Well, I think Metchie ends up a Chief, so there's that.

:D

I am pretty.

But I'm getting kind of old.

Distinguished-like.

I like Shakir. I like Metchie better.

And you still said you'd only seen two WR's get way better at route running after being drafted into the NFL.

:)

Now I have to figure out what teams will ruin your pick.

;)

Back on track here with Watson, here is an example of why I think some of his route running issues can be rectified early with some simple coaching:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/GhGTJBg_XIQ?start=146" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Video should start at 2:26. Watson is running a go route, DB is about 6 yards off with about 1/2 yard outside shade when the rep starts. Obviously a go-route isn't the most technical of routes, what Watson does initially is stem the route outside to take away the outside leverage of the DB. After the first 3-4 yards, Watson then should take a more vertical path, to close the cushion that the DB has and at the last second take an outside path around the DB and use his speed to get open. If Watson goes vertical after his initial outside stem, then the DB has to defend against a go route or potentially a post route, it should give Watson then ability to make his move at the top of his route. Ideally if you run past the DB then you can "stack" him to give the QB even more room to put the ball.

What Watson does wrong is that he fades away way too much on this go route and eliminates all of the space to the sideline which doesn't give the QB any area to throw the ball, even if the ball is thrown perfectly, Watson has zero room to get his feet down.

Real simple and although some may look at the negative as to why he is making this mistake, this shows me that this player has a ton of room to grow.

It shows me a guy who can't even run a go route.

Really? The guy who has a 3-route tree can't even run the one he excels at correctly? One that most of us knew how to run in High School?

(But seriously - good post; this kid is just soooooo raaaaw. This isn't a kid that's going to be ready by November. Of 2023 even. This is a kid who MIGHT be a contributor in year 3 if everything goes well)

LMAO

So about this...


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Christian Watson had another drop against air in drills today. His hands have definitely been questionable. I don’t think there’s been a practice yet where he hasn’t dropped at least one pass. Does it matter much? Prob not - but noteworthy at least.</p>&mdash; Andy Herman (@AndyHermanNFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/AndyHermanNFL/status/1531688624059781120?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">May 31, 2022</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

By the way - we have Christian Watson. Don't even need a different jersey.

Tell me the difference in Christian Watson and Justin Watson.

Justin is 6'3'', runs a 4.42, similar 3-cone and shuttle times. And unlike Christian, he was extremely productive in his FCS program with 3 straight 1,000 yard seasons. He's also demonstrated excellent hands.

For the next 2 years at least, there's an excellent chance that Justin Watson is a better football player than Christian Watson.

Dude is just an underwear warrior, man. Still can't believe folks were mocking this kid to us in the 1st round.

I still can't believe he went as high as he did. Nothing suggests to me that he's going to be a good WR other than his athleticism. Maybe they'll get a gem, but I've seen far too many flame out with all the athletic gifts in the world to be a believer yet.

I kinda feel like the Packers blinked.

This is the same organization that traded up for Jordan Love. It just seems like they get a little panicky, lose trust in their board and then go wild reaching on guys they think they 'need'.

It's what Veach did w/ Speaks but he definitely appears to have righted the ship there.

What’s weird to me is that Christian Watson looks to me like…a more raw MVS. That’s weird to me bc it feels like they just replaced MVS with that pick.

If you think about it they are quite similar but MVS developed over time and seemed to correct his drop problem.

Maybe they are looking for that from this kid? Who knows. We all laughed at DK Metcalf bc he couldn’t run routes and his 3 cone was terrible.

rodgers is good at turning chicken salad into...nevermind

Reports from Packer's sources say their 7th round WR looks better and more NFL ready.

The thing with Watson that cooled me on him as a prospect for the Chiefs is how easily he gets shut down if you are physical with him at the line. He has a hard time getting free from a jam.

When teams realize this they're going to do it all game.

First play on offense and he blows this perfect opportunity. Pretty much incapsulates what we thought of him.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Oh no, Christian Watson... 🤦*♂️<a href="https://t.co/jk4dWxUfVI">pic.twitter.com/jk4dWxUfVI</a></p>&mdash; Action Network (@ActionNetworkHQ) <a href="https://twitter.com/ActionNetworkHQ/status/1569064651563876353?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 11, 2022</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


Lot of folks didn’t like this kid bc they thought he was an elite athlete and not a football player. Turns out they were right (so far).

The drop was so bad. His hands were too far apart and they were flat. It wasn't even close. And after burning PP.

All the talent in the world but if you can't catch... yeesh.

Skyy, OTOH, looked nasty on his reception.

Oof. How do you alligator arm a catch that's right in your breadbasket?

Yeah - nothing about this kid said he should've gone that high. "GENERATIONAL ATHLETE!!!!"

Just a laughable draft crush.

I couldn't get off the bandwagon fast enough when I saw his drop rate. That was clearly going to be an issue.

It's one of those 'god bless the broken road' moments....

Watson might have been appealing to Veach in his first or 2nd year as a GM. But he's learned from past mistakes and gave the kid a wide berth.

You can't bite on fools gold like that. There are just too many ways for it to go wrong.

Much better go route though- kid has all the tools in the world. Be interesting to see if he can figure it out or if he flounders his opportunity.

There was a bubble screen late that Watson wasn't ready for, almost caused an INT. Game seems way too fast for Watson right now.

No, he really doesn't.

No more so than Usain Bolt does.

He's just tall and fast in a straight line. That's like - 2 of the tools in the world. Squint and you can get to 3. I believe there are a few more than that necessary to be an effective receiver.

He can't get off a jam, he doesn't have an NFL route tree and most critically, he can't catch the ball. Methinks he doesn't have all the tools. And in fact, he's missing most of the critical ones.

Kid's not gonna see a second contract in this league.

Comparing the go route which I posted from the North/South tryouts to this go route on play 1 though, it does seem like he's been coached up. Attacks the CB's inside shoulder the first 7-8 yards and when the CB makes his pivot step to the inside, he immediately attacks the CB's outside shoulder. Watson on this play is insanely wide open- 4 yards of separation.

Route running can definitely improve with good coaching and reps, he'll get that at the NFL level. Getting off of a jam can improve with good coaching, and being 6'4 with a long wingspan helps. He isn't going to see press coverage all the time, good scheme and coaching can try to limit those opportunities.

Watson's catching ability is definitely cause for concern, but I'm not ready to write him off yet. Speed kills, obviously plenty of big fast guys have failed in the past but Green Bay knew Watson was a low floor/high ceiling guy when they drafted him. I don't think it's reasonable to think he was going to step in and be a major contributor. Missed a lot of training camp time also, I would start to worry if by the tail end of the season he hasn't taken a step forward.

I think the situation in Green Bay exacerbates Watson's development, the Packers need someone from their WR's to step up majorly. Watson's ideal landing spot would have been a WR room where he can marinate for awhile.

No wonder Aaron looked like he wanted to murder everyone. That’s just gross

Yeah, that was the perfect ball. Under no pressure. Mind boggling.

Rogers is such a classy guy too, I'm hoping Watson drops everything thrown his way just to drive that arrogant prick crazy.

I like this guy a lot better when he was a fourth rounder, months before the Senior Bowl and the draft.

Even as questionable as his hands have been to this point, he’s still going to have enough instances where he gets open deep due to his size and speed that he’ll get more easy opportunities like that.

In all actuality he’s a perfect replacement for what MVS was for them and even with his reputation of having bad hands, still performed enough to be a legitimate decoy for GB and a deep option for Rodgers. I think that’s really all they’re expecting from him at this point. Doubs is likely the closest thing to an eventual WR1 they have on the roster.

You're hoping he turns into MVS.

I would rather just take good football players.

Watson will never be better than Shakir who went in the 5th round.

They're fortunate they took a real football player in Romeo Doubs 3 rounds later or they'd really be up shits creek.

Who had the worse rookie debut, Christian Watson or Nathaniel Hackett?

My friend in Wisconsin who is a Packers fan almost had a stroke when they drafted Christian Watson.


;)

Would have taken him in the 3rd without hesitation. Thanks to the Packers for taking the option off the table.

Watson maybe starting to figure it out? Flashed today for sure.

Rodgers gotta throw to someone, right? Best of luck to him and Watson.

I think there is a very compelling case to be made for NOT SKIPPING CAMP.

Especially with n00b receivers.

Very, very small sample size, but in watching the highlights during the Sportscenter w/ SVP last night, it looked like the defense wasn't being very physical with him. In those clips he wasn't being pressed at the LoS and he was running free from the snap.

Conversely, in the clips Kurt Warner showed in his QB school a couple weeks ago, all the GB receivers were being pressed and physically pushed around throughout their routes, in those clips.

Again, super small sample size, and I don't know if the DBs just weren't being physical last night in those few plays, but the difference was immediately apparent. Kurt will probably do another analysis of Aaron Rodgers this week so it will be interesting to see what really transpired.

Counterpoint- I mentioned earlier in this thread that although Watson's ability to beat press coverage isn't great, that there are ways to scheme around that.

28-14, 4th and 7. Green Bay needs to convert, and this play happens:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Christian Watson needed this game SO badly.<br><br>So happy to see him play the way we&#39;ve been expecting all season.<a href="https://t.co/DNXK9sXXrI">pic.twitter.com/DNXK9sXXrI</a></p>&mdash; Eli Berkovits (@BookOfEli_NFL) <a href="https://twitter.com/BookOfEli_NFL/status/1591944969329446914?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 14, 2022</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

You'll notice Dallas does press the top WR in the bunch formation but since Green Bay is in bunch, Dallas can't press Watson which gives him a free release. The rest is history as he torches the DB in coverage and out runs the safety who is in single high coverage. If you don't believe me, take a look at what Brett Kollmann said:

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">They dialed up a middle read concept on 4th and 7 with him as the primary and he housed it.<br><br>Rodgers trusted HIM to run it. Not Lazard, not Tonyan, not Watkins, not Toure.<br><br>He needed a play and said &quot;go call me something for the 6&#39;4 dude that runs like a deer&quot;. And they did.</p>&mdash; Brett Kollmann (@BrettKollmann) <a href="https://twitter.com/BrettKollmann/status/1592021956253331456?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 14, 2022</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

It will be interesting to see if this big game can have a domino effect on his season. Confidence can absolutely make or break you, excited to see what he does rest of season.

A little confidence can be a huge difference maker, for certain.

We'll have to see. He's still a guy I'd continue to press the **** out of on the line and keep safety help over the top if he breaks it. He's only made plays when he's got a relatively free release. He's also dropped more than his share in similar situations. He has an enormous physical skill set if he does ever put it together.

5 TD’s in 4 days. He’s gonna be a good one

Remains to be seen.

Probably so. But there is a lot of tape to be booked on the kid. He adapts, learns, works on his weaknesses, he'll be good. But he could burn get figured out.

What the **** else do they have at this point?

He demonstrated really good ball skills a couple times the last two games. It's that ' manufacturing yards' thing I was talking about elsewhere.

Any ol' swinging dick can catch a pass on the numbers in wide open space. Watson did a nice job adjusting to iffy passes or pulling in contested catches.

Sometimes you just get guys wrong. That’s what makes the draft so intriguing. I didn’t like this kid very much either but he’s blossoming into a true #1 WR.

Remember Davante Adams wasn’t that good either when he was a rookie. He had drop problems but developed into an elite #1 WR.

This good looks to be on a similar projection.

He's been impressive, but pump the breaks a little dude.

He has however shown he has that kind of upside though.

I liked him in the second round.

Haters gonna hate. I’m rooting for watson. I can’t stand rodgers though. I respect rodgers ability but as a person, he’s a turd. What I liked about watson is that he’s a solid young man and he’s a crazy athlete, not just straight line speed. The kid has special talent. And he seems to be different than a lot of young people today with his commitment and stability. He could have been a great long term investment for us but I think it worked out well for us to not draft him with us getting toney for cheap. I may regret those words if toney makes some bad choices off the field down the road. I don’t see watson as having that same off the field risk.

I'll be honest, I thought he was going to get pressed out of existence and continue to drop balls. I haven't seen how teams have played him but he looks better than I expected. Didn't hate him at all as a 2nd but absolutely not as a 1st. Might be another one I got wrong

I loved the measurables. And his college film showed that he was a football player, not just a track star.

But agreed that there was quite a learning curve for the kid, I just thought that his physical attributes were elite.

I know I sound like my parents but it’s not just the physical skills, it’s their emotional intelligence. Look at our draft picks, veach is trying to get guys like mcduffie, karlaftis, sky Moore, chenal and etc and they all look to be guys that you can trust off the field, high motor, high character guys. We invest minimally in guys like toney with a late third because physically, he’s all you want but he’s a high risk, head case. Watson was rare to me bc his athletic gifts are off the charts and he seems to be a good kid. As fans, I think we pass over the maturity question too quickly when evaluating these players. Thank goodness veach doesn’t. I’m also glad he’s willing to take a risk on players like toney when the reward is worth the risk.

To be fair, we really don't get a lot of the maturity and injury information the teams get. Makes for some wild swings sometimes on guys.

This kid is starting to win more than his fair share of 50/50 balls. Really impressive last half of his season.

George came on the second half of the year with some big sacks... I like George and think Skyy will be fine next year.

Watson has nothing to do with the Chiefs, I've only been speaking about his potential/development as a player. I just thought Watson was one of the more interesting players in the draft due to his high boom/bust nature. Additionally one half of a season doesn't mean much, we'll see if he continues to grow next season.

I'm good with what happened. We'd miss out on either McDuffie or Karlaftis and both of those guys look to be more important than a WR. Hell if he were here he'd be playing as little as Skyy Moore and we'd be wondering if we took the right guy.

Yup.

I agree considering the info we had at the time but a redraft is different. Would you be happier with George and skyy or watson and Sam Williams? We had a great draft. No complaints. Just interesting to think of what might have been.

Not a perfect comparison but I see Watson as a giant Hardman.

I am much happier with Karlaftis.

I would take George over all of those other guys. I'm not sure if we should have drafted a different WR, because Moore didn't really get a chance to play. Andy doesn't play rookie WR unless he has absolutely no other options. Watson played 507 snaps which is 56% of the Packers total offensive plays. I guarantee that Watson gets the Moore treatment if he's in KC and people would be questioning if we took the right WR. Next year will be very telling if we made a good choice with Moore.

Now what would have been really cool though is if we went McDuffie, Karlaftis, Sam Williams. George on one side, Sam on the other, and Chris Jones in the middle. Next year we could be talking about one of the best D lines in football.

I’m down on Moore, as I’ve made it known multiple times, but for arguments sake let’s say it is just a matter of opportunity and he will take a step next year. My concern is, what’s his potential? I maybe completely off on this, but I’m not sure I see a #1 caliber WR there. He seems like a slot or maybe a #2 type, but I don’t see someone who’s going to dominate games at WR. If not, is Toney that guy? I have more confidence in Toney being the go to guy at WR with his elite measurables.

I’m not a fan of signing OBJ to an extension, but if they do I hope they zero in on BPA at DE and WR at the top of the draft. A 6’2”, 210 athletic specimen at WR would be nice if one were available.

I comped him to Julian Edelman before the draft, and I stand by that. He will be a reliable slot target for making the tough catches over the middle and compiling YAC. Sure hands, the free slot releases, and timing routes will be his bread and butter. Of course a reciever coming from a small school will have a learning curve in Andy's offense and route tree, especially in that role. I expect him to be measurably more involved in year two and we will be able to assess who he will be after year three.

I saw a player comp for Skyy Moore and the player that he was compared to was Golden Tate. That's a good #2 and would be more than enough for Mahomes. I'd definitely go with a speed receiver in the first 3 rounds.

If he can be Golden Tate after he joined the Lions, then honestly no one should complain.

Serious? I'd take that. I hated Golden Tate for awhile, because he was so good at making grabs in tough spots, against teams I liked. Pretty sure he made a couple in that game in SEA vs. KC in 2019 or 2018, I think.

If Skyy becomes GT, well, that'd be pretty respectable company.

I think the player comp had to do with size and speed

GT - 5'10"/195ish lbs/4.42 40
Skyy Moore - 5'10"/195ish lbs/4.41 40 time