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OKchiefs 12-27-2018 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valiant (Post 13988100)
I think that is because of the mlb rule change for Latin America and the cap imposed.

So dumb too, MLB uncapped, Latin America capped so the royals quit leading in spending.

Well, they did spend quite a bit a few years ago when they blew their load on Seuly Matias and went over the limit. They were restricted on their spending the past 2 years and finally had their full allotment to spend this year but stit came away with very little, relatively speaking. I also don't think Moore has been able to cope with the restrictions on draft spending, as signing high schoolers to big bonuses as an incentive to forgo college was our only advantage. Without that we've been pretty bad in the draft. I don't see us with a farm system anytime soon that is comparable to the amazing group we had in the late 2000s.

tk13 12-27-2018 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OKchiefs (Post 13989585)
Well, they did spend quite a bit a few years ago when they blew their load on Seuly Matias and went over the limit. They were restricted on their spending the past 2 years and finally had their full allotment to spend this year but stit came away with very little, relatively speaking. I also don't think Moore has been able to cope with the restrictions on draft spending, as signing high schoolers to big bonuses as an incentive to forgo college was our only advantage. Without that we've been pretty bad in the draft. I don't see us with a farm system anytime soon that is comparable to the amazing group we had in the late 2000s.

That group was considered maybe the greatest farm system of all time. Even if they rebuild it up it's probably not going to be comparable to that. Same thing we used to say when we had three closers in the bullpen with 95+ heat and 1 ERAs. Hope you enjoyed it because that's probably not happening again.

duncan_idaho 12-27-2018 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OKchiefs (Post 13987957)
The biggest problem is they still have very little talent in the minors, relatively speaking. Outside of Mondesi they've found pretty much nothing in the international market in forever and they refuse to make big trades to restock the minors. They pretty much have to nail the draft every single year to have a chance at competing.


I would disagree with finding nothing... though it’s debatable whether they have found enough.

In addition to Seuly Matias, the Royals have added Carlos Hernandez, Yefri Del Rosario (who was part of this year’s class pool though signed last fall), and a few others. There was kid flashing at the Dominican complex whose name escapes me right now, but was impressive as an under-radar guy. Can’t remember right now.

What hurts is missing big on big expenditures like Elier Hernandez, Marten Gasparini, and Jeison Guzman. But those are the risks with playing in a market where you primarily are signing 16-year olds.

I think saying they refuse to make big trades is just inaccurate. They have to get the return they want to make a big trade, and they just haven’t been in that mode with highly valuable chips.

If you look at the returns for one-year rentals and/or at what the Tigers got mid season for JD Martinez, there’s not any “re-stocking” talent coming back in those types of moves.

None of the guys the Tigers got for Martinez is even top 10 in their middle-of-the-pack system. The Royals got better players in comp picks for Hosmer and Cain than they would have returned for half-year rentals and likely even for full-year rentals.

Merrifield is the first valuable movable piece they’ve had since the contention window closed. He’s so cheap and has so much control, they can and should sit until they get a return that’s worth Green-lighting, and that includes a top 25-50 prospect as the headline backed by a 50-100 guy and a few lotto tickets (Adam Eaton return).

It’s easy to say “trade a guy” but the match has to be there with a team willing to pay an appropriate price.

OKchiefs 12-27-2018 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho (Post 13989707)
I would disagree with finding nothing... though it’s debatable whether they have found enough.

In addition to Seuly Matias, the Royals have added Carlos Hernandez, Yefri Del Rosario (who was part of this year’s class pool though signed last fall), and a few others. There was kid flashing at the Dominican complex whose name escapes me right now, but was impressive as an under-radar guy. Can’t remember right now.

What hurts is missing big on big expenditures like Elier Hernandez, Marten Gasparini, and Jeison Guzman. But those are the risks with playing in a market where you primarily are signing 16-year olds.

I think saying they refuse to make big trades is just inaccurate. They have to get the return they want to make a big trade, and they just haven’t been in that mode with highly valuable chips.

If you look at the returns for one-year rentals and/or at what the Tigers got mid season for JD Martinez, there’s not any “re-stocking” talent coming back in those types of moves.

None of the guys the Tigers got for Martinez is even top 10 in their middle-of-the-pack system. The Royals got better players in comp picks for Hosmer and Cain than they would have returned for half-year rentals and likely even for full-year rentals.

Merrifield is the first valuable movable piece they’ve had since the contention window closed. He’s so cheap and has so much control, they can and should sit until they get a return that’s worth Green-lighting, and that includes a top 25-50 prospect as the headline backed by a 50-100 guy and a few lotto tickets (Adam Eaton return).

It’s easy to say “trade a guy” but the match has to be there with a team willing to pay an appropriate price.

Well, I'm avoiding directly criticising them for not trading Merrifield, as I'm just beating a dead horse at this point. But I do see a huge difference between Dayton Moore and someone like Jerry Dipoto. The narrative right now from what I've seen is that the Mariners have added a huge influx of talent into their minors from their trades the past month. Perhaps we haven't had much of an opportunity to make trades, but it still seems to me like Moore is much more hesitant to pull the trigger than many other GMs. I think it's also worth contemplating why we don't have many tradable assets. If we are lacking in pieces that are valuable in a trade to other teams, is that not also a further indictment of the front office? The failures in scouting talent are just compounded when you consider that not only do we have very little talent in the big leagues and upper minors to help us win games, but that lack of talent also keeps us from making smart trades and restocking the cupboard.

I'm on board with holding on to the few tradable assets we have, but I'm also aware that we risk injury to them the longer we keep them. Danny Duffy was possibly tradable at one point, now he's an overpaid marginal starter worth very little. There's a fine line between waiting for the optimal return and waiting too long and getting nothing.

ChiefsCountry 12-27-2018 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tk13 (Post 13989620)
That group was considered maybe the greatest farm system of all time. Even if they rebuild it up it's probably not going to be comparable to that. Same thing we used to say when we had three closers in the bullpen with 95+ heat and 1 ERAs. Hope you enjoyed it because that's probably not happening again.

kcchiefsus was a miserable **** during 2015 season.

Oxford 12-27-2018 03:34 PM

SP-R Lopez
RP-J Hahn
RP-L Flynn
RP-R McWilliams*
RP-C Ellis*

*=Rule5 so they must make the 25 man all year or else pass through waivers.
The other three have no options remaining so they either make the 25 or get DFA'd. Hahn might make it through waivers (coming off injury), so if he pitches in few ML spring games, he's being hidden for a DFA to the minors or a trip to the 60 day DL for rehab.

OKchiefs 12-27-2018 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry (Post 13989755)
kcchiefsus was a miserable **** during 2015 season.

I could continue to tell you that I'm not this person you say I am, but what's the point? Don't you think the moderators would remove me if I were this person you continue to accuse me of being?

Either way, what's the point of constantly derailing the conversation? Do you have anything constructive to add, or are you going to continue being a prick?

tk13 12-27-2018 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho (Post 13989707)
I would disagree with finding nothing... though it’s debatable whether they have found enough.

In addition to Seuly Matias, the Royals have added Carlos Hernandez, Yefri Del Rosario (who was part of this year’s class pool though signed last fall), and a few others. There was kid flashing at the Dominican complex whose name escapes me right now, but was impressive as an under-radar guy. Can’t remember right now.

What hurts is missing big on big expenditures like Elier Hernandez, Marten Gasparini, and Jeison Guzman. But those are the risks with playing in a market where you primarily are signing 16-year olds.

This conversation would be 150% different if they'd signed Acuna.

OKchiefs 12-27-2018 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tk13 (Post 13989822)
This conversation would be 150% different if they'd signed Acuna.

This is true, bad luck that went against us in that case. What could have been. I'm curious how he would have developed in our system.

duncan_idaho 12-27-2018 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tk13 (Post 13989822)
This conversation would be 150% different if they'd signed Acuna.


Acuna for 125k and Juan Soto for 4 million (instead of Jeison Guzman for 2.5) would make it quite a bit different as well.

They need to stop spending so much on glove and speed SS in Latin America. They have signed a lot if big deals for those types of players and have not had great returns.

Nothing wrong with spending on the Mondesis or Tatises, but Humberto Artaega types need to drop off the board.

DeepSouth 01-03-2019 10:20 AM

Prospect1500 rated the top 50 Royals prospects;

https://prospects1500.com/top-50-lis...-50-prospects/

This paragraph about Rylan Kaufman caught my eye;

Rylan Kaufman, LHP
Age: 19 (6/23/99)
2018 Highest Level: Rookie
That isn’t how you spell Kauffman. I’m not sure Rylan is spelled correctly, either. Impressively, the Royals did not sign a single high school pitcher from the 2018 draft. Kaufman, from JuCo powerhouse San Jacinto is the closest you’ll find. Drafted in the 12th round, Kaufman signed for a $722K bonus – 2nd round money. In fact, he received the 5th highest bonus in the Royals draft class, ahead of second rounder Bowlan.

Duncan, Why would the Royals give a 12th round draft pick 2nd round bonus money?

Chief Roundup 01-03-2019 12:29 PM

The outlook is bleak.

duncan_idaho 01-04-2019 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeepSouth (Post 14004278)
Prospect1500 rated the top 50 Royals prospects;

https://prospects1500.com/top-50-lis...-50-prospects/

This paragraph about Rylan Kaufman caught my eye;

Rylan Kaufman, LHP
Age: 19 (6/23/99)
2018 Highest Level: Rookie
That isn’t how you spell Kauffman. I’m not sure Rylan is spelled correctly, either. Impressively, the Royals did not sign a single high school pitcher from the 2018 draft. Kaufman, from JuCo powerhouse San Jacinto is the closest you’ll find. Drafted in the 12th round, Kaufman signed for a $722K bonus – 2nd round money. In fact, he received the 5th highest bonus in the Royals draft class, ahead of second rounder Bowlan.

Duncan, Why would the Royals give a 12th round draft pick 2nd round bonus money?


Because he was a top 100, round 2-3 talent who fell because of signability concerns.
You want to take players you know will sign in rounds 1-10, because you lose the slot money if a player doesn’t sign.

If you take a few guys you know will sign for well under slot, you can then draft kids with signability questions in rounds 11+ and not be hurt if they don’t sign.

Al Bundy 01-04-2019 07:04 PM

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The Royals signed Kyle Zimmer to a major-league contract. He was moved off the 40-man roster last season, returned on a minor-league deal and spent time at Driveline Baseball. The club DFA&#39;d Cheslor Cuthbert to make room on the 40-man.</p>&mdash; Rustin Dodd (@rustindodd) <a href="https://twitter.com/rustindodd/status/1081351621127299073?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 5, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

OKchiefs 01-04-2019 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al Bundy (Post 14007024)
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The Royals signed Kyle Zimmer to a major-league contract. He was moved off the 40-man roster last season, returned on a minor-league deal and spent time at Driveline Baseball. The club DFA&#39;d Cheslor Cuthbert to make room on the 40-man.</p>&mdash; Rustin Dodd (@rustindodd) <a href="https://twitter.com/rustindodd/status/1081351621127299073?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 5, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I of course don't expect this, but we could really use some luck. Zimmer actually surprising us and finally providing some value would be huge.


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