"Alex Smith makes your defense better"
 

Article from Arrowhead Pride. Talks of the apparent positive effects of Smith's game on the defense.

This won't change any minds... Smith-baters have been saying this for a while now, but at least someone put it on paper and put some numbers to it for discussion.

Have at it everyone...

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2015/6...defense-better

If only he could make the offense better.

I remember when Steve Bono was the key to our defense.

When playmakers made plays

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/QjQI9Xzivv8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Dumb

But INT's are the debbil! (you'll need to click the link to read the tables)

http://www.footballperspective.com/g...ons-overrated/

Arrowheadpride.com consider the source.

LMAO

What does BossChief think about this?

:facepalm:......

http://i62.tinypic.com/hrwrhv.jpg

This table shows the points allowed vs QB turnovers in the NFL in the 2014 season. The dot with the circle around it is the Chiefs' data point. The blue line is a trend line. As can be seen, the more turnovers a QB has the more points their defense allows, which in turn makes their defense look worse.

10-12 in his last 22 games

Everyone on here is going to go bitch crazy but not turning the ball over is a big key for you defense.

Don't lose the game is often just as important as trying to win the game.


back to the crying

This all comes down to Alex Smith being smart with the football and minimizing his mistakes. He is just too risk averse and that's what prevents our offense from being explosive imo.

And there's the key sticking point.

Alex is great at not turning the ball over. Awesome....that's just awesome when we're in a close game. But if we're down by 14.....he won't attempt a throw if there's a chance of a turnover. He won't put the team on his back and win the game if it involves a risky throw.

It's all about the "Hidden" points he's scoring. I mean, you can basically add 16 "Hidden" TDs to his yearly totals. He's like the best in the game at scoring hidden TDs that never actually existed. If it weren't for the fact that they were invisible "Hidden" TDs, his TD total would almost be right up there with the best QBs in the league.

How can anyone argue with these "Hidden" points?

Playing to not lose the game=\=playing to win the game. Where have I heard this before?

Without Smith, Justin Houston is a 5-6 sack guy at most.

It's like Vermeil logic all over again...

"Yeah, we gave up 194 yards rushing to their guy, but if you take out the 53 and 71 yarder he got in the fourth quarter, I'd say we did a pretty good job at containing him all day!"

Vermeil could sell a frozen turd to an eskimo. LMAO

Most paths to the Super Bowl are littered with them.

If that probably a league minimum guy.

El oh el

As with all issues, there's an argument both ways. But people have polarized opinions.

Alex Smith DOES help the defense when he's playing good, efficient football. And when Smith is on in efficiency, the Chiefs are a tough, tough team. It reminds me of a hitter who always goes to a full count vs. a hitter that always swings at the first pitch. Sure, a free-swinger will have more chances to hit the ball, but the hitter who works the count wears down the pitcher which is good for the team. The strategy works. Much as people go ga ga over Aaron Rodgers and Brees, Russell Wilson and Flacco and Eli and Big Ben have won lots of playoff games with this approach.

Smith should be criticized for a few reasons... 1) if you're going to manage games this way, you better know how to close games. Smith has been below average at that. 2) you better be consistent. Smith has not been consistent and he seems to manage games even when behind. So no... I don't think Smith suddenly becomes clutch. He can't consistently win big games this way so I don't want to see him improve the defense. He needs to do what he can to build big enough leads that he doesn't have to close games (but not to the point of forcing shootouts).

He sure make opposing defenses look better.

I'm still trying to gauge how Smith helps the defense by how he plays?

If anything.....the defense has to be on point because any **** up and the team is down. And we all know that Smith isn't bringing that team back to win.

You know what I believe?

An offense that doesn't turn the ball over isn't the only key to making its own defense better.

What is huge imo is time of possession. I loved it last year when we played games where we controlled the clock. We just rocked the clock for most of the game and won. That's what we need to do. Create long, sustained drives, grind out and kill the clock, keep the defends fresh and prevent them from wearing down late in games and during the season As well. Folks, I tell ya, it's a smart strategy.

The Chiefs need to be really good at converting 3rd downs. I seriously hope they master the sh*t out of that.

I've said this before... to your point about 3rd downs, when the Chiefs were hot last year, they were converting ~50% on 3rd downs. When they started tanking end of last year, it was something like 25%. It's nice when it works but it's brutal when it doesn't.

But agree on other points... keeps the defense fresher and wears out the opposing defense. Helps you win turnover games -- whereas many high powered offenses might frequently 3 and out, a game management offense often helps you pin the other offense in the 20. I also think there's a lot to be said for swagger. Defenses play tougher when they're respected. And a lot of times defenses unfairly get dinged for giving up a TD because the offense gave them a short field.

Chiefs Offensive Playbook - 2015

PAGE 1 - MACLIN Bubble screen

PAGE 2 - DAT Bubble screen

PAGE 3 - Jamaal anything (refer to Jamaal subsection for options)

PAGE 4 - <strike>Bowe</strike> Kelce quick in

PAGE 5 WILSON Fly pattern (Head coach edit - Real funny, Doug)

PAGE 6 - *insert rookie name* Post pattern

You know what helps your defense the most?

SCORING POINTS.

Having a guy who doesn't turn the ball over but only leads the offense to 17 points doesn't help your defense, it puts even more pressure on them - they now have to hold an NFL offense to 16 or fewer points.

Christ. Why the **** would you post anything from that mega-homer site?

And this defense gives Alex 1 or 2 "hidden" TDs per game.

We had a stretch last year where we had a goal line stand in like 5 straight games. Or how about Ron Parker against Buffalo? Christ, there's at least 4 hidden TDs right there.

What a load of homer garbage.

I love how this assclown even admits that these hidden TD's are "hard to see and prove".

I wonder how many hidden TD's he threw to WR's last year?

19

It's a fine line either way. Too conservative, too much gunslinger.

And I didn't read the article, maybe that's in there somewhere.

Actually, this shook a memory....

In Eli Manning's rookie seasons, Kurt Warner was the opening day starter. Eli of course was awarded the job 2/3rds of the way through the season due to Warner's "lack of production". When Warner's stats were studied, he had completed 17 (iirc) passes between the 5 and the 1 yard line. As we all know, Warner was pulled because the rookie had Manning as a last name.

The 49ers defense really fell off after Alex left.

Matthew Stafford threw 2 times more INT's than Alex, yet Detroit's defense gave up the exact same amount of points per game.

Except that the best scoring offenses in the league tend to have mediocre or worse defenses. Explosive offenses force opposing offenses to be very aggressive, it often leads to small field scores, and it increases your defense's TOP. Sometimes by a lot.

Game management works great if you have the right QB. But as I've said many times before, I don't think Smith is nearly as good a game manager as people think he is.

Using the OP's logic, you know who else makes their defenses so good?

EJ Manuel
Kyle Orton
Carson Palmer
Drew Stanton

Buffalo and Arizona were Top 5 defenses in points allowed per game last season

I think those defenses are mediocre because they're mediocre.

I do think offense and defense are symbiotic, but scoring points makes it easier for a defense in the end.

Don't like the AZ example. That's a defense that is really good regardless of the QB. There are some of those that exist. Buffalo, on the other hand... Orton is a really good game manager. He just has no idea how to finish drives.

I don't think it means you have to go full on Marty Ball. But I think a highly explosive offense is incredibly overrated. I would say the same for Marty Ball except that it gets bashed more than it gets praised. I still believe the model Baltimore used to win their Super Bowl is a sweet spot. Largely game management, but not afraid to make aggressive throws.

He leaves a special "wang" in the kool-aid.

Shorter fields (esp. on turnovers) = more points given up
Larger points = opposing offenses attacking = opposing offenses scoring more
Longer TOPs = tired players in the 4Q, which is when these defenses often fall apart
More points given up = less swagger on defense

I don't promote Marty Ball. But I believe in good balance or a game management philosophy behind a QB who is elite on 3rd downs. A lot of defense is attitude, energy, and confidence. Forcing a defense into short fields, shootouts, or high TOPs isn't going to do that.

"Hidden" touchdowns.......


That stat must be listed next to "Hidden" playoff wins.

They're on the mantle next to his "hidden" testicles.

I can't wait until we see the wide frame still photos of Maclin having 10 yards of separation 50 yards downfield during another Alex checkdown.


Damn I have gotten bitter this offseason.....WTF?

I don't buy into that. Just like I hate when people claim Alex Smith was a game manager in 2013 during the 9-0 start. In 2013, Smith was a shitty QB during that 9-0 run. At the end of 2014, Smith was a shitty QB. You know what the difference was? In the 9-0 run in 2013 and the end of 2014, Alex Smith tried to manage games but had something like a 25-30% third down conversion %. During the Chiefs' impressive stretch in 2014, he was something like 50%. At the end of 2013... who cares, because he wasn't managing games.

Last year, we saw some pretty impressive grinder games from our offense. And we saw ones that were really frustrating to watch. When Alex Smith converts third downs, this team is really good. When he doesn't, they're frustrating to watch but still keep games close.

All 22 gonna' be guuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuud....

It's a team game for a reason. I'd just like to point out, Matthew Stafford has been doing the whole 'gunslinger' think that so many clamor for and it has equated to 2, TWO winning seasons in his career. Smith has 4 consecutive now. Last year, Stafford's defense was better than ours from an all around perspective.

I don't give a damn if the guy can lead the team from behind 17 points if we're never behind much to begin with, which we never have been the last two years. See 2011 49ers as always. The hidden touchdown thing is real, and if you can't see how not turning the ball over on your own 20 doesn't help your team, then you can't see anything.

I do however expect and want Smith to take more shots with the improved cast around him.

I would rather watch a Syfy original movie than see an Alex Smith deep ball

Talk me down PG. I was alright with Alex for a while, and now I am constantly dogging him.


WTF is the deal?

no comment

Sustaining long drives that end in 7, having fewer 3, 4 & 5 play drives that end in punts and generally doing things that keep the defense off the field and rested late in games does a lot more to help, as does building leads and forcing the opponents out of their gameplans. The idea of limiting turnovers is generally something you talk about when you're rationalizing about the performance of a limited player.

It's what I like the most about Luck-win or lose, he's GOING to take some shots.

I'll accept the bad because the good far outweighs it.

I always think this board greatly underrates turnovers, but the QB would help the defense most by sustaining drives and scoring points.

I just can not agree with this.

Brett Favre was the ultimate gunslinger, and his lack of ball security almost certainly cost the Packers numerous opportunities in the playoffs.

Alex Smith is at the total opposite end if the spectrum however.

There is a happy medium.

We want a QB that weighs ball security with calculated risk.

Alex Smith never pushes the envelope, so when the time comes to push, he can't even find it.

This. As much as people want to bash the article, it is true. Alex does help the defense by not turning the ball over. Hell that was even said a few times as a credit to Russell Wilson.

But Alex DOES need to push the ball. While he can help the defense by not turning the ball over, he does hurt the offense at times by not being as aggressive as he should. A risky throw here and there can result in a big play and will also result in the short routes opening up and our playmakers having more room to make plays as well.

Because if it were true. The chiefs would be the top scoring team in football. They are not even close.

he is what he is. A game manager. Never going to beat a playoff quality team when it counts. But wont lose those games to shitty teams either.


he has it in him to be a better player. The denver kc example is perfect of him.

This thread went well. I am proud of you all.

**** off.

If Alex Smith can consistently convert third downs, the strategy would be okay. Not great, but maybe workable. That was by far the biggest difference between the good Chiefs of 2014 and the bad Chiefs.

The Chiefs are built to be a really good game managed team. The problem is Alex Smith is grossly overrated as a game manager. Inconsistent on third downs, not a good closer.

Will comply.

Bad fish?

He's going to have a good season in 2015.

If this team doesn't rape this season, it's on him.

He is very effective about hiding points, that's for sure.

Hopefully Mav will hang out in the game thread this year so he can alert us to whenever Alex scores a hidden TD.

Awesome, that way I can have a hidden celebration.

Like Vermeil's offenses did?

Hidden TD just got added to the lexicon with designed sack! :p

Would like to know who is responsible for designed sack.

Well, they did when a SB.

alex smith

jebus, imagine if we where up by 14 at half, how many ****ing sacks he would have got

yers sir, cause 3 and outs just keep the D warmed up

where was jamal during his up and down stats?

as long as we keep getting sucky Qb's we better hope we get superstud running backs

Yes, exactly like Vermeil's offenses did.

Smart, methodical. He's like a surgeon out on the field.

Who?