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-   -   Chiefs *****The Willie Gay Jr. Thread***** (https://chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=330848)

Womble 03-19-2025 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by siberian khatru (Post 18003291)
Hey, you try dancing with a giant cock plopping out of your pants. Believe me, it's not easy.

What are doing trying to dance with some other dudes massive penis in your pants? Pretty gay that.

Chris Meck 03-19-2025 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Womble (Post 18003324)
What are doing trying to dance with some other dudes massive penis in your pants? Pretty gay that.

Shut up, you know you want it.

DJ's left nut 03-19-2025 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealSNR (Post 18002735)
You're the first person to ever even mention that Willie Gay was a transcendent player. Most people identified him as a super athletic guy who could make a really nifty play or two here or there. Our LBs lost their fastest guy when he left. And the team lost its best protection against vacuum cleaners.

Right.

At $8 million I don't think anyone's eager to grab him.

But at less than we tendered Jack ****ing Cochran for? Why the hell isn't he already here?

He's an NFL player and a top 5% athlete for his position. He's nothing resembling a perfect player, but he has a role.

Chris Meck 03-19-2025 02:36 PM

Willie Gay on the cheap is a totally great pickup.

kccrow 03-19-2025 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 18003016)
Wilson's been a better player than Gay, for sure.

Interestingly, I think the concern for most about Wilson was his ceiling - it just didn't seem terribly high. And ultimately hasn't it played out that way?

He improved through his first 3 years to become a really really good player in his 3rd year. But fell back quite a bit in 2023 and seemed to really struggle in coverage last year as well before he got hurt.

Gay was a ceiling over floor pick that didn't work out, but when you see how quickly Wilson plateaued in Cincy, you can at least see the rationale.

Maybe a new DC will get him back on the trend he was showing before he signed his deal.

Wilson's plateau is among the best coverage LBs in the NFL and a 120-to-130-tackle player, not a scrub backup that can't see the field after 5 years. Injuries derailed him last year but you're grossly understating how monumental that gap is between the two, and always has been the case.

Gay was a shit pick then, and I took my downvote lumps to make the point, and he remains a shit pick now.

Chris Meck 03-19-2025 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 18003494)
Wilson's plateau is among the best coverage LBs in the NFL and a 120-to-130-tackle player, not a scrub backup that can't see the field after 5 years. Injuries derailed him last year but you're grossly understating how monumental that gap is between the two, and always has been the case.

Gay was a shit pick then, and I took my downvote lumps to make the point, and he remains a shit pick now.

He's a knucklehead. But he's a FAST knucklehead that hits like a freight train, and on the cheap would be a great pickup. Where he was drafted and who else was available at the time is not relevant.

kccrow 03-19-2025 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Meck (Post 18003504)
He's a knucklehead. But he's a FAST knucklehead, and on the cheap would be a great pickup. Where he was drafted and who else was available at the time is not relevant.

The mental aspect is the main reason he didn't get re-signed. What makes you think that Spags would want him back? I mean, I get it if it's a special team signing primarily but that means he'd need to sign a VSB deal and I don't know that he will see himself as that.

I think he's signing with Miami anyhow so it will be moot.

DJ's left nut 03-19-2025 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 18003494)
Wilson's plateau is among the best coverage LBs in the NFL and a 120-to-130-tackle player, not a scrub backup that can't see the field after 5 years. Injuries derailed him last year but you're grossly understating how monumental that gap is between the two, and always has been the case.

Gay was a shit pick then, and I took my downvote lumps to make the point, and he remains a shit pick now.

He wasn't great in coverage in 2023 though.

Was it a plateau or just a career year?

I think that remains an open question.

kccrow 03-19-2025 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut (Post 18003516)
He wasn't great in coverage in 2023 though.

Was it a plateau or just a career year?

I think that remains an open question.

He was great in 2023. I went back and looked at stats just to make sure I wasn't thinking unclearly and he gave up 75% completion, had 9 PDs and 4 Ints to go with 135 tackles. That's about as good as it gets for a cover LB. He fell off this year in 2024, largely due to being dinged up.

Hell, Wilson's 2022 and 2023 encompasses all of what Gay has accomplished in 5 years and then some.

Even if you want to argue that that is his plateau, it exceeds Gay's production by two-fold. It's really not an argument.

DJ's left nut 03-19-2025 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kccrow (Post 18003526)
He was great in 2023. I went back and looked at stats just to make sure I wasn't thinking unclearly and he gave up 75% completion, had 9 PDs and 4 Ints to go with 135 tackles. That's about as good as it gets for a cover LB. He fell off this year in 2024, largely due to being dinged up.

Hell, Wilson's 2022 and 2023 encompasses all of what Gay has accomplished in 5 years and then some.

Wouldn't a 75% completion rate with that many tackles (and PDs/INTs) indicate he was being targeted?

I'm seeing 62 receptions on 77 targets (80%) for 11.2 yards/rec and 4 TDs given up for a passer rating against over 100 in 2023.

Pretty similar numbers in 2022 w/ 66 receptions on 82 targets for 9.5 yards/reception and a 101.7 passer rating against (largely because he had fewer interceptions).

Meanwhile Bolton gave up 52 receptions on 67 targets this year (8.9/reception at 77% completion), 2 TDs and an INT for a passer rating against at 99.2. Really similar figures and we MURDER him for being bad in coverage.

For his career Wilson has given up an 80.9% catch rate (237 receptions on 293 targets) at 10 yards/reception (2,364 on 237 catches) and a total passer rating against at 95.7.

That's...okay. Bolton gets excoriated for years like that, though.

And I suspect different sources all have slightly different data given that it's really hard to know what a LB is ultimately responsible for an if it was 'his' catch surrendered. But when you see a Will 'backer with that many tackles, I don't typically think of that as a great sign and some of the numbers under the hood would support that.

Wisconsin_Chief 03-19-2025 03:22 PM

He’s a Dolphin now.

He can walk off the face of the universe, and most importantly, I never wanted him back at all.

DJ's left nut 03-19-2025 03:26 PM

Warner, by contrast, in his best years has a rec% in the high 60s to mid 70s. Passer ratings in the low to mid 80s.

To my eyes his best year in coverage was 2020 -- 44 receptions on 61 targets, 7.5 yards/reception and a passer rating against of 81.9. Warner's who I think of when I think of a premium coverage 'backer and seasons like that are why. Wilson...man, I just can't get there. He's fine but not at that level.

DJ's left nut 03-19-2025 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wisconsin_Chief (Post 18003538)
He’s a Dolphin now.

He can walk off the face of the universe, and most importantly, I never wanted him back at all.

He ****ing sucks!

Doesn't Miami use mostly odd fronts? Interesting -- I wonder if that'll help him.

PHOG 03-19-2025 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wisconsin_Chief (Post 18003538)
He’s a Dolphin now.

He can walk off the face of the universe, and most importantly, I never wanted him back at all.

I never liked that vacuum throwing POS!!!

kccrow 03-19-2025 03:47 PM

We both know that comparing Wilson in coverage to Bolton in coverage is foolish DJ. Completely different responsibilities, especially man assignments on TEs and slots, at different positions.


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