On the flip side of the equation, when you have bums like Tamba Hali questioning the coaches, something is wrong.

Brian Waters also never says anything negative about the organization.

What I am saying is we suck so Herm choosing not to be so conservative doesn't matter because there is nothing on the line.

I guarantee you if this team was fighting for a playoff spot Herm would go back into ultra-conservative mode and screw this team just like he did early in the season when he decided to put the game in the D's hands.

Does that make sense?

I guess the owner was fooling himself then because he is the one that said we need to be competing for a playoff spot.

Thank you, William. I know you've been tough on Herm, and this is exactly the kind of rational response I was looking for. It's amazing that so few people can even give that small amount of understanding.

Makes sense except for the part where you speak for what someone else might do...

But there is no rule anywhere that says you have to play differently when the odds are against you. Just because we're out of the playoffs doesn't mean we have to play like nothing matters.

Surely you didn't think that with the roster we had that this was possible.

This was not a good roster. And most of that blame can be placed at the feet of Carl Peterson. Yes, the Chiefs have had three drafts between 2006-2008 to resolve that problem. But #1 - given reports of the power struggle in KC, it sounds like Peterson was overruling Herm on a lot of personnel decisions; and #2 - It is a huge expectation to expect a coach to completely turn around a team with only 3 years of draft picks (2 of those picks being #20 or lower) and no elite free agent acquisitions.

This is the absolute definition of trying to make chicken salad out of chicken shit.

You honestly believe that if the Chiefs were competing for a playoff spot Herm wouldn't go back into his conservative shell?

You and I both know he would because that is just who he is.

I didn't but the owner did and he is the one that made the statement.

Go back and read what he said earlier this year. He specifically said if this team doesn't compete for a playoff spot then there would be changes coming. So far he is sticking to his word.

The bull shitter makes chicken shit

I don't agree with that idea at all. He's not going to change what they're doing because they're having success with it. If the offense is being productive, he's not going to change the offensive philosophy simply because "that is just who he is". Herm is dumb, but he's not that dumb.... If that were the case, then he never would have tried something different in the first place. He wouldn't have let Chan run the spread at all if he were indeed as stubborn as you say. He would have went down in flames clinging to over-conservative offense with a team that couldn't run it. Most Herm critics said he'd never run anything but the R2P2 offense, and they've been proven wrong.

This isn't about his public persona. This isn't about his ability to coach. We know that we don't like those things and I can't argue with anyone about those points.

This is the point about a rampant argument that Herm decimated this team and has done nothing to help this team rebuild. And there is too much indisputable evidence that he was handed a lemon and given very few resources to doing it and, from the sound of it, was held back by his GM from doing the things he needed to do.

There is a lot of good reason to hate and blame Herm Edwards. But the extent of the blame he gets for personnel problems ignores the huge pile of evidence that Peterson had a HUGE hand in it.

You could make the case that at the point that Tyler became the full-time starter the season was lost. They were 1-5 going to NY to play the Jets so they really had nothing to lose by changing it up.

If you look at how they ran the offense prior to the Jets game they ran R2P2.

But if anyone was going to get credit I would give it to Chan because this has his fingerprints all over it. When he was in Pittsburgh he did alot of different things to help Kordell.

I won't defend the coaching staff at all but Tamba Hali is a freakin turd. He should question his own talent and effort not the coaching staff. Yes they played him out of position but you would think that a first round draft pick's pure talent alone would keep him from completely disappearing for entire games.

At the same time, his offensive approach was similar to Herm's R2P2. He always had a 1000+ yard rusher, but few QBs with more than 3,500 yards. Even Aikman.

They changed the offense because it wasn't working. Which still doesn't give any credence to your idea that they would change it back in spite of it's success.

And it doesn't matter when you think the season was lost. I strongly disagree that the team shared that idea. Regardless, that still doesn't change the fact that they changed from something that wasn't working, to something that works much much better. The head coach isn't going to switch back to a failed offense because he hates TDs. You can still hate Herm, but concentrate on things he's actually done instead of what your hatred tells you he might do........