle needs a LT and Pete Carroll wants to go to a more run-heavy offense.

So, I'm guessing Evan Neal doesn't fall to them in the draft but Cross or Penning could be sitting there at 9, both of which are more nimble tackles. Is it out of reason to flip OBJ via trade to Seattle in that scenario and the Chiefs then take a more nimble tackle for themselves? Is a top 10 pick too much value for Seattle to bite off?

What about a blended trade that sends OBJ, 29, 30, and 50 to SEA for DKM, 9, 40, and 41? Chiefs give up 1,660 in value and Seattle gives up 2,340 which is equivalent to pick DKM + pick 27 for OBJ.

Chiefs get a more athletic player at LT, a weapon they have to pay in 23, and high 2nds.

The Seahawks get their rushing game stud at LT and 3 high picks to retool at WR and take a shot on a QB if they want.

Okay, nuff about that unlikely to happen. :)

This is a really interesting concept.

It would continue the theme of reloading rather than spending big. I’d do it without the DK Metcalf complication, personally.

I suspect Seattle may view Panning as the run-impactful LT they want, though.

While interesting I'm not sure it works with what I assume is Veach's plan.

With the construction of our offensive line, the Chiefs can afford a couple big contracts (Thuney and OBJ) while Trey and Creed are on rookie deals. It makes more sense to address the tackle position draft either this year or next (legit RT). To keep talent on the Line, but don't make it a burden on the salary cap.

Also, trading OBJ as suggested would signal to me that the Chiefs punting on the season. Despite the loss of Hill, this team can still win it all because of Mahomes and Kelce.

Nah, they'll sign him to a LTD.

Exactly.

OBJ is going to be here for the next 5-6 years...

Orlando Brown Projected Contract 6 year $145 mil
 

Orlando Brown Jr is seeking to become the highest paid left tackle in the NFL, per OutKick.

https://www.outkick.com/orlando-brow...s-city-chiefs/

Well, the highest paid left tackle in the NFL right now is Trent Williams of the San Francisco 49ers. He signed a six-year deal worth in excess of $138 million that averages $23 million per season, according to overthecap.com. Williams got $45.1 million in guaranteed money.

Green Bay’s David Bakhtiari in 2020 signed a four-year extension worth $92 million that also averages $23 million per season, per overthecap.com. Bakhtiari got $30 million in guaranteed money.

And it should be noted when Ronnie Stanley signed his five-year extension with the Baltimore Ravens, he got $64 million in guaranteed money on a $98.75 million deal..

And while it is unknown exactly what ceiling Brown and his new agent will be hoping to reach when negotiations with the Chiefs begin, it’s obvious $25 million per season and higher will be in the conversation. And $50 million in guarantees won’t seem outrageous.

So a four-year, $100 million or five-year, $125 million deal could be the floor of what the Brown camp might eventually agree to.

The Chiefs this offseason placed the non-exclusive franchise tag on Brown, meaning he’s currently costing them $16.6 million against their cap despite the fact the tender has not been signed.

The sides might eventually be able to work a deal that lowers that cap number considerably while also giving Brown that $100 million-plus deal.

But is he worth that?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

**** that Fat piece of Shit! He can hit the road!!