Taylor Mays 40 Time (4.43) is very wrong
 

Posted this in the Berry thread, but that just doesn't seem right.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/oDhYKZHKh4Q&rel=0&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/oDhYKZHKh4Q&rel=0&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

That manbeast can flat out fly.

who cares?

doesn't matter ... Mays doesn't actually play that fast anyways.

repost?

Mays plays fast as balls during every USC game I've watched during his years on the team.

he looked fast as hell thats for sure

Seriously.

No man, he's ****ing slow. This play, where he runs with a guy that ran a 4.35 at the combine to the sideline, shows how slow he plays.

<object width="640" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/26rLxHZpiKQ&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/26rLxHZpiKQ&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="640" height="385"></embed></object>

It's pretty clear that all of the Mays hate is nothing more than Mecca hate. Otherwise people just really don't know what they're watching. That play with Jahvid Best says it best.

That clip OTWP posted is pretty ridiculous. Mays is an athletic freak, no doubt about that.

Look how easy Mays made that look. He took the guy down with a brush of his arm.

If we were picking 10, he would likely be in my sig.

Pretty much. For some reason, I see Taylor Mays going to the Steelers in the draft and he'll be a huge pickup for them.

Mecca is a douche!!111!

So make him a ****ing linebacker. Wait until he has to use his hips. then we'll see.

PS: Feel free to post all the times he hunts down bad 4.6 receivers in the PAC-10..

Look at that Linebacker run! Oh thats Taylor Mays :p

I do want to post this on here before I get blasted: I like Taylor Mays. He's a great, great 2nd round pick for pure upside. But I just don't think he's someone you draft in the top 15 based on Safety ability.

Water is wet.

Ah, come on, dude...

In that clip, though, the RB isn't going full speed upfield. He's just running sideways, pointed kinda forward. Not saying Mays is slow, but that was a bit deceiving considering the RB wasn't running in a straight line while Mays was.

Not to math-dork out here, but if you have two guys who measure similar 40 times, and both are running towards one point.. if one starts 15 feet behind that point (5 yards-- J.Best as HB), and the other starts 5 feet behind that point (1.6yd --TMays).. and they meet one yard before the LOS.. how does that really prove anything? It's straight-line speed, and it's about what you'd expect.. nothing a safety's expected to do is displayed there. I just don't understand how that's a compliment to Mays as a safety.

Correction: it's 8 behind LOS for Best and 4 above LOS for Mays.. They meet nearly at LOS. How does that flatter Mays?

Mays is always pretty much running straight ahead with his hips pointed forward, while Best has to move laterally at the beginning and at the end, when Mays closes on him. Again, I'm not saying Mays is slow, but that clip isn't really impressive to me. The 40 vid from NFL Network was way more impressive. But they don't just run 40 yard dashes in the NFL.

It's impressive because Best is a guy basically no one ever closed on, on outside runs.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/vFa4aEsZzzw&hl=en_US&fs=1&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/vFa4aEsZzzw&hl=en_US&fs=1&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

4.4 speed with killer instincts (Thomas) > 4.3 speed with questionable instincts (Mays)

Maybe. I know I would be equally happy with Berry or Mays.

I like how Mays almost gets stiff armed by Best.

Really good play by Mays though...unfortunately he doesn't make many of those.

Cause the clips below is what we currently have.... I'll let you compare the angle of attack by our esteemed Mr. Brown, to that of Mays....

Watch these, and tell me that a competent speedy safety like Berry or Mays wouldn't make a considerable difference in the defense.

http://uranus.ckt.net/%7Egochiefs/browns2/brown.gif

http://uranus.ckt.net/%7Egochiefs/bengals/brown2.gif

http://uranus.ckt.net/%7Egochiefs/bengals/brown3.gif

http://uranus.ckt.net/%7Egochiefs/browns2/brown2.gif

http://i47.tinypic.com/21lpwfl.gif

http://uranus.ckt.net/%7Egochiefs/raiders/brown3.gif

http://uranus.ckt.net/%7Egochiefs/chargers/brownbad.gif

Everybody needs to watch this. Mays missing tackles all over the place, getting beat in coverage, taking bad angles...he's not good at football, folks.

I love those gifs. On safety, we can agree: Glenn Dorsey could take a shit and throw it at a player and have a better chance of tackling the runner than Mike Brown. We need to address safety; if it's #5, it better be Berry. If Mays is available at 2a, take him. But he projects between there, and I think it'll be a bad decision for a team to use a first on him. Top of the second is about where he belongs-- take players based on raw upside (many of these players are just a few lingering questions from being in the first-- see: Flowers, Brandon).

I should have placed this in the OP, but I posted the video of Mays running more as a concern that they could **** up that big at the combine.

I am sure that posting a 4.32~ instead of a 4.43 is a big difference to a lot of coaches, so I hope the combine sends around a correction or something. This could potentially cost Mays a lot of money for something that is not his fault.

There are six times that go into the "official time". Teams have access to all of them, plus their own times. Teams aren't being hoodwinked, nor is Mays being ripped off.

Ok, good. I don't really know the process so thank you for letting me know this. It just seemed strange to me.

Damn, those are some terrible angles.

1 time is started by hand and ends with electronic timing.
2 are hand times at both the start and finish.

They do that for both runs, thus you get 6 times total. I don't know the formula for the "official" time that is released. I'm told each team treats the 6 times differently - some average all of them, some discard the highest and lowest, etc. Some rely on their own hand times.

Watching that video he looks like a really fast Bernard Pollard. Doesn't look like he knows how to do much but headhunt.

Because he needs the speed to make up for his lack of instincts? :D

Sorry, but Mays just doesn't show any instincts whatsoever back there.

Even at 10 I wouldn't take him. At 20 I'd consider it, but might still pass. Ultimately I think Earl Thomas will make a better pro.

This kid has Thomas Davis written all over him, perhaps even Urlacher. It's certainly not a bad thing and there are certainly ways he can be utilized on the football field, but safety just isn't one of them, IMO.

What's troubling to me about Mays is that with his uber-super-natural athleticism, 4 years starting in a big time program with excellent coaching, he still has very questionable instincts. You have to be concerned whether he will ever get "it".

After watching the video I'd be almost terrified to have him and Wrong Angle Page playing next to each other.

They wouldn't play next to each other, they play the same spot.

Earl Thomas likely isn't a safety at the next level either, Mays is what he is, an overly athletic freak that will most likely be a better pro than he was collegiate player.

They wouldn't play next to each other, they play the same spot.

Earl Thomas likely isn't a safety at the next level either, Mays is what he is, an overly athletic freak that will most likely be a better pro than he was collegiate player.

6 years and he is out.

Doubt it, Mays even if he never develops big play ball skills is a long term starter in the league.

That's why he's rated high, yes he's an athletic freak but his floor is pretty high and his ceiling is the sky.

He's rated high because people get hard ons for bodies and 40 times. It's not because he's a good football player. Same with guys like JPP.

If the guy was going to turn into a good football player, shouldn't it have happened already since he was a 4 year starter for a guy who is the head coach of an NFL team now?

I think some people have a really hard time realizing what a cover 1 deep safety does, if he was this bad how did USC have the defense it did the prior year?

It's like it's now somehow Taylor Mays fault his front 7 turned into shit.

This only happens if he has a bionic swivel installed for his neck. like i said in the other thread NFL OCs will abuse his lack of ball position skills over the top and his lack of hip flex underneath early and often. Hes good for atleast one game killing interference penalty a game.

USC had some other guys who were pretty good on defense the year before this past one and you know that.

His deep responsibilities don't have anything to do with him taking poor angles and missing tackles.

That's my major concern.

He doesn't seem the have the flexibility to be elite in coverage. He has the speed to make up for some of it, but he's certainly going to get beat deep some w/ a slow backpeddle and mediocre hips.

Worse still, he hasn't shown an ability to make solid reads in run support. He has obscene physical skills that can overcome this in college, but in the pros he won't always be able to do that.

I honestly don't think he'll make a plus safety. He may be a guy that's starting caliber, but that pretty much just makes him Bernard Pollard with more straight line speed.

He really looks like a guy that should be strong side OLB to me.

If you constantly badger a guy as a bad tackler, why would you want to make him a front 7 player? That doesn't make any god damn sense.

Also his entire role at SC was as a deep cover man, if he was shit at it he'd have gotten beat numerous times over the years.

If he can't tackle, and he can't cover, why would you want him playing in the secondary?

pac 10 v. nfl caliber players week in & week out isnt even in the same galaxy.

The idea that he can't cover is completely overblown, he doesn't have great ball skills but that doesn't make him ****ing Bernard Pollard either.

We're talking about a guy playing cover 1 for a team that gave up the fewest passes over 20 yards in college football, they'd have given up some big plays in the pass game if he had no cover ability.

But the fact that he WILL be a liability in deep coverage remains.

We'll see, when he's not responsible for so much field he'll probably look much better in coverage.

Mays is a guy that I fully expect to be better in the pros than college because NFL teams don't play cover 1.

They did give up big plays in the passing game. It's not like they didn't allow any.

I fully understand as you have commented on these facts numerous times. My statements still has truth in them. .

Because he would be a guy that could get to the edges and re-direct plays back into the muck. I don't want him playing MLB.

Time will tell, but I don't see him being more than an average safety in the league.

You are saying USC played a cover 1 this year?

They did, they didn't plan to and it was part of why Mays came back but when Shareece Wright was ineligible to play it meant that Josh Pinkard had to move from FS back over to CB Mays moved back to FS and Will Harris came back in at SS.

They still played as a base cover 1 team, and at times Mays tried to do far to much to make up for other players and well it didn't turn out well.

Will Harris was similar to Ellison in that he's fine in the box and when Mays could basically cover for him he looked fine on the field.

Negatives: Misses plays because he is out of position. Does not read keys well and diagnose. Struggles covering man deep. Plays out of control and lacks great change of direction. Skills will translate to the NFL, but measurables might not. Gets carried away. Prefers setting up a well-timed hit to break up a play over going for an interception. Does not have great playing speed and range.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfldraft/t...player?id=6771

Probably an enormous bust for these reasons. Oh wait, that's Troy Polamalu's draft profile :)

Polamalu looked a lot more natural than Mays and made a lot more plays in college. Polamalu almost had as many pick 6's as Mays had career INT's as a 4 year starter.

It'll be interesting to see if his instincts will get better or not. He'll blow people up and make sports center highlights, but I think other teams will make highlights against him as well. IMO, he's not a top 10 pick but around 20 or so.

id love to see him go to N.O.;) i just dont want him anywhere near a chiefs locker.