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-   -   KU ***Official '22/'23 Defending Natl' Champion KU Men’s Basketball Repository Thread*** (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=343839)

smithandrew051 03-19-2023 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch (Post 16864495)
The announcers did a good job saying what I was thinking, that under 20 you don’t have a good case not to get a 3. With 16 left, it’ll take at least 4 seconds to get a bucket, best case. As in: you can make a move to the basket and have a direct line.


Best case it’s 12 left, worst case is 8 which is what we got. And you ARENT even guaranteed to get a two anyway. They made Jalen earn it at the stripe.


TLDR: three to tie, vs quick bucket + foul + miss FT (at least one) + score again. My gawd which one is more likely????

It needed to be either an inbounds layup with a second or two off the clock or a 3. Anything longer than that ended the game.

I’m sure Arkansas was probably all over Gradey, but I’m certain Self finds a way to get the ball in his hands for a shot.

He managed to get Mario a look in 2008. He got McLemore a shot at home against Iowa State in 2013. He got Svi an open look in 2018 against Duke.

He would’ve gotten that ball to Gradey for a chance at the tie.

smithandrew051 03-19-2023 11:57 AM

One other thing about this year.

For most of the season, it was absolutely painful watching us throw lobs. Adams and Udeh were the only ones who could actually finish, and it took Udeh 3/4 of the season to come around. Took Adams about 1/4 of the season.

That’s a dimension that MJ Rice can bring if he comes back. Marcus Adams Jr would also bring a bit of that.

Ochai made it look so damn easy.

KC_Connection 03-19-2023 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch (Post 16864495)
TLDR: three to tie, vs quick bucket + foul + miss FT (at least one) + score again. My gawd which one is more likely????

Considering Arkansas is one of the best teams in the country at preventing the three and would certainly have been looking to prevent any kind of 3 from getting off in that scenario, it’s probably still the quick 2. It just needed to be executed properly.

This isn’t the NBA (where I’d advocate going for a 3 just about every time in that scenario), players miss foul shots and **** up even worse all the time.

lcarus 03-19-2023 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch (Post 16864495)
The announcers did a good job saying what I was thinking, that under 20 you don’t have a good case not to get a 3. With 16 left, it’ll take at least 4 seconds to get a bucket, best case. As in: you can make a move to the basket and have a direct line.


Best case it’s 12 left, worst case is 8 which is what we got. And you ARENT even guaranteed to get a two anyway. They made Jalen earn it at the stripe.


TLDR: three to tie, vs quick bucket + foul + miss FT (at least one) + score again. My gawd which one is more likely????

Yep even if you get a quick 2 and foul, if they make both FTs, they're in the position to foul to not allow a 3. Which is exactly what they did.

The only shot they had was to miss the 2nd free throw and of course....he accidentally made it. While the ref took 20 seconds before giving him the ball to shoot the FT to make EXTRA certain Arkansas players were ready and knew what was coming. Those ****s wanted Kansas to lose. Just like calling a 10 second violation when he crossed the half court line RIGHT at 20 seconds. Please. But that's the only time I'm gonna bitch about refs. The real reason they lost is Kansas just made a slew of dumb mistakes down the stretch and totally misplayed the last 20 seconds. Just shoot the ****ing three.

KC_Connection 03-19-2023 12:08 PM

In any case, the game was lost effectively before that decision was even made. If you’re in this scenario, your chances of winning are 10-20 percent at best anyway. You need luck and an Arkansas ****up, neither of which came.

McCullar getting fouled out so that Yesefu could come in and give up an offensive board was the real end to yesterday.

KC_Connection 03-19-2023 12:12 PM

That was a pretty clear 10 second half court violation watching it live and from everything I saw after the game. Was there any suggestion it was not?

I had been watching it pretty closely all half as Harris very nearly ****ed up in that regard earlier. He was likely tired and not paying attention.

Prison Bitch 03-19-2023 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 16864503)
Considering Arkansas is one of the best teams in the country at preventing the three and would certainly have been looking to prevent any kind of 3 from getting off in that scenario, it’s probably still the quick 2. It just needed to be executed properly.

This isn’t the NBA (where I’d advocate going for a 3 just about every time in that scenario), players miss foul shots and **** up even worse all the time.


Who cares what a defense wants to take away or if they’re even good at it? It’s our decision I care about and they certainly aren’t easy to penetrate against anyway. They were going to foul anybody who tried it - then you’re left having to make both, then restart the cycle again

It’s dumb

Prison Bitch 03-19-2023 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lcarus (Post 16864504)
Yep even if you get a quick 2 and foul, if they make both FTs, they're in the position to foul to not allow a 3. Which is exactly what they did.

.


And note: Muscle Man had the inbounds play set perfectly. IMMEDIATELY after it went in they tossed it to their best FT shooter. Whom Norm was apparently ok fouling. I get there were 8 seconds but your odds are better to trap him and foul the next guy with 5 left.


At any rate we lost to a worse team who imposed their will on us all second half

KC_Connection 03-19-2023 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch (Post 16864509)
Who cares what a defense wants to take away or if they’re even good at it? It’s our decision I care about and they certainly aren’t easy to penetrate against anyway. They were going to foul anybody who tried it - then you’re left having to make both, then restart the cycle again

It’s dumb

I care what a defense wants to take away because it will reduce our chances of actually making the shot by a considerable amount. As you may be aware, closely contested threes have a tendency of missing way more often than open ones. Gradey Dick basically never got open yesterday and it certainly wasn’t because of a lack of effort on his part.

Arkansas also is easy to penetrate against. They specifically play pressure defense on the perimeter hoping teams will do that. It’s the finishing at the rim that is the tricky part against them. Still, in that scenario, where you know Arkansas is going to have their guys all out preventing a 3, you should be able to get an easy quick 2 against them if you execute a good play. We most certainly did not.

KC_Connection 03-19-2023 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prison Bitch (Post 16864510)
And note: Muscle Man had the inbounds play set perfectly. IMMEDIATELY after it went in they tossed it to their best FT shooter. Whom Norm was apparently ok fouling. I get there were 8 seconds but your odds are better to trap him and foul the next guy with 5 left.


At any rate we lost to a worse team who imposed their will on us all second half

We didn’t have time for a trap there. The mistake was in not being ready on the inbounds. Arkansas was.

dlphg9 03-19-2023 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smithandrew051 (Post 16864452)
Did he say something inaccurate? Kansas did humiliate Missouri on their home court.

Or did he imagine that?

You just miss the "Kindly gtfo". Nope he sure didn't imagine that though.

smithandrew051 03-19-2023 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlphg9 (Post 16864524)
You just miss the "Kindly gtfo". Nope he sure didn't imagine that though.

He said “kindly” though. Very nice imo

Chiefspants 03-19-2023 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC_Connection (Post 16864508)
That was a pretty clear 10 second half court violation watching it live and from everything I saw after the game. Was there any suggestion it was not?

I had been watching it pretty closely all half as Harris very nearly ****ed up in that regard earlier. He was likely tired and not paying attention.

Harris Brain Farts have happened through the season. Unfortunately, one happened at the most inopportune time and may have swung the game.

If we hit one of the front end 1 and 1's, if Harris doesn't get that violation, or if Yesefu doesn't do what he does and go out of control trying to get a rebound off of a FT miss the game could have swung the other direction.

And that goes without saying that with Self, we likely don't rest KJ all the way from a stretch where we had a 10 point lead to a 1 point deficit.

Just a combination of a lot of things against a team that wasn't going to to let any of those miscues go to waste.

KC_Connection 03-19-2023 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smithandrew051 (Post 16864533)
He said “kindly” though. Very nice imo

I really wish I could have trolled MU harder for getting blown out by a 15. A regrettable consequence of this loss for sure.

KC_Connection 03-19-2023 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefspants (Post 16864536)
Harris Brain Farts have happened through the season. Unfortunately, one happened at the most inopportune time and may have swung the game.

If we hit one of the front end 1 and 1's, if Harris doesn't get that violation, or if Yesefu doesn't do what he does and go out of control trying to get a rebound off of a FT miss the game could have swung the other direction.

And that goes without saying that with Self, we likely don't rest KJ all the way from a stretch where we had a 10 point lead to a 1 point deficit.

Just a combination of a lot of things against a team that wasn't going to to let any of those miscues go to waste.

One happened last year at the end of the NC too when he stepped out of bounds. We just got away with that one.

I do believe fatigue becomes a factor in his sometimes poor decision making. We ask a ton out of him on both ends because we don’t have an adequate backup.


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