Early in the season the Chiefs were a running team. Most likely because of the injuries at WR. People wondered why Kelce's numbers were down, it was because they were running the ball more (and effectively) at the expense of the short passing game.

Whether that is due to Pacheco being out, Hunt maybe getting tired, or just opposing teams keying on the run, I'm not sure, but they can't run as well as early in the season. In past years, this was okay because Mahomes could sling the ball and take advantage of a D keying on the run. This year not so much, and it's because of a myriad of reasons. The OL has been weak - usually the LT is the major culprit, but Smith had a bad game and Taylor is good for a 2nd and 20 at least twice a game. Mahomes has the yips, and some of the long developing plays are baffling when the line can't protect. Ju Ju is constantly hurt and Worthy is a bit limited. I know people are blaming Mahomes for inaccurate throws to him, but the kid needs better sideline awareness and he needs to go up and try to fight for the ball. And for the life of me, Steele shouldn't get so much playing time.

Just like last year, I'm sure it'll settle down and work itself out.

It's a good and fair analysis of that game. Smith and Mahomes were the issue. I don't think it necessarily translates to problems experienced in other games. Morris played...OK against the Bills, but he and Kingsley have between them been a significant problem.

Which becomes a bigger issue down the stretch? Dunno. Entirely possible Bills/Harbaugh unlocked the cheat code and Smith and Mahomes are causing the issues. You could make an argument Morris is MAYBE trending up a bit, and Smith down. But if I could fix one position to make this team better, it's still LT. Feels like it still has the biggest ripple effect.

Defense of what exactly? Him playing at less than a MVP level in some meaningless regular season games for both him and the team?

Mahomes is the best player in the history of football and currently leading a team to a 9-1 record coming off B2B SBs while still posting a top 5 QBR in the sport. He doesn't need a defense of anything.

Unfortunately some around here have gotten so spoiled by him and this team that they can't even recognize what it is that they have anymore.

Fans tend to be stupid and lazy in their understanding of football. It leads to stupid/lazy takes.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Most playoff games with a 90+ QBR since 2006 (how many came in a title game)<br><br>1. Patrick Mahomes - 7 (3)<br>2. Josh Allen - 3 (0)<br>2. Peyton Manning - 3 (1)<br>2. Tom Brady - 3 (0)<br>5. Colin Kaepernick - 2 (1)<br>5. Kurt Warner - 2 (1)<br>5. Russell Wilson - 2 (1)<br>5. Drew Brees - 2 (0)</p>&mdash; Scott Kacsmar (@ScottKacsmar) <a href="https://twitter.com/ScottKacsmar/status/1759291206398304306?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 18, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

This is who this guy is. I can't say I give much of a **** that he's not playing as well as Lamar Jackson and Josh Allen in November (when yes, his focus and his effort is not the same as it is in January which has been clear for years now) and it's puzzling that anybody else does either given his track record.

It feels to me like he’s thinking too much and not just relaxing and trusting his instincts and playing the way he wants to play.

It feels like the game has sped up for him from his first year starting, which is weird but makes sense to me when you consider that maybe he’s trying too hard to play the way he thinks he’s supposed to play.

It’s making him hold onto the ball a tick too long and not trusting what he’s seeing and just firing.

It also just seems like he’s frankly not having as much fun as he used to. He needs to turn down his brain a bit and just go play.

I think losing Rice was a REALLY big deal. Guy was poised to have a huge season and be that younger Kelce option.

It hurt yeah but even when he was there it seemed like Pat was starting to rely on him too much at the expense of missing other guys open sometimes.

You'd like to think so, but these are issues we saw from him LAST year as well.

Happy feet/ghost pressure/drops eyes/runs into pressure.

In this offense, the only reason to hold the ball is if WR's aren't open.

The film CLEARLY shows this isn't the case.

You can only guess from the broadcast footage. I doubt many fans without a job related to football pay for or have a way to see all 22.

And even then unless you played in that offense/defense you can't know for sure what a player's responsibility is.

Dear lord people settle the **** down. You lost against one of the best AFC teams the last five years, on the road at their place. It ****ing happens.

DOES MAHOMES EVEN WATCH FILM ANYMORE>>!>!>>!"??!????????

And then there's his inaccuracy and his lack of throwing fundamentals. Are those tied to his trust issues? I don't know. But they definitely exist and are a big problem at the moment and they need fixing.

Qbr. Dvoa. He's not really trying. The sun was in his eyes. I get it. You don't have to repeat yourself.

Keep crying about the best QB in history during a 9-1 season because he missed a few throws in November. We'll see how it works out for you come playoff time when the games actually matter.

This is what happens when you become so spoiled by the historic level of success of Mahomes and the Chiefs that you lose any sense of perspective.

I can only imagine the discourse when the team actually loses a playoff game again for the 2nd time this decade instead of just a November game.

I know it's wild that I want the elite QB that I've grown to love to play well in both the regular season and post season.

It's really hilarious that you think that this is a good point to make. But par the course. I'm sure in 2022 you were pissed in the regular season at all the yards and touchdowns he was throwing and how well he avoided turnovers.

Josh Allen has been a better regular season QB for this entire decade than Patrick Mahomes.

Ask me if I give a shit. Ask me if anybody should.

I didn't go through all the comments but when I went back and watched the Bills game two more times what jumped out at me was exactly what he said in that piece ....

Pat is breaking CLEAN pockets

Trey Smith is the actual problem

So then I went back and looked at the Denver and Tampa games. And it was Trey getting his ass handed to him by Allen and Vae.

Not saying the tackle play is ALL WORLD but I think there was a narrative beginning and it actually isn't true. For the last three games Trey has had a strech of stank I ain't seen from him ever.

I have another theory. I think the team (and Patrick) have significant concerns about his lower body and we’ve repeatedly seen nagging injuries to his lower half through his career. The fact that Reid showed he won’t even call a gimme QB sneak on 4th and 1 with the Super Bowl on the line shows the depths of that concern. I think it’s known around the league, the angriest I’ve ever seen Patrick was when a Bears player tried a dirty shot below the knee last year. There was none of that happy go-lucky Patrick we often see towards defenders, he was incandescent. The last time he was in a funk like this (early to mid 2021) overlapped an often long and arduous recovery with turf toe.

I could be talking out of my ass, I could be completely wrong. But I think if he’s managing substantial ankle pain his blindside could be weighing on his mind with each snap.

He’s shown he can overcome this. He won a Super Bowl with a high ankle sprain in one of his best and most efficient games at QB. But if he’s trying to just get through the regular season, it could lead to the compounding problems we’re seeing from 15 this season.

Gonna talk out of my ass again with a worry there might be a bit of blueprint on Smith. He’s always struggled a bit with stunts against a fast/athletic DE and since Tampa has been having his lunch money taken with concerning regularity. Hopefully it’s just a funk, and hopefully Pop brings back a much quicker option at RB that can allow for quick dump offs and runs that break into the second level to keep opposing DL’s more honest in their approach.

You're not wrong, bro. This is at least a 3 game stretch where he's playing at a back up scrub level. Quite odd because Trey always seemed to be the finisher and mean streak guy, but right now he's absolutely getting worked.

He's the actual biggest issue on the line - not Morris.

Well this is just ridiculous.

Which part? That Josh Allen has been the better regular season QB since 2020 or that I don't care whatsoever?

Because both are true.

A big **** you to KC Connection easily the biggest moron on this board. Mahomes hasn't been good this year and that Canadian bundle of sticks tries to say TOP 5 QBR!

It is just reality, Mahomes and several of the Chiefs are a little bored and unfocused with the regular season. You saw it happen in games with Brade and the Pats as well, come playoff time, he seems to focus and turn it on, until he doesn't, this will be my take.

So the moron is the one defending the best QB who ever lived and not the one trashing him because of a loss in a meaningless November game, eh?

I wonder how this is gonna play out going forward.

Obviously the idea Allen has been better this decade. It’s a terrible take not based on wins, passer rating, QBR, or really anything.

Patrick Mahomes is never and will never be the reason the offense struggles. Well, if he plays until he is 50, his age may become a factor.

Yes, it appears his play, and decision making, and pocket presence is bad this year, but is Mahomes the reason Mahomes is playing poorly?

Come on man, he is the greatest QB of all-time. He did not suddenly forget how to play QB at a high level.

For me, the reason for his poor play is the offensive line, and injuries. And the tackles have been bad, but I believe it is the lack of confidence in his line and his injured ankle (I bet it's about 85% at this point, but nowhere near 100%) and his fear of further injury, that has caused him to fall short of his high standard of play. I feel like he is frustrated that his line continues to be the reason he gets hurt.

Again, I admit he has not played his best, but I just will never blame Mahomes because he threw for 5,000 yards and 50 TDs in his first season as a starter, and until now has established himself as the GOAT in most of our eyes.

How do you blame him for anything? Yeah, he can throw a bad pick, etc. but I will always believe that any time he plays poorly it was either a great effort by the other team, or there are factors we don't know about.

It's not a take, it's a fact. Perhaps you're just unaware about how good Josh Allen is and has been in the regular season.

Josh Allen (average QBR of 71.9): 76.6 QBR (2020), 66.3 QBR (2021), 73.4 QBR (2022), 70.3 QBR (2023), 72.7 QBR (2024)

Patrick Mahomes (average QBR of 71.0): 78.1 QBR (2020), 67.1 QBR (2021), 79.0 QBR (2022), 63.9 QBR (2023), 67.0 QBR (2024)

Again, why am I or anybody else supposed to give a shit about that given Mahomes' playoff pedigree? Why does anybody give a **** about Mahomes not playing at a MVP level in November?

Mahomes, 4 of the last 5 SBs, winning 3. Allen=nah

Have you considered that might sort of be my point?

I haven't read the argument, I just kinda jumped in with the only stats that should matter. :D

Hes played a seasons worth of post season games since he's been the starter I'd think that would have to take a mental and physical toll at some point but losing your top 2 WRs and shaky o-line at play is probably also a factor

This is the dumbest shit ever. Yes, he is the reason he's struggling. The guy is one of the highest paid players and is the greatest ever, but we're gonna make excuses that it's the lines fault that he is bailing from the pocket without any pressure? GTFO with that shit. Plenty of guys are out playing him and they have worse OLs than he does.

I know he will do better in the playoffs, but God damn this shit is boring as hell for the most part.

Yeah, unfortunately with the news of the Harbaugh hiring I was worried they had found their best coach since Marty, and so far they’re shaping up to be a massive pain in the ass in the Harbaugh era.

Yes.

When I went back and looked at the games there's plenty of times where Pat is bailing CLEAN pockets.

My guess is that because the pressure has been bad for so long that he's got a bit of happy feet going.

right now, it's Pat, and Trey Smith.

Pat is def struggling.

Mahomes throwing the ball on time would be nice

Yep, sure, the best QB ever suddenly doesn't know how to play the position of QB.

Now that is the dumbest shit ever.

To think that Mahomes built a HOF career in 6 years as a starter, and suddenly can't play the position, is asinine.

Do you honestly believe he would be playing like this with high quality tackles? Because if you think Mahomes is the problem, then you have to believe that.

JTFC people, WTF are you guys not understanding? Mahomes still has every single skill he had before, and hasn't suddenly forgotten how to figure out a defense.

So, if he still has the brains and physical skills, what is your explanation for his poor play? Do you think he sucks? Because he is playing worse than a lot of lower tier QBs.

Do you think he was never really good, and was just lucky the last 6 years?

Yes, he is playing poorly, but because of factors outside of himself. Again, yes, he can throw a bad pass, or a ridiculous pick, but are you really saying he is suddenly not good at football?

I have All 22.

This reads like a whole lot of autism.

We lost one borderline meaningless game. I’d rather have mahomes scrambling early to protect his health and throw more meaningless int to protect his health.

Thousands of words about 1 borderline meaningless loss

Seth Keysor sees what we see...
 

It’s a stupid take because even this one stat doesn’t support your argument. At all. 3 of 4 completed seasons Mahomes had a higher QBR. The only reason you are even going this route is because you want to pretend Mahomes has elevated his play every post season way beyond his regular season, which is of course only motivated by your desire to remove any and all blame or criticism from him when the offense struggles at times.

How does it not support the argument? Josh Allen’s overall QBR over the past five seasons has been better than Mahomes. On average, he’s been a better regular season QB than him since 2020.

Guess who you and everyone else in the world are still taking come playoff time? I wonder why that might be.

All regular season games are borderline meaningless games for this franchise in this era. Why some want Mahomes to stand in a collapsing pocket and take a few more massive hits to win them, I have no idea.

The team’s primary goal, above all else, should be making sure he’s still standing in January. Because if he is, this team remains the favorite to win another SB.

For one 0.9 is hardly significant, for two I’ll take the guy that in 3 of 4 seasons has had the better season. Or if you prefer the total numbers I’ll take the guy who since 2020 has more passing TDs, more wins, more yards, fewer turnovers, higher completion %, and a higher passer rating.

Seth Keysor sees what we see...
 

This isn’t hard. No one wants him to take massive hits. Everyone wants better LT play to prevent excess hits. They also want him to play a little better because if he played better he would be hitting the open guys on time more frequently and would then be taking less hits.

To recap, we’ve now gone from calling it ridiculous and a terrible take not based in QBR to “hardly significant”.

Josh Allen has been a better regular season QB than Patrick Mahomes in QBR since the 2020 season. He’s been a significantly better regular season QB than him over the past two seasons in particular. I’ll ask again, does that mean you’re taking him over Mahomes this postseason? And if not, why not?

The Sam McDowell article referred to above[post 55) is probably the best analysis I have seen of the situation. Currently Mahomes is not the only problem, but he is the most significant problem as things go. And given his past performance, he should be able to return to elite level. But I am not at all comfortable with the attitude of many posters here that say don’t worry he can just flip a key come to playoffs. He had a bad year last year because of drops, not because of his poor play so much. The drops ended when they simplified the offence and stopped playing Sky and Toney. This year, although he is not the only problem, much of the problem lies with his poor play. That will be harder to turn around on a dime and he needs to start making that change now. In my view the most important part is that as worthy continues to be able to get open, Mahomes needs to start throwing to him accurately.

It is worth noting that We are such a great team that we are still nine and one despite the problems we have had. And nobody seems to be saying it, but I think Drew Tranquill should’ve been able to tackle Allan on his TD run and then Mahomes would’ve probably had another chance to see if he could have reverted to his elite level when it was needed to win the game.

LMAO at Patrick Mahomes being referred to as a significant problem with the 9-1 Chiefs because he missed a few throws the past few weeks. As if they’d even be above 5 wins with Carson Wentz at QB.

Some here seriously need to watch the QB play on just about every other team in the league and report back about what they see.

Agree. 90% of the problems have been in Mahomes' head since the Tampa Super Bowl.

In case anyone's not aware, he has a perpetual "special" of $12/year if you use this:

https://bit.ly/sethreallyhatesmoney

It FEELS like everyone who isn't emotionally connected to the team SEES plainly that Pat is the issue.

The problem is, as soon as you say that a bunch of posters here go into full attack mode, when it's obvious to anyone who is breaking down film and Pats play that he's NOT GOOD this season.

And lots of all time greats have some bad seasons. And Pat is having one.

Traitors, losers and cowards.

I suspect it's more an aging receiver we are limiting a bit. Not to mention that he probably doesn't have the full playbook down pat. Keeping Hopkins healthy for post season is way more important than a draft pick.

Josh Allen pff grade 84.7

Mahomes 84.1 on the season.

I have a job and a life so I don’t have time to evaluate all 22 every play if the season for every player.

So for as much as pff may suck they def have time to do the job. And get paid for it

Wanya morris pff is 57.3 on the season.

So who cares “who was the main problem vs bills”.

84.1 pff grade is bigg enough gap from 57.3 to make it obvious that mahomes isn’t the problem this year.

If you switched Mahomes with Allen for their entire careers it's hard to argue the results would be MUCH different. I think we still get 2 just not 3.

They are both really really good and any time Allen lost to Mahomes in the postseason there really isn't anything else he could have done.

So you think that Pat is playing well because he's last in every meaningful category of his career for this season compared to every other.

Another lie.

yards per game lowest
passing rating lowest
TD to INT ration worse in his career

What are you hanging your hat on, his completion percentage?

Well that's great because his yards per pass is tied for his lowest.

Mahomes’ QBR is not even close to his worst season in his career. That would be 2021 with 2023 and 2024 following shortly after that.

But you knew that.

Uh, better check again, because he's right.
https://www.pro-football-reference.c...M/MahoPa00.htm


Also, Mahomes' passing stats this season vs. all other starters puts him in the bottom third of the league:
https://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/pla.../qb-rating-nfl


And today I heard on the radio that Mahomes is dead last in explosive/chunk passing plays, or something to that effect. And through 11 weeks he's successfully hit less than half the number of explosive/chunk plays he hit last season.


It's not good.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Adjusted Quarterback Efficiency (AQE) through Week 11 <a href="https://twitter.com/Unexpected_Pts?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Unexpected_Pts</a><br><br>- Kyler Murray the new per-play leader<br>- Lamar Jackson falls, but still leads significantly in total adjusted EPA<br>- Sam Darnold with a massive adjustment up, Jared Goff in the other direction <a href="https://t.co/sU98aqEOdb">pic.twitter.com/sU98aqEOdb</a></p>&mdash; Kevin Cole (@KevinCole___) <a href="https://twitter.com/KevinCole___/status/1859233477733835050?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 20, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Looks like you may want to look up Mahomes’ 2021 QBR too.

There is nothing unusual about his regular season performance not being MVP level at this point.

Maybe we should trade Mahomes for Sam Darnold, at least we’d be getting the better regular season QB

He's last in the league in passes of 20+ yards or more. LAST.

Dude up there literally has on rose colored glasses.

Yeah, that has nothing to do with the playcalling or how this team is defended. None at all.

You're right there's not a whole other thread pointing out how he can't hit the broad side of a barn with a bass fiddle on his deep throws.

Patrick Mahomes: 78.1 QBR (2020), 67.1 QBR (2021), 79.0 QBR (2022), 63.9 QBR (2023), 67.0 QBR (2024)

His worst season ever you said. Except it’s on par with 2021 and better than last year.

Don't bother. He picks one pet statistic and just repeats it post after post and ignores literally everything else. It's really not worth clogging up threads to go back and forth with him.

Bud, this is his worst QBR as a starter (not counting 2017) with the exception of the 2021 season. And starting with Succ%, just run straight across those stats; he's either worst of his career, or 2nd to worst in every statistical category.

Succ%-2nd to worst,
Lng (which I could care less)-worst
Y/A-tied worst
AY/A-WORST
Y/C-worst
Y/G-worst
Passer Rate-worst
QBR-2nd worst
NY/A-WORST
ANY/A-worst

And, he's on pace to get sacked more this season than in any other season of his career. Also his %/games with an INT makes him 39th @80%.

His overall play is a problem. And it's not just one thing. He needs to get his shit back together over the next few weeks.

Still waiting for a response here.

His QBR is literally better than it was last year (and was better than it was in 2021 until his most recent game). What happened last year when the playoffs began again?

Why am I supposed to care about any of this?

You stopped "caring" about regular season success right when Mahomes started having rough regular season. Crazy isn't it?

And started having historically good postseason runs at the same time, yes.

I wasn't aware he didn't have great post season runs before 2023.

Dude, QBR isn't an end-all be-all stat, and you know it. It can be as misleading as PR game-to-game. Something I'm certain you're aware of as well. But hey, if you want to stick your head in the sand, go right ahead. Doesn't matter to me. The important thing is that Pat knows he's effed up. And I'm sure he does.

We have people here whining about the best QB of all time throwing the ball short (but overall better than he did last year) in the middle of a 9-1 season coming off B2B seasons.

It’s absolutely absurd to read.

He has great postseason runs every year, yes. Hence why I don’t bitch and whine about him missing some throws, avoiding hits or throwing short in a November football game.

Short, off-target, off-line, early/late, into double and triple coverage, and/or just to the other team. Not throwing the ball at all with receivers wide open . . .

He’s playing better than he did last year at the same point in time. He ended up having arguably the best postseason run by a quarterback in NFL history.

Yeah, I’m just fine with “sticking my head in the sand” on this one.