Only Chief fans would really behind a QB with a sub 80 QBR in his 8th season :facepalm:

This defense is epic and probably rivals the 90s. Hell it may even be better. But that defense won us a whole lot of nothing in seven trips to the playoffs under Schottenheimer.

I don't think that group of people exists... at least not nearly in the number you or anyone else might be thinking. Everything is hyperbole and absolutes around here, but there are plenty of people who really, really want to be wrong, but are lumped into this mostly illusory group of haters who must be happier when the Chiefs lose just so they can push their agenda.

While I do agree with the premise, what big boys should he compete with? I mean, he out scored drew Bree's in a playoff game, but that was rationalized away.

I want to be a team that's looked upon as the pats, steelers, etc, in that we are a playoff constant with a chance every year. I don't think Alex can do that, but I'm not sure yet if he can't.

So again, I do agree, I just don't think we will know until January or later either way, so I'm not going to get too upset either way.

This is the biggest bs statement Smith haters use

The fact is what has happened in the past has NOTHING to do with what will happen to this team. Every year is different. Every team is different. Any team can win in any way. Alex Smith is not to blame for the failures of others. He is not Steve Bono,Elvis Grbac,Matt Cassel. He is Alex Smith he is undefeated as the QB of the Kansas City Chiefs. Sorry haters it's fact. Whats going to happen I don't know. But I do know that the past will have NOTHING to do with it.

I'm talking about what he can do as a Chief.... buying in based on past games or whatever is completely different. If he wins as a Chief and consistently competes with playoff calibre teams, there's really no doubt in my mind that he'd become a fan favorite. Sure, it might take more than one or two games... if they won a WC game and then lost in the 2nd round this year, I'm sure there will be holdouts... but an AFC Championship game? A freakin' SB win, like he mentioned? It's not even a question, assuming he's at least doing some good on the field.

And yeah, the games vs Denver and Indy will go a long way, and then hopefully there's a good test in the playoffs... not that he needs to win all of those or even one of those this year, but being competitive would be a nice start.

Maybe you're right, maybe I've been overeacting to comments like;

We've seen this before
This is the 90s
We know how this worked out with Marty
Just like Bono, Grbac and Cassel
We know where game managers leave us
The inevitable downfall against real competition

etc.

Your basic 'I know the future because I'm traumatized by the past.'

The NY Giants did just that in the 2011 NFC conference championship game, daring Alex to beat them deep, resulting in 1 for 13 in 3rd down conversions, and holding the entire 49ers receiving corps to just 1 reception.

The Giants and Seahawks did that to Alex in the 2011 regular season as well.

I've defintely said that a lot, out of 1) amazement at how some determined the opposite was true after the first week or two, and it really is different this time (of course, stating the absolute one way or the other that early is ridiculous either way), 2) defending my position that I haven't bought in and might actually be waiting several games before making any firm opinions, and 3) yeah, frustration that I follow a team that clearly doesn't get it when it comes to one of the most important positions in sports.

It feels like I've been on this ride before, because it's basically the only one I know as a Chiefs fan, but as jaded or apathetic or even skeptical as I might be, I have no reason to resist or rationalize away the kind of play it takes to win big games once I see it. I'd love to hand over hundreds of dollars (again) to watch it all live, but they'll have to earn it first (this time).

The argument has definitely gone to such ridiculous lengths that you don't really know where people stand... hell, sometimes I start with a simple point like how I want to see some consistency from Smith, and after an hour or two of responding to hyperbole and strawmen, I start feeling like I'm hating on the guy, when I'm only trying to bring the conversation back from one far end of the spectrum or the other.

The defense has been giving him a lot. Welcome to the 90's.

Hey! Welcome to the 90's!

You don't say...

I appreciate that you have made numerous concerted efforts to pull back on overheated rhetoric. But you have to realize that wet blankets fall heavy on the shoulders of optimists watching an AMAZING turnaround with this team.

A lot of it boils down to whether you view a team as a collection of compartments or as a holistic entity. With the former, of course, nothing the defense is doing has anything to do with the offense, or the passing game, or the QB. But I have a long and consistent record of holding that an NFL team is like an automobile engine. When it's out of tune, it's ALL out of tune. An AMG W-16 with a bad timing gear is as useless as a Yugo 4-banger. Our quest as fans is to keep our eyes peeled to be the first to yell 'land-ho' from the crow's nest when the pieces come together.

Our previous 13-3 flame-outs bear little resemblance to 2013 Chiefs FB. There weren't abysmal seasons preceding. There weren't massive coaching and philosophy changes in between. There wasn't over 1/2 the roster changing, with all the good being retained and ALL the chaff being discarded.

I was in St.L. when the greatest show turned the 4-12 Rams into SB champs. They had twice as many wins in the season prior as we have. I also saw how important both a dominant D and being clutch was when they beat the Bucs, what, . . . 3-2, 4-7, . . . some other MLB score [I know, 11-6, Ricky effing Proehl and all that], to go to the SB and win on a defensive stand. I also saw the 2000 Ravens. I saw the Pats completely break down the self-same Rams, minus a dominant D, in 2001/02, in a room filled with Rams bandwagoneers. Oddest schadenfreude of my life, a room full of friends and a team I liked, but certain that Belichek had their number. Sad to see so many disappointed faces, but deep down glad I still knew football.

My rambling has turned Rico-esque. But my point is, I still have a good feeling about this iteration, I'm not some Kool-aid drinking 'truefan,' and we're all going to be in the dark until the rubber meets the road in January. Enjoy the ride, . . . or don't. But cut out the 'are we there yet' [ie, have we lost yet] shit.

As it was then, as it is now.

He's way below average right now.

In YPA, TDs, completion percentage, QB rating...all the things that matter the most in evaluating QB play.

Below average. Statistically.

Get it right.

You are surprisingly like an Ashton Kutcher fan who saw 'Jobs' and is moaning for the day when Ashton gets his Oscar.