Backups can't play well.....got it.

They're backups for 6 years for a reason.

Not everything can be said about a player in his resume, dude. I don't know why you, Sac, and sapho are making such a big deal about the "Four teams in four yearsssszzzz!!!!" crap. He's STARTED games before he came to us as a reserve lineman. When he came here as a reserve lineman, he played WELL for us. Does any other shit ****ing matter other than that? When James Harrison got his first starts for the Steelers, did they give a shit about his up-and-down resume before looking to him for the next season?

I don't care if he came in as just a guy. When he played for us, it was okay. He wasn't this massive ****up like Linkenbach has only ever been his entire career with the Colts. We KNOW what Schwartz is, and that's consistency. That's his entire value. It's not Will Shields, but he doesn't need to be. He doesn't even need to be a top 10 guard, which he's not. That's all I or anybody has ever said about him. I fail to see how that in any way is overrating the player.

And if you want to still call it overrating, then I'd rather overrate Schwartz than draft guard at #1, and I'd rather start Schwartz than Rishaw Johnson or Jeff Linkenbach.

So you hope.

Naw, I think he's got more than just hope here. This is a deep draft and there will be a good WT there.

Regarding the RG position, their actions suggest that the reason they let Schwartz and Asuckamoah walk is because they felt they had their replacement on the roster. Id be shocked if they go Guard at 1.23.

We're not overrating Svhwartz, based on his play in KC, he showed he can start and play well. He had nagging injuries in the past and politics, which limited his playing time. However, when he played, he played well. He played himself into a starters role last season. Ill take that type of player any day.

That doesn't even make sense. So because he played well for 8 snaps a game as a 6th lineman and field goal blocker, that means he's really a good player and he could turn out to be James Harrison? No, it's really because he couldn't beat out a bunch of players and when he was asked to start a full season, he was below average.


Of course not, because he was NEVER asked to do what Linkenbach did. If Linkenbach was only asked to play 8 snaps a game as a 6th lineman, he wouldn't look too bad either.


You are right. He's consistently been a below average player not worthy of being a starter long term. He's proven that 6 years running now. The fact it's taken him till his 7th season in the league to be a starter without an injury provoking it at his position is a testament to how bad he is.

I wouldn't draft guard at #1 either. But I also won't be upset we didn't give Geoff ****ing Schwartz $5 mil. He's no more special than Johnson or Linkenbach. They're all average at best players and more career backups than starters. I wouldn't give any of them $5 mil so if push came to shove I'd choose the cheaper options which we did.

He played well when everybody played well. Even Fisher played well the last few games of the season when he started. The whole offense was playing well. Like I've said many times before. It's not a coincidence that Geoff Schwartz has been a backup his whole career. It's not some conspiracy. It's that he's not good enough to beat out starters. It took an injury to Asamoah for him to start here. It took a injuries for him to start in Carolina, and he allowed 6 sacks that year.

This is silly.

What's with this six years line? He was drafted in 2009. He missed the entire 2011 season with an injury. He's played in only four seasons thus far. I have no clue why you're counting 2014 already when the draft hasn't even happened yet. He just received a four-year starter's contract with the Giants a month or so ago. That means the supposed sixth year (the fifth, really) puts an end to his team-bouncing.

So he was a ROOKIE in 2009. He started three games. In 2010 he started ALL SIXTEEN GAMES for the Panthers. Did he suck? I don't know, I'm not a Carolina Panthers historian. What I do know is that the team penciled him in as the starter for 2011 as well before he got injured. When he went to the Vikings, it was for one year, and also probably because he wasn't yet quite over his injury.

When he got to Kansas City and was plugged in as the swing G/T, it wasn't enough for you that he started 7 games and did well? That career I just described in more detail is more important than actually LOOKING at how he played for the Chiefs? Is Priest Holmes' career with the Ravens all that mattered when he came to KC just because when averaged out it's pretty mediocre? That's why averaging his CURRENT value over the arc of his career is an extremely misleading statistic. On that note, Alex Smith's production at the end of last year means nothing because he was so terrible the first 5 years in the league! No, the fact that Schwartz played decently enough in 2013 to impress enough teams to bid for his services as a starting OG doesn't matter, because he averaged 6 snaps a game for his career!

And look, you've got me defending Schwartz more than I should just because you're being so obtuse about this. You're doing more than just trying to tell people that Schwartz is easily replaceable (which is a totally reasonable argument). You're making it out to be that he's the exact same thing as Jeff Linkenbach and any other garbage backup offensive lineman from another team. The two players are COMPLETELY different. One guy has demonstrated that he can play well, and the other hasn't. That's the difference between the two players, if you really didn't know.

So, the guy misses an entire season for injury, and we're just supposed to dismiss that? That's an outlier?

Great, I can't wait to tell Kelce and Commings the good news...

He missed an entire season in 2011. Before that he was a starter. When he came to Kansas City, it was as a depth guy. The potential for being burned was extremely minimal if he actually was an injury prone player.

Kelce and Commings were rookies when they had season enders. It would be A-okay if we weren't depending on them for starter production, so we could at least see if they're any good at all before putting them in as starters. That remains to be seen if we'll have that luxury or not this training camp.

Yes, there is a significant difference.

Not only was he a rookie in 2009 but he was a 7th round pick. And the year that he started 16 games for the Panthers....Clausen was QB. So it's not like he was blocking for 3 seconds and then the ball was out. He was blocking for a rookie QB on a shit team.

Geoff Schwartz is a turd. Rishaw Johnson is a turd. Xavier Sua-filet of fish is a turd.

All guards are turds. That's why they're so replaceable.

**** em.

Sweet, because Andy Reid drafted Evan Mathis IN THE THIRD ROUND.

KEEP ****ING DOUBTING RISHAW JOHNSON

I can get behind this.

If Goodell wanted to really make the game of football better, he'd get rid of the guard position completely.

That's funny. Since when was Andy Reid Head Coach and GM of the Carolina Panthers?

Oh snap...

My bad. He was drafted in the third round. Not by Reid. My error.

You need to get your facts straight. Please see SNR's post. Explains it very well. Also, do some research on his time in Minnesota. You might be surprised by the politics of his playing situation.

By your thought criteria, no player can ever improve. Schwartz was indeed signed as depth but he played his way into the starting lineup as supported by the fact that he remained the starter even when Asuckmoa was healthy. Contrary to what you believe, players do improve.

I respect your opinion, I just have a different one.

My position is just as valid as this bitchfest shit about taking a guard in the 1st.

thats because competiton at positions and a player earning a starting spot without it being gifted to him rarely happens on the Chiefs

Schwartz beat out a 3rd round Pioli lineman pick who was overrated on this forum for years, and Schwartz came in and proved that. Thats why people like Schwartz he came in and beat out a starter.

Who does Joe Mays have to beat out? Who does Sanders Commings have to beat out? who does anyone at RG have to beat out?

We have ****in nobodies at a lot of positions

One side gets ****ing tired of true fan and media dildo telling us that we need to draft a lineman in the first round every year.

I personally think interior lineman are undervalued, but I also believe that you can find those guys in the mid rounds far more consistently than playmakers on the outside of an offense or the back end of a defense.

And I personally have not complained about giving Rishaw Johnson an opportunity.

Would I have liked to re-sign Shwartz?
Sure.

But I am not overly concerned with it.

You are not in the majority then. I agree with everything you said here.

/drops the mic

Reid is welcome to draft another Danny Watkins at 23rd overall... after he has drafted three playmakers like Desean Jackson, Maclin, and Mccoy.

Will Shields just sent me a pm. He said for you to blow him.

Please don't compare HOF players to anyone currently on our roster...

If we would actually draft Will Shields instead of ****ing around with Jon Asamoahs and Jeff Allens, nobody would be this irate about interior linemen, and all discussion about drafting one in the 1st would cease

He's one of the best to ever play the game. And I'd still take a top 10 receiver IN THE LEAGUE over the best guard IN HISTORY.

Will Shields played in how many AFC title games?

I wasn't. I was addressing the all guards are shit statement. Just like I'm addressing your notion that we don't have at least 1 hall of fame caliber player on our roster.

I didn't say all guards are shit.

I said they're turds.

It's a subtle difference, but it's there.

What does that have to do with the price of tea in china?

One player doesn't make a team. How many championship games did Cris Carter and Randy Moss play in?

What round was Will Shields drafted in?

Hint: not the first
(or the second)

I don't see who we currently have that looks like a HOF player.

Perhaps Charles but he'd need a SB and this level of productivity for like 5 more years...

I apologize for my vulgarity.

I am aware that Shields was drafted in the third and that made his first start in his rookie year because of an injury and never lost it. I am not advocating picking a guard or any position for that manner. I would rather take a player who I know will be solid for years than take a chance on someone who could be great but also could be a giant turd.

One or two, I believe.

Well they both went to the NFCC game together. I'm pretty sure Carter lost another one before that.

Then Moss with the Pats...

If Carter did lose another before that, it would have been with the Eagles. I don't think the Vikings made an NFCC game between their last Super Bowl loss and 1998 when they lost to the Falcons.

Thank you!

Will Shields was a 3rd round pick. Yes please I'll take a HOF Guard in the 3rd every decade or so, sounds great.

Not in the 1st, or 2nd either.

http://www.pro-football-reference.co...9401230buf.htm

One would be the correct answer.

Which was my point earlier with regards to Eric Kush. 2nd pick in the 6th round. Pick number 170 overall. Only a couple of picks away from being a "mid round" pick. Yet we have folks in this thread unwilling to give him a shot. Go figure.