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wutamess 07-11-2008 10:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vailpass (Post 4841264)
Is it true? I just found it funny. Chris Rock cracks me up big time.
You mean where he says... that's Not Ted Koppel robbing me at my ATM... That's a N?

Yes that's true. I hate it when our people try to play victim when we're the one's raising hell. Just as they'd done with the Bill Cosby speeches, etc.

I hold US accountable to GROW UP and face reality. The media isn't building it's case against us... it's US.

NewChief 07-11-2008 10:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutamess (Post 4841276)
You mean where he says... that's Not Ted Koppel robbing me at my ATM... That's a N?

Yes that's true. I hate it when our people try to play victim when we're the one's raising hell. Just as they'd done with the Bill Cosby speeches, etc.

I hold US accountable to GROW UP and face reality. The media isn't building it's case against us... it's US.
I think he's talking about the part where a therapist should come on the ATM at 3am whenever you try to withdraw money, because nothing good is going to come of it. Then he goes into the bit about how the ATM won't even talk to you unless you have $20 in the bank and talks about the walk of shame up to the teller to withdraw 8 bucks and change from your account and the teller just pulling it out of her pocket and handing it to you.

And hell, there's no race involved in that. When I was a poor, stupid white college student, I lived that scenario repeatedly.

wutamess 07-11-2008 10:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by markk (Post 4841272)
I think that when the black kid came in looking for a job for the summer or part time, he felt like he had to impress or he wasn't going to get it.
Hence...

"We have to work double hard."
"Whites (in general) are born with silver spoons".

Thanks for your example. It's valid for all levels of emplyoment.

wutamess 07-11-2008 10:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewPhin (Post 4841281)
I think he's talking about the part where a therapist should come on the ATM at 3am whenever you try to withdraw money, because nothing good is going to come of it. Then he goes into the bit about how the ATM won't even talk to you unless you have $20 in the bank and talks about the walk of shame up to the teller to withdraw 8 bucks and change from your account and the teller just pulling it out of her pocket and handing it to you.
Oh... vaguely remember that one.
I just remember his political points.
Will have to revisit.

Silock 07-11-2008 10:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vailpass (Post 4841257)
Where do you get your data? Sounds like speculation to me.
www.bls.gov

It's funny -- the gov't actually overhires minorities compared to their % of population in the US. The general labor market, though, is well below.

I'll have to dig around my materials from last semester, but we did a pretty in-depth study on the hiring practices of public vs. private sectors.

<- Public Administration major

Donger 07-11-2008 10:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutamess (Post 4841282)
Hence...

"We have to work double hard."
"Whites (in general) are born with silver spoons".

Thanks for your example.
But, the kid in this example didn't KNOW that he had to do that, right? He assumed that the white guy interviewing him expected him to doubly impressive because he's black?

Silock 07-11-2008 10:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by markk (Post 4841272)
I have interviewed and made hiring decisions before. Not for degree-required jobs, but for some other types of jobs that are unskilled labor basically.

I can tell you that I make a lot of visual judgments. You can tell a lot about people in the first 10 seconds of an interview just by whether or not they bothered to dress professionally, if they bother to sit up straight, make eye contact with you. If they are well-spoken, call you by your name, etc.

I've interviewed way more people who were total jerkoffs who were white kids from the suburbs. I think that when the black kid came in looking for a job for the summer or part time, he felt like he had to impress or he wasn't going to get it. I hired minority applicants all the time, it wasn't that way, but I felt like maybe that was their attitude.

In any case, I'll fill a role with a person who thinks they are at a disadvantage and will have to work hard and make it over someone who just comes in to an interview wearing everyday clothes, slouching and acting bored, already asking about pay raises and days off. Don't matter what color you are.

I think there's a kernel of truth in that if you meet these people I was talking to, ages 16-25 approximately, the ones who thought they were entitled to something were generally white.
That's fantastic anecdotal evidence, and it's certainly interesting to note, but it's not what happens in the majority of cases.

Sully 07-11-2008 10:59 AM
This has turned into a GREAT thread.
Keep it going.

DaneMcCloud 07-11-2008 11:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silock (Post 4841255)
You're missing something, though. It's the fact that even though nearly everyone has to work hard, white people are still more likely to be hired simply based on skin color.
While I feel that racism in America certainly exists and that programs like AA are necessary, I don't feel that this statement is necessarily true everywhere in the US.

At my previous job, we had more than 40 people in our music division (a division of Paramount at the time) yet we had six Filipinos, one japanese, one from El Salvador, three Mexican, five African Americans, one Russian, so on and so forth. It was a very racially diverse mix and that was even more prevalent on the Paramount lot.

California (and Los Angeles, in particular) is very racially diverse and I don't think that race is seen as a "liability". At least, that hasn't been my experience or my wife's (and she's Asian).

Everyone has to work hard, regardless of skin color. The "Good Ol' Boy" network still exists in certain circles but I think it's just as difficult for whites, Asians, Hispanics or AA's to break into that circle. And if you DO want to break into that circle, you'd better have an extremely high-level college education (most likely grad school from an Ivy League or Stanford-type school) to even be considered for such a post.

wutamess 07-11-2008 11:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donger (Post 4841288)
But, the kid in this example didn't KNOW that he had to do that, right? He assumed that the white guy interviewing him expected him to doubly impressive because he's black?
Yeah. Whatever. :rolleyes:

Silock 07-11-2008 11:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud (Post 4841291)
While I feel that racism in America certainly exists and that programs like AA are necessary, I don't feel that this statement is necessarily true everywhere in the US.
Of course not. There will always be differences for every part of the country. However, because of the need for fair and equitable policies, it has to be applied everywhere.

Iowanian 07-11-2008 11:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bkkcoh (Post 4840885)
Wouldn't it be better to know that a person got a position as a result of his/her qualifications instead of ethnicity or gender?

Equal outcomes can't be the end goal, equal opportunities can be and it would be up to the person to make the most of his/her opportunity.
I don't really want in the middle of this discussion, however....

2 years ago, I interviewed for a good job, and was told by the director that I was hands down the best applicant and had several years of better experience than any other applicant. He called back a week later and said that he was told by HR that he was to "hire an affirmative action qualifier" and wasn't going to be able to offer me the position.

I know my dad is routinely told by HR to diversify his staff in an ag related business. He said he's hired every black and latino that have ever applied for one of his positions. Zero. In the midwest, in an ag related industry, and corporate from a coast growls about the diversity. Women and a couple of token gheys will have to do.

In any job, the best candidate should win. period.



That said....if the statements in the thread starter are true, its a sad reality of how hypersensitive our society is becoming.

I heard that next year the 4th of July and Cinco de Mayo were being outlawed as discriminatory holidays....they discriminate against people who can only count to 3.

wutamess 07-11-2008 11:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud (Post 4841291)
The "Good Ol' Boy" network still exists in certain circles but I think it's just as difficult for whites, Asians, Hispanics or AA's to break into that circle. And if you DO want to break into that circle, you'd better have an extremely high-level college education (most likely grad school from an Ivy League or Stanford-type school) to even be considered for such a post.
Your statements hold truth... But since the Good Ol' Boy network is mostly made up of an inner circle of white males, who do you think will be more apt to get IN the network?

Donger 07-11-2008 11:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutamess (Post 4841295)
Yeah. Whatever. :rolleyes:
That's it? Is what I wrote not correct?

vailpass 07-11-2008 11:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silock (Post 4841284)
www.bls.gov

It's funny -- the gov't actually overhires minorities compared to their % of population in the US. The general labor market, though, is well below.

I'll have to dig around my materials from last semester, but we did a pretty in-depth study on the hiring practices of public vs. private sectors.

<- Public Administration major

Nicely done, good to see you are getting something from your classwork beside a grade.
As always, the truth is closest when you mix statistics with on-the-ground experience.
Good luck on your PA major, the country could use a whole lot of qualified PAs.


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