Cassel 24th out of 29 quarterbacks in downfield passing.
 

We debated Cassel's downfield passing in another thread earlier this week. I said I would wait for the splits to get updated before I compared him to the rest of the league, and here are the results (completion percentage, TD/INT):

Cassel is 24th out of 29 quarterbacks in the NFL in completion percentage on pass attempts over 10 yards.

I threw out the names in red because they have fewer than 40 attempts.

Henne - 58.6 1/1
Rivers - 54.5 7/5
Schaub - 54.4 4/4
Fitzpatrick - 54.3 7/3
Romo - 51.7 4/2
E. Manning - 50.6 8/4
Young - 50.0 6/1
Kolb - 50.0 2/2
Flacco - 49.4 10/4
Ryan - 49.3 7/2
P. Manning - 48.4 8/1
Rodgers 48.3 10/8
Orton - 47.5 7/3
Favre - 46.9 5/6
Palmer - 46.5 4/3
Garrard - 46.4 4/5
Hasselbeck - 45.2 3/3
Anderson - 45.1 1/2
Bradford - 45 5/5
Sanchez - 44.8 6/2
Cutler - 43.2 3/4
McNabb - 42.8 5/
Brady - 42.0 4/4
Cassel - 41.5 4/2
Brees - 41.4 4/5
Smith - 40.2 4/3
Wallace - 38.2 3/0 (34 att)
Moore - 38.2 3/5 (34 att)
Gradkowski 38.1 2/4
Freeman - 34.2 3/2
Clausen - 30.4 1/1 (23 att)
Hill - 29.5 4/2
Campbell - 25.8 1/2 (22 att)


For comparison, Cassel's downfield passing history:

2009 - 38.8 percent, 8 TD, 13 INT
2008 - 40.2 percent, 12 TD, 8 INT

Notes:

1. Jason Campbell and Bruce Gradkowski suck. We have no business losing to the Raiders.

2. Brees will bump Cassel to 25th in short order.

3. Sanchez, bitches!!!

4. Flacco is a ****ing stud.

5. Impressed by Chad Henne and fearful of Fitzpatrick.

but master shake said he's a genius!

http://www.chiefsplanet.com/BB/showthread.php?t=235831

didn't you see this?

he's eleventy!!!! 111

to the 'ship

yeah whatever just run the ****ing ball
someday we will get a qb
wha are the 9'ers/pats throwing away next year

Brees is vastly overrated. He will have a good... (on occasion great) season and then invariably follow it up with a dud!

I'd settle for a SuperBowl win then a dud. I mean, I guess I probably would.

They're lucky Lord Favre lost his mind when he did. Ah well... such is life.

Damn, it sure does suck to have a QB who's wedged right there between Brees and Brady.

Please pick the duds.

Only in a Matt Cassel bashing thread on Chiefsplanet could someone call Drew Brees overrated one year after he wins the Super Bowl.

Doh! Ya know, 05 and 07 were pretty rough - what with that 89 QB rating...

Where's 2003 where he sat five games behind Flutie?

Look at the interceptions, BUT that isn't the whole story. Find some stats for Red Zone interceptions please.

Whatever, it is what it is. And right now it is Cassel ahead of Brees and behind Brady.

Brees enjoys the support of the 26th ranked running game.

By the way, Brady leads the NFL's top-ranked scoring offense. I'm fairly certain the credit doesn't go to BenJarvus Green-Ellis or Danny Woodhead.

You rather talk about Jay Cutler? :D

I think you have a chance if you invoke the awful birthmark on his face. That thing is hideous.

What's amazing is how many of the QB's ahead of our hero Cassel have a .500 or worse record this season

Jay Cutler downs three long island ice teas, six miller lites, two jaeger bombs and a body shot off the hottest Chicago waitress he takes home and bangs Saturday night before getting up after four hours, enjoying a pregame bloody mary and chucking the ball down the field with 1.0409 times the efficiency of a completely sober and celibate Matt Cassel after 10 hours of sleep.

Yeah he was a total piece of shit 7 years ago....

No matter what you rationalize, Cassel is as bad as Brees and Brady on 10+ yard passes. That's the whole point of this thread. Ignoring that point and throwing in rushing stats means nothing.

Cassel is decent. He's developing. They are scheming to fit his strengths and paper over his weaknesses. We are winning with him being #25 in +10 yard passes.

Certainly a six-game stretch in 2010 outweighs the careers of Brees and Brady.

Cassel isn't as bad as Brees and Brady. Brees and Brady are as bad as Cassel this year. And Alex Smith.

I have a feeling two quarterbacks will elevate their game by the end of the year.

You said he follows up good-great seasons with duds, so I figured I'd give you 2002 and 2003... oh, and that was 7 years ago. :spock:

Here are your red zone stats... the past 5 full seasons (and if you really care, the first two lines are 2009, then 2008, etc). One is Drew Brees and one is Peyton Manning (strange how they're almost identical in # of attempts... oh, and interceptions).

Judging by the list and the order they are in proves little more than this particular stat doesn't mean shit for wins and losses. It also doesn't account for run after the catch.

You're chasing your tail here.

The only thing that matters is that Cassel is playing well right now.

Im not really interested in tearing him down just for the excersize. You come off like you have an axe to grind.

Listen, you can pick every player in the NFL and find something they dont do well. Some more than others. Those resigned to spending thier football experience looking for those short comings and whining arent doing what I would call maximizing thier football experience. In fact, why not watch something else on Sunday.

I understand more when we are losing, but we're not. We are a team rebuilding and winning with promise for the future.

Quit making an ass of yourself.

Yes it does.

By the way, of the top 10 quarterbacks on this list, 7 are 3-3 or better, 6 are above .500 and 5 of those teams are winning at a .667 clip or better.

I havent done the math....but couldnt the same be said for the 5 consecutive teams frrom Cassel on up?

Sanchez - 44.8 6/2
Cutler - 43.2 3/4
McNabb - 42.8 5/
Brady - 42.0 4/4
Cassel - 41.5 4/2

The top 3 on your list are 5-14 I believe.


Yeah, its useless.

And guess what 4 of those 5 quarterbacks have in common?

They're supported by top 10 defenses.

It's not useless. The top three are all good players.

This guy completed 57 percent of his throws over 10 yards last season.

http://www.gambling911.com/files/pub...91309L_3.jpg?0

How'd his year end up?

So you're saying Fitz is going to the Superbowl and this is a list of best to worst QBs in the league? Because if thats not what you're saying, then this is a useless stat pertaining to winning and losing. Like I said.

As far as winning and losing, more factors into a win and a loss. let me repost my original statement so you can recind yours.

Agreed. Why do you think Matt Cassel is 4-2?

Because he's playing well enough to be 4-2.

Does this mean you'll quit whining, now that you agree the stat is useless?

I won't play your game, silly man. Goodnight.

you know what the cassel defenders' argument of 'HE'S DEVELOPING' feels like? the movie step brothers...

THEY'RE OUR CHILDREN, WE CAN'T JUST THROW THEM OUT. they'll find their way eventually...BUT THEY'RE 40 YEARS OLD FFS!

yeah, he may be developing (it's debatable, imo). cool. he'll be fully developed, franchise qb within 5-6 years. and we'll have to go through how many role-players waiting for him to be more than a game-manager? moeaki will have several broken bones by then. waters will be gone. we'll likely have new starters at roughly 80% of the positions.

but hey, who cares, we're winning against shitty teams and charlie weis is game-planning to make cassel not look shitty! who freaking cares if our downfield passing game is a joke: HE'S DEVELOPING! (possibly cancer, fwiw)

Only 10 of the QB's above Cassel have a two to one TD to INT ratio over with passes over 10 yards.

Comparing Brees and Cassel is like comparing DeNiro and Jimmy Fallon.

YAC

That's not really impressive when you consider how often he throws downfield, which isn't much.

None of the top four quarterbacks on this list have a winning season.

Interesting, but meaningless stats.

And the difference between 50% and 40% downfield passing is what, one less long completion a game? What is defined as downfield anyway?

One completion and we'd be 5-1.

Cassel is 22 for 55 over 10 yards.

Schaub (54%) is 31 for 57.

That's a difference of 9 completions and at Schaubs's YPC of 21.67 over 10 yards, a difference of 195 yards, or 32.5 yards per game.

Add 32.5 yards per game to Cassel's per game average and the Chiefs would be 19th in the league in passing instead of 30th.

LMAO

As soon as you can show me a correlation between down field passing and winning this will mean something.

We already argued this in another thread. The correlation does not exist.

It's just a straw man argument that was built to have something to bitch about regarding Cassel.

Favre, Manning and Brees were all in Conference Championship games last year.

Brees - 57%
Manning - 51.5%
Favre - 48%

Who won the AFC West?

Phillip Rivers. 49.7%

Who had the four best records in the league?

Indianapolis
New Orleans
San Diego
Minnesota

Now let's take a look at the other division winners and their quarterbacks.

Dallas - Romo - 49.4%
New England - Brady - 46%
Cincinnati - Palmer - 47.5 %
Arizona - Warner - 56 %

Must be a coincidence.

boom

Someone needs to ask Weis and Haley why? Instead of passing off speculation as fact GoChiefs...

Weak sauce. Lets look at the % at the end of the year since we are using complete year statistics. What's Cassel's % the last 4 games?

I'm sure that as soon as Polian sees this he'll arrange an off season trade of Manning for Fitzpatrick or Henne.

I've said it before.
I'll say it again.

Stats mean jack.

Right now, my team has a QB who I have no confidence in his ability making plays when plays need to be made.

I had more confidence in Bono, in GrBac, in Thigpen.

One mans dump is another mans Cassel.

Last year and this year are toltally different.

This year the division leaers are NE, Pitt, Ten, KC, NYG, Chi, ATL and Sea.

Only 3 QBs on the list are in the top 10. 4 in the top half.

So judging from last season to this season, there is no consistent pattern.

So yes, it's a coincidence.

The season isn't over.

Polian? Bill Polian?

How dumb do you have to be to confuse Pioli with Polian?

:rolleyes:

I show you an entire year's worth of data proving a correlation between downfield passing and winning, and that's what you come back with?

Some of you are dumb as ****.

Here, how about this for a stupid ****ing correlation? This mother****er won more games than anyone in NFL history:

http://blog.synthesis.net/wp-content.../07/favre1.jpg

This mother****er was second:

http://www.babble.com/CS/blogs/famec...C12192603.jpeg

And this mother****er is third:

http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Page...dan-marino.jpg

Now go **** yourself.

Personally I think one of the most important things Cassel has done well is protecting the ball. He also has not been knocked around near as much as last year.

He is never going to be a great QB. But he has been playing pretty well. I think that Weiss has a way of making his QB's better. He has certainly done that with Cassel. I am willing to give Cassel the benefit of doubt and hope he can take a few more steps toward being better.

That being said this team has appeared to me to always be on the lookout for someone who can do a better job at all positions. I don't think its any different with the QB position. I am hopeful that the organization will continue to improve this team in ways that will have us excited for years to come.

Montana has 4 rings, Brady has 3. How do they compare to Favre and Marino on throwing down filed?

He WAS talking about Bill Polian. Is there a Manning or Fitzpatrick on our team?







Now you, good sir, can insert your own penis into your own anus/mouth/nose/earhole or any other hole you can think of, as long as it's your own.

I didn't confuse them, rah-rah-reerun.

Henne and Fitz are in the top 5. Peyton's not close to Henne. Henne must be better. Polian would be smart to trade Peyton to Miami for Henne.

This. His protection has been better (in another thread there's a comparison between Cassel and Brady and IIRC Cassel has 5 sacks to Brady's 12). Brady has not looked that great at many points this season, and it's usually when he's under the most pressure. Again, as has been the case for a season and a half now, Cassel's problems can't ALL be blamed on the O-line, but when they play better it helps a lot.

The bottom line is this: playing defense and running the ball is a fine way to win a Super Bowl. Ask Brian Billick, who won one with Trent freakin' Dilfer. Or the Colts, who only finally won a SB when they played a little D and ran the ball (the Great Peyton was the least important player on the field that day IMO). Or even Elway, who finally only won SBs when he had a running game. I don't think the Chiefs will mind if Matt Cassel gets mentioned along with Doug Williams and Jeff Hostetler and Trent Dilfer as "one of those mediocre QBs who won a Super Bowl".

Gay statistic. What's his W-L record this year? Oh yeah....first place in the West.

Wow, should have read that post more carefully.

ROFL

*wipes egg off face*

Im surprised more people didnt call you out on that oversight.

You've got to be shitting me.

Translation: "Wow, a lot of people must have you on ignore".

Or just dont have the energy to fight stupid on so many fronts.

I don't think that's the case at all.

It was pointed out in the second post after he made that post, and there are only about 7 or posts after, two of hwich are Claythan himself, one of which is another post pointing out his error by the original poster.

It would actually be pretty stupid to put Claythan on ignore because of his gifs.

:clap:

I think it's a legitimate question.

While I do believe that you have to keep defenses honest by chucking it downfield occassionally, I also believe that some of the greats took their shots sparingly, specifically Joe Montana.

To me, the measure of greatness is more about what you do in the last 5 minutes of big games, in the playoffs, and the SB.

Now, it is a team game, and guys like Marino and Dan Fouts were limited by the teams around them on the defensive side, so it's really hard to get a true measure of their greatness.

On the other hand, I believe a guy like Kenny Stabler is highly underrated.

Another QB I think is highly underrated is Terry Bradshaw, who changed and evolved as the team around him changed and evolved more than any other QB that I can remember watching.

No, the guy is sitting there saying Montana and Brady couldn't throw down the field or didn't do it with efficiency.

At least that's what he's implying.

Montana made some gorgeous ****ing throws down the field during his career.

Case in point. The battle of turnovers. The team that turns over the ball the least wins the most, generally speaking.

Phillip Rivers is 2-5 because he and his team turn the ball over despite all the amazing down-field throws that he makes.

Yes but Montana didn't make a living chucking the ball down the field. The West Coast Offense is not an "air-em-out" offense.

You miss his point.

Montana was, and Brady has been through most of his career, very effective and efficient throwing the ball downfield, regardless of the limited number of attempts to go downfield.

Damn your old...


but to your previous post, I think it is a valid arguement. I do like how Weis and Haley are slowly growing this offense as a unit and not worried about stats (ala DV)... Each week we see a little more and a little more stuff down the field, but I dont ever recall a Weis team being a martz type of team....


I think by years end, we will have a better attack downfield, but I wouldnt bet the farm on it. Just dont think the OC and HC give two shits about throwing the ball 30+ yards in the air...

I was watching a replay of the bills/ravens game last night... There was a good drive where they were mixing up the pass and run, moving the ball, Then when they got to about the 25-30, 3 straight incompletes to the endzone... Why? What was wrong with the shorter underneath routes that were working the whole drive long? People are enamored with the big play and focus way too much on one persons stats...

Now it was a 46 yard FG instead of moving the ball and eating clock...

Agree completely...

It was cool watching Brady with 10 seconds in the pocket launching a bomb and letting moss go abuse someone for it....

Well I agree that when those guys go downfield they have had better success.

I think Matt could increase his downfield % with a Jerry Rice.

Then again, Cassel throws a long pass down field, Bowe catches it and runs another 15-20 yards into the endzone and it results in a 53 yard TD pass and all we can do here is bitch about the throw.

I think Cassel could improve his downfield % with better accuracy.

Rice doesn't gain the kind of yac he did throughout his career with a QB that constantly forces him to adjust.

Fortunately, I'm seeing Cassel improving in that area.

I really think that was a much better throw than he is given credit for, because a pass that leads Bowe leads him right into the safety.

EXACTLY!!! I tried to point that out during the game but was quickly drowned out by the emotion of Cassel Hate.

Cassel threw that ball to the open spot in the zone. Had he lead Bowe, bowe probably catches it but as you said, the Saftey is right there and probably doesn't miss the tackle since Bowe would have no chance to put on a move.

Try again. The safety was way out of position.

http://i51.tinypic.com/e0ldmp.jpg

I said the same thing in chat.

Ok well seeing that view I agree. Bowe could have walked into the endzone.

You're only seeing the two guys behind Bowe there, but there is a safety sitting in front of Bowe that isn't seen in this screenshot.

Edit:Actually, as you look closer, I think that we see the saftey's shadow on the right lower part of the shot sitting right between the 15 and 20 yard line.