More proof these coaches and decision makers are incompetent
 

http://www.tampabay.com/sports/footb...icle911430.ece

Jimmy Wilkerson kicking ass and taking names. The funny thing is how Herm tried to talk bad about him after drafting Turk McBride when McBride has done nothing but prove to be the definition of useless.

Wilkerson's play has Tampa Bay Buccaneers finding a bigger role for him
By Stephen F. Holder, Times Staff Writer
In print: Friday, November 21, 2008


TAMPA — Bucs defensive coordinator Monte Kiffin, attempting to inspire his players the night before Sunday's game against the Vikings, showed a highlight tape filled exclusively with all-out-hustle plays.

Some involved a defender not giving up on running down a streaking ballcarrier. Others showed the potential payoff for playing until the whistle and never assuming a play is dead.

It's now clear that at least one guy in that room was paying close attention.

Sunday, Jimmy Wilkerson watched as Vikings running back Chester Taylor burst through the defensive front and caught a pass from Gus Frerotte with his mind focused on scoring the winning touchdown with just more than a minute left.

Wilkerson had other ideas. He ran Taylor down from behind and stripped him of the ball. When the play was over, cornerback Ronde Barber had recovered the ball, holding it and victory in his hands.

"We had that film with (Derrick) Brooks and Barber and all the great hustle plays we've had here," Kiffin said. "I think we might be seeing Jimmy Wilkerson on there sometime. That was a great hustle play. That's what it's all about."

After a sack, a forced fumble and five tackles against Minnesota, Wilkerson, 27, is beginning to show what he might do in an expanded role, one that Wilkerson, a career special-teamer until this season, believes has been a long time coming.

"My playing time is not even close," Wilkerson said when asked to compare his experience this year with that of his first five seasons, all with the Chiefs.

They were anonymous years, with Wilkerson starting five games and never gaining a place in the regular rotation. His two starts last season came at defensive end only because Pro Bowl player Jared Allen was suspended.

"Sometimes I'd play three snaps, five snaps, maybe 10 snaps if I was lucky," he said. "I played more on special teams than I did on defense. It had been like that for basically five years. Now, I'm averaging about 20 snaps a game on defense, and I'm on just about every special team.

"I'm having fun, man. In Kansas City I was just basically mad all the time. I'd take it out on people on special teams. I had a lot of frustrations and was mad at the coaches, wondering why I wasn't playing."

He took those concerns to defensive coordinator Gunther Cunningham. Told by Cunningham the front office would have to address his issue, Wilkerson went there for answers. Then, like a caller trapped in an automated phone system, he was bounced around again.

"I went to management and asked them the same question," he said. "I was told that the coaches wanted to play the young guys that they drafted. That didn't make any sense to me. Here you had me, a guy with years of experience in the system against guys who were just out of college and just learning the system. They're getting playing time before me?"

How, then, did the Bucs come to recognize the former Oklahoma Sooner's suitability for their defense when he so rarely was on the field?

Tried and true scouting methods that have uncovered defensive gems such as Jovan Haye and Greg White are the reason Wilkerson's number was among the first the Bucs dialed on the first day of free agency this year.

"Part of the thing we saw in Jimmy in preseason film and the little bit of regular-season film we saw was the Buc defensive line characteristics that we always try to find," said Mark Dominik, in his seventh season as director of pro personnel.

"It's that high-energy pursuit and toughness. He showed those. And you also saw a guy who looked like he had some instincts and could locate the ball and attack and pursue from the backside. If there was a play it didn't look like he could make, he'd still try to run it down."

Those are skills Wilkerson, 6 feet 2, 290 pounds, has shown of late as he forces coaches to find a place for him in the rotation. He is frequently used as a nickel rusher, playing on the interior defensive line in passing situations. At other times, he switches to left defensive end, where he helped create a consistent pass rush against Minnesota that yielded five sacks.

Wilkerson's role is the biggest of his career. The only question is whether it continues to grow.

"We thought he was a good player," Kiffin said. "But really, he's exceeded our expectations."



[Last modified: Nov 21, 2008 06:12 PM]

Our pass rush is the league's worst, but we couldn't use this guy...nah....

yep ... i like Wilkerson

really wanted to keep him

our coaching staff deserves to be genocided....their families too

ya I always liked him too

Yeah, I was a Wilkerson fan. I was very surprised they let him walk. No competent team would've done that.

I noticed the other day that the Vikings had three ex-Chiefs playing on defense: Jared Allen, Nap Harris, and Benny Sapp.

It's hearing about guys like Wilkerson, Fujita & Mitchell doing just fine now is why we need to so badly fire Herm & Gunther this offseason so our young players have a chance to develop before it's too late.

I have absolutely zero faith in the current coaching staff's ability to develop young defensive talent.

Without that move, I fear we'll indeed turn a Glenn Dorsey into the next Ryan Sims.

These types of articles really make me feel like there is no hope for this team

I really always wondered why they didn't use him more or properly.

wilkerson didn't cost anything, and he's better than Herm's draft pick McBride...

but Herm is immune from criticism because we're rebuilding..he's a damn genius

you know ..... everyone always says i'm too negative about everything.

but guess what, i liked wilkerson (and said so before we let him go)


he was AT LEAST a solid backup, at a position that we've been sucking ass at for year.

:shake:

disappointing

Come the **** on.

Teams lose players to free agency all the time.

Wilkerson's had 15 tackles and 2 sacks all season.

McBride's had 41 tackles and 1 forced fumble. And he's been playing in pain and missed a few games.

With these responses, you'd think the Chiefs had let go Reggie White.

JFC.

This isn't a thread about Wilkerson's stellar abilities, it's about how the coaching staff is such shit that it can't get a lot of out players like obviously the Bucs' staff can.

I'm not heartbroken about losing Wilkerson. He hasn't been a world beater in Tampa.
He was an underachiever as a Chief. I'm fully aware that our staff leaves a lot to be desired, but until he can produce consistenly elsewhere... I'm not all that concerned about him not playing here anymore.

Wilkerson is going to be a monster. He was developing fine at OU, came out too early, and got stuck on the worst team/organiziation in the NFL. He would have been a first rounder if he would have stayed at OU another year.

Thank God, for his sake, we let him go. F*** you, Carl, for letting him go.

Tell me you're joking. He's already played past the average NFL players' life expectancy. He has 3 career sacks in 6 seasons.

He's going to be a monster?
You mean the type that molests children or the ones that hide in the closets?

Is Snoop Minnis active?

A monster huh?

Wilkerson is what he is: A Role player.

didn't do enough here to warrant it.

OK I embellished a little bit :) He did have T Harris working on the same line at OU, also.

BUT, give him another year in a decent system, and I believe he can be very good against the run, and 8-12 sack pass rusher. He is only 27, too.

Remember, he was playing out of his normal position most of his time here in KC.
Never underestimate the incompentance of our coaching staff.

I have a REALLY hard time believing he'll ever have a 12 sack season in the NFL.

He was pretty good when he was here if you would've watched him. Like the article said, he was only getting 5 snaps a game. In order to know whats really going on in the trenches you gotta watch the trenches on a play by play basis, not just the highlights. There are players on this roster right now that are in similar situations. For example, Ron Edwards is playing better than any defensive tackle on this roster but he doesnt' get many snaps.

I think Herm deserves a 5-year extension.

he was on the radio after he went to TB, and trashed the chiefs front office. He said he was surprised anyone would stay here with the way they treat their players.

That doesn't really surprise me with some of the things I've heard, but yes when you look at how many lineman this team has picked high to have none of them workout reflects on the organization as much as it does the players.

I see a pattern developing...

We draft defensive players ....

We don't develop them...

They play better elsewhere...


We draft defensive players ....

We don't develop them...

They play better elsewhere...


We draft defensive players ....

We don't develop them...

They play better elsewhere...

God, we really need a new ****ing GM. Carl first. I don't even care if Herm stays one more year, but Carl and his cronies like Gun need to gtfo.

Kinda like they are doing with Ryan Sims?

I will still to this day never understand that Turk McBride pick it makes no sense at all.

We needed a guy who could play DE for 4 games that we could then slide over to DT. So we drafted a guy who wasn't really suited to either.

I wanted Ryan Kalil, but we were still playing Solari ball with Wiegman.

Yea we couldn't draft him he went to USC don't you know USC is hated around these parts.

Oh, give me a ****ing break.

Wilkerson has 15 ****ing tackles!

How is THAT development?

Especially after 4 years in Kansas City.

The guy is what he is: a 6th round draft choice that is hanging on by a thread in the NFL.

Big. ****ing. Deal.

its not usc(even though the guys drafted from there all end up injured)

Well he could be Turk McBride who has more roughing the passer penalties than sacks.

and turk has 41 tackles

Name ONE who's played "better".

Fujita's numbers aren't "better".

Mitchell's numbers aren't "better"

And for ****'s sake, Wilkerson's a bum.

In addition, all of those guys went to teams that already had good defenses in place.

Of COURSE they're supposed to better because of the talent surrounding them.

JFC. You guys act like the Chiefs let go of three Pro Bowl players.

And he's been injured all year.

But don't let the facts skew Mecca's viewpoint.

:rolleyes:

The fact that we're having this argument really is all we need to know about how bad the team is and how shitty our line is...

And for the record stats don't always tell the whole story of players Mitchell has been a better player since he left the Chiefs.

I'm sorry, oversized ends that are slow and don't generate a pass rush don't excite me.

the TEAMS might be better the player still looks the same.

Your and idiot

All I'm sayin is this team better learn how to draft ends because so far they've used a 1st and a 2nd rounder and we got exactly shit to show for it.

Don't forget Terdell Sands.

KM and SF are better than anyone we've started at LB this year other than DJ.

and used a 4th on the guy who ended up being pretty good( and got us a couple of really good players)

We should just blindly draft longsnappers and hope for a Pro-Bowler. Seemed to work out last time.

So?

The Chiefs traded Fujita and Mitchell was a free agent.

Just because they're better than what's currently on the roster doesn't make them "great" players. I'd say they're both average at best.

And Mitchell? JFC. That guy knew how to ride a running back better than anyone in the league. For how many years was he referred to as "Kaweaka"?

Longing for Mitchell, Wilkerson and Fujita is like longing for Steve Fuller, Steve Pelluer and Dave Kreig.

No thanks.

FYP sorry had to

Herm wasn't here for that pick, so I wasn't really counting picks before that.

If you want to start going back we hit on a 4th round pick that the Chiefs thought would be a long snapper while we have bombed on to many to count.

carl was right?

Boy, this really pisses me off. If we still had playmakers like Kawika and Wilkerson, our defense would be AT LEAST 31st right now.

um...but they ARE better than what we currently have. And we let them go.

a great team is not made up of 53 pro-bowlers. we had young above-average players, and we let them walk. what do we have now?

Read some more of the thread, you will see that I pulled back some of the embellishment.

If you look into Wilkerson a little more, he was drafted a year earlier than he should have been, and he has a lot of potential.

Tampa will make him a lot better player than the KC coaches even gave him a chance to become. If you think otherwise, you are pretty much stating that our coaching staff is better than Tampa, thus making you look like the idiot. I doubt that you are Dane, you have posted some good stuff every once in a while.

I've watched this guy in about 5 games this year for Tampa. He's 100x better than he ever played around here. I don't care about tackles. He's blown up several plays.

He never did that here.

That comes down to coaching.

Are you really arguing that we have coaches that can get the most out of players?

COACHING. COACHING. COACHING.

Kawika Mitchell is a much better football player since he left KC. Not even close. The point is, we really don't know how good a lot of these guys are because we are relying on a horrible coaching staff to DEVELOP these players.

This team will never be competitive again under Carl Peterson. Anything good that happens under his watch is pure happenstance. And, I lose more and more faith in the Hunt Family with each passing day.

We're at a crossroads people, a moment of truth. What transpires at the end of this season is going to set the tone for a long time to come. If Clark doesn't sack-up; just burn your gear and call it a day, cause' it's pretty much over. Unless of course you enjoy watching the Titanic sink slowly for 3 to 5 years.

Too bad Gruden is sitting pretty in Florida. His post-game interview is stuck in my mind for some reason and flattery aside, I get the feeling he was genuinely impressed with the majority of the young talent we have, and wouldn't mind taking a crack at whipping this team in to shape.
Or stealing our talent...:)

You'll NEVER hear that argument from me, especially if we're talking Line Coaches. Tyler Thigpen and the Gailey "Quasi-Spread" are the only things making that O-Line look "not completely a pile of shit", and even with that; they're still skirting the border.
It's just ****ing sad...

You're right.

Gailey is absolutely 100% the only one.

Gunther is bar-none the worst DC in the entire NFL.

but...but he had the #1 defense in 1967

ROFL

The thing that just pisses me off and confuses me, is that this staff is the most "charming" bunch of losers you'll ever see and hear.

Go to the KCC site, and watch 'Chiefs TV' with Mitch H. You're watching these interviews with great questions from Mitch, great answers from Gun, great answers from players who aren't really getting it done, and it's like "What's going on here"? "Why isn't this translating in to effective play and leadership"?

I'm watching bits of practice sessions, and the only guy I see running a solid show is the Coach in charge of the Corners( and it shows ). Everything else just looks like going through the motions.
Despite appearances, we DO have some contenders on this team. And it KILLS ME that these guys aren't getting the development and leadership they deserve.

We need to draft players who can develop themselves. :)

No, I'm not saying that the Chiefs coaches are getting the most out of their respective players.

I'm saying that Wilkerson is a bum. And if some Tampa beat writer had something better to write about today, no one would even be discussing him.

Kawika Mitchell looked better when surrounded by Aaron Ross, Michael Strahan, Justin Tuck, et al?

You don't say?

:hmmm:

I think the Chiefs played Mitchell out of position for 4 years. I think Chiefs defensive coaches should be fired and never allowed to coach in the NFL again.

But I don't think that Mitchell is anything better than an average OLB. Could the Chiefs use that? Of course.

The Chiefs need help everywhere.

Throw in a towel boy who can "develop" good micro-brew out of Carl's newly vacated office, then pass it out for free to us fans in the stands, and I'm down with that.:thumb:

Who's your vote for new Head Coach? Hypothetically speaking of course.

Since we're in Fantasy Land anyway, I've been pining for some "Chin-age" to storm the sidelines for about a year and a half.

Or hell, just ANYONE with some brains in their head and fire in their gut!
:toast:

Although I agree with our coaches being morons, this is a total homer article.

Wilerson has started 5 games, and has 3 sacks in damn near 6 yrs.

Whoopty fucin doo. Way to go charlie husltle. Who gives a shit.

I agree Mitchell should have strictly been an OLB and that playing with Tuck/Strahan/etc makes him look better but he is above average MLB, Mitchell is a speed/strength freak and has good awareness IMO. His improvement is more than being surrounded with better players, coaching has got to be a factor. When you can't get guys to perform and they go elsewhere and perform then there is a coaching problem.

Is the coaching problem x's and o's? Perhaps.
Is the coaching problem being too strict or too leniant, or handling certain players the wrong way, showing preference to certain players, locker room problems? Perhaps.

Could be anything but clearly coaching can't be dismissed here.

How about that ex-Chief that the Bucs TRADED for? Boy he is tearing up the league now. LMAO Some players work out better in different systems, others are just fat pieces of shit with no talent. Now if Simms had turned his career around in TB, I would be upset.

The Bucs were foolish to cut Chris Simms.

They need a QBOTF.

Maybe we can trade Thigpen to them after we draft Stafford.

And LJ.

Cowher, just shoot me now. :rolleyes:

???

I was talking about Ryan Simms.

Its Sims, not Simms.

Oh, do you mean Ryan Sims?

Kendall Gammons?

Branden Alberts?

Chase Daniels?

You're right; let's keep Herm. What the **** was I thinking? :rolleyes:

Most of us would like to get some front office people and coaches that have no past ties to the organization.

That's reasonable, but Cowher's ties and/or loyalty bonds to Hunt and Carl can't be too deep, right?
I mean, he did hit the bricks under Carl's watch, yes? I'm guessing any Arrowhead Loyalty he might possess lies squarely with Schottenheimer.

And, it would be a Total Control situation anyway; Carl would have NO part in that picture. It's a pipe-dream; our ownership doesn't have the stones or the cash to make a move like that.

Though I do have a somewhat inside-source who informed me that Bill's name was being tossed around in a very serious way prior to the emergence of Thigpen/Gailey. Whether it's still on important lips these days, I couldn't say.

Maybe I'll get nosy and find out.

I guess I do. I thought it was Simms.

Even with playing out of position, Mitchell was called Kaweaka, in part, because of poor tackling.

He's moved on and his tackling has improved substantially.

Among the other problems, one of the most obvious is that ****her's defenders are among the worst tacklers.