KU is going crazy... WOW

This is better.

I don't think MU has ever drawn big crowds during non-con. Not until football is over with anyway.

19-3 run by the hawks

AFH would be packed and going bat shit crazy against a middle school team.

tharpe going to grab him some bench time with garbage like that...

Oh come the **** on. Be smart.

If I were Self, the next time Relaford takes a 3 I would bench his ass for a long time. He is 0-9 but keeps taking that shot. Needs to have a message sent to him.

KU ramped up the Defense... Self has to like this...

He can hit that. But he's the best defender on the floor. He'll go out for a bit, but he's not staying out.

Until they got out of control and got reeruned.

Jesus. Releford is playing like ballsack.

Your sack?

Quit thinking about my sack.

Seriously.

I will punch your face...

Ok that was a foul but hardly an intentional.....pretty weak call

Sure wish MU was still in the Big 12....

Gonna miss those games...

Withey just clubbed Chattanooga with his 14 inch cock.

I would like to see this year's MU team vs. KU. No more size agvantage to KU. In fact it might be the opposite but would have to see them on the court at the same time.

Hopefully they meet up in the tourney. It will be better if they meant something.

Eh, he wasn't making a play for the ball. I'm OK with the call. I'd be bitching about the ones Withey got away with down low, if you want to bitch about fouls.

Following that logic, Self should have benched every single player that played in that disgusting first half. Except that's no way to coach a bunch of players that you're going to need in the future. They need to learn to learn to deal with adversity.

Releford can make that shot. He also needs to make that shot if KU's offense is going to be successful. He shouldn't be discouraged from taking open ones.

missing Manning some

The called it intentional, not flagrant.


it was clearly an intentional foul because he didn't go for the ball

actually Releford was a key in turning it around for KU .......... on defense.

Self put Releford on Cobb and Travis shut him down. So much so that Self made sure and sub for Relaford at the same time they sub for Cobb to make sure that Cobb didn't start hitting all those 3's again.

Releford's outside shooting is ass though

I don't mean bench him permanently or even for entire games. Just sit his ass down for a while and make him think about it.

Bitching about Withey or KU for that matter getting away with calls is like crying about the Broncos getting away with calls.

I didn't think it was that bad of an officiated game save the clear goal tending they let KU get away with in the 1st half.

I'm pretty sure he has the green light from Self to launch wide open 3's, as he should.

He's been in a slump. He'll snap out of it , as all good shooters do.

While I agree TR will snap out of his shooting funk -- he's not really a very good shooter at all.

Why?

seems like the fundamentals of our bigs isn't as sharp. It doesn't mean they won't develop, just that maybe without Manning they aren't developing as quickly.

Interesting game. At one point in the second half, UTC led by twelve and hadn't shot a single free throw.

Losing Manning will hurt to some degree, but I am assuming you are talking about the freshman. This was only their 2nd "real" game, 4th overall. You can't make that determination so quickly.

As far as Withey goes, he's just in an unfortunate spot. He really needs an athletic scoring big opposite him to be effective on the offensive side of the ball.

Yeah, KU is struggling right now. Just can't get the production out of the bigs that they need, which is putting more pressure on the guards to hit from the outside. KU has always been an inside/out team under Self - right now they are still trying to find themselves.

On a more optimistic note, the effort was there yesterday. Much more than it had been at all this year. Additionally, he was snagging quite a few DREB. Last year, he let TRob do all that. It might not be so easy against the big 12 bigs, but I'm looking at it as progress.

Yeah, because Wayne Simien sucked so bad. :rolleyes::spock:

Withey's a doofus. He should have left after last season. His stock is never going to be that high again. Robinson freed him up to do what he does best. Without that presence on the opposite block, Withey is just a guy.

A seven foot guy that still blocks shots.

FYP.

Against a team with a 6'5 power forward.

Don't be obtuse.

He's a useful college player for sure. He just doesn't look like an NBA player without Robinson.

That is true.

No, he probably isn't, but I don't really care about NBA anyway. Like I said, he needs an athletic scoring big on the opposite side to be an offensive threat. But he is still a good defensive player and that will be important.

Right. It works out well for Kansas that he came back. I tend to think he went from NBA player with guaranteed contract to insurance salesman when he chose to come back.

I agree with that. But you mentioned his performance last night. When last year against top competition he set the NCAA Tournament record for blocked shots.

If he can continue to be a defensive presence, rebound the ball and score between 10-15 a game, as a fan, I will be content.

I'd be happy with that. As long as I get to keep yelling "Damnit Withey!"

That's my point. He did that LAST YEAR...when he had Robinson.

He's never going to be asked to score in the NBA. He's going to be asked to come off the bench for defense and rebounding.

Against bums, he is averaging 14 points, 11 boards, and 6 blocks. Scouts aren't going to care how many boards and swats he gets against teams who start 6'5 power forwards.

Against MSU, a team with legit size, he had 8 points, 7 boards, and 2 blocks. Yawn

I'm not quite sure why you keep referencing the NBA. You and I haven't spoke about the NBA or his NBA potential.

If he can do what I mentioned in my previous post I will be content. And he will probably get drafted in the NBA based on his size. What numbers he puts up in the NBA is pretty irrelevant to me.

It seems your argument is impossible to win. You are declaring last year invalid because KU also had Robinson (which makes no sense because everyone else is talking about defense, which Robinson did not affect at all. If you are talking rebounds it makes even less sense because he had to fight with Robinson for all of them). And you will discount any stat from this year that isn’t against Michigan State – and stats are wonderful tools when the sample size is limited as much as possible :rolleyes:

So, cool story bro.

Oh hell. If we can't yell "Damnit Withey," and "You Son of a Bitch". I won't have a whole lot to say during the games.

where did i say ANYONE was going to suck?


tuck that tampon string back in and get back to work

Despite what the MU fan thinks, that should be enough to get him an NBA contract. Hell, Ostertag had a decade in the NBA being just that. Of course, I understand that Withey has to get more physical for that to happen.

OSTERTAG!!! FTMFW

Teams will take dudes on potential. I learned that with Julian Wright. Dude needed to eat about 10 pounds of steak a day, had no shot outside of 15 feet, and had a LOT further to go with physicalness. He was long and could run, that's about it. And he went first round IIRC.

Oh, he will get a contract based on his size and defensive presence alone.

The MU fan is talking to us like we think he's a world beater and #1 overall pick worthy.

I think Withey is a bench guy in the NBA with some potential offensively, who can rebound and block shots.

Not sure why he keeps talking about Withey and his NBA numbers.

Yeah, I don't know of a single KU fan that thinks he is an elite NBA prospect. I think he is basically Aldrich with a little higher ceiling.

Well, I do get his point... Withey's stock may never be higher than it was at the end of last season. But, who knows what went on behind the scenes... I'm sure he got a ton of advice on the subject. I assume he was projected to be drafted?

imo Withey will get draft in the 2nd round and sent to the dev league.

I worry about his motivation, he seems to need a pretty regular kick in the ass to keep his energy level up.

Man, are you that slow? I was making an exaggeration to emphasize my point. Simien had sharp fundamentals.

In other words, MUron. :D

jesus...i didn't even know there was a game last night.

I'm talking about his NBA stock because I said he was dumb for coming back this year. He would have likely been a late (maybe even mid) first round pick. I think it's unlikely that he goes in the first this year.

I don't know why this updates Kansas fans. The team is obviously better off with him.

I agree with your sentiment regarding Withey and the NBA.

But, you're the one who threw the 6'5" forward jab too.

If you watched Withey last year during the tournament you know he can compete with anyone, from a defensive standpoint.

So you don't think Withey had an advantage playing next to Robinson on the defensive end? Robinson was a ****ing load in the paint and on the block. Players had to try to go around him which created the opportunities for Withey to get blocks from the weak side. Robinson could force players a certain direction because he was so damned strong. Perry Ellis can't do that. He isn't physical enough to do what Robinson could do.

As a tall center with good timing but limited athleticism, Withey's best friend on the defensive end is an enormous power forward. Frankly, it didn't hurt having Taylor guarding the point, either. Taylor is so long and quick that he wasn't beat by the first step. If someone got around him, they didn't get free at the three point line. By the time they were past Taylor, Withey was there waiting, and they didn't have room to make a move. He swallowed them up, and he was really good at it.

That wasn't a jab at Withey. The Mocs' starting power forward is 6'5. Those guys don't exist in the NBA.

Michigan State has a front court that compares to NBA size, and Withey didn't control the boards nor the paint. He had eight points, seven boards, no assists, and two blocks, and the Spartains shot 52% from the field. He looks more like Jeff Withey circa 2010 than 2011.

I think Withey is an outstanding off the ball/weak side defender. I think he struggles when teams pound on him with a big man of their own. In college, you can get away with just being taller than everybody. That doesn't work in the pros.

Maybe he proves me wrong and plays himself into a lottery pick. I just don't see it.

so basically you're just full of shit.

you exaggerated my post, so you could exaggerate your post, so you could bitch like a child.

The reality is that the coach for our bigs just left and our bigs look a bit rough.

Is it just coincidence? Just the coaching staff settling in? Just this group of bigs are a little raw?

I dunno ... i made no conclusions, merely an observation.


But Hey, nothing brings out your bullshit parade like any post from me.

Lol, well if that is your opinion, then you are entitled to it.

And I’m entitled to think you are a f**king moron.

Yup, Manning left less than a year ago and our bigs have gone to shit. Throw in Self ruining all outside shooting for guards we are screwed.

Good analysis. Would read again.

Wait, are people actually saying that Withey's success at the end of last year was because he's awesome?

He's not a terrible player, but if you want to know why he's kind of regressed a bit to open this season, it's pretty obvious. We knew losing Robinson was going to be a challenge for Withey, and that he had to make even greater strides than he did last year if he wanted to build off his success.

Thus far he hasn't done enough. It's fine. He's still a good player. He'll get better. That's what all Bill Self players do.

Welcome to the ****ing moron club. /slides over to make room

Dude…its been 3 F-ing games. The announcers don't even know everyone's names yet. Let them at least get used to playing competitive basketball again before we throw out "regressed".

And I think people are mixing offense with defense. Is Withey a trainwreck on offense? Yes. Is he one of the best shot-blockers in the country? Yes.

When your opinion is “he was one of the best shot-blockers in the country not because he’s good at defense but because he played next to a guy who was widely regarded as a liability on defense”, there’s not much I can say except agree to disagree.

If Withey played for Missouri he would be spoken of like a Greek god. Mizzou fans would pay $15 and stand in line for hours to get slapped in the face with his dick.

Instead he plays at Kansas were expectations by KU fans are mostly unrealistic and rival fans relish the opportunity to criticize his NBA potential three games into a very long season.

He's not able to do the stuff he did last year in the tournament. He's still adjusting.

He's a good player. I'm glad to have him as our starting C. I hope he gets better. He needs to get better. And I think he will get better once he gets used to having Ellis and Traylor around instead of Robinson.

What part of "he is an outstanding off the ball defender" confuses you? He blocked a bunch of shots from the guy Robinson defended. He cleaned up a bunch of rebounds from the weak side.

Guys struggled to get past Taylor and found themselves too deep to challenge Withey.

I'm not saying he's not a good college player. He is. I'm saying that his NBA stock will never be higher than it was at the end of last season.

Actually, Saul is pretty spot on there. :eek:

The hell they would. Have you seen the attendance for non-KU games in Columbia?

Imagine if Barry's Koolaid or Autumn Wind said something intelligent and wanted to be a constructive part of the conversation. It doesn't matter if it was well thought out, completely logical, and would have been positive repped 1000 times had Rain Man posted the same thing. It would get torn down on a misspelled word or on the weakest part of the argument way before anyone agreed with it.

It's pretty much the same with Saul talking about the Jayhawks. I guess you can call it a downside to looking for an argument time and time again... after a while, you're pretty much guaranteed to get one.