Haley reminds me of....
 

Brian Billick.

Billick was the offensive coordinator of the Vikings from 92-98 and had one the highest scoring offenses in league history in 1998. The Vikes had an older QB, Randall Cunningham, a super talented, young receiver, Randy Moss, and another very good receiver, Chris Carter.

Billick went on to win a superbowl, but his offenses were never very good.

The point of the comparison is to show that coaches are often given credit for success that may not be attributable to them. Haley maybe a great coach, but the success of the cardinals offense is not enough to determine that.

The Chiefs should hire Chan Gailey as head coach and wait for a more proven coach if Gailey is not successful instead of making a huge commitment to a unproven coach like Hailey.

Chan Gailey was a massive, massive failure as a HC.

I do not want to play musical chairs with coaches each year. Hire the guy you want leading this team for the next 5 years this year.

It better not be Gailey.

Why hire a loser? Chan has never won as a HC.

And, no they should not hire an interim HC. If they were going to do that they should have kept Herm on for the last year of his contract. They should get "their" coach so he can help Pioli build the team. You can hire a coach now ... have a draft/FA's and then start all over next year.

OMGWTF

With a little BBQKFCJFC thrown in.

I wouldn't mind a young Billick. Especially one that hires a good OC.

There is not a coach like that available.

Gailey was not a great HC with the cowboys but he did make the playoffs both years that he was there as head coach. He could be good with a good defensive coordinator. Not my ideal choice, but with his experience with the offense, he could continue to develop the offense with better lineman.

Of course there is.

Did you think Mike Smith could lead the Falcons to the playoffs with a rookie QB?

He had an insane amount of talent with the Cowboys.

He was ****ing awful as a college coach, and it took him about 8 weeks to figure out his offense wasn't working.

Hell, YOU could have made the playoffs with the Cowboys' roster then. They won the Super Bowl with Barry freaking Switzer, fer crissakes.

Thats what Patriots fans thought about Billichick at first and same with Colts fans thought about Dungy... since both weren't that good the first time around.

So, are you saying that I'm right about Gailey since Belichick and Dungy were both fired from previous coaching positions before becoming successful? Belichick had one winning season with the Browns in five seasons. Dungy was more successful than Belichick in his previous head coaching job with the Bucs, but the Bucs still fired him.

Haley doesn't have any head coaching experience, so I don't see how this relates to him.

So basically your strategy is for the Chiefs to essentially not compete until they can get a proven coach?

What if they hire Gailey and the Chiefs go 9-7 next year. Under your plan, you would favor the Chiefs firing Gailey and hiring Cowher or Shanahan?

Is your plan advocating essentially naming Gailing as an interim head coach until they can hire a head coach like Cowher?

Do you realize how brain-dead your idea looks?

Seriously :shake:

In a way, but personally I would rather not promote someone to HC from a 2-14 team. Especially when you look at the talent Gailey has had compared to what those two had with their first teams.

Billick reminds me of Gruden -- both struggled in developing a competent QB...

I could be wrong

Chan Gailey = Mike Martz

Mike Smith wasn't a head coach but he did have one year of experience coaching the LB's at Baltimore and 4 years of success as the Jags d-coordinator.

Haley has been calling the plays for one year. Haley maybe a great coach, but he seems like a big question mark at this point in his career to me. Plus he had problems with Kurt Warner, so he must not be easy to get along with.

What problems has he had with Kurt Warner?

Elaborate

Haley coordinated the passing game in Dallas with Parcells, and he's been calling the Arizona offense for TWO seasons.

When did he have problems with Kurt Warner?

I think if you hire Gailey as head coach and hire a good defensive coordinator that the chances of success would be better than hiring Haley. Haley has only been calling plays for a year if Larry Fitzgerald wasn't catching everything thrown to him, Haley wouldn't have even been mentioned. The bonus is that if Gailey is not successful that you haven't invested as much in him and hopefully you could move to a more qualified head coach sooner, maybe even promote the d coordinator that you hired to complement Gailey to head coach.

I was trying to figure out that, myself... :D

He had a sideline spat with Warner about a fumble.

Haley has been OC for 2 years but Whisenhunt called the plays the first year.

Way to reach there sport.

And so what if he only called plays for one year? The guy clearly is a great playcaller. Wisenhunt didn't get half out of the offense that Haley did.

Haley would be an interesting gamble. He has the potential to be one of a long list of Parcells tree coaches who get under the players' skins, but knows how to get the best out of them. Then again, he is also abrasive enough that he could maybe lose his players if they aren't winning right away, especially with a young, impressionable team. But I keep steering back to the idea that while his approach seems to work 50% of the time in the NFL, for some weird reason it always seems to work for Parcells-tree coaches. Weird.

I don't know that he has a ton of experience with playcalling with Whisenhunt probably serving as at least an advisor most of the time he was in Arizona, but that doesn't really matter to me. In the end, a head coach can get away with lack of playcalling experience if Pioli hires a strong coordinator on both sides of the ball (which I am confident he will). What matters most is if Haley can get the most out of his players. His style is unorthodox, but it works.

It's a gamble, but it's one I'd be willing to take.

Gailey hasn't done anything merit the job. He certainly doesn't have a history of success as an HC. Not everyone can be a retread. If Gailey's only qualification over Haley is that he has HC experience, that's pretty weak.

One thing that makes me comfortable with Haley is how Bill Parcells has been singing this guys praises for a few years. Parcells loves this guy, and that counts for something.

Pioli may like a hard-ass like Haley to weed out the guys who don't fit in long term. Listening to Tony G's comments, it seems that Herm ran a looser ship that we thought. And by the way, that was one big reason Herm had no chance at staying -- being an over the top players' coach. Whoever the new coach is, there are going to be a lot of players who hate him after the Edwards regime.

The point of this post was not that Gailey is the guy, but that Haley is weak coaching candidate from a historical perspective. I don't think Gailey is a great head coaching candidate, but I do think he did something with nothing. He made an offense that was one of the worst I have ever seen into something that was decent.

With Haley, no one on this board would think he is great if not for some great plays by Whisenhunt's players. Does Larry Fitz catching a ball over two defenders make him a better coach???? Did he pick Larry Fitz in the draft??? If not, then what makes Haley such a great coach that we should commit to him long term?? The cards would have been out of the playoffs without Larry F. making those plays and no one would know who Haley is.

Also another negative for Haley is that one of the teams weakest point is on the front seven defensively. What expertise does he bring to the team that can solve those problems?

Not gonna happen but if Gailey could make this team 9-7 next year he would be coach of the year.

I don't care who takes over. A Miami Dolphins / Atlanta Falcons type turn around is very rare and not likely to happen next year in KC.

I do hope I am wrong though.

The short bus called.

They're missing the kid from the back of the bus.

so, you think Haley will be a good head coach???

Let's get one thing straight. Haley has never been a HC. So all speculation aside of his potential his record is zero. Now, that we have established that let's review. Shanahan, Parcells, Cowher hmmmmm..............all have Super Bowl Ring, Gee who do I want unkown or proven?????

I do.

Whether or not Haley will be a good coach has nothing to do with it.

Hiring a coach that you think of as an interim coach to start a new regime is about the stupiest ****ing idea ever.

i'm starting to warm up to him

What made this offense decent? The fact they could move the ball in the first half?

Please start making some ****ing sense. Haley would hire a defensive coach to handle the front seven deficiencies.

The Patriots wouldn't have won 3 Super Bowls without Tom Brady. What's your ****ing point? Haley's job was the put players in position to make plays. He did that. The Cardinals offense was pretty awesome most of the year.

You are going round and round in circles.

I knew who Todd Haley was before he was the Cardinals coordinator. I pay attention to the NFL - it's a shame you obviously don't.

I didn't say that I wanted to hire an interim head coach. I said that I believe that Gailey has a better chance of being successful with a good d coordinator than Haley does. I don't Haley has done enough to deserve a shot at being head coach yet. I do think that it is added bonus that if Gailey is not successful that the Chiefs will likely cut him loose and not stick with a bad coach because you are financially invested in him and his staff.

Chan Gailey has PROVEN he's a shit NFL head coach.

Keep spinning.

yes you pay attention to the nfl.... oh...... that's right. you thought he had been calling the plays for two years.... you need to calm down buddy. Haley is getting too much credit for his players making big plays. He's only been calling plays for a year. and they went 9-7 in the regular season with a weak schedule..... so why do you think he will be a great coach? please convince me if i'm wrong. i would like to have more optimism than i do about him if he ends up coaching the chiefs.

Continuing this argument would be pointless.

You're a hypocrite. You keep saying how Gailey should be promoted, but then you knock Haley for ALL THE REASONS you want Gailey. You say that you're concerned because our front-seven is weak defensively, but wouldn't that criticism apply to Gailey as well?

I don't have to prove anything to you. You lost when you constantly backed Chan as the next HC.

switzer was always underated as a college or NFL coach imo

i posted in the wrong thread...

Chan Gailey proved without a doubt in the NFL and in college he is not a head coach...

And for the record I don't care how long he's called plays, you can be a great coordinator and a shitty head coach. Knowing how to call plays or having experience at it is not the end all be all of a head coach.

If you want to knock Haley for saying those aren't his guys, frankly most of them are Dennis Green's players. Todd Haley was a WR coach before he was an OC, there's a reason no one in this league has WR's like the Cardinals do...he made Fitzgerald better, he's turned Steve Breaston into a player, he deserves credit for this.

First thing is Haley isnt some flash in the pan. He was on alot of coaching propsect lists before the Cardinals run in the playoffs. Reason his name wasnt brought up as much bc he wasnt the name at the time - it was Schwartz, Spags, McDaniels and Garrett.

Second, his track record with receivers is pretty amazing. Keyshawn, Wayne Cherbet, Marty Booker, TO, turned Patrick Crayton into a decent receiver. Of course the Cardinals WR's. He is tough no nonsense guy with the most primadonna players in the NFL.

Generally a Super Bowl winning coach on his second job does not produce championships. History shows a guy who failed the first time generally is the better choice - Gailey is not it so please dont bring it up, or an assitant waiting for his chance. The dyntasties in the NFL - first 2 were assitants, Lombardi and Noll. Walsh and Johnson came from the college ranks. And then you have Belichek who was a retread. Intresting that Noll and Walsh were only coordinators for two and one years.

Were they always proven or were they first time HC's at one point? Lets look back at them before they took over as HC.

Pasqualoni-
1982-1986 Western Connecticut assistant
1987-1990 Syracuse assistant
1991-2004 Syracuse HC
2005 Cowboys TE coach
2006-2007 Cowboys LB coach
2008-present Dolphins DC

Haley-
1995-2000 Jets WR coach
2001-2004 Bears WR coach
2005-2006 Cowboys WR coach
2007-present Cardinals OC

Cowher-
1985-1986 Browns ST coach
1987-1988 Browns DB coach
1989-1991 Chiefs DC

Shanahan-
1975 Oklahoma offensive assistant
1976-1977 NAU RB coach
1978 EIU OC
1979 Minnesota OC
1980-1983 Florida OC
1984-1985 Broncos QB coach
1986-1987 Broncos OC

Parcells-
1964 Hastings LB coach
1965 Wichita LB coach
1966-1967 Army LB coach
1968-1969 Army DC
1970-1972 Florida State LB coach
1973-1974 Vanderbilt LB coach
1975-1977 Texas Tech LB coach
1978 Airforce HC
1979 Giants DC
1980 Patriots LB coach
1981-1982 Giants DC/LB coach

Haley, while interviewing for the Dallas hc job (probably an opportunity for his dream job) told jones he would not coach the team if TO was on it. That integrity alone makese like the guy.

I agree with this.

Yes, everyone has to start somewhere. IMO the Chiefs need a HC who has been a HC before for the experience of knowing how to run a program. Will they be successful? If I knew that I would be in Vegas. There are two many variables involved.

Yah, I was going to mention this to. That is not the way you want to start over building a franchise. Clark could have done that on his own. Then why not just let Herm finish out his contract?

Another Good Argument for a Seasoned Head Coach.

THIS


No Gailey for Head Coach ,for that matter his azz should have been on the Herman Edwards short bus outta town :cuss:

Parcelles was unproven in 1983. Shanahan was not proven when the Broncos hired him, in fact was a failure in Oakland. Cower was an unknown before coming to Pittsburg. Those were all pretty good hires. All of those guys are out of the question. Parcelles is staying in Miami. Cower is not coming back this season, and I don't think Shanahan is either. The biggest speculation would be to imagine one of those guys as the next Chiefs HC. Having a coach that won a Super Bowl is not always a road to success. Didn't work for Stram, Ditka or Seifert. Parcelles quit in New York and Dallas before the job was done.