Could have had Larry Fitzgerald.

If you're a big fan of the spread check this out...

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=202128

"This is America, so we love to see the ball fly all over the place. But if you are going to make a living in the National Football League, you can't do it in the spread or shotgun formation, throwing the ball for 60 plays a game," Terry Robiskie said. "In the NFL, if you repeatedly leave those two tackles open, they are going to get beat. You can say it's a quick offense, and the ball is going to come out quick. That's accurate. But just as the ball comes out, that $80 million quarterback is going to get hit in his mouth and hit often. That's just the history of this game.

"On this level there are too many Jason Taylors and Bruce Smiths in this world, and they will be better than your best tackle."

You realize that Sanchez has superb footwork right now, don't you?

This.

Croyle was sacked 1 time in 2 starts: .5 sacks per game.

Huard was sacked 4 times in 3 starts: 1.3 sacks per game.

Thigpen was sacked 21 times in 11 starts: 1.9 sacks per game.


Thigpen got hit WAY more, which is what happens in the spread, yet he stayed healthy.

The Chiefs could have won the Super Bowl in the 90s if.... lots of things.

There are guys that were taken with top 10 picks from the spread that could never figure it out yet we're suppose to believe Thigpen can, I don't understand that.

I'm not remembering, so I'm not going to be intellectually dishonest with a reply.

I just remember thinking that game was a disaster, and I recall the scared talk going into the Jet game (even from Tony G. as a matter of fact) as a result.

No doubt, the spread hasn't done Jack S&^%.

Thigpen never had 60 attempts last season.
The closest he came was 54.
Aside from that game he never had more than 38 in any one contest.

And I'm not arguing FOR the Chiefs staying with the Spread.
I'm just saying.

I'm pretty sure the post you quoted says playoff wins, does it not?

Many QB's win playoff games.

Very few win SB's.

So no, I don't think winning a SB is a good barometer.

But you ought to be able to win some playoff games, and give your team a chance at the big game.

Why can't Gus Frerotte improve?

60 is an purposely exaggerated number....it's saying when you are throwing at a 2-1 even 3-1 rate out of the shotgun constantly you are begging for your QB to get beat around.

The quotation says "60 plays" not "60 pass attempts," FWIW. Slight difference.

Now pull out the 13 sacks in games where Thiggy was not in the spread....

Is that coach currently working?

If you really think spreading out the field and leaving your OT's unprotected helps the OL, you need to go back to football school.

Read it again...

"throwing the ball for 60 plays a game"

When was that quote? I mean the Pats live out of the spread and shotgun and so do the Colts

Gruden.

TeeeeBooowww on the sweep.

Okay. At least you agree that the number's exaggerated.

I tend to agree though.

Are you aware that the Colts base formation involves 2 TE's one lined up next to the OT?

They are not leaving their OT's open..same for the Patriots.

Right. Plays are different from attempts.

Let's not get this thing twisted.

yes if you read you would see that i'm ALL FOR sanchez.

Some of the benefits of the spread

1. They create one on one match ups.
2. They allow you to take advantage of the speed your team has.
3. They limit the defense by formation.
4. They reduce blitzing.
5. They reduce the number of blocks that need to be made.
6. They reduce the amount of time that blocks have to be held.

No way the spread contributes to hits on the QB, its the exact opp.

Substitute the name "Thigpen" for the name "Croyle", and these are last years posts.

I don't and it doesn't.

No argument there.

You need some football school.....I don't know if you are aware of this but if you watch Baltimore play if you lineup in a spread formation they blitz it every single time.

This is my stance on Thigpen:

1. He was one of the few highlights of this past season.
2. I don't believe he should be handed the starting job, but I also think he has enough talent to be able to earn it in TC.
3. A competent coaching staff could turn him into a franchise QB...
4. BUT, if there's an opportunity to draft a top QB this year, it would be silly not to take it.
5. Ultimately, none of this matters, because it's up to Pioli. And I trust his opinions (whatever they may be) more than those of anybody on the board. Even Mecca.

*Sigh*

"Throwing for 60 plays"
There's no way to twist that. Mecca himself said the number was exaggerated.

I understood the quote. YOU...um...did not.

why not give the whole story? pass attempts. he also had MANY more pass attempts per game than either

13 sacks?

WTF are you talking about?

Thigpen has ONE START where he didn't run the spread: the Atlanta game.

He took two sacks in that game.

If you want to take that game out, fine.

19 sacks in 10 games: Still 1.9 sacks per start.

*sigh*

Quote is a verb. Quotation is a noun.

The whole point of his comment is to stress balance, that's what you want and it's extremely hard to be balanced when you are in shotgun every play.

by yourself? what if your defense sucks?

Dont mention that 13 of those sacks were while we were NOT running the spread IIRC.

How about all the dropped INT's Thigpen had? He literally had over 10 of them, a stroke of luck like that only lasts so long, Damon Huard had it when Green got hurt..then he returned to normal the next year.

Merriam-Webster disagrees with you...
quote, to cite in illustration (noun)

OTW doesnt understand what you are saying, i do, and he didnt even reply to my pass attempts post

Yep but they run alot of 3 WR's set or spread the TE out. The Pats last year ran a lot of 4-5 WR's sets and Brady averaged 37 attempts a game

So, no one can expect him to improve, but we should all expect him to actually get worse?

Croyle: 1 every 29 attempts

Thigpen: 1 every 16 attempts

Huard: 1 every 9 attempts



Considering Huard's lack of mobility, I don't see what this changes.

Thigpen was hit a lot, and the spread is responsible for that.

It does. Was just trying to figure out where it ended where someone was considered being a good QB.

It's not Super Bowls, but a good QB wins playoff games.

Got it.

we ran the spread in the Car and Ten games?

I understood that completely and I agree.

He also threw TD passes that were dropped.
Just sayin...

Pittsburgh's defense had a 2nd half collapse in the Super Bowl, allowing Arizona to take a late lead after being down 13.

I don't have to tell you what happened next.

Thigpen didnt start those games. Huard started Carolina and Brodie did Tennessee.

"to cite"

Yes, like a verb.

It's a colloquialism in speech, but not an accepted form in formal writing. Trust me. Key here being the word "formal."

Drop this. I goofed the quotation--but disagreeing with me on this is dumber than my initial smart-ass reply.

Look it up.

He started ONE game in a pro style offense: Atlanta.

TWO SACKS.

croyle 29 pass attempts 2 games-13 per game avg
huard 81 attempts 6 games-13.5 per game
thigpen 420 attempts 14 games-30 per game
now i wonder who got sacked more times per attempt?

Thigpen didn't start those games, did he?

Reading is fundamental.

learn this

My fault.

did their defense suck? no it had a bad half. our defense sucked all game long in every playoff game TG played in

Relax.

I can't believe I'm actually watching people say that running the spread helps your OL when it leaves them unprotected..

Is this bizarro world?

It's one of the reasons I have serious questions about a guy like Jason Smith being rated so high as an OT, yes he's athletic, yes he can pass block but he literally never lines up with his hand on the ground and has very little experience run blocking or drive blocking.

Tyler Thigpen had numerous chances to make a play and win a game at the end, he failed every time.

Ass clowns...

I apologize. I shouldn't have taken that out on you.

I'm doing all the dirty work here, pulling up stats, and I'm basically being called a liar.

Forgive me for being short with you, it should have been directed at the source.

Some The Man Jacks would really help this situation.

But, he had a bad OL, and the playcalling was bad, and the QB coach is an idiot, and....

how many sacks did oklahoma give up this year? would you want to draft their LT in the first round? 2 nd?

:spock:

So, what you're saying is that Jason Smith looked like a better OT than he was because he was in a spread offense?

yes exactly. but it doesnt help the oline:rolleyes:

No I'm telling you he has very little experience doing something that NFL teams will expect him to do.

who has called you a liar?

....You guys have bad reading comprehension skills.

I'm not going to read this whole thing so sorry if I repost something. At this point I think Thigpen is servicable. He might be able to develop into something more but I just don't see him becoming a true Franchise QB. I don't really have too much of a problem if we spend another year with him.
With that said, I do like Sanchez. I haven't seen a enough of him to really give a good opinion but his demeanor on the field, some of the throws I've seen, etc. just make me think he could be something special. You have to understand that it is tough for people to want to gamble a #3 pick on a guy with so little starting experience so it's pretty easy to side with Thigpen for another year when you can see some of the success he's had with an awful coach like Herm at the helm.

...he still moved the ball and made us look like we actually had some chance of scoring a touchdown.

I wouldn't want their lineman because they are slow...they get away with that in the Big 12 against all the shitty defenses but Florida's defense absolutely exposed that entire offense as slow.

Which one of those isn't true?

Until they hit the red zone.

But how can you argue that he looked better as a tackle because he was playing in a spread. It's what you just said. Same could be said for Loadholt, etc.

If he could have put up decent 2nd halfs at all they'd have won some more games...

:spock:

IIRC, (I was there) we held Peyton and Company to NINE points in the 1st half in 2006. Only giving up 23 for the game was a miracle, considering the defense was on the field the entire game.

We held Denver to 14 points in 1997.

You can bitch about the Indy home game, and that's it.

The best analogy I can think of for why I don't want to draft a quarterback and stick with Thiggy for now is this:

The Chiefs drafting a QB is like buying a $3000 set of rims to put on a $500 chevy cavalier.

Why waste the money and time drafting a QB when they aren't going to make your team any better? Thigpen has the ability to overcome the weaknesses of our o-line (read: the boy can run!). Sure he may not be as good behind an awesome line as Croyle or Sanchez or any other QB crush people have, but he has shown that he can at least make the defense pay for strictly playing pass or run.

How do you figure? You're speaking out of both sides of your mouth on this argument.

I agree

which of those isn't true?

I'm not telling you he looks better as a tackle I'm telling you he has very little experience at an entire facet of the game.

He's very athletic and is a very good pass blocker but never run blocking to me would immediately catch my attention. NFL OT's have to be able to run block.

To take a OT in the top 10 he should be good at all facets of the game.