I'll be surprised if your perspective doesn't change with time. You're not jumping through hoops. You're being given an opportunity to improve yourself: knowledge, critical thinking, etc.

Essentially, it's like you're going to the gym, surrounding yourself with weights and people lifting, yet you're doing nothing, save bitching about not getting stronger.

Giving up 20 points to the Lions without Polamalu and letting the Bengals drive the field and score a game winning TD, I bet they're thrilled he's missing time...oh and giving up 28 to San Diego.

Of course.

But I can't stand the bullshit lines about being unable to compare players "because the situations are different."

Well, no ****ing shit. Guess what? Try a bit more nuanced analysis.

i'm sure theyre not thrilled, and the points allowed avg HAS actually gone up a little this year.still facts are facts

well for once I totally ****ing agree...

a bachelors is just todays high school diploma...even the dumbest ****s try and get one...

I did a year of community college and JFC, not only have they dumbed down the classes to "if you know the alphabet and show up you'll pass this class with a B" but some of the dumbest ****ing people I've ever met were in this class...

a 40 year old crack whore...was in an into to business class...of course the teacher partners everyone up randomly...I draw her...she can barely even read...really motivated me going to class trying to explain to her every single aspect of the class...

Oh man. I hate it...it is a waste of my time...everything I need to know is on google, anyways.

I've seen 94 in college. Exponentially different from facing 88-92. It's unreal.

Can't even imagine what 97-98 would look like because it's an exponential difference.

You can watch this simple highlight package and see Palmer playing under some pressure.

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Mecca...I would probably take 15 QB's over Palmer...he was a former #1 pick...you don't expect more?

What has Carson Palmer ever done to this point of his career? Isn't he a less established, less talented version of Tony Romo? Undrafted Tony Romo?

For the record...I'd take Tony Romo any day over Carson Palmer...and I'd take Tony Romo over Matt Cassel...

And that's why people laugh at you.

I've wasted my whole ****ing day on this website...I got off work to finish all of my freaking assignments so I didn't have to worry about them before the games on Sunday...now I'm going to be up until 5 AM doing homework rather than playing Halo.

So...you'd take Palmer over Romo?

Yes I would, Romo pisses on himself in any kind of adverse situation.

I think I'd probably take Cassel over Romo, actually.

Agree on McCoy. Not impressed.

highlights, lets see his lowlights. do they make cute youtube vids of those? palmer only had what 2 top flight seasons. he might bounce back this year but there's a ton of football to be played, even mm said that palmer hasnt looked the same since the knee injury. that was BEFORE the season though

every day, palmer too and i'm not a palmer fan.

I think he's actually looking like he's finally fully back from the knee.

He moves around better and looks much more confident.

Palmer is still the type of guy you build a team around, the Bengals have also finally put a solid defense on the field.

Well he sure fooled me, with his intent anyway, if that was it. It seemed like a sincere peace offering, on his part.

lol.

Everyone references that Denver game from this year when he threw the ball to Austin twice and Champ made two great plays to prevent a tying TD...but no one references the 4th and 6 (or whatever) where he totally had to improvise and he made an unbelievable play to Austin for 60 yards to keep the game alive...

Two years ago when they lost in the playoffs to the Giants...Crayton dropped a sure-fire, 70 yard TD pass that would have been the dagger and the Cowboys would have beaten the Giants...in that game...the only guy that showed up to play for Dallas was Romo...

People think he's a choker because he fumbled a snap for a FG in the playoffs...he was doing something he shouldn't have even been asked to do...

I bet Romo wins a Super Bowl in the next 5 years or so...I bet by the time it's all said and done...Romo is 36 or 37 and wrapping up his career...there will be questions on whether or not he had a hall of fame career.

He threw the ball to Sam Hurd, it wasn't even Austin.

he is looking that way BUT like i said there's a ton of football left to be played and he has been injured other than the knee recently.

Peyton Manning
GAP
GAP
GAP
Tom Brady
Drew Brees
Donovan McNabb
Ben Roethlisberger
Eli Manning

Those guys have to be the top tier of QB's...

that's not even the point...the point is...he made that play happen...only one or two guys in the NFL can make that play...he's one of them...his pocket awareness is very, very, very good.

Romo won't win a Super Bowl.

he was talking about the BAD plays

i'll agree with you here, i'm not a fan of him

Romo has great pocket awareness, plus arm, good mobility...he makes poor decisions at times but Brett Favre has done that his whole career. Romo is a smart guy, too...he UNFAIRLY gets ragged on...Tony Romo is better than Carson Palmer...hands down. Not sure why people make excuses for Palmer...he's had two good years...he's a #1 pick...his teams have never done ANYTHING. Romo is the more established player...has had less career starts...and wasn't even drafted.

Brees is fantastic in that offense, but if we're simply rating QBs, I'm putting Roethlisberger after Brady.

Palmer won't win a Super Bowl.

(and that's actually a definite...whereas Romo, on the Cowboys, can EASILY win a Super Bowl in the future...)

The point is....

Bailey > Leggett and it's not even close.

And Romo is the Schottenheimer of QB's. Play well during regular season, but when playoffs come around, he'll shit his pants.

The Romo as potential HOFer line is going to be referenced about 1000 times in the not-too-distant future.

referenced by him fumbling a FG snap...he's the starting GD QB...why is he on the field at that point, anyways?

Against the Giants the year they won the Super Bowl...he played them MUCH BETTER than Tom Brady did in the Super Bowl (the year Brady threw 50 TDs)...and was the only Cowboy that even showed up that game...Crayton dropped the dagger that would have put it at 28-17 in the 4th quarter...Romo made one of his great improvisational plays...hit Crayton in stride with nothing but green grass in front of him...and Crayton dropped it...the dagger...the Cowboys would have played the Pats rather than the Giants if Crayton makes that catch.

But somehow that is Romo's fault?

I wish we could all have a planet gathering and watch that game so you all could explain to me why Romo shits his pants when it counts.

What a myth that is.

I remember when people said that about Peyton Manning.

ok...that's fine.

Romo is a terrific QB...he is much better than Carson Palmer. He will continue to prove how great he is over the years...when it's all said and done...he'll have HOF consideration...especially if he wins a Super Bowl...and we know Jerry Jones will always do whatever he can to give him the weapons he needs to do so.

How Romo gets such a bad wrap is beyond me. He had a bad game against the Giants this year and the friggin' wheels fell off some how.

History says that Romo won't win one. Palmer has a better chance at winning one than Romo does.

why because he was a #1?

Whether it's entirely accurate or not, the perception that Romo is soft has become reality. This is why you get crowds with Jessica ****ing Simpson masks because the fans think this type of stupid shit can actually rattle him.

Romo was a solid FF QB last year, and that's about it.

I do agree, however, that he's in a great situation with an owner who will do anything to win. The problem, however, is that it works both ways. If Romo doesn't elevate his game, Jones won't hesitate to replace his ass.

I'd bet on the latter.

Bears fans are puking at what Benson is doing, especially with Forte not getting off to a fast start this season.

I always felt they gave up on him a little quickly.

Forte isn't being used appropriately.

So much of his productivity last year was from short passes and such; he's not getting that this year.

Unintended consequence of the Cutler acquisition.

Obviously you have forgotten the botched snap against the Seahawks in the 2007 playoffs.

Obviously you have also forgotten the intercepted pass that he threw against the Giants in the 2008 playoffs. IIRC, that also the incident where he spent a "vacation" with Jessica Simpson before the Giants game.

That ended well, didn't it?

That INT was on a 4th and long with like 6 seconds to go...a desperation heave into the end zone ROFLROFLROFLROFLROFL

I already referenced both of these "choke jobs"...and wonder how either is considered a choke job, considering Romo was the only Cowboys player who played well against the Giants that year.

If Romo choked against the Giants that year...Brady had the biggest choke job of all time in that Super Bowl. All time.

What's funny is Tony Romo plays on a team with alot more talent than Palmer does...in the clutch Palmer has delivered while Romo hasn't.

The Cowboys were a superbowl favorite last year and choked, they lost to the Giants this year because of Tony Romo.

Mainly bc he was a first round pick. Only one UDFA has one a Super Bowl and that is Kurt Warner. You just have to play the odds - Brady, Montana are rarity's not the rule.

Actually, in that Giants game, Romo was victimized by a huge drop on a crossing pattern by Crayton (I think) that may have resulted in a TD. The game is a littel sketchy in my memory though.

And ya know those opportunities to win it all don't come around very often. Romo has had two very good chances, but fate has intervened. It's entirely possible that the window of fate for him has been shut.

My point being is, as I said in my earlier post, Romo is the Schottenheimer of QB's in the NFL. Even if Romo had a good game, there'll be a way that will vicitimize him, such as a dropped pass, or a muffed snap, etc.

Just like Schottenheimer. The Drive. The Fumble. The kicker who shall not be named.

Successful in the regular season, but come around playoff time... :shake:

That makes sense, I will have to watch the next game with that perspective in mind.

Romo usually starts fading before the playoffs, usually as soon as late November and December roll around that's it.

ummm palmer had two of the BEST WRs in the game at his disposal for his whole career until this season. thats a fact.

i know that, as of right now they are on equal footing IMO, both are starting QBs in the nfl. it's a team game no one player can will a team there

And a horrendous defense and a RB that wouldn't even be 3rd on the Dallas depth chart...

Their defense is improved now but they still don't have a RB comparable to Dallas, Benson wouldn't make that roster. Chad is better than all of the Dallas WR's but Witten is far better than any TE there...plus Dallas has a much better line.

If you were just going team for team Dallas has more talent, they're just a team that doesn't play like it....

this makes my point about this being a TEAM game. and i only talked about palmer's WRs and during his career he's had two of the best in the NFL in ocho and housh. what does the defense have to do with palmer delivering in the clutch?

Hootie, what you call "exceptional people skills" is routinely called "bullshit artist". I hope you know or learn the difference.

yep you can either dazzle with brillance or baffle them with bullshit

Most folks with any experience can smell the baffle a long way off.

ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL

Tony Romo is the one of the worst starting QBs in the NFL. If Dallas had a competent QB last week, they would have put up another 10-14 points. Dude is flat out taint.

I think Palmer is playing with more confidence now than he has at any time since he came back from the knee.

He's still not quite at the top of his game yet, but there's no way in hell I'd take Romo before Palmer.

This thread is still going on? Can't we just all get along?

I doubt he'll win a playoff game.

He's the anti-Montana/Elway/Marino.

He finds ways to LOSE important games...

Romo's play throughout his career as declined substantially in the months of November and December, and that is the only consistency in his game.

If he can ever paly consistently smart football, along with the ability to make big plays, and overcome his propensity to fall off in the last two months of the season, then there's a chance he might win a SB.

Only the fantasy football base would promote Romo as a top 10 QB...

If I'm breaking the starting QBs down, I'm probably doing it like this:

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P. Manning
Brady
Roethlisberger
<o:p> </o:p>
Second Tier (Clear Franchise QB)<o:p></o:p>
Rodgers
Brees
Ryan
Rivers
Flacco
Ryan
Warner
E. Manning
McNabb
<o:p> </o:p>
Enigma (Possible Franchise QB)

Cutler

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Game Managers (Not yet a Franchise QB, highly unlikely to be one)

Hill
Collins
Garrard
Schaub
Favre
Hasselbeck
Romo
<st1:place w:st="on">Cassel</st1:place>
Orton


Too Soon:<o:p></o:p>
<st1:place w:st="on">Stafford</st1:place>
Johnson
Henne
Sanchez
<o:p> </o:p>
Ass: (Won't be a starter in 2-3 years, possibly out of the league)

Edwards
<st1:city w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Anderson</st1:place></st1:city>
Russell
Bulger
Delhomme
<st1:city w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Campbell</st1:place></st1:city>

I won't get into a long argument with you about this (mostly because I really don't give a $#it how you look at it) but to me unless you've accomplished some "feat" you don't get considered in with the best.

A playoff comeback, SB where you played well, multiple game winning drives in a season, etc.

Right now the NFL is just flooded with average/poor QB play...

I don't necessarily disagree, but that's why I put the "best" as Manning, Roeth, and Brady.

I look at Manning just like Marino.

I think they're both dicks. I think most the players on their teams hated them. I think their attitudes held them back.

Guys WANT to win for players like Montana, Brady, etc...

Did you include Marino in there with Montana and Elway? What were all the important games Marino won after his second year?
Posted via Mobile Device

IF that is the Case, True Fans will be begging for him over a 1st round stud in about 6 years...

I've been watching this thread on and off all day. I marvel at the fact some of you get so worked up over what will or will not happen. I learned more than 40 years ago that there is just no predicting success in football. You just have to wait to see what happens. That is what makes it interesting. In the mid 60's KU had a pretty fair RB named Junior Riggins. He wasn't great but was good for us. When his younger brother John showed up we were ecstatic. And rightly so as he was quite a bit better than Junior as we all now know. Then, along came the youngest Riggins, Billy, who had broken all of John and Junior's high school rushing records. We all expected great things of Billy but he fell flat on his ass at KU. Never to be heard of again. But you guys go right on predicting and calling each other names as it is quite entertaining.

Anyone, who's been dogging Palmer...have very short memories, he & Cinco with a decent run game elevate that place.

Palmers's a stud. period.

While Palmer has all the tools of a franchise QB, he has only made the playoffs once in 5 yrs as a starter. Minus last yr and this. Not exactly a resume for a franchise guy. Though he is playing at his pre-injury level.

Thanks for the information on the other two Riggins Skip.

I don't think I ever paid any attention to KU football, until they allowed us to listen to the 68/69 Orange bowl in bootcamp, on a radio, as a special Holiday treat.

You are right about the entertainment part. I have heard a story, years ago, about a mean ****er tying two cat's tails together, then throwing them over the clothes line.

I think that might be what Phil did with this thread. **edit** unintentionally, of course

Phil is a good guy and a long time poster. I don't think he intended to start this shit storm. I was in Korea for that Orange Bowl we lost on that infamous 12th man play. I think that was John's sophomore season. On another note, in John's 4 years at KU, he was never thrown for a loss. I have other stories about Riggo but I'll wait for another time.

Yeah, I agree, that part of my post was tongue in cheek, see my earlier posts on that very subject.

Well once Hooties gay ass showed up, it went to shit in a hurry.

No I didn't.

Why when I click on this thread does it want to run an add-on?

PhilFree:arrow:

Would you two old farts just shut the hell up.

You're ruining a perfectly good bitchfest.

Hell no I won't you @#$%^&. You're a ^&*(). Refute that!!!

I think it is past my bed time anyway, darn it, I already missed the news waiting for the next swing.

LMAO LMAO LMAO

**** you bundle of stickss...

I WIN

he is nothing more than average, at best