Texans pay CB Derek Stingley $30m per year
 

…. And just like that, McDuffie being trade bait becomes all the more possible :(

https://www.threads.net/@adamschefte...cUx0nlC61E-Whw

Record deal: Texans All-Pro CB Derek Stingley Jr has agreed to a three-year, $90 million extension including $89 million guaranteed. At $30M base value per year, Stingley is now the highest paid defensive back in NFL history. The CB market has been completely reset.

Deal negotiated by David Mulugheta of Athletes First.

Also, a fully guaranteed deal?

**** the Texans. I bet they did this knowing it would **** us some too.

With all of these ballooning contracts, the reality is that we will likely have to pay one out to our blue chip talents.

And we shouldn’t feel bad about that, especially if we end up signing Trey Smith to a deal worth anywhere near $23m APY :barf:

Give me Trent at $30m over Trey at $23 any day of the week.

While I totally agree with that, there’s not much of a choice there anymore now is there?

We’re backed into somewhat of a corner with Trey.

Trent is one of my favorite Chiefs of the past decade, but gosh damn. $30m gets pretty dangerous I feel, especially for a position where you’re just kinda hoping he stays this good through year eight at most.

Expected after Horn got 25 million AAV from the Panthers. Shitty teams and completely resetting the market go hand in hand.

Bro, this was an assterclass by Houston.

You had the player on cost control for at least two more years. And you gave in to his every desire?

1) made him highest APY by FAR
2) gave him it fully guaranteed
3) gave him the length he wanted to he could hit the market at 28

You’d think this was prime Darrelle Revis we are talking about. But no, just Derrick Stingley Jr.

The Chiefs only hope for getting Trent still in the $25m range is the fact they also have two more years of cheap cost control.

He never made Pro Bowl, so his 5th year option is substantially lower than Stingley’s was going to be.

Just hate how this reminds me of when we almost had Tyreek done and then Vegas blew the cover off by paying Adams.

Ultimately the Chiefs just gave $6.4m total to Jack Cochrane and Nazeeh Johnson combined. So if we have to give that money to Trent now to keep him, hey, he’s elite. I’d do it.

Just frustrating that we seem to put ourselves in this position by not getting serious on extensions until late summer.

Does this hurt chances of retaining McDuffie?

Or does it just hurt chances of retaining McDuffie AND Karlaftis?

I love George, but he’s always felt replaceable to me. He’s more likely to get paid more than he’s worth, and pass rushers can command decent trade comp.

Waited too long, now the Texans became the Browns and screwed over everyone else.

Well this is crap

The Mahomes' contract still has the league playing ketchup

It’s probably more likely that it plays out that way, you’re right.

My guess is they definitely wait for the draft to unfold now and then see where the depth stands. If we come out of the draft with a DL haul, or a CB early, that may lead their hand similar to what happened with Reid and Jaden Hicks.

Now now, if he tears his achilles they can recoup a million american dollars so

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Trent McDuffie rn <a href="https://t.co/BrrLJPBBjb">https://t.co/BrrLJPBBjb</a> <a href="https://t.co/POynBaofQX">pic.twitter.com/POynBaofQX</a></p>&mdash; Jordan Foote (@footenoted) <a href="https://twitter.com/footenoted/status/1901626727027048852?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 17, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Love ya McDuffie but there’s no way we should even think of paying a slot CB who struggles against bigger outside WR1’s $30 million.

Keep drafting CBs... if there is a guy you like the first, go get him.

Veach needs to have that conversation with McDuffie and his agent now.

If McDuffie wants anything north of $25 million you trade him. You cannot pay McDuffie $30 million. You just can’t.

This. All of this. Love Trent's game. Inside he is elite. Can be moved outside in a pinch but if you want $25-30M you can't be getting torched by Mack Hollins in a 1 v 1 match up. AJ, heck, even Court I get it but when I watched him get beat by Hollins I knew he wasn't a CB1.

I get it, I do, but what’s scary to me is I don’t think you can get a first rounder for him.

You might be lucky to get a top-40 selection. Most realistic case, you get a 3 + 4.

Is that worth it?

It’s not like you’re getting a Tyreek haul.

Sneed showed us that teams won’t trade much for a CB they then have to pay top dollar. Ramsey was the only one who fetched a lot, and he was a prototype outside CB.

What about when he was beating up Ja'marr Chase and stealing his lunch money?

The league isn't designed for any CB to be able to shut down any WR at any time. They are all going to have certain matchups that give them trouble.

If you're a player that makes $30 million and you shut down a player that makes $40 million, you've earned your keep.

We need to keep McDuffie. He's the lynchpin of that entire secondary.

That's why I was cringing this weekend when I saw a few different Mocks that had the Chiefs trading away the 63rd to move up for DT Grant and one of the OTs. Draft capital is more important than ever for the rare instances when a trade-up is the right move, but you have to go into each draft with a few aces in your hand.

Exactly.

People have to stop viewing slot CB with negative connotation.

Not having Trent in the slot last year got us torched game after game by players in that position.

If you can’t get at least a 1 or at least a proven starter at LT DE or WR, it’s not worth trading him.

He’s everything you want in a player on and off the field. That “star” role he plays in the secondary is the most valuable piece of a Steve Spagnuolo secondary.

Even Baltimore’s best WR is a slot guy.

Buffalo loves Shakir.

Trent means a lot to our defense when he can be moved around.

Pay Trent, go cheap at outside CB, double-bird Houston for a few more years.

I can help my outside CBs a lot more with safeties when I have McDuffie defending pass and run from the slot.

Contrary to common belief, the Chiefs have struggled mightily to find capable slots. They have been successful developing outside CBs cheap.

The idea of minimizing the value of a 'slot' CB is antiquated as hell, ESPECIALLY in a system like ours.

We'll have an easier time replacing any boundary CB we have than we would what McDuffie brings from the slot.

His ability to stop/start and change directions is without peer. It isn't something I've seen from any other CB in the league and it just leaps off the screen any time you watch him going all the way back to his college days.

It's a truly elite trait and it plays WAY up in the slot. And by having that person there, we take pressure off our LBs, safeties and boundary CBs. We also have far more versatility in what coverages we can use.

Having a guy who gives you B/B+ performance on the boundary with a very specific weakness and also gives you A+ performance at the most important position in the secondary anytime you're in a nickel set (i.e. about 2/3 of our snaps) is MASSIVELY valuable for us.

If you won't pay McDuffie, there's just nobody on the defense worth paying. He's definitely more important than Karlaftis and Bolton.

I'd give him 3/$90 on the back of the current team control with relative ease; hell, I'd take another year on there for 4/$120 million and essentially lock him up for 6 seasons. That gives you you essentially 5/$135 when his fifth year is picked up. Okay -- done. We'll have him through his age 30 season at that point and in all probability he'll have been passed by at least a handful of CBs in terms of AAV before we even hit the extension years.

Or you can wait and see what happens. I mean it hasn't worked out for any team that's gone that route, but maybe we'll be the ones to buck the trend.

(Eds Note: We won't be)

McDuffie got beat by bigger WR1’s. Sutton, Hollins, Brown. If you have to bring in Kristian Fulton to help your star corner play inside as his first option, he’s not worth $30 million.

This feels a lot like the Tyreek situation. We were prepared to give him $25 million and Adams came in and threw a bomb in the market skyrocketing it to $30 million.

If McDuffie is cool with taking what Jaycee Horn got then fine. But if he wants closer to $30 million you trade him. A $30 million CB1 is a true consistent shutdown outside corner. That’s what Surtain and Stingley are. It’s not what McDuffie is.

You’re looking at it all wrong man.

They aren’t moving Trent to protect him.

They’re moving Trent to save the pass defense.

Sneed never once made a pro bowl or all-pro. He was an older player (27) who had known knee issues and wanted elite money. He also was a penalty machine. That’s why he had no market.

McDuffie is only 24, has 2 years cheap left on his rookie contract and was an all-pro.

The trade market for McDuffie would be robust. You’d get value for him.

I’ll add a few thoughts:

- Markets don’t always reset with a top contract. No one followed Cleveland’s lead with fully guaranteed QB money.

- The salary cap growth makes the numbers feel different. Salary was $143m in 2015, $198m in 2020 and $279m in 2025. $30 million now is the same % of the cap as $20 million 5 years ago and $24 million 2 years ago.

- Mahomes and Jones are 1 of 1-type players. McDuffie is elite but there are others like him. You have to consider trades if you can get good value out of him but you also have to consider paying him big money. He improves our defense significantly when he’s out there.

We need to keep him.

It’s gonna come down to McDuffie. It really is. Do you want to still make filthy money at $26 million or do you have to have $30 million?

Veach needs to get this decision done now bc Sauce Gardner is probably gonna get $31 million making it even more untenable.

Get this figured out now Veach.

I think the only "negative" is the rarity of physical attributes needed to play on the boundary. Simply a matter of winning the genetic lottery, just like tackles with 34.75" arms. They may not be more skilled, but there are just so few that have certain key phys attributes, they are just in greater demand.

And the leverage is pretty substantial now.

He makes $2.7 million in base salary this year. So, what, $150K per week as a game check? Nice money, to be sure.

But if you offer him a $40 million signing bonus in what would amount to $100 million or so in effective guarantees....man, that's gonna turn his head.

That's money NOW. In his pocket tomorrow.

Or he can make about $15 million over the next two seasons. He could more than double that tomorrow with the stroke of a pen. And have it in his bank account that evening.

That's gotta mean something.

They moved off Tunsil to pay Stingley.

Eh...they're not more rare on the boundary, they're just different.

First step quickness and ability to change direction (not to mention gear down) are straight up physical traits and they are MASSIVE for an NCB. Every bit as important as length on the boundary.

And there aren't many people that have those at a premier level either. Fewer than there are guys who are 6'2" and can run fast these days.

I just feel like some have an outdated view of what a NCB really is these days. It's not just some guy who couldn't hack it on the outside. Those guys have very rare skills of their own that are unique to them and the position.

There are still people that don't understand a NCB is a starter in today's league.

As suggested earlier, I think this impacts George's second contract with the Chiefs more than McDuffie's. We aren't losing McDuffie.

If George has an elite year (10+ sacks & shitton of pressures) then we gotta do what we gotta do.

But if George has another good/great year and demands elite money, then Veach will explore all options.

Use every situation to the advantage of your team. Just like with Tyreek, we took that situation and capitalized on it. Trent right now is an affordable asset for any team out there and is a hell of a player. If the worst case scenario is a sign and trade, you can manage yourself into a wonderful haul of picks for an up and coming star cornerback.

I’m to the point where I just execute his 5th year option then tag him for a season.

And just start drafting corners every year if this is going to be the going rate.

Yup. That was my point.

Don’t trade the All Pro. Trade the very good player.

Trust Veach to keep finding value at DB around the 1 expensive guy.

Address the pass rush in volume, especially after Jones.

Out of curiosity what do you pay then?

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Another stupid team doing stupid shit.

See if he and his agent wants to stay with the Chiefs or pursue the highest $. If he will take something this off season to an additional 4years/$125 with a $50 million signing bonus. Guaranteed money $75million. He blows out a knee, you are not in cap hell.

But, he will go for the money and go back to the west coast. So this is probably our last year of him on our team. Should get a 1st for him.

I’m not opposed to paying him, but we basically have cheap control until he’s 27 or 28. Not sure it’s wise to lock him up to aged 32 when you look at how long CB stay elite. Now McDuffie looks like a guy who could be really good for a long time.

Do we reach a point where we're too worried about signing a guy? I ask this because when you look at a guy like McDuffie, you have 1 year of cheap, the following year is his 5th-year option, which is cheap all things considered (13.6m), and then you have another year you can play him on the franchise tag for, let's call it probably around $21-22m (it's 20.2 right now), and then you could even exercise that tag again the following year. At no point in the next 4 years would you ever need to approach anything near $30m if you wanted to play hardball with the guy. I think you can, at minimum, be fake in negotiations and use the tag the first year without pissing the guy off. You'd have him locked through his age 27 year. That next year though, tag and cut bait when he's 28.

I'm asking because I've seen...don't pay RB's, don't pay WR's, don't pay interior OL, don't pay off ball LB's, don't pay secondary.

So we should just have a really expensive QB and OT's and a really expensive DL and that's it.

No, but that’s not going to stop me from bitching about it lol

Veach should offer him a 3 year deal barely above the $25 million mark Horn just got. I get these guys want full value but I think he’d sign it bc it’s instant life changing money in his life today and he gets to cash in yet again in 3 years when he’s 27 and still valuable.

Sounds like too good of a deal to turn down.

No player has ever played on a 2nd year tag. They all settled or the player set out the whole season.

That's not an option in our culture.

Does anyone know if this Stingley deal includes the fifth year option?

Cause if so, $30m per year is some serious leg work from the agent. And I think that’s exactly what it was.

But in actuality, it may be like $25m per year over the next five.

Yeah he stays with us but then goes for the money on that last big contract.

Nick Bolton is half of what Tyreek Hill got. Trey Smith is 75% of what Tyreek Hill got. Creed Humphrey is 60% of what Tyreek Hill got. Hell Jawaan Taylor is 66% of what Tyreek Hill got.

It’s good business to keep players at good prices. It’s insane to pay players that are not clearly the best or elite at insane prices or $30+ million.

A couple of things to remember here... one is that Stingley is just a better CB than McDuffie. Two is that Stingley is a great CB on the outside whereas McDuffie plays a lot better from the slot.

There is a differential in value for these guys and I'd argue it's fairly substantial. I don't think people realize just how good Stingley is. He might be the best CB in the game right now.

I don’t think anyone prevents separation better than McDuffie.

Now the length can be an issue at the catch point, but he’s the best pure cover guy in the league I think besides Surtain.

Pretty sure Veach is gonna draft multiple DL with those first 4 picks as insurance and a long term plan.

Hell I kinda hope Veach trades back at 66, picks up another 4 or 5 and uses it to draft 3 DL in this draft.

Good lord - why would you do that?

We have him under control for his age 24, 25 and 26 seasons for about $40 million total.

You're saying give him $75 million for those years before he hits FA at 27? Good lord no. That's just charity.

Even if you start it AFTER next season, you have him at $65 million for those 3 years.

No extension I offer him starts before the '27 season. And if you offer him 3 after that he doesn't hit FA until age 29 so you might as well try to get him in for that 4th year. Getting to FA a season earlier at 29 for a DB isn't worth a ton, IMO...

It has to. There's just no way they tore that year up AND paid him $30 million. Makes zero sense.

They're dumb -- they're not THAT dumb.

Because of his Pro Bowl this year, his 5th year option would've been more like $18 million instead of our $13 million for McDuffie.

So there you’re looking at $27m per year after the first four-year rookie contract for Stingley.

I’d do that without hesitation for McDuffie, and because his fifth year is five million less, you could lump than into the extension to make it look like he’s paid more than Stingley when he really won’t be.

Bc the player is rightfully gonna be pissed off and want his money. These guys are not stupid. They know one play could mean a catastrophic loss of potentially earned money. One Achilles and the contract suddenly changes drastically for a corner.

It’s just bad business that leads to hold outs. He’s eligible to be paid today and is a valuable known quantity that is very important to this team…and per your post, you won’t pay him for another nearly 3 years?

So you’re letting the price get to probably $34 or $35 million and making him wait?

Again these guys are not dumb. He’s a first team all-pro. He knows his value. You think he’s gonna be fine playing upwards of 40+ more games before getting life changing money? I seriously doubt he wants to entail that much risk before making huge money.

Edit: looks like your post in suggesting a deal that is now but added onto the end of his rookie deal account for the 5th yr option. If that’s the case I’m fine with that

Nobody stops other guys from catching the football better than Stingley.

I’ll accept your stance and still raise you that Trent McDuffie specifically is the perfect DB for Spags’ defense.

The blitzing, the safety protection behind press corners outside, all of it makes it so IMO.

If we want to copy the Patriots sustained dynasty, its difficult to justify large contracts to anyone besides the QB.

Actually New England did pay several key players big deals.

The difference with them compared to others was they would set hard lines in the sand, and wouldn’t go past those points. They also would trade key players for a pick even while still seemingly at the end of their primes, especially those who had already been on a fairly high salary.

But off the top of my head I know they paid Gronk, Hernandez, Edelman, McCourty, Hightower. They just never got bent over on a deal.

They weren’t afraid to let a guy see what he was truly worth and many times, it didn’t seem enough for them to leave.

At least we're not going to have to pay Skyy Moore a big contract ammiright

I remember when we signed Carlton Gray to a 5-year, $15 million contract back in the day and everyone said we overpaid.

Who’s laughing now?

Wait, no this isn’t good. Trent? Where are you, Trent?

What a disaster that was.

Yeah, I just don't remember those guys making the highest salary per their positions. Nothing extreme. Gronk would have deserved it at least.

Something I've only seen reported by the athletic is that 89 mil in guarantees includes these next two seasons. The new money guarantee is only 63.5. This is also being shown by spotrac.

Because the guarantees are including the 5th year option but the 3 yr/90 mil doesn't a more accurate portrayal is 4 years 107.6 mil.

Good finds.

So yeah, the pathway to a McDuffie extension that makes sense for both sides is not as steep as it came off with agent reports this morning.

Yeah.

Another way to look at it is this:

After his rookie deal finishes this year the Texans will pay him ~81 mil the next 3 seasons with a 4th year non guaranteed option at 27 mil.

I say Trade him and keep the team young. That’s not what I WANT because of exactly what you said about Trent. But we’ve been in this situation before where we traded an amazing player away and if paid off in the long run.

We need the OL more than a corner.

Clay was right. McDuffie is getting shipped out but not this year. Next year will begin the third lap in Mahomes career. No Kelce and IDK about Andy.

His age and ability, all we need is the right scenario. Team with lots of cap..all in on defense.

Hell. I would defer the pick even and say next year or two years first when time comes.

Teams may be all in depending on the division..say another team is loaded with wr.

We seem to always be behind on the market with our CBs and WRs... we never get locked in before it explodes, I can't tell if it's a ethos that we aren't going to play in that side of the pool or if it's just not recognizing which position group is going to blow up next.

But after Sneed I thought we'd be proactive to get McDuffie done... we didn't do that and now the market is even more bonkers. It's scary to think they might move on...

The only way I trade him is if I’m getting a 1. Or perhaps a proven starter at another position.

But I don’t think that’s going to happen.

Pay him this summer and you’ll still come out ahead by including this fourth year and his fifth year option.

Then explore trading him with a couple years left on that contract, if you want. Could get another 3-4 years of elite DB play and then flip him for a 3rd rounder if they so choose.

I think you can get a top 50 pick + a 4th for McDuffie today as the floor. That may be a top 40 pick.

If we want to keep him, we need to pay him now and add onto the contract to make it a 5 year deal. Keep this and next year cheap then progressively backload it and either redo the contract in year 4 to backload it again or trade him for a day 3 pick or maybe a 3rd (like Thuney)

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunKC (Post 18001938) I think you can get a top 50 pick + a 4th for McDuffie today as the floor. That may be a top 40 pick.

I wouldn't make that trade. Teams overvalue picks too much, IMO.

McDuffie is better than any top 40 pick you're getting. And most 4th rounders are JAGs who only play a few years.