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-   -   Movies and TV Herolympics Sweaty Sixteen - Round 3, Matchup 1 (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=229741)

kysirsoze 06-20-2010 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 6833307)
It actually can think for itself, that's why when they go out in the field, Skynet flips the switch to read only.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guru (Post 6833314)
That is not thinking for itself. That is blindly following orders. Only in this case it has no choice in the matter. Thinking for ones self requires choice.

Agree with Guru. It is my understanding that while Skynet is sentient, each of it's creations are merely advanced AI operating off programming. I suppose the programming could be so intricate that a terminator's "decisions" would be nearly indistinguishable from rational thought, but I don't think that's the case here. Most of the T-800's responses are pretty transparent and based a a few simple guidelines.

Hammock Parties 06-20-2010 01:56 PM

The T-800 is capable of thinking for itself. John Connor wanted to go home in T2.

"Negative. The t-1000 would definitely try to reacquire you there."

'Hamas' Jenkins 06-20-2010 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guru (Post 6833314)
That is not thinking for itself. That is blindly following orders. Only in this case it has no choice in the matter. Thinking for ones self requires choice.


Which is why Skynet flips the switch to read only.

If its CPU is switched to where it can think and learn from past experience, it becomes capable of independent choice, including the ability to defy orders.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrDo7...eature=related

Skip ahead to 40 seconds.

007 06-20-2010 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 6833333)
The T-800 is capable of thinking for itself. John Connor wanted to go home in T2.

"Negative. The t-1000 would definitely try to reacquire you there."

It's in its programming to know what the other terminator will do. It's a terminator.

Hammock Parties 06-20-2010 02:01 PM

Threads like these are why the Herolympics are awesome.

007 06-20-2010 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 6833338)
Which is why Skynet flips the switch to read only.

If its CPU is switched to where it can think and learn from past experience, it becomes capable of independent choice, including the ability to defy orders.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrDo7...eature=related

Skip ahead to 40 seconds.

Still no choice involved there. It was completely at the mercy of either Skynet programming or them shutting it down to reset the switch for it to learn. It was still following orders at the end though. If it was able to think for itself why couldn't it self terminate at the end of the movie?

007 06-20-2010 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 6833345)
Threads like these are why the Herolympics are awesome.

I definitely agree. I've enjoyed this.

'Hamas' Jenkins 06-20-2010 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guru (Post 6833349)
Still no choice involved there. It was completely at the mercy of either Skynet programming or them shutting it down to reset the switch for it to learn. It was still following orders at the end though. If it was able to think for itself why couldn't it self terminate at the end of the movie?

Sacrificing yourself for the greater good.

FWIW, depending on what you can consider canonical, this issue has already been dealt with in the TV show.

kysirsoze 06-20-2010 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs (Post 6833345)
Threads like these are why the Herolympics are awesome.

This is basically my college years rehashed. Spending more time dissecting a movie or comic book mythos than the original writers spent coming up with it.

007 06-20-2010 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 6833358)
Sacrificing yourself for the greater good.

FWIW, depending on what you can consider canonical, this issue has already been dealt with in the TV show.

I watched the series but don't remember that part of it.

kysirsoze 06-20-2010 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guru (Post 6833349)
Still no choice involved there. It was completely at the mercy of either Skynet programming or them shutting it down to reset the switch for it to learn. It was still following orders at the end though. If it was able to think for itself why couldn't it self terminate at the end of the movie?

While it couldn't physically kill itself, it did make the decision to allow itself to be terminated. This could be seen as progress beyond what Skynet had programmed. In fact it flew in the face of that programming.

Then again, it's more likely that the humans who reprogrammed the T-800 added a little something about screwing over Skynet any chance it got in addition to just protecting John Conner.

'Hamas' Jenkins 06-20-2010 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guru (Post 6833363)
I watched the series but don't remember that part of it.

Cameron was able to lie and disregard programming based on her own volition. She hid parts of other Ts for example, lied to John about a variety of things, and even after he "fixed" her at the beginning of S2, she still had the terminate order but disregarded it.

kysirsoze 06-20-2010 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins (Post 6833370)
Cameron was able to lie and disregard programming based on her own volition. She hid parts of other Ts for example, lied to John about a variety of things, and even after he "fixed" her at the beginning of S2, she still had the terminate order but disregarded it.

What model was she in that? More advanced than the T-800, no? (And hotter)

'Hamas' Jenkins 06-20-2010 02:19 PM

FWIW, debating this makes me feel like a virgin.

'Hamas' Jenkins 06-20-2010 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kysirsoze (Post 6833371)
What model was she in that? More advanced than the T-800, no? (And hotter)

TOK715

But its CPU operates under the same premise.


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