Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 5480504)

So were their legalities once debated, or were they not?

I forgot that organized sports are monolithic. Sorry.

Originally Posted by Laz (Post 5480539)

dude ... you miss understand me

i have no problem with them making a new rule to close the loophole for this new offense.


this title of the thread sound like the OP was crying about people wanting to use rules to stop this new offense because they couldn't stop in on the field.

like i said .... it's high school, so i don't care if they are using rules just to stop this offense.

Originally Posted by KC Fish (Post 5479747)

A-11 is just stupid anyway. Good for them. A-11 makes a joke out of football by using silly jersey number exceptions. That isn't football. If you can't play the game the way it was intended and you have to resort to sneaky pass-eligible exceptions, then maybe you shouldn't be playing.

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 5480221)

Do you recall the debate over the legality of the forward pass?

Or the fact that pre-snap motion could have been considered exploiting a loophole.

Or the tackle eligible play.

The huddle.

7 guys on the line

The funny thing is that the inferior talent of Notre Dame triumphed over the powerhouses of the day, like Army, by using a little known and employed system called the forward pass, something strangely similar to how these A-11 schools can compete with inferior talent.

Would you feel comfortable in telling Knute Rockne that his offensive scheme was "not football"?

Originally Posted by whoman69 (Post 5480295)

Horrible argument. Leagues and state classifications are done by school size. If the schools they are playing are too large then they should change conferences. The rule is only in place on kicks to allow the team to get down the field for coverage. Anything else is bull.

Originally Posted by KC Fish (Post 5480542)

The rules you listed were once debated, and afterward accepted.

The A-11 has been debated, and afterward rejected.

Can you see the difference now?

Originally Posted by Valiant (Post 5480602)

Kind of like the spread has allowed normally non traditional football powers in college and the chiefs of last year to compete somewhat..

Originally Posted by Valiant (Post 5480578)

Yeah but if it is a school with zero traditional lineman what are they suppose to do??? Get ran over every game??

Originally Posted by KC Fish (Post 5480640)

It's rather simple. If you don't have the facilities to properly compete in terms of students, training facilities, money, etc. with the rest of the established league, then don't form a team in that league. If you still want your kids to have a chance to play football, then establish a rec league that adheres to that competition level. But don't expect the rest of an established league to make exceptions to the rules for individual teams that are vastly under-competitive.

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 5480617)

The A-11 is only being rejected because schools that are more traditionally powerful, with a bigger base of supporters, find that it is making the playing field unnecessarily even.

Pissed off programs who lost are trying to go back and change the rules of the game because they are poor sports.

The fact of the matter is that if these same arguments were used 100 years ago, and accepted, football would be about as popular as lacrosse right now.

There's no reason to be afraid of innovation. Go back and watch a football game from the 40's. Look at how ****ing boring it is.

Originally Posted by KC Fish (Post 5480696)

BS. There are no rules being changed. The A-11 has been, and will continue to be an illegal formation that is only allowed on the high school level because the refs choose not to penalize them for running a scrimmage kick formation as a full-time offensive formation. There are no pissed off programs or traditional powerhouse football teams doing anything at all about the A-11. They don't ****ing care because it's a high school gimmick kick formation. The A-11 is not innovation. There's no future for it in American football. It's not even possible to implement in college or the pros.

Originally Posted by KC Fish (Post 5480696)

BS. There are no rules being changed. The A-11 has been, and will continue to be an illegal formation that is only allowed on the high school level because the refs choose not to penalize them for running a scrimmage kick formation as a full-time offensive formation. There are no pissed off programs or traditional powerhouse football teams doing anything at all about the A-11. They don't ****ing care because it's a high school gimmick kick formation. The A-11 is not innovation. There's no future for it in American football. It's not even possible to implement in college or the pros.

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 5480765)

So, they were allowed to run it, then they weren't, but no rules were changed?

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 5480765)

Originally Posted by KC Fish (Post 5480826)

No. Teams were never previously allowed to run the A-11. They added an exception in high school football called the 7-5-2b rule that allowed for receiver-numbered players on the LOS to declare themselves eligible for a pass on scrimmage kick downs only. Which was an update to the 7-5-2 rule. It was intended to aid in coverage for scrimmage kicks, and was never intended for any normal offensive formation. When they enacted the 7-5-2b rule, that's when teams started taking advantage of the loophole it created. This article discusses them changing 7-5-2b to remove the loophole.



You can't.



You can't line up in a scrimmage kick formation without the intention of a kick. High school refs don't call the teams on this.