Jonathan Rand: What if (Matt) Ryan's there?
 

What if Ryan's there?
Apr 10, 2008, 2:15:51 AM by Jonathan Rand

What should the Chiefs do if Matt Ryan from Boston College, considered the standout quarterback in this draft, is sitting there when it’s time to make the fifth overall pick?

Thousands of Chiefs fans would be screaming, “Take him!” Some of these same fans, no doubt, were throwing chairs at their big screens last year as the Chiefs declined to trade up during Notre Dame quarterback Brady Quinn’s free fall. The Browns traded up with the Cowboys to grab Quinn at number 22 and the Chiefs, sitting chilly in the 23rd spot, took LSU wide receiver Dwayne Bowe.

Quinn, whom many fans urged the Browns to draft with the third overall pick, now backs up Derek Anderson — a sixth-round choice in 2005 who was waived by the Ravens.

Bowe enjoyed a standout rookie season. Had the Chiefs traded up, they would have lost Bowe and an extra high draft pick that they would have had to give to the Cowboys. For the Chiefs, trading up would have been a big mistake.

Drafting quarterbacks is a lot trickier than you might think. The list of first-round busts at this position is much longer than the list of first-round successes, which is bizarre when you consider how much tape, statistics and workout information is generated by quarterbacks.

But the adjustment from college football to the NFL is so dramatic that “can’t-miss” quarterbacks are few and far between. We still don’t know if JaMarcus Russell, the LSU quarterback picked first overall by the Raiders a year ago, was a wise pick.

The Chiefs need, first and foremost, a top-flight offensive tackle. But if Michigan’s Jake Long is one of the top four picks, the next-best tackle may not be a good enough athlete to justify taking with the fifth pick.

The Chiefs could then try to trade down or take the best player still available. And what if they consider Ryan to be that player?

Chiefs coach Herm Edwards attended Ryan’s campus workout, and should have an educated opinion on whether he’s a superior prospect to incumbent Brodie Croyle. Ryan, 6 feet 5 and 224, gets positive reviews for his size, arm and ability to throw on the run.

The Chiefs haven’t committed a first-round pick for a quarterback since they misfired with Penn State’s Todd Blackledge in 1983. Considering their long-term failure to develop a young passer, is it time now for them to finally take the plunge?

Even if the Chiefs could draft Ryan, they’d have to wonder who’d be blocking for him. It makes no sense to commit a high pick to a quarterback if you can’t protect him, and the Chiefs stand three starters short of a decent line. When the Browns drafted Quinn, they’d already solidified their protection by taking Wisconsin tackle Joe Thomas with the third overall pick.

Houston’s David Carr was a classic case of a highly drafted quarterback who received scant protection. The first overall pick in 2002, he was sacked 249 times during his first years as a Texan. Recently released by the Panthers, it’s tough to know whether Carr ever had the tools to win in the NFL. But it’s fair to say it was hard for him to develop while staring at the sky.

If the Chiefs consider drafting Ryan, they need to be convinced he’s a “can’t-miss” prospect, project him as the opening-day starter and feel confident they can quickly rebuild their offensive line. The chances of Ryan being the real deal and getting enough protection to help the Chiefs progress this year appear remote. It would come as a surprise if they draft him.

http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2008/04...f_ryans_there/

If Jake Long is gone, and Ryan is still there, I could see making the pick. Get a RT, G, and possibly even a center as well. Then next year get Oher in the 1st round to fill out the O-line.

Sorry defensive homers, the offense needs fixed way worse than the d needs attention right now. Gun has had high draft picks and FA's for far to long.

More Propoganda from the Chiefs?? Trying to cool the fans down in case we bypass him??

Which is the crux of the issue , the guy isn't an Elway caliber QB. He'll need to be in the right situation to succeed

Only if J. Long, Dorsey, and Ellis are gone.

:spock:

Hopefully Atlanta will take Ryan and it won't be an issue either way.

If the Chiefs don't pick him, try not to cry as he quarterbacks the Jets or Ravens into the super bowl in a few years, while Chiefs management keeps you all baffled with bullshit.

I'm kind of a Croyle backer, but what if the guy does not have it? Rayn this year, and Oher next year sounds a whole lot better to me than Long this year and Tebow next season.

All most everything I have read or heard lately has Ryan being rated at the top of the past few years draft classes. Ahead of all three of the AFC West young guns... or at least nearly even with Russell and ahead of the other two. Rated near even with Eli Manning and ahead of Rothlisberger as well.

It took Eli 3+ years to do anything good...any qb in KC will not be allowed 3 years to "figure it out".

Not true.


Any top 10 pick in the NFL is allowed 4 years to figure it out. There is too much money involved to not let him.

Why not? The offensive line is in shambles. A 2nd year WR could be the only WR we have. Gonzo isn't exactly young anymore. And LJ is pushing 30 comming off of an injury. This offense is going to need a lot of retooling. 3 or 4 years for us to be Super Bowl caliber is not that bad of an expectation IMO. And if Croyle isn't the answer, it could be even longer than that. And again, the guys that watch tape for a living seen to all think Ryan could be a franchise type QB.

If Ryan is available at 5 the Chiefs need to pull the trigger hell if the Chiefs had the #1 pick I'd pick him then as well. This team needs a QB to build around and lead this team in the worst way and Ryan has every single thing I want in a QB.

IMO Croyle is what he has always been an undersized, injury prone QB with a rocket arm. I guess I just don't see what some of you guys see. Alot of young QBs get thrown to the wolves on bad teams with bad lines and the good ones always show you something and I never saw that in Croyle.

"The Chiefs haven’t committed a first-round pick for a quarterback since they misfired with Penn State’s Todd Blackledge in 1983."

Uhhh... Trent Green

True, but not quite the same thing.

A draft pick. Or do you mean the #1 pick they gave up for him??

Eh, some of you fall in love with a guy every year and thats fine...Ryan is not for me. If we sign him that's fine by me, if not, no big deal for me. The ONE guy I would take is J. Long but it's doubtful he will make it to us at 5. Several good choices and NOBODY will know if we made the "right pick" for a while...could be years.

See post #2.

Nice one...what about it?

The article states that the Chiefs have not commited a first round pick to a QB since Blackledge; that is not true. We gave the Rams a first round pick (#13, IIRC) to get Green. I remember it because I wanted us to pick up QB Collins in free-agency and draft Deuce McAllister and get Green for free in free-agency the next year. Apparently, Carl couldn't wait one year because it was oh-so-important to have Green in 2001 so he could teach Minnis and C. Thomas the playbook and go 6-10 while throwing 400 interceptions.

Holy hell they mean draft a QB with our 1st pick. Jesus people.

Just wanted you to know if I had my preference, it would be Jake Long. If he is gone, Ryan may not be a bad option. Most all of my other posts were all in defense of Ryan.

A ****ing men.

Brodie Croyle is a glass vag, who will never, ever have the same success at Ryan at this level.

The only defense I've ever seen win a Super Bowl with a completely shitty QB is the Baltimore Ravens and I don't think I'll ever see a defense that dominant again.

Well, why don't they say what they mean and mean what they say? Words have meanings; or does the author buy into the Humpty Dumpty school of thought where words mean whatever he wants them to mean?

Give me a fuckIN break LMAO, already proclaiming him a SB QB before even playing a down in the NFL

Such is life.

That's why no matter who we pick, I am not going to go crazy and think the franchise is doomed or headed for a SB. There's just too much uncertainty to get too high or low off of one player when no one knows how he will pan out.

Dude, haven't you heard Croyle has a strong arm? Apparently that's all you need to succeed in the NFL according to some on here.

According to who, specifically?

What should the Chiefs do if Matt Ryan from Boston College, considered the standout quarterback in this draft, is sitting there when it’s time to make the fifth overall pick?
_________________________________________________________________

Draft him and don't look back. Then they can throw out the trash after the season and get a fresh start, with Ryan, in '09. This one's easy IMO.

If we DO take him, I don't see the point of waiting until 2009 to start him - get him out there and break his ass in. We have little/nothing to play for as it is.

Otherwise, you're spending a Top 5 pick on a guy that won't likely make an impact until 2011, if he makes one at all.

I see the point. There's no way he would remain intact behind this Oline this year. Let Croyle get shitbeat, exit about Week 2. Let Huard come in and take his lumps.

Let Ryan take over fully in 2009 with an upgraded line.

Id be down with that. Most teams that have stopgap QB's do this.

Even Eli didnt start until halfway or towards the end of his his rookie year. The Giants had Kurt Warner to take the lumps.

I guess I'm more optimistic about the OL than you are.

IMO, no matter WHO plays, it will be better than last year, because dumbass Solari won't be hanging them all out to dry.

A reeruned monkey on a meth bender could do a better job of situational play calling than Solari did.

People are so worried about "David Carr-ing" a QB.

If this kid is as mentally tough and a great leader that some claim him to be, getting beat up a bit isn't going to shell-shock him.

Get him building a rapport with Bowe and the others ASAP.

By the time this kid hits his stride (approximately 3-4 years after getting the starting gig, see: Rivers, Philip and Manning, Eli) Dwayne Bowe is going to be twenty-****ing-eight years old.

Agreed. David Carr had more than enough chances to prove himself. People can make all the excuses they want for him but he just wasnt very good.

At some point a good QB will rise above his situation, make plays and lift the team up around him.

Exactly.

People just assume that the OL ruined a #1 overall pick, when really it was that the kid just didn't have some combination of the talent, smarts and heart to play at this level.

Christ, John Elway is the most sacked QB of all time. He turned out OK.

If he's there at 5 they have to take him period.

And I'm fine with that, provided they play him.

Which, of course, they won't.

Even if Dorsey or Ellis is there?

Whats the most important position on any NFL team??

Well if you're going to play dumb, I believe you were the one who said Croyle can do anything that Ryan can do.

To make a statement like that you must place a priority on pure arm strength, because that's the only area anyone would agree that Croyle can compete with Ryan.

Yeah, and where is just arm strength come into it? I've never said that. I was a Trent Green backer too, and the man never had a strong arm.

well, if you believe he is a franchise QB then you have to take him....

QB is the most important position on the team, and the most important face of the franchise....

Like I just said, every single analyst would agree that the only area that Croyle can match or beat Ryan is in arm strength. That is why Ryan is a top five overall prospect and Croyle was a middle-round nobody.

Thus, if you think Croyle can do everything that Ryan can do, you must place a HUGE priority on arm strength.

Again, where do I say this? Really, point it out to me where I say I favor Croyle because he has a stronger arm. I've said this over and over the reason why I don't like the Ryan pick is it would be a lateral move.

Considering Ryan has yet to play a NFL game, I'm not sure how you can say that.

The only thing you can say with any certainty that Ryan > Croyle is injury history while in college.

Otherwise, their college stats are similar.

Ryan 60% completion percentage, Croyle 56%

Croyle 13 yards per attempt, Ryan 11.5

Croyle 1.86 TD's per INT, Ryan 1.51



Matt Ryan is no more guaranteed to be a good NFL QB than Croyle is to bust.

Crapshoot.

I still don't remotely believe that Croyle will ever make it a season without missing several games.

Actually, almost "every single analyst" said on draft day that Croyle had 1st round talent, but that his injury history scared teams off.

Again, you sound awful confident that a guy who's never taken a NFL snap is going to be the next Peyton Manning......

Let's be a little more honest though, Ryan threw the ball this past year nearly twice as many as Croyles highest year, he was relied upon alot more....

I would hope so, considering Alabama has always been a run-first team.

That's why I listed averages, not totals.

The numbers don't lie.

TD's per attempt is going to favor a guy who threw it 350 times to a guy who threw it over 600...

I didn't list TD's per attempt.

I listed TD's per INT.



What I find comical is that there are people who were whining in TC that if Croyle played, he'd be a turnover machine.

Then he goes out and throws 6 INT's in 6 starts. Fewer INT's per game than Eli Manning, Drew Brees, Carson Palmer and Tony Romo, among others.

Meanwhile, some of those same people are stoked about Ryan, who threw the ball all over the yard.

Hey, y'all can rest easy. Nick Athan just said that we were taking Brandon Albert with the 5th pick. Case closed....

I admit I know little about QBs and what it takes for them to succeed. However, I haven't seen anything from Ryan that says "Wow! I gotta have this kid."

I stated before last season that I was willing to give Croyle some time. I still am.

I won't be furious if they take Ryan, but I certainly don't think he's BPA at #5.

so you are FOR snagging Ryan? or jsut another QB in the 2nd or 3rd? (after ellis of course ;))

Oh really? I'd love to see a link of this. If "almost every single analyst" said this, I'm sure it won't be hard.

Ryan certainly isn't a guarantee - I said earlier in this thread that no player is a guarantee to boom or bust. That said, the odds of him developing into a franchise QB are much greater than Croyle.

Would you seriously disagree with that? If so, I lose a lot of respect for your football IQ.

I know I will get torched for this but here goes.....

Screw taking Ryan in the 1st.

*IF* Long or Dorsey are not available with our pick, I honestly believe we should trade down 1sts and pick up Clady plus get another 2nd and 3rd in the process. With that we should be able to address several concerns.

I am betting that Talib's stock took a hit with getting lit up 3 times for smoking weed. We will need a replacement for Law and someone to look forward to when Surtain hits the wall this or next season. I am betting he will be available in the 2nd when we go to pick.

If Talib is gone then we still have a shot at Porter.

Last but not least.....

Also, if Colt Brennan is available when we go to pick in the 4th round.... we DAMN well better pick him up.

No, no, no...:shake:

So, you want a link to a TV broadcast?

Yeah, that should be easy.

And Ryan's odds HAVE to be better, his draft slot DEMANDS it.

That still doesn't make him a Top 5 pick in my book though.

He's the one guy in this draft that I'm middle-ground on. If we pick him, fine. If we don't, fine.

I agree they are equal....neither have won an NFL game

yeah but to be fair the o was run run pass punt. Again more throws = more int's for those guys. Croyle certainly isn't any better.

omfg

It depends on who is there, who wants to trade and what they are offering.
Nobody wants to trade anything decent, J. Long, Dorsey gone, We have little use for Mcfadden at this point. We have Larry Johnson and we couldn't block for shit with him back there, so unless......

My guess is that Dorsey and Ellis are two candidates for the "Big Slide", Ryan gets drafted by Atlanta, we take Clady with Dorsey or Ellis on the board. Probably wrong about this. Miami Drafts J. Long, STL C. Long. Oakland takes Dorsey, Mcfaddn, or trades down. We are stuck with ellis or dorsey, and we take clady.

You know, it wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing to have two young, good quarterbacks if Ryan is there and the staff thinks he's worthy of the pick. Better than pinning all hopes on Croyle and him not living up to them. Competition could make both better.

LMAO.

Oh man ROFL, that is rich.

It's almost as funny as you claiming that you are good at evaluating quarterbacks because you're a noted interweb quarterback genius, because you always thought trading for Trent Green was a smart move. Even though everybody else has Ryan as a first rounder and Croyle wasn't drafted until the third, you claim they're the same thing. You're good for a laugh your own self.

I can tell you this right now, and I've said it before- the Chiefs won't draft Ryan. There's one simple reason why: Peterson's ego will get in the way. He drafted Croyle last year and he knows if he drafts Ryan with the first pick, then he's admitting to everyone he made a mistake with Croyle. The last thing Peterson wants to admit, is that he made a mistake.

Croyle wasn't a 1st rounder anyway so i dont think it would be that big of a deal to draft Ryan

???

Upgrading a position is not a mistake.

ROFL

Croyle was taken in the 2nd round which commands a high salary. I didn't say he was a first rounder.

Peterson isn't George Steinbrenner, and he's not interested in having 2 quarterbacks: one taken in the 2nd round, and the other taken in the 1st round. That's way too much for Peterson and his cheap bank.

I may be wrong, and the only way I'm wrong is if they saw something they very much liked in Ryan and feel he is worth the 1st pick on their draft board.

But, knowing Peterson's ego and his stingy wallet- I don't see him having two costly QB's on the same staff- one of them being only a year older than the other.

Croyle was taken in the 3rd round, and it was in 2006, not last year.

:doh!:

You're absolutely right! Dammit. Ugggh....Okay folks, well that blows my whole argument. :D

More coffee for me!!

Don Banks of SI: "At least one league insider predicted to me that if the Chiefs take Ryan instead of an offensive tackle, Peterson and Edwards will both wind up getting fired sooner rather than later."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/200...ml?eref=si_nfl


PLEASE TAKE MATT RYAN!!

Matt Ryan's agent is Condon? If he does go in the first round as planned it is going to take big bucks to sign him. Is Hunt ready to pony up with the big boys?

Who are these "big boys" you're speaking of?

Didnt he pony up for Gonzo and LJ???

Yeah, a TE who's on the wrong side of the 30 year old plateau, and a running back who had a NFL record of 416 carries, the year before he got paid.

You mean like how Tom Brady was a middle round nobody?

I don't think Deberg was saying if they're good signs or not.

He was simply making a point that shows Clark is willing to pony up the big bucks as it was being questioned.