Without Gun this is a 4-12 Team
 

Herm came in and achieved "balance". That's what you could say after having a D suck so bad the past 5 years that getting under 300 points (we didn't) would have been a monumental achievement. But in the name of "balance" we took the league's best offense and demoted it to a predictable, 1-dimensional cliche that dropped SIXTEEN places in ranking and performed worse than almost any offense in NFL playoff history (126 yards of total offense).

I think without Gun trying to make shinola out of $#!+ with Herm's insistance on Cover 2, this team is horrible. The Colts game shows that the testicles are on D, and that is NOT because Herm "changed the focus". If DV was here, we'd be 14-2 and laughing at the Colts because he kept Gun. That said, this team had better realize that flushing DV's O leaves not much in its place. Thank God for Gun, because without him and these over-acheivers, this team is a waste of talent. Hopefully Gun stays and keeps this team at least semi-competitive.

Awesome thread. Simply amazing.

LMAO

Wow....

Just wow..

.......Yea Gun is such a genius he asked for a ton of players got them and well those players suck.

DV would not have done much better with this offense. The line sucked.

Gun is the same piece of human feces that took a team that had an offense than set a ****ing NFL record for first downs in 2004, and led them to a losing record.

**** you, KCJ. Gun is part of the problem.

:BS:

If ya don't have what ya want, work with what ya have. Today demonstrated a cluelessness that makes Jimmy Raye look like Don Coryell. Without a valiant defense, we lost this game 56-0 with no dignity intact at all.

I highly doubt Will Shields would have returned
Roaf sure as hell wouldn't have even tried

well this is out of left field. Gunther? Really?

I hope Gunther gets fired.....

Dignity died today my friend,thanks to that putrid display of offense.

Oh, that's a good solution.
STFU

Vermeil built this offense into what it was, and I think you underestimate his ability to adjust. I have no doubt that if Vermeil were here this line would not be playing quite this badly. The play calling would not be this bad and our offense would have more confidence if Vermeil was here.

I was referring to the entire season.

Without the heart demonstrated by the D, this game is a humiliation of Biblical proportions. The NFL's Top O from 2005 getting 126 yards of total offense against one of the worst defenses in history to ever make the playoffs. Yeah. Right. Fire Gun. :shake:

Gun likes it in the rear.

ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL

:toast:

well DV is gone so who cares what he would have done this year. Herm is here and all we can do is hope that Carl will activate his good ol' boy network in 2008 and bring back his boy Cowher

you have to build through the draft
you can't say DV didn't suck at it
5 years was enough for the old man

Fixed yer post.

Oh ya I forgot. Thanks.

This game reminded me of the Defense from 1997 where they would bend like hell between the 20's but when you got in the red zone they shut it out. I am not saying it is the D from the 97 team, but it was reminding me of it.

Guntharr wether people like it or not is the one that started the turn around. There was flashes of it last year, and it was even better this year. The D will be even better next year when we get a DT worth flying fuck.

GUntharr isnt going anywhere, and i for one am glad.

People may hate on me, but thats fine, you got haters everywhere.

\\I agree, we were an 8-8 team last year without Gun's leadership. I just hate it that he was force fed Cover 2 this year or we might just well have been 11-5. Still, Herm killed this O. Damn. :shake:

Best part was when Whitlocked asked Herm, how did this defense go from bieng 1-2 in the league to what it is now in under a year. Herm just said i dont know. lol I really did laugh

I am still not sure whether it's soley Gunther's doing. However, he led the D's of the '90s so he has to know something. I think that with some possible badass safeties (pollard and page) and a DT then we might have something going for us.

I agree with this. After playing 16 regular season games Herm and his offensive coaches should have a better grasp on both their strengths and weaknesses.

I heard one of the announcers today quote Herm as saying he knew that if we got behind the line wouldn't be able to stop their pass rush. Good that he knew that, but why work off such a conservative strategy if you know you can't play from behind? Seems like that's a clue to come out aggressive and try to get an early lead.

Having said all that, the Colts are the better team and would probably win 8 times if we played 10. But it shoudn't have been so lopsided.

:clap: :clap:

Thanks, RJ. There should have been, as Jo Po suggested, a plan B, especially when the game plan was run it down their throats with2 of our best blockers (Dunn and Turley) voluntarily put on IR to protect PRACTICE SQUAD players from the waiver wire.

it amazes me how people on this board have totally deluded themselves on how lucky we were when DV and AS were here. All we needed was a decent D, and we would have gone the distance at least twice.

This O will never come close to what we had the prior 5 years. Tis a shame. Rest in peace almighty O we'll miss you.

if you would change your love to Saunders for HC
you might get more support
never mind most have you on ignore most likely

Which he never achieved in FIVE years. Game over.

Other coaches have fixed a defense in a year or two.

Gunt has made some progress, but this is his third year.

Gunt has had enough time to fix this defense, and while better, it ain't fixed.

If we were to go 4-12, Carl would be gone, we'd have a high pick and go directly into rebuilding mode.

As it is, we were "close" and need "just a few fixes". As in, make some superficial cuts and sign aging free agents.

Exactly. And if Solari really had the killer -instinct that AS had, even without Raof, we would have had a majot year on offense. DAMN. a 1789 yard RB gives you CARTE BLANCHE in the play-action pass game if you have the %$#@ common sense to USE it. Steve Bono out-performed Green this year. 16 Games with Huard with Al Saunders as OC = 13-3. GO GUN!!!!!!!!

And the fact that DV gave more atonomy to Gun than Edwards does...Yeah, it's all DV's fault.

It never amazes me how people see the O over those 5 years and proclaim they love Dick, while completely ignoring the fact that the D he had was one of the worst in history over a 5 year span.

Jesus Christ, KCJohnny.

Gunther is lucky as hell that Herm is here to hold his hand. He is NOTHING without Herm.

Herm Edwards gave Kansas City it's best defense in almost a decade.

Head coach. Comes with the territory.

Do you really believe that? I highly doubt Carl would be fired in this scenario.

And hating on the Cover 2 and Herm's influence on this defense doesn't make sense. The Cover 2 is what worked today.

Delegation is a bitch, isn't it. How many DCs have Holmgren and Shanahan gone through? It's called specialization, and DV brought something to the table. (More than just something, actually.) Edwards is an absolute joke.

Oh yeah. Dropping the O from #1 to #16 is definitely the formulae for advancing your D. Do you REALIZE what a monumental achievement it is for a D to get better when its O drops SIXTEEN palces in the league ranking??????

You just don't want to acknowledge the job Gun did with ZERO stars on D and some vets, hopefuls and maintenance players. Without Gun's D today, we lose 56-0.

At least it is his $#!+. All the players on defense are the ones he wanted, plus a couple of draft picks and Law thrown in.

And you know it was a bad day when a defense that gives up 450 total yards (188 yards rushing) is the bright spot.

You know how lukcy KC is to have Herm bring in his Butt Sex Offense?

We are now balanced and were totaly humilated on national TV agian with Herm!

Thanks for reminding us how lucky everyone is that we have Herm.

The eason they gave up so many yards is we had 7 count them 7 3 and outs. 42 minutes the Defene was on the field. Ty Law even said F@ck me when the O couldnt do shit with his interception.

The D was just so gased at the end of the game there was nothing left in the damn tank. They did a damn fine job against Manning in their house. Did they play perfect? no, of course not, but there isnt a Defense in the league that really would have done better in the RCA dome.

Get a %^&*()%$ clue, dude. we didn't make a 1st down until 3:33 was left in the 3rd quarter and took the ball away 4x. We were in this game until the O just laid down and quit. This D was tremendous today on the road against an 8-0 home team. If this O gets 10 first downs, Indy's offensove output is reduced by 33%.

And Dick was an absolute joke on the other side of the coin.

The sorry sad fact is, Carl's entire tenure is a study in head coaching futility.

We have done a complete 180 Milkman.. Herm is absolute Shit on the Offensive side of the ball....

We once were all Offense and no D

Now we will be all Defense and no O....

No matter how you slice it DV would not have produced the most embarrassing NFL playoff loss for any team!

That legacy won't be there for him.

WRONG!!!!!!!!!
Now we are some defense and no offense. Please annotate.

I'm acknlowedging that someone did an incredible job on defense this year. That someone is NOT Gunther Cunningham. It's Herm Edwards.

Gunther's claim to fame is drooling over talentless has-been's like Kendrell Bell.

Defense did OK. Gave up a boatload of yardage and got a little lucky on some of Mannings decisions today. But overall they did OK. Not enough for me to see Gun as the almighty. And I can think of a couple of other defenses that could have done the same as the Chiefs did. Shoot, the Bears did it on a weekly basis last year with their 3 and out offense.

He's right. This has the negative potential of scarring the franchise for generations like the Bills losing 4 SBs. BAD NEWS. :shake:

It would be nice to have a GM that understands the importance of having a coach that understands offense as well as a defense.

Maybe not.

All I know for certain is that it doesn't matter if you suck the left cheek, or the right cheek.
Either way, you are still sucking ass.

I was referring to your quote that Gun made a defense out of crappy defenders. Shinola out of $#!+, was your terms. All the players on that D were the ones Gun wanted. You may have been overseas or something, but Gun gave CP his shopping list, and CP filled it plus a few players like DJ, Hali, and Law.

Didn't Gunther want that waste of skin Siavii, too?

Yep, Gunther is AWESOME. He totally doesn't need Herm.

We should have promoted Al Saunders to head coach so the offense would kick ass while Gunther raised the D up on high all by himself!

I said better, i didnt say the same. In all honesty thats about the best you can do to indy at home. They are just to good of an offense at home.

The whole game plan was to keep everything in front becuase if you blitz he will burn you for big yards. Whats the old saying, you cant stop them you can only hope to contain. Well thats what they did, and the offense just didnt show up.

Yeah, DV's D at Philly and at StL were jokes, right? The sad fact is that we traded in a HOF coach for a sub-100 IQ asshhole.

I don't give a rat's ass what Dick did in Philly or StL or Bumfuk, Egypt.

What he did in KC for 5 years was field one of the shittiest defense the NFL had ever seen.

**** him and his wonderful ****in' O.
**** Hermie and his wonderful ****in' D.

**** Carl and his old boy network.

They can all kiss my ass and suck your dick, cause I'm ****ing tired of fielding half assed teams.

Amen.

I agree Carl has to go. At least with DV in charge of the offense, we had one half of the equation taken care of. Now, under Carl and Herm, there is no hope -- we're 0 for 2.

I agree, the defense did fine. But I am not convince that Guns defense is the reason we were not 4-12 as the thread title indicates.

when Carl goes
Matt Millen will be primed to step in

Yeah come on get it out of your system sir. It will be alright. Don't worry everything will be fine. Yeah try not to focus on just what happen today .
Yeah point fingers at other HC's keep diverting attention to something else. Ventilate ! Breath Breath!

Herm came in and castrated the offense.

On the contrary, DV hosted the most embarrassing NFL playoff loss. DV's 13-3, #1 seed playoff team did not force a single punt. That "D" was so embarrassing that the NFL commisioner made jokes about it at an official NFL ceremony.

Losing this year sucked but we were the surprise #6 seed playoff team. Noone really expected us to go far in the postseason.

For good or for evil, there it is.

I don't know why Herm cut Roaf the night before camp and got Welbourne suspended. I bet, in hindsight, Herm probably regrets those moves. Herm probably shouldn't have cut Holmes either or held Green out for half the season. Yeah, Herm is pretty dumb.

Please see box score from Indy 23, KC 8.

:shake:

Dude, all that box score tells me is that the Colts are a better football team than the Chiefs right now. Yes, Herm is partly to blame for that but it is not entirely his fault. Please just admit that other events happened which were beyond his (or anybody's) control.

oh, me either, but Gun's D today played about the best football you can play against the Colts at home.

lol, We didnt get far or anywhere for that matter. Least give us 1 play off win. lol

A fuckin MEN

The sick thing is you can see the vague outline of this guys Gunther-wood right there.

:Lin:

Thats the direction it's going. These offensive superstars had better mutiny or get the hell out of Missouri while they can. Why squander a (relatively) short NFL career doing what you love for leadership that can't utilize your gift. I'll always love this franchise, even when the folks in charge make fools of us faithful.

Everyone on offense is now a soprano.

Our D gave up 38 points that day. Other playoff D's have given up far more points at home than that...far, far more. Today's showing was far more embarrassing. At least we had a fucking shot in '03. Today's failed unit was so inept, it made the '03 defense look like the goddamned 2000 Ravens in comparison. Not getting a team to punt is one thing, but matching a 65 year old record for futility 1 year after having the #1 O against a historically bad defense is a whole 'nother ballgame. The degree of regression is staggering...staggering.

We had a shot today too, Even how bad our offense played, we had a damn good shot. Offense blew it. We more then likely score if trent didnt trip, we would have been up 7-6, and it would have been a new ball game. Same thing in 03, if priest didnt fumble it would have been a different game. 03 was pretty horrible. I didnt think we were going to win this game though. I thought we may have had a shot, but Petyon at home, no dice.

I think you would have to be a complete idiot the likes of which only comes around once every 10-15 years.

But hey, thats just my opinion.