Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6223902)

I agree 100%

BUT

take into consideration that Pioli is working off information by HERMS SCOUTS.

The only players he knows and trusts the scouting on are the ones he had a "hands on" process with. I understand Dimitroff handled this mostly, but man Pioli is basicallly alone right now as far as talent goes. Not saying Im giving him a pass because the players he did bring in were of the fail to the tenth power, just sayin...

During the time when getting the lackadaisical, lazy loser mentality out of the teams brain, it isnt a complete fail to bring in players that are used to being around winning.

I have given them a leash in this situation that may be a little longer than I gave in past ones because of the total fail they were willing to take over and hopefully transform into a winning franchise and their records in doing so are there for all to see.

If we are still a team getting blown out by middle of the pack teams like the Chargers during the first quarter of next year, I will open the floodgates...but I didnt really expect too much progress up to this point because of what they were given.

That fair?

Originally Posted by Bearcat (Post 6224022)

That's what I've been sayin'... the sooner we can get the next regime in here the sooner we can start picking them apart, finding every flaw in their system/personality/work history, and endlessly bitch about them.

The Pioli/Haley bitchfest is so week 3...

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 6224048)

There's a lot of merit to what you're saying here.

However, the thing that pisses me off, and that can not be defended, IMO, is the total lack of of trying to upgrade this roster with any players outside of players that have a former association with the braintrust.

I get that every new regime likes to bring in guys they are familiar with, but have never seen any that have gone almost exclusively with those players.

I'm not exactly sure of the number anymore, with the additions made in the last couple of weeks, but it has to be something like 19 of 20 players added to this roster with previous NFL experience that have been associated with Parcells, Pioli or Haley.

That is ludicrous.

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6224032)

here is what I actually said though, maybe it was taken wrong...I will try to be more clear in future posts.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
It has nothing to do with the W's and L's. The problem stems from the myopic dipshittery of the regime, thinking that because players came from NE, Miami, Dallas, or Az that they are the only worthwhile NFL players. Compound that with the belief that the 3-4 is the only defense to run, and you have rampant one who sucks the penisy and ineffectiveness which belies itself in the weekly performance.

BossChief:

I agree 100%

BUT

take into consideration that Pioli is working off information by HERMS SCOUTS.

The only players he knows and trusts the scouting on are the ones he had a "hands on" process with. I understand Dimitroff handled this mostly, but man Pioli is basicallly alone right now as far as talent goes. Not saying Im giving him a pass because the players he did bring in were of the fail to the tenth power, just sayin...

During the time when getting the lackadaisical, lazy loser mentality out of the teams brain, it isnt a complete fail to bring in players that are used to being around winning.

I have given them a leash in this situation that may be a little longer than I gave in past ones because of the total fail they were willing to take over and hopefully transform into a winning franchise and their records in doing so are there for all to see.

If we are still a team getting blown out by middle of the pack teams like the Chargers during the first quarter of next year, I will open the floodgates...but I didnt really expect too much progress up to this point because of what they were given.

That fair?



If that is that far off base, we will hjust have to agree to disagree.

That is what discussion boards are for I guess. Would be hella boring if everyone agreed with everything.

Originally Posted by TheGuardian (Post 6224058)

I hear you MM, but my take is this.

We'll see another big roster purge this offseason and a real run at players in FA and some more trading before the draft to load up on picks. I think for right now Pioli is simply keeping bodies on the roster that he is familiar with for comfort reasons only. I don't think in any way shape or form they will continue this after this season.

This team is probably shorter on talent than any team in the league. I think this season is nothing more than a throw away while Haley learns some HC ropes and Pioli does more scouting (I remember hearing a while back he himself was already out visiting and scouting college players). It's very possible that this team won't even be very competitive next season as well. When you've had 20+ years of crappy GM duties and bad drafting it's not an easy fix. I think personally, the Vermiel years were FAR worse from a drafting standpoint than the Herm years and IMO Vermiel set this franchise back more than anyone from a drafting standpoint. Or at least, he and Carl did during the years Vermiel was the HC.

Originally Posted by kcbubb (Post 6223793)

I never wanted Pioli or Haley and I would love to see Cowher in KC. Is it possible?

Originally Posted by TheGuardian (Post 6224058)

I hear you MM, but my take is this.

We'll see another big roster purge this offseason and a real run at players in FA and some more trading before the draft to load up on picks. I think for right now Pioli is simply keeping bodies on the roster that he is familiar with for comfort reasons only. I don't think in any way shape or form they will continue this after this season.

This team is probably shorter on talent than any team in the league. I think this season is nothing more than a throw away while Haley learns some HC ropes and Pioli does more scouting (I remember hearing a while back he himself was already out visiting and scouting college players). It's very possible that this team won't even be very competitive next season as well. When you've had 20+ years of crappy GM duties and bad drafting it's not an easy fix. I think personally, the Vermiel years were FAR worse from a drafting standpoint than the Herm years and IMO Vermiel set this franchise back more than anyone from a drafting standpoint. Or at least, he and Carl did during the years Vermiel was the HC.

Originally Posted by Danman (Post 6224056)

Why do you want a new regime again? Do you want to win only 3 games every year? Every new regime wants "our kind of players" or "the right 53" whatever you wanna call it. When they first come in they're gonna weed out the that don't fit their system. It happens all the time. If you change again, the new regime will start again at square 1 to get "our kind of players".

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 6224060)

What you said is essentially that Pioli/Haley are being given a pass in talent evaluation because they didn't have their guys in place.

That's bull.

Scouts gather info.

Even with the old staff, it is Pioli's responsibility to communicate to those guys what they are looking for and sift through the info provided.

Even with the old staff, he should have been able to make sound decisions.

And he did have his staff in place through the preseason whne they were looking at players on the bubble, and he still only brought in the "tree" players.

That's inexcusable.

Originally Posted by BossChief (Post 6224070)

I agree with most of this and would add that the Hunts should shoulder some blame as well, we are 35 million or so under the cap and one of the only teams (if not the only one) to ever go under the salary floor.

that is the biggest reason we are in the basement afterall.

no talent
lots of unspent money
the guy with the wallet should shoulder some of the blame.

Originally Posted by milkman (Post 6224060)

What you said is essentially that Pioli/Haley are being given a pass in talent evaluation because they didn't have their guys in place.

That's bull.

Scouts gather info.

Even with the old staff, it is Pioli's responsibility to communicate to those guys what they are looking for and sift through the info provided.

Even with the old staff, he should have been able to make sound decisions.

And he did have his staff in place through the preseason whne they were looking at players on the bubble, and he still only brought in the "tree" players.

That's inexcusable.

Originally Posted by TheGuardian (Post 6224079)

Spending has never had a correlation with winning. Every year the Raiders are like 50 million over the cap and every year they suck donkey balls. There is a happy medium here.