Orlovsky on Toney
 

Proves to me that Toney is dumber than we thought he was, and that is no easy feat...

https://twitter.com/danorlovsky7/sta...27971618369895

That's an odd takeaway. It seems like it's just confirming what Andy was pissed off about - the officials typically warn a player and the HC when a player is getting close to being called for it. Andy wasn't pissed because the call was wrong - he was pissed that the refs didn't do the job he expects them to do. If Toney had gotten a warning on this early in the game, they could have corrected it.

Dee Ford his ass outta town

Really out of bounds with that commentary.

Wow

Andy won't make heads roll over this. And frankly it's not our place to tell him what the right course of action is moving forward. He knows best how to manage big problems like this.

But god damn it do I want to see somebody get guillotined. Either Toney, Embree, or Nagy. Or a couple of them.

They're all chumps and they're all easily replaceable. And in Toney's case specifically, I've got the feeling it's going to be addition by subtraction when he finally goes away. And the same could very well be true for the two coaches I mentioned.

I do think though, that if it happened multiple times in the game, why was he never warned, and why didn't they flag him for it earlier? One would hope that if he got nailed for it earlier in the game, he would make it a point not to do that again.

But, he's a grown ass man who's been playing football all his life...he should know better. But yeah, the fact that he did it multiple times without a flag is kinda bullshit too.

Toney's taking his stupidity over the line.

Guy just lacks attention to detail

Former quarterbacks uniting behind Patrick?

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Interesting take from a Super Bowl QB…. <a href="https://t.co/KVTUxUe2Ma">pic.twitter.com/KVTUxUe2Ma</a></p>&mdash; ��������ℂ��������ℝ�������� (@JordanTribe) <a href="https://twitter.com/JordanTribe/status/1734318242443809254?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 11, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

NY Giants fans are laughing that the Chiefs even traded for this guy...

Refs seem to throw flags whenever they feel like it.

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Then I imagine they remember they are NY Giants fans and drive their cars into a river.

Toney is so dumb...

"How dumb is he?"

His rap name should be Tung Choka.

Yeah he's a dumbass and should have known better but if it was so egregious and obvious why no flag until after the 2 min warning in the 2nd half? If he's doing it on purpose because it gives him an advantage then why would he stop after not getting flagged the first few times. Like if it was something that absolutely must be called then why wait

I'm not sure Embree needs to be fired, but I think he's in over his head with this particular group of receivers. If he had a stacked WR room like the Bengals or Eagles, the coach's lack of experience would not be so much of a potential liability for the team. So instead of firing him, he needs to be put into a different role like his old job (quality control or whatever it was). Get a legit experienced WR coach to deal with these guys.

Yes, and lose the receiver-by-committee nonsense. Rice and *gag* Watson are clearly the two best WRs on the roster.

I had calmed down about this, but Dan's work makes it so much worse.
1. Refs have to either warn/call earlier or keep ignoring it.
2. How does our sideline go the whole game and never let Toney know? That's nuts!
3. Toney, come on dude, look at the other receiver.

Refs needs a new response now in light of this video!

I have a feeling if you look around the league you'll see WRs on the blue line A LOT. Clay posted a pic earlier from a Rams game that I can't find now because we have 47 threads on this topic.

I'm not a Toney supporter but the vitriol so many people are spewing at the dude is excessive. Especially when you take into account Orlovsky's evidence that he did it all game with no warnings or penalties. Former players have said they try and get as close as possible to the ball for an edge and that's all he was doing here.. with every indication that it had been fine all game.

The mother ****er has cost the team two games this season, thanks to an inability to perform the most basic functions of his job.

I get the point of view that if he had been doing it all game, the refs should be doing some preventative officiating by giving him, the coaches or Mahomes a heads up about it. I agree with all that. But it's Toney's ultimate responsibility to ensure he's lining up legally by covering the tackle, but not being in the neutral zone. If the guy's spatial awareness is that bad, it's no damn wonder that he can't catch the ball.

Can't believe you downvote all my shit and then post some stupid as **** BS like this

Stupid? How so? Seems pretty logical. And I upvote you all the time for funny sh*t you post. Can't believe you care...

Exactly.

AND, it makes we think that the ref knew it and waited to call it when it actually mattered.

When I went to bed last night, the main thing I was wondering about this game was whether or not Toney had been lining up the same way in earlier plays in the game. Orlovsky's remarks confirm what I has suspected. The Chiefs are right to be pissed off about the fact that the refs waited until later in the game to throw a flag. Now, if the refs had in fact warned Toney or the Chiefs before the flag that he needs to line up differently, that would be another thing, but I haven't yet seen any indication that this was the case.

And then you have to wonder why. This is how conspiracies are born. Dee Ford all over again.

Orlovsky completely throws the officials under the bus and rightly so.

How is this the conclusion you arrived at if he's been lining up there the whole near and never called for it????

Toney might be dumb, but if someone is never corrected one time on it then they keep doing it, are they dumb for continuing to do it???

L take

No they're not. I live here. They think he's a moron but the Chiefs won a SB with him as an important piece. There's nothing to laugh at.

See post #22.

Not only did homeboy line up a yard offsides, and not check with the ref ALL GAME, this is the second game this year the Chiefs have lost that can be pinned pretty much exclusively on him. And you think people should cut him some slack?

I'm sorry - but looking at this. That same line judge saw this numerous times throughout the game - and chose to not call it. How can you call it magically at the last minute?

That one play is magnified because of the circumstances and it sucks but offense as a whole didn't get it done on plenty of other possessions. I get the anger but I just see plenty of other issues on offense besides one play.

Can’t tell on these other plays if Toney is blocking the ref’s vision of the ball like he was on the penalty call. It would be nice to see these plays at the same level view.

Chiefs "get all the calls" being shot down before the repeat!

Do people have this same take on the holding call in the Superbowl?

How about Toney do the job he’s tasked with? In this case lining up so he’s not offside. Dude has been playing football for the greater portion of his life this should be a no-brainer. Why on earth should the ref have to remind any player about this shit? Take accountability and do it right next time. Toney is a ****tard who’s done nothing but cost the team this year.

This. Muthafreakin THIS !!!!!

I really wish people would stop comparing this shit. It's not equal in any ****ing bizarro timeline.

What advantage did Toney get by being ON THE LINE with the football?

Well his job was to rub Kelce's defender. So it could have helped.

I don't understand your question. In the Super Bowl, the Chiefs got two touchdowns running the same maneuver because the defenders didn't hold them. When the defender held our receiver late in the game when our received attempted the same maneuver, the refs flagged it, appropriately. The refs weren't holding the holding call in reserve like they were Billy Martin in the ****in' pine tar game, waiting for the most opportune time to get it called.

If these refs didn't warn the Chiefs earlier about where Toney was lining up, then the fact that they called it late in the game means that they're incompetent. Either because they didn't notice it until then or they noticed it earlier but let it slide before deciding at the end of the game that they aren't going to let it slide.

If the refs gave the Bills a fourth time out at the end of the second quarter. To line up properly, I guess we would have heard about it

Toney will win us the SB

When during the play did the flag come out? Was it thrown quickly after the snap (as it should have been) or later in the play?

I don't have access to the all-22 to answer this question.

The flag was thrown as soon as the ball was snapped.

One penalty had a direct effect on the play. If they don't tug JuJu the whip route is open for a 1st down and he doesn't have to option to the wheel. If the guy doesn't hold the result would have been the same.

Toney lining up 2 inches, yes its to inches from where the ball was spotted, not where Creed had the ball in the pic, had ZERO effect on the play, just like Dee Ford... Both were travesties being held in the Refs pocket for the opportune time.

If it plays out like last season yup.

Sky Moore, MVS, and Toney all key contributors in the playoffs and SB after shitting the bed most of the season.

Well, they also mauled Toney 10 yards off the ball and should have been illegal contact and offsetting.

While I agree with this take, I still blame Toney for lining up offsides on many snaps during the game. You learn how to line up and coordinate with the ref in pee-wee leagues. These are the basics.

So, he thinks he's lining up right all game, exactly like he did on that play, and they don't warn or call it.... That's BS...

I saw that too.

I don't care what the career backup QB thinks, if you line up offsides five times in a game eventually they have to call it. The refs review tape too and the ref could get demoted for not making the call eventually. It isn't the refs fault a 4 year NFL player doesn't understand what the neutral zone is.

No, they should warn you and then call it... If they don't call it the previous 5 times, then it shouldn't be thought of as wrong. This is a pretty easy concept for anyone with a brain.

You can't be serious with the refs being demoted... seriously, if you think that you are not a serious person and obtuse with the history of the league and official making terrible repeated calls.

Oh, as I said in the other thread. The other 11 times this was called this year were on Tush Pushes, where the lineman are gaining an advantage...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="no" dir="ltr">No flag! ����*♂ <a href="https://t.co/qPgPlTaaBR">pic.twitter.com/qPgPlTaaBR</a></p>&mdash; Danan Hughes (@dahughesguy83) <a href="https://twitter.com/dahughesguy83/status/1734389100445094141?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 12, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I don’t remember, it’s kranz a faid troll or donk troll?

This has probably been discussed elsewhere today but I've been super busy and haven't had time to look. What was the crow chanting after this call? I couldn't make it out.

bet he gets 5 snaps in our WC loss

lmao

iTs A pOiNt oF eMpHaSiS

CP went through the same **** after the Dee Ford call, and discovered that offense players are typically allowed to line up close to or on the LOS, some even across, with no flag, and had been for years.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Wow! It’s almost like this exact thing happens multiple times a game, every game, yet has been called on a WR exactly *5 times total in the last 3 years.*<br><br>Reminds me of the Chiefs RT “jumping early” in Week 1… like half the RTs in the league do every week. <br><br>��*♂️��*♂️��*♂️ <a href="https://t.co/Gqn3ccOZda">https://t.co/Gqn3ccOZda</a></p>&mdash; nick wright (@getnickwright) <a href="https://twitter.com/getnickwright/status/1734391758446895322?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">December 12, 2023</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

lol in the episode today Nick said this and the WR guy they bring in (his name escapes me atm) said no it never happens and well would you look at that

Classic #2 take

I'm a baseball umpire and it's like a pitcher that's using an illegal windup with no runners. We don't just let it go and then wait until there's a runner on third and then balk him for it. We alert his coach to it when we first spot it to AVOID balking in a run. It's called preventative umpiring, and is a tool to help manage the game.

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Agree, this actually makes it worse. If he had been on the line multiple times, and we were never warned, which would be typical, and then were penalized in a critical spot. That sucks.

I feel like every person in the media is missing what really makes this call, and the outburst by Mahomes, so important.

You have people saying it was so blatant, the refs HAD to call it. But, last week the DPI against MVS that wasn't called was even more blatant, as the foul actually did directly impact the play, and you had the same people saying it was a judgment call. And that doesn't even take into account how not only was the DPI blatant and not called, but they reviewed the Mahomes late hit penalty, and STILL got it wrong, which is why they CHOSE to not throw the DPI flag. That is not human error, or human nature, that is corruption.

Last week, and now KT lining up illegally all day but not getting flagged until that play, are clear examples of officials purposely manipulating the game.

At the very, very least, those calls in those two back to back games, should have the need for integrity in officiating, and the need for full time officials, as lead topics on every talking head television show, radio show, or podcast.

Dan Orlovsky brings up a good point on ESPN
 

I get it I get it I know KT was offsides and if you look at that in a vacuum you could say it was what it was

BUT

He looked at every snap in that game that KT played and every snap he was lined up offsides just as much as he was on that play. He did it on the second play of the game, several times in the first quarter a few times in the second a coulple times in the third and all that would of have to of happen was him getting a penenty, or getting a warning, just anything so KT would KNOW he was offsides throughout the entire game. for the officials to not throw a flag at all and wait until that exact moment when he had done it a dozen times earlier was just wrong and 100% on them. It like if the center flintched throughout the game 10 times with no call and on a fourth and one with one minute left he does it and they call it. Taking the game in their hands is just wrong, either call it earlier in the game or don't but to know call that many and to ONLY call that one at the end of the game is borderline firing the official.

This needed a new thread.

Q

Yes, let's listen to what the qb who runs out of the back of the endzone still looking to pass has to say.

This is also the "Mahomes is broken" guy.

This is brand new information.

Jesus H. Christ, just move 4 inches back without having to be told to. This isn't rocket science.

Also a play or two before this our receiver got absolutely mauled by the defender before the ball got there, he still caught it (CEH maybe) but no flag for that one. Happened all game. The officiating is clearly biased against us.

JFC.. it is offside not offsides.

League wants a different place for title game. Fans are bored with Arrowhead.

Was Rice...

It's Taylor first game of the year he lined up off the line and started early and nothing was called. Then the next game after Collinsworth ran his pie hole constantly about it the next game he was flagged early and often. If the refs aren't calling it why would the player change what they are doing?

Almost every one-score game in the NFL can be turned on a single play, so I’m not buying the idea we give the refs a free pass just because the offense missed other opportunities. Especially when officiating is atrocious throughout the entire game. It’s too easy to forget last week that before the no call on PI, there was a questionable holding call on a first down scramble near the goal line.

Again, I don’t like Tony as much as the next person but the fact that he did that all game and was lined up offsides at the same point the entire game in the refs never warned him or warned Andy Reed, and then decided to throw the flag with one minute left was absolute BS. If it was the first time that game he had done it or Something along those lines I get it but not when he does it all game and there’s no warning given and they decide to throw it at the end of the game to basically decide the outcome. That’s ridiculous.

This is true. I also wonder why nobody on the Chiefs coaching staff noticed this all game. And surely this is not the first time he's done this. And why is nobody on the coaching staff making certain that he checks with the officials every time?