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Old 01-20-2019, 09:33 PM  
Iconic Iconic is offline
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Why is Mahomes incapable of running a 4 minute offense

Yeah yeah yeah defense sucks ass and Mahomes got us to OT. Cool, I don't give a flying ****. Mahomes and Andy have serious ****ing issues they need to fix. And to be frank I think it's a Mahomes issue more than an Andy one. He seems obsessed with the deep ball even when we very clearly don't need it or want it. Like he literally threw bomb after bomb on our second to last drive and one of those bombs almost got picked.

I love Mahomes as much as anyone else, but I'm hoping this isn't some weird Favre like bullshit that plagues his career forever. Hopefully Andy can drill him into being a smarter QB.
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Old 01-21-2019, 07:43 PM   #196
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Is it more likely that the chiefs' offense could deliberately choreograph a drive that incorporates, say, 9-yard routes, then subsequent 1-yard runs for first downs, that adequately runs the clock and forces NE to burn their TOs? Yes. That seems like something that can be achieved.
Some team would already have shown this is possible to be executed.

It's not possible.

There are too many bad things that can happen. Your execution needs to be too precise for this to be a repeatable offensive strategy.

You can't have one bad block on a running play.

You can't have a dropped pass.

You can't have a ball slightly overthrown.

When you're down you can't think about burning clock. You just have to think about finding the open man and hitting him, whether it's a 5-yard gain or a 20-yard gain.

You can't sit there and say "oh shit that man is open 25 yards down the field, but I only need five yards on this play."
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Old 01-21-2019, 07:44 PM   #197
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Someone just made that analogy.

It's a terrible analogy that makes no sense.

You can't do that in football.

A football possession is not the same thing as a basketball possession.
Sorry, I missed that one. Its obviously not quite as simple as the basketball analogy, because you have to keep getting first downs in order to keep possession. I can admit that its not easy, particularly when ball control isn't a normal part of the offense, but my only point is we have a better chance of Pat getting first downs and milking the clock rather than putting one of the worst defenses ever against the best QB ever with the game on the line.

But the offensive philosophy was wrong on that second to last drive. I'm not mad about the Watkins play because they needed to get a first down at that point, and once we were in the red zone we did the right thing and ran the ball, which happened to score a TD. But the two previous plays were two deep balls, one to Watkins that drew the pass interference and then one to Tyreek in the endzone that was almost picked off. The level of urgency on those plays was not appropriate to the situation, we didn't need to be chucking balls into the endzone with 3 minutes on the clock.

I'm not a Reid hater but it really felt like the coach didn't understand the amount of time that was left in the game. We DID NOT NEED TO SCORE RIGHT AWAY, there was plenty of time and timeouts. And saying that the only other choice is to give Williams the ball up the middle is a false choice. We had one of the most creative offenses all year, with jet sweeps, run-pass option plays, actual option plays, screen passes. There are other options between passing the ball deep and running Williams up the middle.
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Old 01-21-2019, 07:47 PM   #198
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There are other options between passing the ball deep and running Williams up the middle.
And the Patriots had those options covered.

They didn't send every receiver deep on those plays.

Would you rather Pat take a sack than try to hit the guy who's actually open?

You can't play small ball when you're down.

That leads to 7-minute Alex Smith drives and pointless TDs to Albert Wilson with 2 minutes left.

You just have to go score.
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Old 01-21-2019, 07:48 PM   #199
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If that were at all true the offense would have scored a lot more than zero ****ing points in the first half.
It's amazing how schizo that game was. We had 7 in the 1st half, but Pat overthrew it.

Andy had designs on something in the 1st half, and it went horribly wrong.

NE's D was fresher obviously in the 1st half, but it's still bizarre.

Amazing how much there is to consider, like if our offense had aired-it-out from the jump.

That's why we love the game!
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Old 01-21-2019, 07:52 PM   #200
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Some team would already have shown this is possible to be executed.

It's not possible.

There are too many bad things that can happen. Your execution needs to be too precise for this to be a repeatable offensive strategy.

You can't have one bad block on a running play.

You can't have a dropped pass.

You can't have a ball slightly overthrown.

When you're down you can't think about burning clock. You just have to think about finding the open man and hitting him, whether it's a 5-yard gain or a 20-yard gain.

You can't sit there and say "oh shit that man is open 25 yards down the field, but I only need five yards on this play."
I think it's possible.. players would obviously be told to kneel at a certain point on the field if the opposing team were wanting to let us score.

Gurley did that twice this year that i remember.
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Old 01-21-2019, 07:55 PM   #201
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you wouldn't design a play with an option 25-yards deep, other than for that player to be a decoy... you don't think opposing Ds would almost be happy to allow 5, 7 or 9-yard plays, until the whole charade was widespread, then it would get even more interesting.
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Old 01-21-2019, 07:56 PM   #202
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Originally Posted by Rivaldo View Post
It's amazing how schizo that game was. We had 7 in the 1st half, but Pat overthrew it.

Andy had designs on something in the 1st half, and it went horribly wrong.

NE's D was fresher obviously in the 1st half, but it's still bizarre.

Amazing how much there is to consider, like if our offense had aired-it-out from the jump.

That's why we love the game!
Which is exactly why you score when the opportunity is there regardless of time on the clock, you don’t know when or if the opportunity will come again.
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Old 01-21-2019, 08:00 PM   #203
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you wouldn't design a play with an option 25-yards deep
bring back the cassel era

you people
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Old 01-21-2019, 08:01 PM   #204
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And the Patriots had those options covered.

They didn't send every receiver deep on those plays.

Would you rather Pat take a sack than try to hit the guy who's actually open?

You can't play small ball when you're down.

That leads to 7-minute Alex Smith drives and pointless TDs to Albert Wilson with 2 minutes left.

You just have to go score.
We lost the same way against the Pats though last time, and I remember having the same arguments with people after the game. Its just a difference in philosophy I suppose. I've seen Brady and Manning absolutely play "small ball", if by small ball you mean trying to orchestrate long drives to score at the end of the game. I think Pat absolutely could do the same thing, but he isn't being coached properly because sadly Reid doesn't seem to believe in situational football. Again I love Reid and I think the good outweighs the bad with him, but this does seem to be a real deficiency in his coaching from what I can tell.
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Old 01-21-2019, 08:01 PM   #205
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I think it's possible.. players would obviously be told to kneel at a certain point on the field if the opposing team were wanting to let us score.

Gurley did that twice this year that i remember.
The Rams were AHEAD when that happened.

Literally no team in NFL history has done what people are advocating in this thread.

I'm sure teams have gotten the ball with four minutes and scored the game winner with a few seconds left, but it wasn't by design.
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Old 01-21-2019, 08:02 PM   #206
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I think you do know. This offense was prolific.

Last edited by Rivaldo; 01-21-2019 at 08:02 PM.. Reason: @raiderhader
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Old 01-21-2019, 08:02 PM   #207
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A quick scoring offense is a byproduct of having a poor line. If you can't consistently get rushing yards or give the passing game time to run routes, you can't have those kind of long, time consuming drives that end in tds.

Brady was able to have those kind of drives all game and since we already had a bad defense, it led to them also being exhausted at the end of a game. Sometimes you need the offense to grind out some time to get the defense some rest.
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Old 01-21-2019, 08:02 PM   #208
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I think it's possible.. players would obviously be told to kneel at a certain point on the field if the opposing team were wanting to let us score.

Gurley did that twice this year that i remember.
With the lead
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Old 01-21-2019, 08:05 PM   #209
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The way the Patriots were playing defense it's almost impossible to get small chunks and have 12-15 play drives.

They were inviting the big play with the way they were playing defense, with sell out blitzes and aggressive man coverage.

Trying to dink and dunk down the field plays right into their hands.

You just have to rape their blitzes and hope your defense gets a stop.

In our case our defense DID get a stop, Dee was just offsides.

That doesn't mean the offensive philosophy was wrong.
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Old 01-21-2019, 08:07 PM   #210
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bring back the cassel era

you people
all this abstraction is fun

a competent D would likely eliminate the need for all this machination ha

I still think it's not totally absurd.

Get 2 1st downs via 4 plays designed to do exactly that, you're at the 2 minute warning at approximately midfield

after that lol it gets goofy
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