No, Browns ownership ruined the Browns

The owners have been terrible because they have spent 16 of the last 22 years relying on a Parcells/Bellichick guy to run the show.

Parcells' tree ruined the franchise. The owners suck. Both are true. I don't know why you insist it's one or the other.

So when Pioli destroyed the Chiefs, none of that was Pioli's fault and all of that was Clark Hunt's fault?

You made a TON of stretches to blame Parcells dude. What don't you understand? ??

Stretches? Are you serious? Again, to be clear... I am blaming the Parcells tree and the Parcells way, not Parcells himself.

Bill Bellichick is a pure Parcells disciple. He coached in Cleveland.

Regime 1: First coach upon returning to Cleveland was Chris Palmer, a Parcells guy.

Regime 3: Phil Savage and George Kokinos become GMs. They were personnel guys when Bellichick was with the Browns. Savage and Kokinos follow the same dumbass tree incest method and hire two Pats coaches: Romeo and Mangini. This era reeked of the Bellichick Way.

Regime 5: Bill Parcells is brought in as special consultant. He hires Mike Lombardi as GM, who was groomed under Bill Bellichick. Lombardi fires Chudzinski and lobbies for, you guessed it, Josh McDaniels and Greg Schiano (at the urging of Bill Bellichick). Lombardi is fired and replaced with a Pioli guy, Ray Farmer.

Regime 6: DePodesta is brought in. He mentions in an interview that he consulted with Bill Parcells to help transition in.


How is any of this a stretch when for 16 of 22 years, a Bellichick/Parcells guy was in charge. And in most of those years, both the GM AND HC were from the tree? How is it a stretch to say Parcells influenced the modern Browns when the Browns specifically hired him as a special consultant?

The point is so obvious that you're a complete loon for not seeing it.

You still are the only one saying it, kid ROFL

Plus you are a buffoon comparing Piolis role with the Chiefs to that of Bill with the Browns

FYP

Edited....
1991 - 1995 - Bill Bellichick - Parcells D-coordinator
1996 - 1998 [No team]
1999 - 2000 - Chris Palmer - Parcells WR coach
2001 - 2004 - Butch Davis/Robiskie [no Parcells link]
2005 - 2008 - Romeo - Bellichick D-coordinator
2009 - 2010 - Eric Mangini - Bellichick D-coordinator
2011 - 2012 - Pat Shurmur & Holmgren [no Parcells/Bellichick link]
2013 - 2015 - GM MIke Lombardi [Bellichick personnel] / GM Ray Farmer [Pioli personnell]
2016 - 2017 [No team]

(consulted with Parcells)[/QUOTE]

No, you're the one making shit up because you're backtracking.

I did not say Parcells is to blame. I said the Parcells way is to blame. Multiple times. If you want to say bellichick is mostly to blame... Fine. But everyone knows bellichick follows the Parcells handbook.

And I brought up Pioli because you blamed the owners and put zero accountability on the GMs.

I'm not the only one saying it. Go read the thread. It's so hilariously obvious that stunned you still don't see it.

I don't know why, but I like the Browns.
If my team wasn't the Chiefs I would be a Browns Fan.

He also is the last HC to win a playoff game for Cleveland, and has gone on to win multiple Super Bowls and lead the most dominant team in in NFL history. Are you blaming HIM for the Browns moving the next year, wrecking that season, and then getting fired by Art Modell?

Modell. Who also fired Paul ****ing Brown. Arguably two of the top five HCs in NFL history fired by the same jackass.


So do the Ravens, where Ozzie Newsome learned how to team build under Belichick.


Finally, if you have a guy you work with who does a good job for you, and then someone else hires him for a higher ranking position, and it turns out he sucks, is that YOUR fault?

Get your head screwed on straight. The Browns sucking has nothing to do with Parcells and everything to do with (1) ownership, and (2) the ACTUAL GUYS that ownership has hired.

Again, I am not criticizing bellichick or Parcells. I am blaming "the way" and the cult of owners who continue to think it still means anything. Note that all the regimes I listed are post bellichick.

The patriot way works in new England. It probably would have worked in Cleveland with time. Because bellichick was there. Hell, bellichick doesn't even follow the patriot way (he changed his defense, hires coaches outside the tree, etc...) "the way" cults masturbate over the same outdated defense, the same boring offense, the same ridiculous Parcells rules approach to qb evaluation, and churn the same coaching candidates over and over and over again. And it's not just Cleveland. It happened in Miami and Kansas city, and now in Houston.

The owners are terrible in Cleveland. That's obvious. But they have failed because of their continued insistence to push a Parcells and bellichick cult philosophy 16 of the 22 years they've been there. So no, bill Parcells wasn't individually responsible. But his disciples copycatting Parcells and bellichicks in at least 3 of the last 5 post bellichick regimes no doubt account for the vast majority of Clevelands miserable recent track record

Swing and a miss of a thread zilla...deal with it

Because a Pats fan (who is obviously going to disagree) disagrees with you. Mmkay.

I can't help it if you can't see something staring directly at your face.

When the worst team this century has pulled from the same tree 4 separate failed times, 16 of 22 years, that's shocking. But not nearly as shocking, as it turns out, as a guy who actually thinks that tree's influence has nothing to do with the team's failure.

No, because i said so..and apparently the rest of the board

Interesting note from today's MMQB related to this:

Peter King's nutlicking of the Patriots is beyond annoying. He kept trying to peg Pioli as a martyr in KC from the very beginning.

That being said, maybe owners are wising up and refusing to force these guys install "the Parcells/Bellichick way." None of these teams, including the Patriots, run that stone age 3-4 2-gap. None of these guys have a tree coach, except NE (obviously). You'll recall that the ONLY reason Dimitroff/Pioli found success is that Arthur Blanks completely emasculated Pioli and refused to let Pioli/Dimitroff have any say in the head coach -- he and everybody's mom knew that Pioli was looking to pick another tree guy. It also helps that all 4 non-Bellichick guys had a consensus top 3 QB pick fall into their laps.

New England obviously breeds a lot of talented personnel guys. The problem is when they get sucked into the Bellichick/Parcells cult. These guys insist you can plug the same exact approach rather than carving their own way. I don't think Pioli made awful draft decisions, but his arrogance in jamming 2-gap and a Bellichick QB ****ed over everything he tried to do. We're seeing the same shit in Houston. And it's a long line of these types of Bellichick/Parcells cult guys that have destroyed the Browns. Even today, considering Parcells was consulted by DePodesta, you can't help but wonder if it was Parcells who urged them not to draft Carson Wentz -- Wentz doesn't pass the Parcells rules.

King raises a good point but it also misses the point entirely. The success of these GMs isn't because they follow the Patriot Way. It's that they've so far been good about making their own way instead of following the cult. But there are still lots of cult members in their ranks.