Deep Thoughts: By OnTheWarpath58
 

Getting ready to watch the broadcast now, but I thought I'd share my thoughts from yesterday with Tiny and Clayton watching from Section 334 at Arrowhead.



Do they call it "offense" because it's offensive?

Watching from the upper level end zone gives you an opporunity to see the entire field, plays develop, etc - and just as suspected, our WR's ARE getting open. Cassel IS holding the ball too long. I lost count at how many times Bowe wasn't the 1st or second read.

There were a few plays that come to mind that Clay and I discussed. One was a completion to Ryan, where he ran 10-15 yards up the seam, then hitched, and Cassel hit him. Cassel's eyes never left Ryan, and I asked where the **** he would have gone with the ball had Ryan not been open. You can't lock onto one ****ing guy in this league.

Another, where Bowe ran a 10 yard out, was wide open, and Cassel threw the ball away.

Guys WERE open yesterday, but Cassel has to realize that guys aren't going to be WIDE ****ING OPEN like they were in NE. If the WR has a step, get the ****ing ball in there.

Which he did on the game tying drive. So if we can program Matt Cassel's brain to think that every drive is do or die, he might become a solid QB. Otherwise, we have a "franchise QB" that's afraid to throw the ball in tight spots.

Speaking of OL, pass protection and run blocking became noticably improved when Goff left the game.


So, should they call the defense "offense" as well? They are offensive too.

I'll start with the only two positives I saw.

Glenn Dorsey had his best game of the season. And I thought that Flowers had a good game as well, though I don't recall them throwing at him much - there were several plays that he either made the play in run support, or turned the RB back inside to the big boys, usually Mays.

Mike Brown is a slower, dumber, undisciplined version of Bernard Pollard. I'm sure that Leggett is getting all the blame for the Austin TD's, but had Brown done his job, they would have been 15 yard gains instead of 60.

Mike Vrabel shoudl stick to playing TE, because he's ****ing worthless as a LB.

Another game giving up 500 yards of offense, 150 of it on the ground, and I'm sure someone, somewhere has said something to the effect of the "defense is getting better." Bullshit.

The Cowboys were the gift that kept on giving, and we said "**** you."

I don't recall a game where the opposition did this much to give a game to the Chiefs. A bounty of gifts wrapped in nice paper and a bow, and we shunned it like it was socks and underwear from Great Aunt Gertrude.

13 penalties. 4 fumbles, two of which we recovered and started drives in/near the red zone. (Thanks for half out points, Dallas!) Austin dropped 2 TD passes, and there was a 3rd at our end of the stadium that was dropped, and I don't recall who the WR was.

And the best gift of all: Starting a drive in OT from the 50 ****ing yard line, and getting ONE YARD. Nothing like getting that bike you wanted for Christmas, then getting so excited you decided to take it for a spin before Dad installed the seat. Ouch.

Someone tell Dorothy that "there's no place like home" is a crock of shit

At bare minimum, half the stadium was in blue, and personally I think we were outnumbered. Reminded me of the game in STL back in 2006 where we outnumbered Rams fans. Dallas fans were loader when thier team needed it that Chiefs fans were, crowd noise was even a factor on an offensive penalty we committed.

Wait 'til Pittsburgh comes in, it'll be 75/25 Steelers fans.

Greatest fans in the NFL, my ass.



That's it from memory, I'll probably post additional thoughts as the TV broadcast sparks some more.

A receiver may be wide open, but the QB has to be able to see it to get the ball there.

Our OL is S H I T. They not only do not open passing lanes (kinda important for a QB), but they also don't hold a block for, well, they don't hold blocks. The line is a sieve... a rusted, cracked, shot up with a figging 12-guage sieve that allows defenders to pour through.

While Cassel and the receivers certainly deserves some of the blame, remember that the OL is just as important. Until we stabilize that area, it doesn't matter who we have at QB and receiver.

You forgot LJ sucks ass.

Given.

it's a good thing Felix Jones wasn't playing yesterday..

The "Greatest Fans in the NFL" I believe do reside in Kansas City. Unfortunately, a 2-30 record and nauseating play this season, has taken just a little of the wind from our sails. However, I will concede, I don't know when you could expect to see Arrowhead really "return"....maybe 2013-ish?

What I want to know is how you could see Cassel's eyes from the upper level? :P

You can watch his head, and when he's only looking at one side of the field, it tells you all you need to know.

just messing with you. Thanks for the observations. I was wondering why he couldn't find open receivers. However, it does seem that Chiefs receivers get the least separation than any other teams' receivers. There is always a defender or two or three to tackle them right after the catch while our defenders play 10-15 yards back. Been this way for years.

Boy I tell you, Warpath would NOT shut up about Sanchez during the game. Every other play it was "Oh, Sanchez scores there." Or, "Sanchez would have hit that guy."

Awful! :D

ROFL

I still think LJ is getting a bum wrap with this crappy oline he is useless....charles quickness is better suited until we get a decent line that can give lj a crease

LJ is running soft too. He does not explode into the line... he hesitates, then goes down to first contact.

Savage runs <i>hard</i>. Watch a couple of each players' runs, and you will see the difference.

LJ has run hard a few times this year, but for the most part, he is playing soft. I think that's why he is getting dogged.

Everyone knows the OL is shit; it is frigging obvious. Even Joe Buck and Aikman saw that.

I've developing a strong hatred for Vrabel. The only time you ever hear his name mentioned is when he's complaining on the field. He's perpetually pissed off.

"Mike Vrabel has never been on an 0-5 team in his life!!!! He provides good leadership and a strong veteran presence because of all the winning he's done!!! He's the "consummate" professional!!! From the day he got in here he's been nothing short of everything you'd want in a player!!!"

**** you Holthus. I'm tired of listening to you kneel and bob on Vrabel, and I'm tired of watching him complain to the refs.

LJ use to go into a pile, and squirt out underneath on the other side for a couple extra yards. Use to

it starts and stops with the o-line. plain and simple. you cant even cover fundamental football with a crap o-line.

His pass rush is about as "yawn" as Hali's.

He's just a guy. Anyone could have caught that TD.

Great post. Several of us were echoing all of your sentiments, save for the open receivers, as it was hard to tell from the broadcast.

If you go back to about 3:30 yesterday, there was a lynch mob forming for Leggett, when about 3 of us had to point out, that while he missed the tackle, the dumb mother****er at safety has to take the correct angle to put himself in a position to clean up.

Mike Brown should be seeing Ray Farmer as we speak. If not, "The Right 53" is bullshit.

On a more positive note, imagine how bad our defense would be without Vrabel and his leadership...

Right? Right.

Oh, and despite all the crowing about our run D: If Tashard Choice was given 22-25 carries yesterday, he probably would have had 180 yards. They really helped us by playing Barber.

/Simplex3

Cassell did hold the ball too long and I think someone needs to check his peripheral vision, there were times when he started to scramble and absolutely noone was about to touch him. That being said, he did manage to make something out of nothing a few times, and managed to eek out that last regular time drive to tie it up. I think he had a decent game, considering the fact, that of the first quarter he got sacked, how many times? Our O line needs help, something needs to happen, we can't make the run game work, which means we cant' make the passing game work, and it's because of those guys not doing their jobs.

And yes, I was absolutely DISGUSTED at how many Cowboys fans there were. And even MORE disgusted, with 2 minutes left in the game, and seeing Chiefs fans actually start leaving. There is NO way we can call ourselves the best fans in the NFL with that kind of bullshit.

And not that it matters, but I actually saw some improvement yesterday, and on the plus side, we were ahead most of the game. So that was something new!

And Mecca, the most dire, negative poster in the world, was cautioning people to give Leggett more time to develop; he's still a pup.

This, and some of us have been saying it all year.

Yes, there is pressure sometimes.

But very honestly, the OL has given him more time that people here are giving credit for, only to see Cassel get a case of happy feet and panic.

He's falling victim to as much "phantom" pressure as he is real pressure.

He's also not very good at recognizing the blitz.

Just saw the play where Brooking blitzed, and Cassel went into a shell instead of getting the ball to Pope, who had beat the LB.

The Royals drafted a guy who, literally, couldn't see, Hosmer, so, while funny, your statement about Cassel's vision isn't beyond the realm of possibility.

That would be vintage Chiefs. LMAO

You keep patting yourself on the back about this. If I were you, I would take any win I could get too. The fact of the matter is, no one is saying that Brown played well, or did his job on those plays. They're just pointing out that Legget is as bad as Brown is, and neither should be on an NFL roster.

PS: Pollard takes the same angle, or worse, and is just as slow.

Cassel looks better in the no-huddle/shotgun offense (this was true with the Patriots lsat year). But his Rob Johnson-esque tendancies in holding onto the ball too long and taking sacks is alarming. The Chiefs can go out and spend all the high draft picks and $$$ on free agents their heart desires on rebuilding the offensive line and it will be wasted if Cassel plays like Rob Johnson.

Not necessarily. There are usually more than one WR/TE/RB on one side of the field at a time. Just because he's looking at one side of the field doesn't mean he's locking onto one WR.


As far as him holding the ball too long, yes he does. But he's also the reason we were in OT after the game-tying drive. He made some great plays that made me think that he's gunna be a great QB when we get a legit team around him.

I'm sorry...this whole explanation is part of the problem. Chiefs fans were supposed to be different. I was 100% for shoving it up ownership's ass when Herm effing Edwards and Carl Peterson needed to be shown the door...but now that they're finally gone, there's no excuse. I don't care if we lose every game. Get your asses back into the stadium seat and bring the force of your fandom's will on the other team! :cuss: It does have an affect. Hell, that was at least part of Marty's success.

If the above explanation is really what this fan-base has come to, then you might as well change the team's name to the Dallas Texans and wear those retro-helmets from now on...because you're NO effing different than Cowboy fans. You're fair-weather. At least get out to the damn stadium, drink a few beers and cause 20 false starts for the other team. The twelfth man effect is real. Now go out and do your part if you're season ticket holder or local resident. Damn, this frustrates me.

Good post OTW. I was at the game yesterday as well and agree with most of your post. My biggest complaint about Cassel is he holds the ball way too long but I couldn't tell if the WR's were getting open alot because it seemed someone was in his face the whole time. After the game I heard a crazy stat that he got hit around 35 times out of his 41 attempts. I am really surprised he is still standing today.

On the defense side of the ball I kept yelling all game long not to blitz because every time they did they got smoked. They also left Legget on the island by himself which is horrible decision because he can't cover\tackle worth a shit.

As far as the crowd\fans go I will have to disagree with you on this. The Chiefs now are tied with the Bucs for the worst losing record over a 2 year period yet 50,000 Chief fans showed up and this was the first time since probably the Colts playoff game where everyone was standing the entire game.

Allow me to make two observations. (First post. I have a very soft spot in my heart for the Chiefs because I believe they have one of, if not the GREATEST fans in America.

1. Cassel needs to throw it to Bowe even if he has to fight for the ball. Bowe is a stud and he will get it.

2. Cassel holds onto the ball too long.

3. Please say goodbye to LJ

4. Chiefs must begin right now to see what JCharles can do with more playing time. It is not easy to show your skills when you only get 4-5 touches per game. You need to get into a rhythm and see what the opponent is doing over time (I played college football.)

5. The Charles' naysayers perhaps are misguided here.
First, I hear he is too small. He is 5'11" and about 200 pounds. There have been plenty of NFL runners with that build who survive on speed and stealth. Besides, see his college career.
Secondly, I read all about his many fumbles. Well, he has only lost one this year, on a kickoff, and has lost two in his career. Tiki Barber lost a hundred, or so it seemed, yet the giants stuck with him and ultimately Coughlin showed him how to carry the ball.

I have more to share, but let's chew on and discuss these points.

Great to be here. Sorry if this comes across too arrogant; that's not the real me. You guys rock!
TM

if a reciever is open and the qb cant see it is he really open? kinda like if that tree in the forest falls and no one is there to hear it does it make a noise?


It's nice to sit in a seat and second guess, i'm sure its ALOT different with 5 guys running free at you

Good post! I agree with pretty much all of it, and I also learned that 2=5! :toast:

Oooops...I guess I got carried away.! :):LOL:

Cassel may or may not be developing a case of Drew Bledsoeitis. This is a condition where, after being hit so many times and not having faith in your OL and skill players, you develop a.) happy feet, b.) lock onto a WR without seeing options, c.) hold onto the ball too long and get sacked, and/or d.) get skittish and throw the ball away too early. Having said that, Cassel is young enough and talented enough to work through it.

One issue is the same one I see with my Patriots: shitting OCing and playcalling. Both Brady and Cassel suffered similar fates: when they were allowed to open things up and do what they do best, they did well, but when the shitty offensive calling got in the way the team sucked. 1st down, run for 1. 2nd down, run for 1. 3rd down, incomplete (since 3rd and long is an obvious passing down). Punt. NO team will look good doing that.

Say what you want about him, but Cassel's not the problem on your team. Starting QB is low down on your list of worries. Frankly, if my Patriots had held onto him and let Brady come back slowly, the Pats would be 5-0 right now.

Yeah, kind of awesome. Also, my only knock on Charles outside the fumbling is that I'm willing to bet he can't read. Man, I really wanted to move Larry and somehow take a shot at Donald Brown last year, I think that dude's got something.

Excellent analysis, OTWP58!

The I noticed immediately was that when Smith replaced Albert and Alleman replaced Goof, the running lanes opened up, Cassel appeared more confident and the offense put together a good drive. Why Goof returned to the game was beyond me.

The bottom line for me is that Alleman is far superior to Goof and that the Chiefs need to get Wade Smith on the field, whether it's at center or right tackle.

He's far too athletic to be sitting on the bench.

Was the reason Smith got in because Eat Dookie was dinged? He's listed behind Waters and Niswanger on the depth chart with Dookie at the back up Tackle spot.

I agree. I think he is so used to not having time, that those few instances where he does have the time to go to a 2nd or 3rd read, the internal clock is telling him to lock on. I hope we haven't broken the guy...but he seemed very David Carr-ish. That said, I still was impressed with his guts.
I think Dorsey had a better game last week, but have been very impressed with him the past two weeks.
Nothing to add to this...

I was livid leaving the game yesterday. I promised myself I wasn't going to let games affect me this year, and so far they haven't, but the fact that, IMO, it was at least 75% Cowboys fans in our place was bullcrap. KC fans have proven we aren't the greatest fans in the NFL.
We have proven that we belong among the elite of fair-weather fans, though.

Nsuckwe was inactive. Why the Chiefs tried him at right tackle after he effectively started 15 games for the Dolphins at right guard is way beyond my ability to comprehend.

I believe that Wade Smith is their "utility" lineman, meaning he can play any spot on the line and fill in when needed.

Cassel is definitely holding on to the ball too long in some situations.
No question about that.

To win he'll need to take more chances, but he will also need this Offensive Line to give him time to go through his reads.

He's not turning the ball over so I suppose all isn't lost.

You'd think our awesome coaching staff would have the best guys out there

Bullshit. There were multiple threads that popped up instantly urging for Leggett to be cut. Not one. Not two. Several. It was the same shit in the game thread. Of course, since you're the kind of dumb mother****er who only posts to rip on about 5 people, I don't expect you to get this.

The fact of the matter is that someone could put a ****ing bullet through your brain and the slug would be the first original item to pass through your imbecile cranium since you were pulled out from your mother's diseased womb.

well,lets hope Haley notices this and makes the changes....

I have a feeling that after the Oakland game, he was basically told not to turn the ball over, which is leading to a lot of the hesitation. When a coach is constantly pounding into your head that turnovers are unacceptable, you are not going to be taking chances, especially with this O.

The reason Trent Green had so many INTs his first year here was that Vermeil was installing a super aggressive passing offense, which preaches throwing downfield and taking chances. They didn't stray too far from that even though the first year they didn't have the talent they needed. Right now you've got to question how these guys are being coached...

Exactly what I said back when we signed him:

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showp...2&postcount=28

There is pressure a lot. And when there isn't pressure, there is no pocket and no passing window.

Between Waters, Niswanger, or Goff, one of those guys either misses a block or gets immediately pushed back on almost every single play. And it's usually Goff.

People assume that just because a QB has time, he's not being affected by the pass rush. That's just not true.

100% correct. It wasn't just confidence. It was fundamentals too. When Cassel actually had a window to look through, you could see him going through his progressions like a real QB. Few top-tier QBs have even a fraction of the protection issues he has to deal with.

If Haley doesn't bench Goff after this game, then somebody needs to sit him the **** down.

Excellent point. Haley has stressed the importance of not turning the ball over since the off-season program began. I'm sure if he had his choice he'd rather Cassel go down than get picked off.

I think the playcalls substantiate that claim.

I think some of you are being a little short-sighted. Besides the fact that this team has won 2 out of their last 30 games, our economy has completely shit the bed. I am sure there are plenty of people who used to have season tickets (myself included) that just cannot afford them right now. I would never put the Chiefs before my family.

I would say it is about 50/50 Chiefs sucking and the economy that is causing reduced season ticket numbers.

Good Analysis OTW. I'm not as low on Cassel as you are. The line blows. It really does. Just badly. People were saying Manning's line is bad and he still makes plays, but the mother****ers we have don't even get out of their stances before they're beat. Did Dallas send anymore than 4 all day? And they still hit Cassel every play.

I still think Barry Richardson should be starting. Goff should retire and we should activate Ndukwe for RG. I was surprised that Wade Smith wasn't epic fail at LT. Very surprised.

We saw the O-Line improve markedly when Allenman replaced Goff in the game.

It was no surprise that the line play reverted to the same crap as soon as Goff re-entered the game.

Exactly. The poor guy was hit over 20 times! TWENTY! Any QB would be gun shy.

I do think the defense played GREAT in the 1st half. Those turnovers don't just happen. Also, #84 couldn't catch a cold. Once they figured out Miles could catch, they just kept throwing to him.

And, what happened to my fantasy TE, Witten? I figured him for 120 and 2 TDs. But noooo, the Chiefs had to go and cover him, hmmm?

And Choice averaging 11.5 per pop?

that was the second half

Choice killed us if they had given it to him instead of Barber that would have been a long ass day.

Choice is going to tear up next year in Shanny's offense.

I have to agree with that. LJ cannot bust through the middle. Several time I saw him pokey up to the line when he thought he couldn't break it and then go down with first contact. He's saving himself for life beyond the Chiefs. I have spoken up for LJ in the past. No more.

I think he had an earpiece with live feed from Dane McCloud.

Great post OTW. :thumb:

I'd hate to see your critique of the tailgating before the game. ;)

Same shit he has been doing on most carries, since he got his contract. He doesn't want to be hobbled, for dancing in the evenings with them Hoes he wants to slap.

The tailgating was outstanding as usual, with the exception of some shitty chili.

:D

ROFL

Yeah Monty's tailgate kicked ass...I stuffed myself...

Glad to hear it! Meeting you was good....you're nothing like what I had expected(in a good way) and I hope you got some over the weekend. :D

if we didn't fill the stadium was ...that's bad