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-   -   Chiefs Evaluate the Defense Game #1 (https://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=324958)

R Clark 09-09-2019 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 14436653)
They didn't play much base, Hitchens played 100% of the snaps, Wilson was at like 85 and Darron Lee played like 10 plays as the 3rd LB.

So how would you rate the lb play?

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14436654)
I mean, he bull rushed him backwards 3 steps?

Looks like he wanted to go outside but saw the chip coming and just put his head down and bull rushed.

But the LT re-set and the pocket didn't do anything. Willie Roaf would give a bull-rusher a step, that's just smart OL play (no need to stand a guy straight up) and someone with a running start against a dude in a backpedal is always going to push back the other guy a bit.

But the OL re-anchored and held him with no real risk to the QB. Minshew dropped back on the hash and never had to even consider vacating it (not from his blind side anyway). That's a clear win by the OT.

And I know that Clark's more of a 'set up' rusher in that he'll use that bull rush to get guys to behave a certain way and set them up for a hump or a rip move later. But even still, Clark quit on that rep once he got stopped. The bull-rush is a part of every down lineman's arsenal but once it's stopped, it's time to try something else to keep advancing. Clark didn't - that's the 'counter move' thing you want to see from developing pass-rushers and Clark doesn't even attempt one there.

O.city 09-09-2019 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436678)
But the LT re-set and the pocket didn't do anything. Willie Roaf would give a bull-rusher a step, that's just smart OL play (no need to stand a guy straight up) and someone with a running start against a dude in a backpedal is always going to push back the other guy a bit.

But the OL re-anchored and held him with no real risk to the QB. Minshew dropped back on the hash and never had to even consider vacating it (not from his blind side anyway). That's a clear win by the OT.

And I know that Clark's more of a 'set up' rusher in that he'll use that bull rush to get guys to behave a certain way and set them up for a hump or a rip move later. But even still, Clark quit on that rep once he got stopped. The bull-rush is a part of every down lineman's arsenal but once it's stopped, it's time to try something else to keep advancing. Clark didn't - that's the 'counter move' thing you want to see from developing pass-rushers and Clark doesn't even attempt one there.

Minshew is looking left, looks like Frank figured he couldn't get there and was gonna try and bat it down which allowed the LT to re set and slow him down.

GloryDayz 09-09-2019 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duncan_idaho (Post 14435872)
Part of that is getting the ball out quick. Part of it is Jax getting flagged for 5 holds. Part of it is playing base sets and not doing any of the exotic blitzing Spagnuolo is known for.

The Chiefs aren’t going to be as effective rushing 4 this year as they were last year. They personnel changes dictate that.

All fair points, but he still beat-up our secondary nonetheless.

So I guess next week Spag will unveil some exotic defensive looks? Sorry, the only exotic looks we've seen from a Chiefs D in recent years is a multi-millionaire player made-up to look like a hobo.

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14436669)
He tried to jump or something it looked like, had he just kept pushing he pushes the LT into the QB.

I'm not exactly overly joyed by the deal, but I think you're being a bit overly harsh here DJ.

Then club the guy; he's got his hands set inside now, do a club with that right hand and clear them - use his momentum against him to free yourself inside.

This is a BAD OT he's going against - he doesn't need to toss Walter Jones out of the way here. He hits the guy and rocks him; feel that and make your next move. Instead he goes full Bailey and the guy just re-anchors.

It was completely ineffective.

Titty Meat 09-09-2019 03:00 PM

Regarding that play though can we give Daly some props? That's beautiful work by a former first round bust on that play.

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14436685)
Minshew is looking left, looks like Frank figured he couldn't get there and was gonna try and bat it down which allowed the LT to re set and slow him down.

I'd give that some thought but like I said - he didn't ever find the QB. He drops his head (almost never a good idea) and when he does that, Minshew is actually looking over the middle.

That isn't one of those Chris Jones specials where he gets stood up and puts his hands into the passing lane - Jones is a master at that precisely because he keeps his eyes up and finds his mark. Clark didn't do that here.

O.city 09-09-2019 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436697)
I'd give that some thought but like I said - he didn't ever find the QB. He drops his head (almost never a good idea) and when he does that, Minshew is actually looking over the middle.

That isn't one of those Chris Jones specials where he gets stood up and puts his hands into the passing lane - Jones is a master at that precisely because he keeps his eyes up and finds his mark. Clark didn't do that here.

He's looking past he tackle at the QB when he sticks his hand up though.

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titty Meat (Post 14436695)
Regarding that play though can we give Daly some props? That's beautiful work by a former first round bust on that play.

2nd round.

But your points stands - great set of moves by Ogbah there. Getting free was nice enough but then the little dip/rip to keep the OL from getting his hands on him as he's trying to get the corner was awfully nice.

Yeah, that was a hell of a play and if that's something Ogbah wasn't showing, it definitely deserves some praise for Daley.

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14436702)
He's looking past he tackle at the QB when he sticks his hand up though.

At the QB who is STILL looking up the middle and is starting to turn his head to the right. What exactly does he intend to do with his right hand there? He expect Minshew to go all Cassel, pull a 270 and throw it into the end zone behind his head?

If he'd have kept his head up, he'd have known that there's no reason to be looking for a deflection there and that he might actually have a play to the inside.

Just looks like a half-plan executed poorly to me. By the end he's just getting ridden out of the play because he's compounding problems.

RunKC 09-09-2019 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436641)
Here's a tweet of the sack:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Emmanuel Ogbah (<a href="https://twitter.com/EmanOgbah?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@EmanOgbah</a>) beats Jawaan Taylor with the cross chop/club/rip. Sacks the QB! <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PassRush?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PassRush</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Chiefs?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Chiefs</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/ChiefsKingdom?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#ChiefsKingdom</a> <a href="https://t.co/2J7RaBJyfT">pic.twitter.com/2J7RaBJyfT</a></p>&mdash; DLineVids (@dlinevids1) <a href="https://twitter.com/dlinevids1/status/1170778961288163328?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 8, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I mean c'mon man...what exactly was that?

This one isn’t much better either..

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Jaguars?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Jaguars</a> WR Marqise Lee was not targeted Sunday, but he did a good job blocking here to set up QB Gardner Minshew&#39;s 69-yard pass to WR DJ Chark. Very valuable having Lee back even in a limited role. <a href="https://t.co/7NBOPJBhcg">pic.twitter.com/7NBOPJBhcg</a></p>&mdash; Phillip Heilman (@phillip_heilman) <a href="https://twitter.com/phillip_heilman/status/1171080237876228096?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 9, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 14436717)
This one isn’t much better either..

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Jaguars?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Jaguars</a> WR Marqise Lee was not targeted Sunday, but he did a good job blocking here to set up QB Gardner Minshew&#39;s 69-yard pass to WR DJ Chark. Very valuable having Lee back even in a limited role. <a href="https://t.co/7NBOPJBhcg">pic.twitter.com/7NBOPJBhcg</a></p>&mdash; Phillip Heilman (@phillip_heilman) <a href="https://twitter.com/phillip_heilman/status/1171080237876228096?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 9, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Boy, that play will take more time to unpack than I'm gonna give it; mostly because I kinda think I know what I'm seeing there but I'm not positive.

Is that an RPO? Or just a really cleverly designed PA pass? Because the entire OL down-blocks so you can see Fuller and Hitchens both kinda take themselves out of the play. Fuller gets stuck in the wash and Hitchens is just too slow to react to the play-fake and get upfield to disrupt the rhythm.

Clark seems to first be going 'with' the run, squeezing to his left and treating it like a run play to close up the gap and potentially maintain a new edge. If that's a run play and he tries to freelance it (jump outside and get after the passer, for instance), he could create a massive cutback lane so credit to him for really engaging his guy first. Then he diagnosis the play action and by then it's too late.

I won't put that play on Clark. That's mostly on Ward for getting beat by a single move and then just being outrun to the spot. Clark did what he needed to do given that the OL was showing run. Be it an RPO or good play-action design, the down-blocking from the OL fooled most everyone there. Ward needed to do his job there and Minshew probably checks down to the guy squeezing out to his left there for maybe 6-8 yards.

In either event, that was a well designed play and I think there were yards there whatever the case ended up being. You just sure would like to see that not be 60+ in that spot.

EDIT: Yeah, I dunno - I really think that's an RPO given that Lee came across the formation and his first step was to block. I'll remain open to being educated there. Fournette seemed to give up on the mesh pretty quickly for an RPO but it's possible he was just making the same read as Minshew and knew what was going to happen so he was trying to get out in the pattern. Dunno really but I don't think Clark did anything wrong there.

O.city 09-09-2019 03:20 PM

Yeah, that's where Ward has to just make a play and do something other than that. Make him check it down.


I'm atleast encouraged because it seemed, to me atleast, that it was a lot of breakdowns caused by communications and such. That can be fixed (in theory).

O.city 09-09-2019 03:21 PM

Defense is so reactive and looking around at the best defenses, they've been together for quite a while. Cohesion matters.

So, i'm thinking when Spags was saying it'll take time, he's probably right.

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14436734)
Yeah, that's where Ward has to just make a play and do something other than that. Make him check it down.


I'm atleast encouraged because it seemed, to me atleast, that it was a lot of breakdowns caused by communications and such. That can be fixed (in theory).

Go read my posts from September of 2018.

I spent the first 6-8 weeks of last season saying "don't worry guys, these are communication problems and not talent problems, they'll work themselves out..."

I won't whistle past that graveyard ever again. Call me irrational or premature, but I banked on that shit just working itself out last year and it just never did.

O.city 09-09-2019 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436743)
Go read my posts from September of 2018.

I spent the first 6-8 weeks of last season saying "don't worry guys, these are communication problems and not talent problems, they'll work themselves out..."

I won't whistle past that graveyard ever again. Call me irrational or premature, but I banked on that shit just working itself out last year and it just never did.

I think it was the issue though, there just wasn't any accountability to change it or improve.

I hope and it seems like there is now. They're all talking about it and they seem to have the guys in place to do it atleast.

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14436746)
I think it was the issue though, there just wasn't any accountability to change it or improve.

I hope and it seems like there is now. They're all talking about it and they seem to have the guys in place to do it atleast.

Well that's why this is so critical to me.

I'm pretty sure Clark reads my posts and is gonna say "shit, y'know what? Nut is right and I really should've done a club/rip to free myself. That guy knows his stuff and I'm gonna do that next time. Accountability matters - thank you, DJLN..."

I'm always thinkin' ahead, O.City. Always thinkin' ahead...

PAChiefsGuy 09-09-2019 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14436741)
Defense is so reactive and looking around at the best defenses, they've been together for quite a while. Cohesion matters.

So, i'm thinking when Spags was saying it'll take time, he's probably right.

That's true effort also plays a huge role w defense. Ray Lewis always talked about this and preached it. That's why it is important to have a strong intimidating leader to keep everyone in line on D. Hopefully Clark can play that role but he has got to play better otherwise players wont respect it

FAX 09-09-2019 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by R Clark (Post 14436643)
I must be reerun cause I sure thought Wilson , hitchens was linebackers? Had I been right about that by your calculations the linebackers would have had at least 10 tackles . In a 4-3 isn’t three linebackers on the field?

You might be, but I doubt it, Mr. R. Clark. I stated that in a confusing manner. What I attempted to say was that "other than" Hitch and Wilson, the linebackers didn't stat a solo tackle (Lee had an assist).

Digging a little deeper, the linebacker stats seem better than I originally thought (again, I still haven't seen the All-22).

Lee had something like 8 or 10 snaps (depending on which source you use ... some places have us playing 58 defensive snaps others have us at 51 ... probably due to eliminating penalty snaps ... and I didn't take the time to count them myself). Either way, Hitch is listed as the only linebacker to play 100% of the snaps. Wilson had about 80%.

As for the way they used the linebackers in the scheme, it wasn't a base 4-3 from the get-go. They mixed it up a bit. It appeared that they entered the game in a "nickle" (or something similar) with 3 corners, 2 safeties, 2 linebackers, and 4 down linemen.

FAX

DJ's left nut 09-09-2019 03:41 PM

When even the Jags are forcing you to play mostly 2 LB sets, you know the league as we grew up with it is very different.

'Base' sets are going to be even less common than they were last year. I was thinking we'd see 3 LB looks around 25% of the time and now I'm thinking it may be nearer 15%. Nobody is using 21 personnel anymore.

petegz28 09-09-2019 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436641)
Here's a tweet of the sack:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Emmanuel Ogbah (<a href="https://twitter.com/EmanOgbah?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@EmanOgbah</a>) beats Jawaan Taylor with the cross chop/club/rip. Sacks the QB! <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/PassRush?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#PassRush</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Chiefs?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Chiefs</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/ChiefsKingdom?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#ChiefsKingdom</a> <a href="https://t.co/2J7RaBJyfT">pic.twitter.com/2J7RaBJyfT</a></p>&mdash; DLineVids (@dlinevids1) <a href="https://twitter.com/dlinevids1/status/1170778961288163328?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 8, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I mean c'mon man...what exactly was that?

Dude, he damn near pushed the guy into the QB and he also maintained so the QB had no where to go. I'm not mad about that play at all. Not to mention the dude was probably gassed as **** playing in that heat.

O.city 09-09-2019 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAX (Post 14436770)
You might be, but I doubt it, Mr. R. Clark. I stated that in a confusing manner. What I attempted to say was that "other than" Hitch and Wilson, the linebackers didn't stat a solo tackle (Lee had an assist).

Digging a little deeper, the linebacker stats seem better than I originally thought (again, I still haven't seen the All-22).

Lee had something like 8 or 10 snaps (depending on which source you use ... some places have us playing 58 defensive snaps others have us at 51 ... probably due to eliminating penalty snaps ... and I didn't take the time to count them myself). Either way, Hitch is listed as the only linebacker to play 100% of the snaps. Wilson had about 80%.

As for the way they used the linebackers in the scheme, it wasn't a base 4-3 from the get-go. They mixed it up a bit. It appeared that they entered the game in a "nickle" (or something similar) with 3 corners, 2 safeties, 2 linebackers, and 4 down linemen.

FAX

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436773)
When even the Jags are forcing you to play mostly 2 LB sets, you know the league as we grew up with it is very different.

'Base' sets are going to be even less common than they were last year. I was thinking we'd see 3 LB looks around 25% of the time and now I'm thinking it may be nearer 15%. Nobody is using 21 personnel anymore.

I think we'll see a lot more of Lee as we play teams that are gonna throw it more.

I also think we worry to much about people running the ball on us. Sure, don't get mauled, but as long as the offense is just blasting people, it won't really be a worry.

Titty Meat 09-09-2019 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436743)
Go read my posts from September of 2018.

I spent the first 6-8 weeks of last season saying "don't worry guys, these are communication problems and not talent problems, they'll work themselves out..."

I won't whistle past that graveyard ever again. Call me irrational or premature, but I banked on that shit just working itself out last year and it just never did.

Gonna have to disagree with ya here and I dont think anyone would confuse me for a homer. I thought Ward was garbage and it's also pretty clear Thornhill still doesnt get it but were going to roll with him til it clicks. Thornhill is still more talented than any of the shit we played at safety and we got Claiborne coming off the bench after week 4. Another guy more talented than anything we had last year sans maybe Fuller.

Overall it was a C- performance at best but they still did come up big at a critical juncture of the game and it was never really in doubt.

pugsnotdrugs19 09-09-2019 10:03 PM

Not gonna flip through all these posts right now but if it hasn’t been said, I’ll add that the defense seemed extremely vanilla yesterday.

IUsedToBeATightEnd 09-10-2019 06:40 AM

Much MUCH better on fundamentals, tackling and overall "attitude".
Middle of the pack D is what we asked for, middle of the pack D is what we probably got - and we may improve as the season progress.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hog's Gone Fishin (Post 14434006)
Patriots will destroy our defense

They won't be able to run the clock as they did last year, so who knows...

WhiteWhale 09-10-2019 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436743)
Go read my posts from September of 2018.

I spent the first 6-8 weeks of last season saying "don't worry guys, these are communication problems and not talent problems, they'll work themselves out..."

I won't whistle past that graveyard ever again. Call me irrational or premature, but I banked on that shit just working itself out last year and it just never did.

**** man, at least you learn.

I've been bitching about the lack of back 7 talent for what seems like 3 years now.

They're mostly made up of training camp cuts and guys other teams didn't want to pay. KC has had one first round pick in 4 years, and spent it all on offense (and, you know... what an awesome Pick. Super A+ for that one first rounder.).

KC's last 4 years of defensive back 7 draft picks: Thornhill (cross your fingers), Rashad Fenton, Dorian Odaniel, Armani Watts, Tremon Smith, Keivarie russell, Ukeme Eligwe, Eric Murray, and DJ White.

Jesus. We need someone in our scouting department that can spot this talent, because we clearly don't have one.

Hammock Parties 09-10-2019 06:45 AM

Thornhill and Damien Wilson making plays. Don't listen to that negative nancy Direckshun.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Damien Wilson played the majority of the nickel snaps and showcased a high motor. Blitz from slot &amp; the A gap forces the QB to go to his hot route in the flat. Wilson not only does well to track the RB and stop him short on third and 2, he punches the ball out for a big turnover. <a href="https://t.co/TrckVpigjs">pic.twitter.com/TrckVpigjs</a></p>&mdash; Craig Stout (@barleyhop) <a href="https://twitter.com/barleyhop/status/1171396901616476160?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

O.city 09-10-2019 09:37 AM

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">First Okafor great job assisting on the WR coming across to slow down before pressuring QB on boot. Ward a little late in deciphering his coverage. Now watch Thornhill opposite side and just chases the play down. Full display of his athletic ability. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/Pq2ODW1xS2">pic.twitter.com/Pq2ODW1xS2</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171445086959235073?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

One positive with the defense I thought was the tackling. They always seemed to have multiple guys flying towards the ball.

Thornhill can run too.

Mecca 09-10-2019 09:39 AM

So basically what I got from everything I've seen is.....Frank Clark needs to be a superstar and Ward is a pile of shit that killed us.

Lzen 09-10-2019 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halfcan (Post 14436521)
The defense held them to 13 points until the outcome was pretty much decided. It created 2 turnovers and held their stud rusher to 66 yards and under 100 with a fumble. The Jags piled up some garbage yards but were never a threat to win.

I am not being a homer- just stating positive things they did, but I know that goes against the narrative that the D. still sucks.

I guess my expectations were much lower since it was the First game with several new players, playing in a new system under a New coordinator- on the road in the heat.

I highly doubt this is the High Watermark for this defense and they are only going to get worse.

It reminds me of what Marty S. used to say. Something like "it never is as good as it looked and it never is as bad as it seems". I think with some changes, it could look like an adequte defense. I have a hard time believing that by the end of the year that this defense won't be better than last year.

Aspengc8 09-10-2019 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 14438752)
So basically what I got from everything I've seen is.....Frank Clark needs to be a superstar and Ward is a pile of shit that killed us.

Not quite. Clark played fine. Ward is terrible. Clark was routinely set up to get chipped, so instead you collapse the pocket and maintain pass rush lane leverage, taking away throwing lanes as well as areas for the QB to escape (as such in that sack video a few pages back).

Mecca 09-10-2019 09:53 AM

I think the most surprising thing I saw was that Wilson got nickel snaps and Darron Lee was a weakside base set LB and nothing else.

Lzen 09-10-2019 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14436552)
Leonard Fournette is a 'stud rusher' in the same sense that Ward is a 'stud Corner'.

Dude averages 3.7 YPC for his career. He was at 3.3 last year and was on his way to healthy scratch territory. Any sort of in-depth analysis of the Jags offense last season was that it was less efficient and less productive with him on the field than it was with TJ Yeldon.

Fournette ain't good, man.

The Jags were never a threat to win. They shouldn't have been - the Chiefs are MUCH better than they are. And winning in a cakewalk with a 1-footed QB and your top offensive weapon injured makes that clear. Especially when the pass-rush DIDN'T perform.

But the Chiefs are a contender and when the SB is your bar to clear, everything should come with heightened importance. The Cardinals can go out there and tie the Lions and claim a moral victory because their rookie QB didn't puke on his shoes. The Colts can go out there with Brissett, push the Chargers to OT and be pleased with their performance. Because neither of those squads are relevant.

The Chiefs...well they need to see where they were struggling and ignoring some of the issues from yesterday because they hung a W doesn't help there.

I think you're being a little dishonest. First, he has only played 2 seasons prior to this year and everyone knows about his struggles last year. I don't think Fournettee is bad. Actually, he had a few really good games in his rookie year. And for that the players voted him the 58th best player in the league. So let's not act as if he's some kind of 4th stringer.

RunKC 09-10-2019 10:12 AM

Interesting note: the 2007 SB Giants amazing defense under Spags gave up 80 combined points in the first 2 weeks of that season.

ToxSocks 09-10-2019 10:13 AM

I thought they tackled well. I thought they flowed to the ball well. The LB's actually hit the gaps, which was nice.

Breeland was invisible out there, which is a good thing.

Sadly, HBD was also invisible out there which is a bad thing.

And Frank Clark was disappointing. Dude was going up against a 3rd string LT and got very little pressure.

We made what could be a career day for a backup QB that no one has ever heard of before. But, some of it is a bit-misleading. The bulk of his work were throws into the flats and screens.

The pass rush was poor, which was my biggest worry about this D.

O.city 09-10-2019 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 14438866)
I thought they tackled well. I thought they flowed to the ball well. The LB's actually hit the gaps, which was nice.

Breeland was invisible out there, which is a good thing.

Sadly, HBD was also invisible out there which is a bad thing.

And Frank Clark was disappointing. Dude was going up against a 3rd string LT and got very little pressure.

We made what could be a career day for a backup QB that no one has ever heard of before. But, some of it is a bit-misleading. The bulk of his work were throws into the flats and screens.

The pass rush was poor, which was my biggest worry about this D.

This is why I was as disappointed in Clark as I was. He's being relied on a lot for the pass rush.

Everyone assumes that Spags is gonna run all these games and stuff and maybe he will, but they need to get pressure with 4 and let the backs drop

ToxSocks 09-10-2019 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca (Post 14438752)
So basically what I got from everything I've seen is.....Frank Clark needs to be a superstar and Ward is a pile of shit that killed us.

Ward is taking a lot of heat. I mean, dude got schooled by Chris Conley. But then again, i was never in the camp that thought Conley was a bad receiver.

And while Ward's coverage did in fact suck, he too, like the rest of the D, did pretty well in the tackling department.

There were some plays early on around the LoS where i was like, "Who's that? Oh shit that's Ward, nice tackle"

Aspengc8 09-10-2019 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 14438866)
I thought they tackled well. I thought they flowed to the ball well. The LB's actually hit the gaps, which was nice.

Breeland was invisible out there, which is a good thing.

Sadly, HBD was also invisible out there which is a bad thing.

And Frank Clark was disappointing. Dude was going up against a 3rd string LT and got very little pressure.

We made what could be a career day for a backup QB that no one has ever heard of before. But, some of it is a bit-misleading. The bulk of his work were throws into the flats and screens.

The pass rush was poor, which was my biggest worry about this D.

Clark was getting chipped and doubled. Jags went to a 3 step game the second foles got hurt, so your not going to see much from a 4 man rush against that. The big play throws were all off a 7 man protection with 2 guys going out and a leak for a checkdown. Defense played fine overall sans a few coverage mistakes.

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14438877)
This is why I was as disappointed in Clark as I was. He's being relied on a lot for the pass rush.

Everyone assumes that Spags is gonna run all these games and stuff and maybe he will, but they need to get pressure with 4 and let the backs drop

If you think about him as the point guard of the pass rush, I don't think you'll be too far off.

Lonzo Ball can't be a premier PG in this league because for as good as his court vision is, he can't shoot. If you can't shoot, teams will back off you and close up your passing lanes. A premier PG, even if he's not an amazing shooter in his own right, has to be a credible threat to force other teams to respect him. That makes the job easier for everyone else on the court.

Even on days that Clark isn't racking up sacks, he's gotta be a credible threat. He has to be occupying double teams and making the job easier elsewhere. And at times Jones will be doing that as well. Even when Clark isn't the one getting the sacks, the pass rush will still go 'through' him when its at its best.

Teams will be forced to reckon with him, provide more help out wide and give Jones some space to work.

He simply has to draw more attention than he did Sunday.

Lzen 09-10-2019 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 14438866)
I thought they tackled well. I thought they flowed to the ball well. The LB's actually hit the gaps, which was nice.

Breeland was invisible out there, which is a good thing.

Sadly, HBD was also invisible out there which is a bad thing.

And Frank Clark was disappointing. Dude was going up against a 3rd string LT and got very little pressure.

We made what could be a career day for a backup QB that no one has ever heard of before. But, some of it is a bit-misleading. The bulk of his work were throws into the flats and screens.

The pass rush was poor, which was my biggest worry about this D.

Who is HBD?

O.city 09-10-2019 10:30 AM

Eh, if Aspen8 is saying that, i'll trust him on it.

Lzen 09-10-2019 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 14438891)
Ward is taking a lot of heat. I mean, dude got schooled by Chris Conley. But then again, i was never in the camp that thought Conley was a bad receiver.

And while Ward's coverage did in fact suck, he too, like the rest of the D, did pretty well in the tackling department.

There were some plays early on around the LoS where i was like, "Who's that? Oh shit that's Ward, nice tackle"

Conley was actually a nice, possession, 3rd down receiver for us last year. It's just that he got a case of butter fingers late in the season.

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lzen (Post 14438912)
Who is HBD?

I believe that's 'honey badger'...uh...'dawg'?

Maybe just a spare consonant in there.

O.city 09-10-2019 10:35 AM

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Really hope that was Jones’ gap. Good job by Wilson, Hitchens and Thornhill in run support. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/Jh1o46laB8">pic.twitter.com/Jh1o46laB8</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171458302883979270?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Think that was Jones gap?

ToxSocks 09-10-2019 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aspengc8 (Post 14438899)
Clark was getting chipped and doubled. Jags went to a 3 step game the second foles got hurt, so your not going to see much from a 4 man rush against that. The big play throws were all off a 7 man protection with 2 guys going out and a leak for a checkdown. Defense played fine overall sans a few coverage mistakes.

There were plenty of plays in which Clark simply did not win his 1v1. They were not chipping him all game long. He needs to do better considering the competition he was facing.

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14438932)
Think that was Jones gap?

Do you really need me to answer that question?

O.city 09-10-2019 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14438953)
Do you really need me to answer that question?

LOL.

Man, the more I read and look into that, I just don't see Jones being here long term. I get all the splash plays and such, but take that play right there for instance.

He's talented enough to jump a gap and make a TFL, but if he whiffs it and there isn't a gang behind him, it goes for yardage. You just don't see the best defenses do that shit.

Aspengc8 09-10-2019 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 14438935)
There were plenty of plays in which Clark simply did not win his 1v1. They were not chipping him all game long. He needs to do better considering the competition he was facing.

I'm only up to halftime on the A22 film. Can you link me to some plays where he didn't "win"? He's had multiple double teams and chips alone in just the first half. Most of the 3 step game he simply tried to drive the tackle back into the QB to take away a throwing lane and keep the QB from escaping, mainly because the RB was lined up on his side or the TE did. You don't have to "win" a 1v1 in every pass rush situation, it depends on how the offense is aligned and who is getting chipped. There are important aspects such as passing and escape lanes that are accounted for by how many you are rushing. Its not as black and white as you are making it out to be.

Aspengc8 09-10-2019 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14438963)
LOL.

Man, the more I read and look into that, I just don't see Jones being here long term. I get all the splash plays and such, but take that play right there for instance.

He's talented enough to jump a gap and make a TFL, but if he whiffs it and there isn't a gang behind him, it goes for yardage. You just don't see the best defenses do that shit.

I think Spags will take care of that when they are reviewing film. I hope at least lol.

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14438963)
LOL.

Man, the more I read and look into that, I just don't see Jones being here long term. I get all the splash plays and such, but take that play right there for instance.

He's talented enough to jump a gap and make a TFL, but if he whiffs it and there isn't a gang behind him, it goes for yardage. You just don't see the best defenses do that shit.

It's just one of those things you don't notice until you start looking for it. Then you notice it a LOT.

I mean you have Williams in a 0 technique (sorta; would you call that a 1 shade?) and Ogbah pretty clearly manning the C gap.

It has to be wishful thinking for Jacobs to sit there and say "yeah, Ogbah at the C, Williams drawing a double in the As...I'm sure it was Jones responsibility to just abandon the B gap in favor of crashing inside.

His athleticism is obscene - even on that play you see him doing shit that other guys just cannot do. But I don't know how many times you can watch the guy freelance like that and just ignore it. He's so clearly doing his own thing out there at times that it makes team defense awfully difficult.

And lemme tell ya - if he keeps getting doubled as often as he was getting doubled on Sunday, that's only going to get worse. He'll see every chance he has to split a gap as a breath of fresh air and he'll take it.

Buckweath 09-10-2019 11:54 AM

Surprinsigly enough, the Chiefs defense is ranked #22 for toal yards allowed and #16 in PPG.

Sure they played a below-average offense with a backup QB but that backup QB played really well regardless of the defense and also, the defense was playing away.

Still hoping for major improvements moving forward but looking at those stats, it doesn't look too bad, granted it doesn't mean much after one game.

FAX 09-10-2019 12:10 PM

After perusing the All-22 (just a scan of certain plays; not an actual analysis, by any means), I can report that Ward doesn't seem to understand how to play Spaggyboots' zone defense properly.

Either he doesn't understand the call or he doesn't know how, if, or when to release his man into another zone and what to do if he does.

Who knows if that's "fixable" ... but it was a real and repeated problem in that game. I felt bad for the guy. But the Yaguars sure as hell didn't.

FAX

Hammock Parties 09-10-2019 12:35 PM

Run D. Much better.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">AWESOME run defense here! They have every gap covered. Controlling the LOS. Rewatch each player. This is how it is suppose to be! Frank Clark forces the hold otherwise it’s a 5 yard loss instead 10-yard penalty. Thornhill is so quick! Fuller holds the edge. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/WQ9bqjQbQI">pic.twitter.com/WQ9bqjQbQI</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171491828962492420?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Mecca 09-10-2019 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 14438973)
It's just one of those things you don't notice until you start looking for it. Then you notice it a LOT.

I mean you have Williams in a 0 technique (sorta; would you call that a 1 shade?) and Ogbah pretty clearly manning the C gap.

It has to be wishful thinking for Jacobs to sit there and say "yeah, Ogbah at the C, Williams drawing a double in the As...I'm sure it was Jones responsibility to just abandon the B gap in favor of crashing inside.

His athleticism is obscene - even on that play you see him doing shit that other guys just cannot do. But I don't know how many times you can watch the guy freelance like that and just ignore it. He's so clearly doing his own thing out there at times that it makes team defense awfully difficult.

And lemme tell ya - if he keeps getting doubled as often as he was getting doubled on Sunday, that's only going to get worse. He'll see every chance he has to split a gap as a breath of fresh air and he'll take it.

He's probably not happy they're in 4-3 at the moment and he's busy getting screamed at by Daly.

In reality I think in some sets they should let him play DE just to try to placate him enough to do his job at DT.

Hammock Parties 09-10-2019 12:47 PM

What the **** is Jones doing?

He needs an ass chewing.

lcarus 09-10-2019 01:01 PM

Seems like when our guys actually do get to the QB, the QB takes a baby step to the side and our guys go flying right by. Get the SOB!

pugsnotdrugs19 09-10-2019 01:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties (Post 14439156)
What the **** is Jones doing?

He needs an ass chewing.

Got tripped.

Hammock Parties 09-10-2019 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pugsnotdrugs19 (Post 14439191)
Got tripped.

Bullshit. He just fell down.

He should never have abandoned his gap. It created a huge hole.

O.city 09-10-2019 01:22 PM

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Same run play as Thornhill. Frank Clark still penetrates and splits the double and causes the hold otherwise he owns the edge on a double team. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/UZMjcolckj">pic.twitter.com/UZMjcolckj</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171503509855821824?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Just the damn effort is so much improved from last year.

Hammock Parties 09-10-2019 01:23 PM

Dee Ford could NEVER do that.

O.city 09-10-2019 01:24 PM

Nope.

And look at Wilson flying in there.

Did we actually get a really good player there?

Hammock Parties 09-10-2019 01:26 PM

Absolutely awesome. Nnadi is a tank. Darron Lee shed Norwell's block.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Wilson and Clark notify Fournette that they edge is closed until further notice. Nnadi and Lee greet Fournette on the cutback. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/zCGb38lrac">pic.twitter.com/zCGb38lrac</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171504970404790273?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

O.city 09-10-2019 01:28 PM

Yeah and Jones isn't really built or suited to anchor and take on double teams.

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties (Post 14439202)
Dee Ford could NEVER do that.

Lots of things don't happen last year.

1) No, Ford doesn't occupy that double team.
2) When #80 peels off, Hitchens is coming hard down the hill and immediately locks him up. He doesn't get walled off and leave Fournette with an easy lane and a lead blocker. Hitchens of last year likely doesn't completely swallow up that TE and keep him from clearing a lane
3) The critical player here - ****ing Wilson is shot out of a cannon in pursuit. Him getting across the formation like that and making that tackle kept that from being a 6-8 yard play before Hitchens and Thornhill finished the play.

Last year Ford gets pushed back and the the LT/TE are probably able to get into Hitchens significantly earlier, allowing the TE to peel upfield. Ragland doesn't get through the wash and so you end up with Fournette and the TE in the open field vs. Lucas. Lucas was always a game run defender but I don't think he gets the tackle there. At best he re-direct Fournette to the middle.

A 3-4 yard gain on that run is probably in the 15+ range on last year's defense and it took strong efforts from Clark/Hitchens (and a damn nice play from Wilson) to blow that up.

Hell of a nice demonstration of team D there.

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties (Post 14439206)
Absolutely awesome. Nnadi is a tank. Darron Lee shed Norwell's block.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Wilson and Clark notify Fournette that they edge is closed until further notice. Nnadi and Lee greet Fournette on the cutback. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/zCGb38lrac">pic.twitter.com/zCGb38lrac</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171504970404790273?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Yeah, I think it was my first post in this thread where I said Nnadi is a genuine joy to watch play the run.

He's a football nerds dream. If you're not watching him, you'll never know he's there. But man, if you just watch him for a handful of snaps you get a masterclass in run technique and you see just how critical being assignment sound and aware of your limitations is.

If I were to get a present Chiefs jersey, I really think it would be a Nnadi jersey. That guy is a lunchpail player and just seems to do everything right.

O.city 09-10-2019 01:40 PM

I'm more encouraged after all these clips about the D.

The effort is atleast there this year.

Hammock Parties 09-10-2019 01:40 PM

Another dude we're gonna have to pay - but maybe not as much since he won't be a 10 sack dude.

ToxSocks 09-10-2019 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14439225)
I'm more encouraged after all these clips about the D.

The effort is atleast there this year.

You could see an improvement in effort even before these clips. You said it yourself, the tackling is much improved and defenders are flying to the ball. That's effort.

FAX 09-10-2019 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14439207)
Yeah and Jones isn't really built or suited to anchor and take on double teams.

?

Jones has taken on his share of double-teams in his career ...

BTW, Nnaughti has a great base, but his upper body strength might be his most impressive attribute. Once he gets his hands on you, all you can do is wait to find out if you wind up flying left or right.

FAX

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties (Post 14439226)
Another dude we're gonna have to pay - but maybe not as much since he won't be a 10 sack dude.

I'd give him the contract that the Saints gave Malcolm Brown the instant he's eligible for it. Very similar players and I think Nnadi will be steadier. Johnathan Hankins is pretty similar.

There's not a huge difference between someone like Brown and someone like, say, Linval Joseph. But Joseph got paid a LOT more. And if you wait until Nnadi fully develops, he'll get paid closer to what Joseph is making (or Brandon Williams). I think you want to get that deal done as soon as you can get him to agree to that Brown/Hankins $5 million/yr AAV level deal.

RunKC 09-10-2019 01:50 PM

Spags and his staff saw big value in Alex Okafor, Damien Wilson, Alex Okafor, Emmanuel Ogbaha and hopefully Darron Lee. So far that appears to be paying off.

This makes me feel good about the future because more of this with another offseason should make the defense that much better each year.

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAX (Post 14439237)
?

Jones has taken on his share of double-teams in his career ...

BTW, Nnaughti has a great base, but his upper body strength might be his most impressive attribute. Once he gets his hands on you, all you can do is wait to find out if you wind up flying left or right.

FAX

And Mr. Nnadi will be telling you which directly it's gonna be.

Watch his head - you see him trying to peak around and find the ballcarrier. He's really damn good at it. I don't know how one has an innate 'vision' for something like that but Nnadi has it. That plays an excellent demonstration of it because you can see him looking past the C and trying to wait for the RB to commit to a lane. As soon as Fournette commits, Nnadi just whips the C out of the way and is waiting for him.

Like I said, I really enjoy watching him play.

O.city 09-10-2019 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAX (Post 14439237)
?

Jones has taken on his share of double-teams in his career ...

BTW, Nnaughti has a great base, but his upper body strength might be his most impressive attribute. Once he gets his hands on you, all you can do is wait to find out if you wind up flying left or right.

FAX

He's too tall. He's an athletic gap penetrator.

His pad level is just too high to take on doubles consistently.

Hammock Parties 09-10-2019 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14439271)
He's too tall. He's an athletic gap penetrator.

His pad level is just too high to take on doubles consistently.

I have no idea why anyone is doubling Jones on a running play anyway.

Nnadi is going to get that respect soon.

O.city 09-10-2019 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties (Post 14439284)
I have no idea why anyone is doubling Jones on a running play anyway.

Nnadi is going to get that respect soon.

That would be better for the Chiefs. Nnadi can hold it up.

Jones would theoretically be able to shed that single blocker and make plays.

O.city 09-10-2019 02:12 PM

The thing with defending the run is you have to consistently do it as a unit. You can't be guessing and jumping gaps cause you leave guys out to dry.

That's what they did last year. We saw how that worked out.

O.city 09-10-2019 02:13 PM

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Thornhill strikes again on this jet sweep. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/u0Xaw3jqj9">pic.twitter.com/u0Xaw3jqj9</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171515247623954434?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Thornhill was flying Sunday. He's gonna be a good one.

ToxSocks 09-10-2019 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14439298)
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Thornhill strikes again on this jet sweep. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/u0Xaw3jqj9">pic.twitter.com/u0Xaw3jqj9</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171515247623954434?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Thornhill was flying Sunday. He's gonna be a good one.

Looked like vintage Berry on that play.

O.city 09-10-2019 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detoxing (Post 14439300)
Looked like vintage Berry on that play.

I didn't wanna say that, but that guy was everywhere.

Some smart teams will bait him and throw over the top but he's super smart, he'll be fine.

DJ's left nut 09-10-2019 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.city (Post 14439298)
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Thornhill strikes again on this jet sweep. <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JacobsEyeInTheSky?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JacobsEyeInTheSky</a> <a href="https://t.co/u0Xaw3jqj9">pic.twitter.com/u0Xaw3jqj9</a></p>&mdash; Nick Jacobs (@Jacobs71) <a href="https://twitter.com/Jacobs71/status/1171515247623954434?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 10, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Thornhill was flying Sunday. He's gonna be a good one.

Remember last season when that would've been Ron Parker? I mean this in the most clinical, matter of fact way possible - Parker would've been standing at the 25 yard line waiting to see what happened. You know he would've. That's all he ever did in run support, he'd wait to see if the first line took care of it and if there was a LB flying in to clean up, he'd stay out of the fray altogether. The only time he'd engage was when the first guy missed and there was no help to be found.

Damn he was frustrating to watch.


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