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chiefzilla1501 12-13-2015 11:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buehler445 (Post 11952307)
And since you made me look, here are your guys that are "good"


LINK

Wade Smith Played until 2014. Legit.
De La Puenta I didn't find him on the roster on the link.
Barth Still in the league but was horrid. Nobody whined about him leaving
Gafford Still in the league. Legit.
Page played until 2011, but never stayed more than a year, marginal at best
Turk played until 2012. I had no idea. I thought he was done after he went back to Goonther. Legit.
Tank Out of the league after 2009. NOT legit
Studebaker played until 2014, probably legit player
Battle Legit.
Richardson played until 2013, probably a legit player
Ron Edwards Played until 2012, but played 0 snaps in 2011. Not sure he's all world.
McGraw played until 2011, barely snuck in there.
Boone Played until 2010, didn't make the 3 year window that you held DVs guys to.

Take out De Le Puenta, Barth, Tank, and Boone. that leaves Team Herm with 13 guys and Team DV with 20 dudes that played 3 years.

And DV was the one that sold out to win.
DV had 20 expensive dudes who barely made it 3 years. Most of them miraculously made it well past 35, which is the only reason your argument at all works. And the majority of those guys were garbage by the year 2008.

Herm brought in 10 or so guys who had excellent careers, costed nothing, and most of whom are still relevant almost 10 years later. And he barely spent any money (except for Carl's dumbass moves). Pioli was gifted one hell of a roster situation. Meaning given the situation Herm was put in, he left the team in a really good place. Don't blame him for Pioli ****ing it up.

Buehler445 12-13-2015 11:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 11952375)
DV had 20 expensive dudes who barely made it 3 years. Most of them miraculously made it well past 35, which is the only reason your argument at all works. And the majority of those guys were garbage by the year 2008.

Herm brought in 10 or so guys who had excellent careers, costed nothing, and most of whom are still relevant almost 10 years later. And he barely spent any money (except for Carl's dumbass moves). Pioli was gifted one hell of a roster situation. Meaning given the situation Herm was put in, he left the team in a really good place. Don't blame him for Pioli ****ing it up.
Dude. No. That 3 year deal was your thing. Not mine. Don't whine to me when it doesn't ****in work.

DV sold out to win. Herm was team building. If He was worth half a **** at it he'd have way more guys that played 3 years than DV did. If you have 3 years and come up with 17 guys that are worthy of a roster spot (your number not mine) then you are terrible at building a team. That's not even ****ing sustainable. It would take you 10 years to build a roster that was worth a ****. Most player careers aren't 10 years. And don't give me any bottom 20 bullshit. Several of the guys you listed are bottom 20 players. Herms success rate is a 10 year plan. That's horrid.

Like I said. He got a few decent dudes. Almost every team has a few decent guys on it. That doesn't mean e did this franchise any good. You could have picked any personnel man and he could have found you a few decent players. Probably would have been able to do so without making the franchise a joke.

Herm made the franchise a joke. Not Pioli. He didn't do ****all to fix it. But Herm made it a joke.

FloridaMan88 12-13-2015 11:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 11952375)
DV had 20 expensive dudes who barely made it 3 years. Most of them miraculously made it well past 35, which is the only reason your argument at all works. And the majority of those guys were garbage by the year 2008.

Herm brought in 10 or so guys who had excellent careers, costed nothing, and most of whom are still relevant almost 10 years later. And he barely spent any money (except for Carl's dumbass moves). Pioli was gifted one hell of a roster situation. Meaning given the situation Herm was put in, he left the team in a really good place. Don't blame him for Pioli ****ing it up.
Bullshit.

Thanks to Herm, the Chiefs QB situation was Broken Croyle and Thigpen. Far from "one hell of a roster situation" at the game's most important position.

Also the Glenn Dorsey bust at #5 overall goes on Herm's record as well.

chiefzilla1501 12-13-2015 11:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buehler445 (Post 11952374)
Hey man. The three year thing was your deal, not mine. I'm not saying it wasn't a cluster **** when DV left.

What you are missing is that Herms team was just as horrible. Give a guy 3 years that's 21 base picks. Especially if they're high ones like Herm got because he was ****ing horrible you should be able to pull a nucleus of decent talent. But 10 guys don't win. The 2 wins are evidence of that. If this team wasn't a total ****ing tire fire it would have won far more than 2 games. I bet you can go through about any team and find a few guys that you can build around. But it takes something better than awful at every position on the field and Herm wasn't able to get that done in 3 years. Dorsey did it in 1. He wrecked the cap to do it but he put Together some guys that can play.

Herm drafted a few stars. So did Pioli and nobody besides the local Pats trash is clamoring to his defense. Herm was a ****ing disaster. His team had less dudes that went on to play 3 years than DV did by your own count. And DV sold out to win. I'm not blinded by Herm hate anymore than you are blinded because you are enamored with a few stars he stumbled into despite being remarkably incompetent at every single aspect of his job as head coach. That is all despite the fact that crediting Herm with the acquisition of all those guys is beyond a stretch.
Herm inherited an old as shit roster in unbelievable cap hell, and left behind an immaculate cap situation and a core roster of 10 or so players who are still not just starting, but playing excellent even today.

Do you realize that Herm left Pioli with $57M in cap space in 2009? That is insane. And it's not a stretch to give Herm a lot of credit. It's widely known that he went over Peterson's head and demanded that he blow up the roster and push for a youth movement.

With 10-15 not just good, but mostly excellent players, $57M in cap space... there is no excuse for Pioli not to have built a kickass roster in 2009. I have never, ever, ever said Herm was a good coach. But JFC, to blame him for the piece of shit he was given and not acknowledge what a terrific situation the Chiefs were in by 2009.... some people will just hate for the sake of hating.

chiefzilla1501 12-13-2015 11:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by KCChiefsFan88 (Post 11952390)
Bullshit.

Thanks to Herm, the Chiefs QB situation was Broken Croyle and Thigpen. Far from "one hell of a roster situation" at the game's most important position.

Also the Glenn Dorsey bust at #5 overall goes on Herm's record as well.
That is unbelievably nitpicky to knock on the Dorsey pick. And he wasn't a bust.

The QB situation wasn't great. But he's the only damn person in Chiefs' history who had the guts to start a young QB even when Peterson was trying to shove Huard down his throat.

Bowser 12-13-2015 11:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 11952031)
Herm didn't drag this team down. The hate for the guy among Chiefs fans is seriously unreal. Romeo dragged a team down. Herm made the team better under his watch, even if he wasn't a great gameday coach.
What in the actual ****.

I distinctly remember Herm at his press conference saying he wasn't going to change the offense Vermeil and Saunders had implemented, "because why would I want to change an offense that scores 30 plus every game? HAHAHAHA!!", only to watch him ride Larry Johnson straight into the ground with a 400+ carry season in 2006. He absolutely drug this team down, even if Vermeil left the pantry empty when he left and Peterson was past giving a ****.

Herman Edwards was an AWFUL coach for the Chiefs. What he SHOULD HAVE done was take over for Peterson had Peterson left with Vermeil like it really should have gone down.

Buehler445 12-13-2015 11:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 11952394)
Herm inherited an old as shit roster in unbelievable cap hell, and left behind an immaculate cap situation and a core roster of 10 or so players who are still not just starting, but playing excellent even today.

Do you realize that Herm left Pioli with $57M in cap space in 2009? That is insane. And it's not a stretch to give Herm a lot of credit. It's widely known that he went over Peterson's head and demanded that he blow up the roster and push for a youth movement.

With 10-15 not just good, but mostly excellent players, $57M in cap space... there is no excuse for Pioli not to have built a kickass roster in 2009. I have never, ever, ever said Herm was a good coach. But JFC, to blame him for the piece of shit he was given and not acknowledge what a terrific situation the Chiefs were in by 2009.... some people will just hate for the sake of hating.
So you are going to say you acknowledge he is a shitacular coach, which WAS HIS ****ING JOB and also was the basis of my rant. Then you are going to say that he said **** winning and went out and got the bust guys he could and ended up with 10. In three ****ing years? And you're going to make the argument that it was a job well done? Are you ****ing kidding me with this shit?

Sure. I hate Herm. But you have done nothing here but reinforce it. Quite strongly.

JFC dude. Herm was horrible. At everything he ever did in KC. He was horrible at the Jets And now he's horrible at everything he is doing in Bristol.

**** Herm. Peterson could have went and got ANYBODY and thy could have done just as well. And probably could have coached a little too. Because you know. That's the ****ing Job.

Moreover, if you're going to tell me he made the call on all the personnel moves LOL. Just LOL.

Buehler445 12-14-2015 12:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 11952399)
What in the actual ****.

I distinctly remember Herm at his press conference saying he wasn't going to change the offense Vermeil and Saunders had implemented, "because why would I want to change an offense that scores 30 plus every game? HAHAHAHA!!", only to watch him ride Larry Johnson straight into the ground with a 400+ carry season in 2006. He absolutely drug this team down, even if Vermeil left the pantry empty when he left and Peterson was past giving a ****.

Herman Edwards was an AWFUL coach for the Chiefs. What he SHOULD HAVE done was take over for Peterson had Peterson left with Vermeil like it really should have gone down.
**** taking over for Peterson. If zilla is going to give Herm credit for every guy that could play, that's 17 guys in 3 years. That's 5 and a half players a year that deserve a spot. **** that shit. KC picked up a few talented players and fielded team of complete shit otherwise. No thank you. Get Herm the **** away from my team.

chiefzilla1501 12-14-2015 12:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowser (Post 11952399)
What in the actual ****.

I distinctly remember Herm at his press conference saying he wasn't going to change the offense Vermeil and Saunders had implemented, "because why would I want to change an offense that scores 30 plus every game? HAHAHAHA!!", only to watch him ride Larry Johnson straight into the ground with a 400+ carry season in 2006. He absolutely drug this team down, even if Vermeil left the pantry empty when he left and Peterson was past giving a ****.

Herman Edwards was an AWFUL coach for the Chiefs. What he SHOULD HAVE done was take over for Peterson had Peterson left with Vermeil like it really should have gone down.
Like I said, Herm was a terrible X's and O's and game day coach.

But that is different from discussing the moves he made personnel-wise. He was 100% right to push for the rebuild. And he did it effectively. For as much shit as people give him, he left the team in a very good place when he left.

Buehler445 12-14-2015 12:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 11952398)
That is unbelievably nitpicky to knock on the Dorsey pick. And he wasn't a bust.

The QB situation wasn't great. But he's the only damn person in Chiefs' history who had the guts to start a young QB even when Peterson was trying to shove Huard down his throat.
Dorsey was shit here. Then he went to the 9ers and was middling. That's basically Ryan Sims. The whole DL was a ****ing dumpster fire save for Herms first year when JA was still here.

For 5 overall that's a bust.

TimBone 12-14-2015 12:05 AM
I've never seen Buehler so passionate about something. I like it.

Buehler445 12-14-2015 12:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 11952411)
Like I said, Herm was a terrible X's and O's and game day coach.

But that is different from discussing the moves he made personnel-wise. He was 100% right to push for the rebuild. And he did it effectively. For as much shit as people give him, he left the team in a very good place when he left.
17 dudes that deserve a roster spot (your numbers) in three years at a whopping clip 5.6 players per year is not effective. And very likely at least some of those 17 dudes are in the personnel department. Not solely Herm.

He was right to cut some fat. But you don't have to win 2 mother****ing games to do it.

Herm was awful in every single aspect of his job.

Buehler445 12-14-2015 12:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimBone (Post 11952414)
I've never seen Buehler so passionate about something. I like it.
****ing Herm man. I had no idea that he had any ball washers left. It is truely incredible.

Bowser 12-14-2015 12:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 11952411)
Like I said, Herm was a terrible X's and O's and game day coach.

But that is different from discussing the moves he made personnel-wise. He was 100% right to push for the rebuild. And he did it effectively. For as much shit as people give him, he left the team in a very good place when he left.
Haha, no he didn't. He had an eye for talent, but he ****ing buried this team in futility. No free agents wanted to come play for him and his shit coaching philosophies, that was as much of a reason why Pissant Pioli had so much cap to use as Herm's "brilliant maneuvering" was.

Are you related to Herm or something? An old neighbor of his?

FloridaMan88 12-14-2015 12:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 (Post 11952398)
That is unbelievably nitpicky to knock on the Dorsey pick. And he wasn't a bust.
ROFLROFLROFLROFL

It is "unbelievably nitpicky" to knock the Glenn Dorsey pick, which was a Ryan Sims-level bust with the 5th overall pick in the draft?

And yes Dorsey was a bust.


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