Chiefs Have NFL defenses fully adjusted to the RPO? - Page 2

rabblerouser · 09-30-2022, 08:30 AM

Elements of this discussion are popping up in other threads, so let's discuss it in its own thread?

My opinion :

NFL defenses have caught up with the RPO.

Time for Patrick to really hone his pre-snap reads and start actually going through progressions based on those reads as opposed to reading the safety to determine man or zone and then doing everything else based on what the defense presents once the ball is snapped.

They know what we're doing and have adjusted.

Will Reid toss Bieniemy and go back to his WCO roots and press Mahomes to be even greater?

Or are we looking at another McCarthy-Rogers situation?

Red Dawg · 09-30-2022, 10:22 AM

Hate RPO. Are the only SB winner to use it? I think so.

TambaBerry · 09-30-2022, 10:23 AM

I am really starting to hate EB, he just doesn't have it. The offense is stale, teams know what we're going to do. Get rid of him and bring in a young fresh mind to throw some wrinkles into the team.

rabblerouser · 09-30-2022, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TambaBerry

I am really starting to hate EB, he just doesn't have it. The offense is stale, teams know what we're going to do. Get rid of him and bring in a young fresh mind to throw some wrinkles into the team.

So much this.

OKchiefs · 09-30-2022, 10:27 AM

Unfortunately this thread is a moot point, at least as far as hoping they'll change, because I think it's pretty clear by now that Reid/Bienemy are incredibly stubborn and have no interest in trying to change. You'd think there would be a clear plan and connection between the team building strategy and their offensive strategy (i.e. building a powerful run blocking OL with clear pass blocking deficiencies, maybe switch to a power run game and some more traditional offensive concepts) but that doesn't appear to be the case. They're going to keep doing what they're doing because that's what they do, for better or worse. It certainly works a lot of the time, but we have over a season of evidence now that the offense hasn't quite been the same for the most part since 2020 and they seemingly refuse to adapt.

rabblerouser · 09-30-2022, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosmo20002

It's all rigged, right? What the difference?

It's BORING, you dumb mother****er.

If it's ENTERTAINMENT (watch the Amazon halftime yesterday, they say about Tua's injury "these guys put their bodies on the line to entertain us.")

So ****ing ENTERTAIN ME.

This offense USED to be EXCITING two years ago, you were on the EDGE OF YOUR SEAT wondering "what will they spin next?"

Now?

"Hope it's not a sack or a turnover. Oh...RPO. run out of the shotgun loses a yard. Again."

YAWN
*wet fart*

No one wants to come over and watch the team lose to the Colts because CJ called Matt Ryan a dumb cracker statue.

It's.
Not.
Fun.
To.
Watch.

How come that EXTREMELY SIMPLE concept is so hard for YOU to understand?

Did you eat lead paint chips when you were a kid?

You from Flint MI?

"He we are now, entertain us..."

rabblerouser · 09-30-2022, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OKchiefs

Unfortunately this thread is a moot point, at least as far as hoping they'll change, because I think it's pretty clear by now that Reid/Bienemy are incredibly stubborn and have no interest in trying to change. You'd think there would be a clear plan and connection between the team building strategy and their offensive strategy (i.e. building a powerful run blocking OL with clear pass blocking deficiencies, maybe switch to a power run game and some more traditional offensive concepts) but that doesn't appear to be the case. They're going to keep doing what they're doing because that's what they do, for better or worse. It certainly works a lot of the time, but we have over a season of evidence now that the offense hasn't quite been the same for the most part since 2020 and they seemingly refuse to adapt.

This is the point I was trying to make.

Thank you.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees this.

Brody Wa · 09-30-2022, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sofa King

RPO doesn't work without the run.

Wish we had Jamaal Charles.

I would settle for Kareem Hunt

Best22 · 09-30-2022, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Dawg

Hate RPO. Are the only SB winner to use it? I think so.

The Eagles did it

Wisconsin_Chief · 09-30-2022, 01:33 PM

It has absolutely become stale and predictable, just like the Wildcat and the Pistol and all the other gimmick offenses that have come and gone like farts in the wind. This one lasted a little longer and was quite effective for a good stretch, but it simply is not fooling anyone anymore. It also doesn't help that we have a cabinet full of average to below average JAG running backs that no defense remotely fears. That's probably the biggest issue overall.

Andy has evolved many times in the past, so I'm not sure what's stopping him this time. I truly hope it's not complacency, and I have no reason to believe Reid is ready to phone it in based on all we know about him. If it's because EB has too much control over what we're doing, then that shit needs to be put to a stop immediately and I don't give a damn if it pisses EB off. Put the guy up in the booth with a fake headset and let him ride out his contract.

The most concerning point of view is if they truly think this is the offense Patrick needs to run to be most effective, which I have to trust they aren't foolish enough to believe. It really is a mystery at this point, my only guess is Reid is giving EB and this scheme one more year and then will revamp everything this offseason since this year was kind of viewed as a "retooling" year anyway.

**penguinz** · 09-30-2022, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabblerouser

Plus, this Oline is waaaay more suited to short/intermediate routes and power running, like ISO/Power O, stuff like that.

Not to mention going pro-set/I formation with 22 and 12 personnel would get Hardman off the ****ing field...

AND defenses are so keyed on stopping the deep pass off the RPO, they're susceptible to being gashed by a power running game...and cover 2/cover 3 have always been susceptible to giving up chunks to the TE on seam and wheel routes (Kelce and Fortson in the 12 group!?)

If Andy Reid is just letting Eric Bieniemy "run" this offense, it shows. It's lazy and predictable and they've been running all the same shit they lost the Super Bowl with, and that shows, too.

"RPO. Oh. Defense is keyed pass...here's a delayed handoff out of the shotgun 7 yards behind a run blocking line thinking they're blocking a pass that got changed to a run. Handing the ball to a MEH rb who gets exactly 1 yard on 2nd down.

"Innovative."

I feel like this is happening. Colts game looked like Andy believed the team talent would make up for bad calls and it was near a guaranteed win so he let EB call the game. Would also help tie in with how Mahomes went after EB at half.

htismaqe · 09-30-2022, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wisconsin_Chief

It has absolutely become stale and predictable, just like the Wildcat and the Pistol and all the other gimmick offenses that have come and gone like farts in the wind. This one lasted a little longer and was quite effective for a good stretch, but it simply is not fooling anyone anymore. It also doesn't help that we have a cabinet full of average to below average JAG running backs that no defense remotely fears. That's probably the biggest issue overall.

Andy has evolved many times in the past, so I'm not sure what's stopping him this time. I truly hope it's not complacency, and I have no reason to believe Reid is ready to phone it in based on all we know about him. If it's because EB has too much control over what we're doing, then that shit needs to be put to a stop immediately and I don't give a damn if it pisses EB off. Put the guy up in the booth with a fake headset and let him ride out his contract.

The most concerning point of view is if they truly think this is the offense Patrick needs to run to be most effective, which I have to trust they aren't foolish enough to believe. It really is a mystery at this point, my only guess is Reid is giving EB and this scheme one more year and then will revamp everything this offseason since this year was kind of viewed as a "retooling" year anyway.

The RPO gives Mahomes a TON of control. In fact, it's probably a big reason we don't run the ball as often.

Chief Pagan · 09-30-2022, 01:45 PM

Why does KC need RPO to give Mahomes a ton of control and take advantage of his skills?

Why can't he just line up, survey the field, and audible?

Chief Pagan · 09-30-2022, 01:47 PM

I've always been puzzled why KC didn't use more no huddle. They seemed good at it.

OKchiefs · 09-30-2022, 01:50 PM

Maybe my memory is off, but didn't KC use a hell of a lot more pre-snap motion when Smith was here? Would love to get back to that for one thing.

htismaqe · 09-30-2022, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OKchiefs

Maybe my memory is off, but didn't KC use a hell of a lot more pre-snap motion when Smith was here? Would love to get back to that for one thing.

One of the talking heads (I think maybe Chris Simms) said that the Chiefs aren't using motion effectively. It's basically just a way for them to determine man vs. zone and they're just kind of doing it robotically.

09-30-2022, 08:30 AM
rabblerouser left blank intentionally Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Belize Nuts Casino cash: $4694897	Have NFL defenses fully adjusted to the RPO? Elements of this discussion are popping up in other threads, so let's discuss it in its own thread? My opinion : NFL defenses have caught up with the RPO. Time for Patrick to really hone his pre-snap reads and start actually going through progressions based on those reads as opposed to reading the safety to determine man or zone and then doing everything else based on what the defense presents once the ball is snapped. They know what we're doing and have adjusted. Will Reid toss Bieniemy and go back to his WCO roots and press Mahomes to be even greater? Or are we looking at another McCarthy-Rogers situation?
Posts: 32,166

09-30-2022, 10:22 AM	#16
Red Dawg Going home eventually Join Date: Dec 2002 Casino cash: $4782858	Hate RPO. Are the only SB winner to use it? I think so. __________________ If you're not first you're last!
Posts: 30,361	1 0

09-30-2022, 10:23 AM	#17
TambaBerry MVP Join Date: Jan 2013 Casino cash: $1705541	I am really starting to hate EB, he just doesn't have it. The offense is stale, teams know what we're going to do. Get rid of him and bring in a young fresh mind to throw some wrinkles into the team.
Posts: 10,598	3 0

09-30-2022, 01:33 PM	#24
Wisconsin_Chief MVP Join Date: Aug 2019 Casino cash: $2040400	It has absolutely become stale and predictable, just like the Wildcat and the Pistol and all the other gimmick offenses that have come and gone like farts in the wind. This one lasted a little longer and was quite effective for a good stretch, but it simply is not fooling anyone anymore. It also doesn't help that we have a cabinet full of average to below average JAG running backs that no defense remotely fears. That's probably the biggest issue overall. Andy has evolved many times in the past, so I'm not sure what's stopping him this time. I truly hope it's not complacency, and I have no reason to believe Reid is ready to phone it in based on all we know about him. If it's because EB has too much control over what we're doing, then that shit needs to be put to a stop immediately and I don't give a damn if it pisses EB off. Put the guy up in the booth with a fake headset and let him ride out his contract. The most concerning point of view is if they truly think this is the offense Patrick needs to run to be most effective, which I have to trust they aren't foolish enough to believe. It really is a mystery at this point, my only guess is Reid is giving EB and this scheme one more year and then will revamp everything this offseason since this year was kind of viewed as a "retooling" year anyway.
Posts: 7,084	1 0

09-30-2022, 01:45 PM	#27
Chief Pagan Sometimes it's black and white Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: California Casino cash: $3784900	Why does KC need RPO to give Mahomes a ton of control and take advantage of his skills? Why can't he just line up, survey the field, and audible? __________________ Sometimes.
Posts: 6,138	1 0

09-30-2022, 01:47 PM	#28
Chief Pagan Sometimes it's black and white Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: California Casino cash: $3784900	I've always been puzzled why KC didn't use more no huddle. They seemed good at it. __________________ Sometimes.
Posts: 6,138	1 0