Would Haley/Weis ever consider Croyle instead of Cassel?
 

First and foremost, leave out the Croyle is injury prone issue.

That done, let's proceed...

Haley has said many, many times that the players that give us the best chance to win will play.

Reports from the OTA's have pretty much said that Cassel's performance during practice pretty much mirrored last season production during games. Very inconsistant.

Even though Croyle's practice time was cut short, it seems as though his reports were pretty glowing.

Croyle has been given about the same amount of time to groom for the QB position as Cassel (and Rodgers for comparison) with a few more actual game apperances prior to Cassel taking over for the Pats.

If this pattern continues in the preseason, do you think we could actually have a QB controversy that is legit, and that Haley would pull the switch if he thinks it would be best for the overall good of the team?

Me, I think he would. He seems very sincere in his approach to this season, and in his attempt to do everything he can to make this team better.

If it means getting the ball to a receiver down field, I think Haley would let Colquitt QB if need be. That said I don't see anything happening till game 6 at earliest. And that is only if Cassel downright loses us two or three games.

Yeah, if it was actually up to them.

Yeah i think he would, I know Haley the one pushing Warner to start over Leinert a few years ago in Preseason.

I think that Croyle is the more talented QB and will definitely make leaps and bounds under the tutelage of Charlie Weis.

But unless Cassel struggles to the point where he's directly responsible for multiple losses, Croyle won't see the field except in the case of injury, IMO.

I agree completely. Cassel is really going to have to tank for them to make a change.

This.....Unfortunately

Who cares?

Herm Edwards destroyed Brodie Croyle.

Honestly, stop pushing the croyle issue. he never was and never will be a starter. It's like a monthly thing with you. Should just change your name to herpes or some shit.

Unequivocally false.

It's an opinion, not a fact.

Croyle will never be a successful NFL quarterback.

What?

Correct. In order to be successful, you have to be able to stay on the field for more than half a game.

There's really no use in discussing if Croyle could win the job or whatever; because he probably could.

But we all know how it's going to end. Broken elbow, cracked rib, dislocated shoulder in about 2 games max.

Croyle is good for gauging the status of the Chiefs' starting quarterback, though.

If someone is pining for Croyle, you know the starter is garbage.

Well it's not just that. Whenever I see him play, I don't see a confident player. I see a quarterback who looks afraid to make a mistake.

I honestly think Matt Cassel, for all his shortcomings, is a better quarterback. Perhaps not more talented, but more capable of leading a team to a victory.

I see Croyle as a guy who can come in a game when the starter is injured and not **** it up.

It's really too bad about Croyle. If not for being made of porcelain, I think he'd be a very good quarterback.

Porcelain's far too sturdy of a material to be compared to Croyle.

Rules are stated to leave the injury piece out of the equation.

Well hell, if we're leaving reality out of the equation, we may as well talk about a possible trade for Peyton Manning. What do you think we would have to give up to get him?

You can't knock this guy except that he's injury prone. Every one hypes that Moaeki tight end around here and he's just as injury prone and has never even played an NFL down yet.

The thing is with Croyle, is that he gave the best QB play for us last season in one game, week 1, against a team that went on to be one of the best teams in the league. I'm just saying if Croyle had week 1 what Cassel had in the ending weeks with the emergence of Jamaal Charles and a little bit better defensive play, Croyle sets the bar high by beating that Ravens team. But instead Croyle had Larry Johnson, Bobby Engram and Mark Bradley to work with Week 1 and STILL managed to do a serviceable job where it was at least competitive enough to watch as a fan, even though we lost. That game was a lot better than the dumpster performances that followed for the next 15 games, especially from the QB position.

I think if we start off 0-4 or 0-5 this season how can they not play Croyle? Haley's coaching and this system does seem like something his arm can be great in. It's a shame is body is built like a glass house.

For the record I'm not Croyle fan boy or am siding with what QB should play. I want the best QB out that can throw the best football, if it comes down to OTA reports on how Croyle continues to throw "lazers with smoke coming off of them" regardless if they are intercepted or not, I'd take that arm in passing situations over the floaters and hanging WRs out to dry that Cassel throws. If Cassel's arm improves come the start of the season than this rant/point is moot. If not, I want the best cannon in there, no different than I want the best RB in there that can actually hit a hole like last season when it came down to LJ and JC.

Look at this way, if Croyle was one of the "bad/shit" Herm players, Haley and the gang would have cut his ass long ago like they have most of the dead weight already. They can't just let him go, some team will pick him up in an instant and he could end up playing well for them, boy wouldn't that be a ****ing kick in the ass. Croyle's arm is what guarantees him a roster spot on this team.

Yeah, but what happens when he bangs his wrist on his lineman's shoulder pads and shatters it?

That's likely to happen.

Not really. Cassel's game against Cleveland was better.

But Croyle did a good job of not ****ing up the game against Baltimore. That's what he does. He's just good enough to lose close games.

I think he would in a heartbeat if the injury issue was a non-issue.

Wild cat or change of pace qb.

If the line play and the RB situation continues to improve, Croyles health risk should also go down. And if the WR's and TE's add to that equation, it should even reduce the risk further.

lol, There was absolutely no qb in our system that has been confident for years now. Not with that shitty as line. In all honesty, there is no way a QB could be confident while playing behind the offensive line we have had for years. Jordan Black as our starting LT? lol

Yo, you just compared Croyle's WEEK 1 OPENING SEASON game against one of the top 3 teams in the AFC last season to Cassel's performance against the CLEVELAND ****ING BROWNS.

Think about what you are saying for a minute...

Cassel was 55 percent passing that game with a 99 QB rating and had JC run for 154 yards to HELP that passing performance, against one of two teams that were worse than us defensively last year, and CASSEL STILL COULDNT WIN THE GAME.


CROYLE was 66.7 percent passing with 116.1 QB rating in a game where LARRY JOHNSON RUNS FOR 20 ****ING YARDS against one of the top 5 defenses in the whole league.


I really hope you were just ball busting and weren't actually serious, so that this post can just make me look silly.

I agree with GoChiefs. Croyle is undeniably the more talented qb, but I think Cassel is more able to lead his team to a win. Its kind of like a JaMarcus Russel/Bruce Gradkowski situation. Russell is more talented, but Bruce would get more wins.
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Cassel had a pretty good game against the Cowboys.
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these.

Seriously? Sometimes you come off sounding like a ****ing moron.

Tell me why I'm wrong?

When has Croyle ever "wowed" you?

The ONLY thing that makes Cassel a more servicable QB is his ability to take a hit.

I realize what you are saying. I'm just saying purely from a production standpoint, Cassel was more impressive against the Browns. Croyle was fairly pedestrian against Baltimore.

Croyle has never had a game like Cassel had against Cleveland.

And that's a big ****ing part of being a qb.


I don't give a **** about a IR hall of famer.
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He's going to get hit. Hard. By very large, fast men. And he won't get up.

End of ****ing story.

Never. He just more closely resembles an NFL QB than Cassel does.

The guy gets injured from routine hits. Sorry, but that's doesn't resemble an NFL qb
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These are two very differrent questions:
Would Haley go with Croyle over Cassel if Croyle has a better training camp?
Would Haley/Weis ever consider Croyle instead of Cassel?

I do believe Haley would start Croyle over Cassel but I do not believe it would happen game one, unless Cassel were injured. Based on the trade and the contract, Cassel will start game one- wouldn't even matter if every single pass he throws between now and game one is an interception returned for a touchdown. Cassel will start the season.

Haley was singing his praises last year though, talking about how he depends on Brodie during games, how he's right next to Haley on the sidelines...sounds like Haley might have a bit of a man crush on Croyle.

But Cassel would have to completely shit the bed or be injured for Brodie to come in and start.

I don't agree. Cassel has won 15 games as an NFL QB.

Croyle has won zero.

He got hit hard last year, and got up. Again, this is a WOULD question... not a SHOULD question.

Does throwing 25yd hail marys resemble an NFL qb?

Since Croyle was drafted, Huard has won games, Cassel has won games, Tyler ****ing Thigpen won a game....Croyle? None.
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Does 0-9 resemble one? Does getting injured every single year you've been in the NFL resemble one?
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Brokie has no business being on an NFL roster. He can't step onto the field without getting hurt. It's over.

Cassel is awesome. He won all those games on his own.

It's a team game.

Seriously, what has Croyle ever done? Ever? Even that Baltimore game was fairly unimpressive. The offense scored 10 points, the defense handed them 7 more, and the special teams scored the other 7.

Brodie Croyle has never even led an offense to 20 points.

Cassel won 11 games with ALL STAR talent and still got nowhere.


Croyle won 0 games with NO TALENT and still got nowhere.

So in the end, it does not matter.

You mean to tell me if you give Croyle guys like Wes Welker and Randy Moss and that offensive line of the Patriots that he wouldn't do a better job than Cassel did? I find that hard to believe. Get Croyle in a system were every guy around him is actually good with one of if not the best coaching in the league and this isn't even an argument.

What Cassel has had for his success was a luxury and a golden opportunity. It could have been any back up nobody QB that stepped into that system that season and could have won 11 games on that team with their eyes closed.

Croyle took a bigger hit in Baltimore than Bradford could take
The lifespan of a head coach is far too short to worry about $$
even less so with a 4-12 season in the books

They are not exact, but similar. Similar enough that you know what I meant.

Despite the biggest knock on a guy, do you think...

He still wouldn't win with the Patriots. He'd get injured calling heads or tails at the coin toss
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I don't think he would have won 11 games.

I don't think some of you realize how well Cassel played that year. He wasn't dogshit. He made plays I've NEVER seen Croyle make.

He threw for 400 yards and rushed for 60 in one game.

Croyle has one 200-yard game his entire career. One.

Now, maybe if Croyle had been drafted by the Patriots and avoided the Herm Edwards mind****, he'd be a different player today. But he's not. He's never going to amount to a hill of beans in this league.

What the offense scored 10 points? Is that a joke? Croyle threw TWO touchdown passes that game and tied it with 5 minutes left in the fourth quarter.

On a team that game that had:
LJ runs for a 1.8 YPC
No Brandon Flowers on defense
No Chris Chambers

Think about the shit he had to work with that game, half the guys he was throwing to aren't even on the team anymore.

People on this forum can throw for 400 yards in a game when you have Randy Moss over the top and Wes Welker running under routes all day. They weren't the best WR duo in the league or anything, that team was coming off a ****ing 18-1 season, like seriously, that Pats team was STACKED for Cassel.

you can't leave out his injury prone stuff ... if he wasn't made of glass he would already be our starter. probably and dang good starter at that

He would of been our starter before Pioli got here and Cassel wouldn't even be here.

Croyle led two drives worth a crap that entire game. It really wasn't that impressive.

The Chiefs had barely 50 yards of offense at halftime....

Can he play NT?

Well, Cassel managed to throw for 300 yards in a game last year, in as bad a situation as Croyle has ever been in.

Croyle has never even had a 250-yard game, let alone 300.....if he throws for 400 in a game it will be because the game was fixed.

You act like Croyle has had all kinds of playing time to show that he sucks. Due to Croyle being fragile, we have no idea what kind of QB he really is. We do know his arm is loaded with potential. That's it.

Tom Brady never had a 400 yard game with them.


Just sayin...
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He played what, 7, 8 games in 2007? Didn't do much of anything.

Next year he comes out and does squat, just gets hurt.

Last year he comes out and proves he is just good enough to lose a game where defense and special teams hands him 14 points.

Based on the evidence he's pretty much a big bag of meh, and we have no reason to believe in him over someone who has actually WON GAMES.

Glass-jaw Brokie? Seriously? Will KC consider picking up Quinn when Denver cuts him?

In some ways I agree GoChiefs.

Croyle's game against Baltimore wasn't as impresssive as some here seem to think.

And Cassel's best game, all factors considered was against Pittsburg, and it was more impressive than Croyle's one game.


I also think that Croyle does play tentative as a result of the piss poor coaching he received under Herman ****ing Edwards and staff.

Where I disagree is that I don't don't think he's permanently damaged by Herman ****ing Edwards and good coaching can fix him.

The problem, however, still remains his fragility.

Four years in the league now.

If Haley don't fix him, no one will.

this
piloi won't let them

I think the coaches will play anybody for a win

I can't help but wonder if maybe he put on 10 lbs since he was drafted or especially under Haleys condition program? If he has or would I bet that muscle would definitely help his ability to stay healthy.

Which is right where Cassel and Rodgers were when they got their careers off to a start. One with great results so far, one not so much.

actually cassel threw for back to back 400 yard games for NE. and his best game last year was against pitt.

how many times did cassel bring us back in the last 5 minutes last season?

for all the 25 yard hail mary jokes, croyle was AT LEAST as bad at the end of the ravens game. again that was AT LEAST, imo it could have been worse
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And I don't give a **** about a Garbage-Time HOF'er.

At least that QB has a strong enough body to make it to the garbage time of the game.

Brodie is our Bob Sanders.

"THE BEST QB TO NEVER PLAY THE GAMES".

As far as I'm concerned, they can BOTH go do community service in the AIDS-Tree nursery.

You really think Brodie's cut out for manual labor?

He'd pop his shoulder out of place lifting the very first jug of antifreeze.

BAH!!!!ROFLROFLROFL

It is not whether Haley would start him.

It is that Pioli will never let that happen. EVER

No! /Pioli
I saw him at Best Buy and he told me that.ROFL

Brodie can thrive elsewhere, he needs to get to elsewhere before it's too late.
Cassel won't thrive again, he needs to join Scott Mitchell in the 1 year semi-wonder HoF.

You guys have kind of ventured off track here into a bashing thread of both QB's. Since OTA's are over basically... if Cassel stays inconsistant like he did last season and during OTA's, and Croyle stays sharp like he was in OTA's, do you think Haley would make the move to switch Croyle to the #1 group?