ZMA is the shit
 

Does anyone else here take it? Its Zinc, Magnesium, and B6. I take it right before bed and I get the best sleep ever. Hell, I've even had control of my dreams.

Waking up is super easy and overall I feel more like a man. Check it out if you.haven't already.

Placebo, does nothing, scam.

If Norv takes it, I'm in.

what do you mean, "control of my dreams"?
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So long as it works for him, does it really matter?

STuff never worked for me.

LOL. Mr Pessimism right on time.
A few days ago when I woke up, I remembered my dream completely. I felt like I had control over what I did in the dream. Last night I decided to test it and I told myself I'm going to dream about trains. It sorta worked because I ended up riding a train from Philly to LA in my dream. I don't know. Its weird. I remember so much detail from my dreams since I've started taking it. Very vivid stuff.

He experiments with inception.

I had a dream last night that I was getting mugged and the mugger twisted my arm pretty damn hard. Woke up in the morning and that arm was really, I mean really, sore.

Our minds are powerful entities.

Then there is Matt Cassel.

so, you're taking this as some kind of sleep aid? (sorry if i sound like donger)
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It was recommended to me for muscle recovery (by way of better sleep at night). Nearly every review of it talks about awesome sleep. Check it out.

If you think and believe something is going to make you sleep better it's going to make you sleep better.

I guess I don't believe anything will make me sleep better then, because nothing works with any success.

don't think so, thanks.
my sleep is ****ed up enough w/dreams, walking and talking. if i take something, i want it to knock me out. no dreams at all(that i can remember).
it just interests me when i hear of people talking about their dreams.

like sbg said, the mind is a powerful entity.
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Can you sleep less, or do you still have to sleep the same number of hours?

Not really.

You know exactly what it means.

http://turtlecanyon.files.wordpress....ding-story.png

People claim that is the case. Not for me. I tried getting 5 hours only on the ZMA and I was pretty dead the next morning. It doesn't help you fall asleep either, just gives you a deeper sleep. As far as it being a placebo or hoax, I read a study that it has minimal effect on men's testosterone levels, which it is sometimes marketed for. However, a simple Google search should pretty much put away any doubts that one has about its positive effects on sleep.

Sleep is overrated for recovery. Food quantity/quality is much more important. I don't think I've had more than 5hr sleep/night since my daughter was born 9 months ago, and I still hit PR's. Shit I had 2 hours sleep last week and drove upstate with a buddy for a meet and still hit a 1200 total.

Have you reached level 4 yet? What did you use as your kick to wake up?

ZMA really works, and has been proven to. It's not placebo.

It's not so much that it makes you sleepy, but it relaxes your mind which allow you to fall asleep easier.

No joke I woke up freaking out because I was under arrest, was dehydrated, and the cop was making me drink milk. I don't consume sugars so it freaked me out.

I woke up and my mouth was super dry.

It made my pee turn green.

...if you are deficient in zinc or magnesium

BTW buck...I haven't seen many posts from you lately? What happened?

Work 5 am- 3:30 pm everyday. Then I lift after work til 6ish 3 days a week. I'm usually here on the weekends though.

I'm not taking anything where the creators can't spell the acronym of their own product correctly. :p

Not true, I just looked and there are exactly ZERO studies say ZMA has any effect on anything, and there are well-designed double blind studies showing it has zero effect on testosterone. So the feeling more "manly" is pure placebo. Sleep evidence is all word of mouth (anecdotal). No studies have been done as far as I see pertaining to sleep benefits.
One study had "evidence" that it increased testosterone, but that study was done by ZMA creator, Victor Conte of BALCO infamy. The study has been discredited and has never been duplicated.
But the placebo effect is often just as real for those who feel it. If you believe it's giving you better sleep, then enjoy. Only thing getting hurt is your wallet.

Entertainment for the kids!

Although I do have to say that when I took it in college it DID do something to my sleep (not muscles though). I would go to sleep and wake up super early and I'd be wide wide awake. I had lots of dreams too. It's kind of weird.

And it WASN'T placebo because I didn't even know it was known to mess with sleep at the time (it was right when ZMA came out and I took it for the claimed test upping effects). The effect on sleep was very noticeable and it definitely wasn't a placebo. It took me a few weeks to draw a connection to what was messing with my sleep and it stopped when the ZMA ran out.

Wat?

Get more sleep and you'll be even better?

Can't post...busy controlling dreams!

This sounds similar to my experiences with melatonin, better sleep, more vivid dreams. How do the 2 differ?

Melatonin is a hormone.

ZMA is a combo of Zinc, Magnesium, and B6.

FYI - more than half of Americans don't get enough Magnesium, so that's probably what's causing the effect.
http://www.longislanddiabetes.org/Mi...0for%20ADA.pdf

I've been gluten free for 6.5 years and I still have gluten nightmares, where I eat some bread or something then stop and think "oh, wait!" and hunker down to wait for the pain to start. I am so relieved when I wake up and realize it's a dream. LMAO

Yeah. I have sugar nightmares at least once a week lol.

Any Gaba users?

Whats not to understand? Do you need a consistent 8hrs of sleep to recover? Nope. I've been eating my ass off and sleeping 4-5 hrs/night, and training 5 sometimes 6 times per week and recovering fine. Weights going up every week so whats complicated about that? Am I tired, hell yeah. Nothing a good pre-workout drink can't fix.

It's shit, that's for sure....

http://i48.tinypic.com/30xho2c.jpg

How long have you been training for continuously to this point? Any other PED's besides caffeine?

It would only make you "feel more manly" if you were already deficient in zinc. Then yes, it would help raise natural test levels.

But either way, you're wrong.

http://www.charlespoliquin.com/Blog/...Deficient.aspx

A 1200 total? I hope you're 130 pounds.

Sleep is the most important factor in recovery. You may can pull off a decent training session here or there with lack of sleep, but without a lot of solid sleep growth will be inhibited.

I get asked all the time why I don't post in the fitness and supp threads anymore and it is because of posts like this. The calming effects of magnesium and calcium were well known way back when I was a just a kid which was a long time ago. I am sure you could come up with all kids of examples right here at the planet. About 6 months back Iherb sent me a few complimentary packs to try. A deeper undisturbed sleep is immediately noticeable as well as the ability to sleep longer. I usually can only sleep 7 hours but I can sleep up to 10 hours after taking the product and yes because of that you definately have more dreams you remember. I bought a couple bottles and have turned friends and family onto it and have recieved the same feedback with one even dumping his sleep meds. You certainly will not be bringing a tranquilizer to the party but the effects are very noticeable.

On a supp note I have to say I love using nitric oxide. I got a bottle of vitrix the other day as I was told the product was amazing. It's like walking around at 16 again with a boner. YOu want to **** until you draw back a bloody stub and have unfriggen believably strong orgasms you gotta roll with that combo. I like their t-up product as well with a little reversitrol when cycling down.

Just DL/SQ. Cant bench for another 6 months, just had 3 osteophytes removed from my left shoulders. Not nearly as strong as some of the beasts on this site, but not bad considering the injuries I've been through. Anyway..

I'm sure 8 hours would be better, but I cant remember for the life of me the last time I had that much. Everyone is different and what some people need to grow isn't the same as the next. People respond differently to different types of training, intensity, etc but as long as caloric needs are met, I think people can and will grow off low sleep. Not NO sleep, but 5-6 hours per night should b fine.

Then since you don't get 8, you can't say. I can tell you that when my sleep is top notch, training is too. However as a lifetime insomniac that isn't often.

But you still progress on your lifts as a insomniac, no?

We have a place where I live that specializes in making custom tintures. I had them make one for sleeping and it was like getting hit in the head with a baseball bat. You might want to try that if you are trying to stay on natural products. If you can't find a place that does cusom work like that I could refer you.

so it's the immaculate inception.

I had a similar experience using Plasma Jet from Gaspari, but not a fan of NO products as a whole. I do love me some stims though.

Does it have Yohimbe in it? That stuff always does the same to me.

Then I'm assuming you plateaued long ago and you saying you're still adding weights every week is horseshit. When seriously weight training, sleep is most important factor when building/rebuilding muscle.

The only thing I have from ON is the ZMA

When my sleep is not going well, my training tends to be very up and down, sporadic. When I can get 10-14 days of great sleep in a row, it's off the charts every time.

Recovery happens at it's highest level when you sleep. So even if you have some decent training sessions on little sleep, you'd have even better ones on more sleep. If you can get 10+ hours in plus a nap, watch what happens.....

Yes sir.

liquid-German tribulus

Ment NO- Nitric Oxide.

I am using Nitrix right now.

I'm going to try and sneak a lunchtime nap in @ work and see if it makes a difference.

both weights and bodyweight still going up so far. I'm sure it will plateau eventually though.

If I could I would. I just can't ever actually fall asleep. If I get a nap in on the weekends it's like someone gave me a new body in terms of recovery.

I can't even imagine living like that. You must be aging at an unreal clip. Have you seen a sleep specialist?

I'll give it a try. I've been having a bitch of a time getting any sleep lately.

When I was younger. I go through bouts where I am fine. Fall asleep on my own, sleep all night, etc. Then I'll have 1 night and it all starts from there.

I love sleep, I just can't seem to get as much of it as I want. :(

I've been taking generic lorazapam for years for that effect.

I'll definitely try it unless it's like $30 a bottle...

That's a solid choice. I go back and forth between lunesta and ambien when I REALLY need to catch up.

Dude if I was going to test it my topic of choice wouldn't be trains. WTF?

Maybe just not THAT type of train.

I wanted to test it on something that I never dream or think about.

If you really wanna have vivid, ****ed up dreams....put on a nicotine patch before bedtime. I'm dead serious. It's nuts. For me at least.

Where do you pick it up at?

If you aren't in a hurry I would pick it up on Amazon. NOW is a cheap quality brand.
I take their Omege -3 and CoQ10.

http://www.amazon.com/NOW-Foods-Zma-...ywords=now+zma

I bought it at The Vitamin Shoppe.

What if you don't want to dream about trains? Do they have a version that is about ships and boats?

FAX

I've had dreams where I'm constantly peeing, then I'm like WAKE UP WAKE UP WAKE UP GOD DAMNIT WAKE UP

Then I suggest a water bed and a lovely lady from our BBW threat that likes to toss and turn in her sleep.

Are you okay, Mr. seclark? I mean, this is like the longest post you've ever made in your whole life. Flat gabby today.

By the way, remember her? Ol' Flat Gabby? Quite a girl ...

FAX

Used to experience frequent sleep interruptions due to pain.

Doctor gave me oxycodone...problem solved.

Ahhh great stuff. I've also used low dosed hyrocodone as a sleep aid. Too much of that stuff and it's like line of speed though.