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Old 09-26-2013, 06:07 AM  
the Talking Can the Talking Can is offline
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Chiefs' offense: "one of the worst in the league, by nearly every measure"

http://www.arrowheadpride.com/2013/9...chiefs-offense

some numbers to chew on from arrowhead pride

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The Chiefs are actually 12th in the league in PPG, at 23.7. But if you take away the 14 points the defense is directly responsible for, that number drops to 19 PPG, which would be tied for 23rd - with the Raiders. The Chiefs are relying on the defense to score points, which isn't good. Defensive scoring is random and shouldn't be part of the game plan. They didn't need Tamba Hali's pick-6 to beat the Jaguars, but they did need Eric Berry's against the Eagles.

They also are just not moving the ball; their 333 yds/gm is 21st in the league and their 4.9 yds/play ranks 25th. "Well Kyle," you may ask, " if the Chiefs offense is so bad, how are they undefeated this year?" That's an excellent question, thank you for asking. The answer is that the defense and special teams are much, much better than we thought.
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The problem the Chiefs are having is getting to the Red Zone in the first place. They're 30th in yards per drive, with only Tampa Bay and Jacksonville behind them, and Cleveland directly in front of them (not good company to be in). This is a really, really bad offense. But here's the real kicker: the Chiefs' offense has the best starting field position in the NFL this year, and still can't score.
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The Chiefs average 17 yards per drive better field position than their opponents (ok, ok, 16.95), the best mark in the NFL (2nd table). Only two other teams average more than 10 yards better starting field position than their opponents (New England and Chicago). The Chiefs' average starting line of scrimmage (LOS) is their own 36.97 yard line (best in the NFL), while their opponents average starting LOS is their own 20.02 yard line (also best in the NFL). What all of that means is the Chiefs's offense is handed consistently great starting field position and can't do anything with it, then they let the special teams pin opponents deep in their own territory. The defense bails out the offense by not letting opponents move the ball, giving the offense the ball back with great starting field position. Lather, rinse, repeat.
There's a nice breakdown of our defense against philly over there as well:
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2013/9/2...p-kelly-eagles

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I have to reiterate and emphasize just how much the Chiefs played man to man -- like a ton of it. And they have the secondary to handle it, unlike most teams in the NFL. Specifically, they matched up Sean Smith on Cooper a lot on the outside. If this had been a prize fight, Cooper's corner would have thrown in the towel somewhere around the middle of the second quarter. Smith owned him right up until the end of the game when he started cramping up. Cooper just couldn't shake him, especially on those aforementioned deep routes Kelly had him running all game.

Last edited by the Talking Can; 09-26-2013 at 06:49 AM..
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:35 PM   #946
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The dropped picks crap is comletely reeruned.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:35 PM   #947
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Originally Posted by Bearcat View Post
Yeah, mediocrity rules in the regular season. It seems to fool a lot of people, or maybe they just really like regular season wins. You have to put up points in the playoffs, which usually means your quarterback has to step up.
Putting up a lot of points fools a lot of people too.

It doesn't explain the Jets coming really damn close to a Super Bowl two years straight. Or the 49ers being a goat performance away from an NFC conference championship. Or a Jim Caldwell offense ripped on by this board for being too conservative winning a Super Bowl. Or an extremely efficient Eli Manning offense winning his first Super Bowl.

It also doesn't explain why many of the explosive QBs have had such mixed success in the playoffs.

Putting up points isn't the only pre-req for postseason success.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:36 PM   #948
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Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 View Post
What's stupid about it? There are people insisting that a game management approach is such a terrible thing. And yet, we see teams like the 2011 49ers, two years of the fighting Mark Sanchez's, and right now an absolutely elite team in Seattle make deep playoff runs off of this model. Regardless of Wilson's ceiling, he is probably going to be a favorite to make a deep playoff run NOW off a largely game management approach.

I'm not saying it's ideal. Again, I don't know if Smith can consistently make big 4th quarter plays the way Eli and Flacco have. But the knock on this approach is a little bit silly, because there are plenty of times who have had big postseason success with it.
It's pretty ****ing easy to see the stupidity:

How many of these game managers won the ****ing SB? OK. "Oh, but the Chiefs suck shit and winning in the playoffs would be good enough."

Yeah, no ****ing shit that it's an improvement. Is that the bar now? Or our the Chiefs actually expected to build to something? Accomplish something? If the goal is to replicate the "success" of the 90s, my bad.

If Alex ****ing Smith were a second-year player right now, we'd all be ecstatic. He's not. We're not. He's ****ing mediocre.

And don't ****ing compare him to E. Manning or Flacco again. Ridiculous, even in the most tangential sense.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:37 PM   #949
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Originally Posted by O.city View Post
It was brought up earlier in a thread, not sure which one, but that Smith has thrown passes that should have eben picked, which is true.

But I just saw a stat on Twitter that EJ Manual and Luck lead the league with 6 should be INTS apiece. Thats pretty crazy.
Holy ****ing shit. Smith is comparable to a second-year player and a n00b? Smith must be a complete sack of shit.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:38 PM   #950
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Originally Posted by DeezNutz View Post
Holy ****ing shit. Smith is comparable to a second-year player and a n00b? Smith must be a complete sack of shit.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:38 PM   #951
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Great teams win in the playoffs. Elite offenses paired with average defenses or vice versa.


You can't win with an elite offense and shit defense, or an offense that is shit and an elite defense very often. Unless you have a guy like Rodgers just get on an ungodly level, which is extremely rare.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:39 PM   #952
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Originally Posted by HonestChieffan View Post
The sob cant block worth a shit. He has added zero to the oline and needs to die. We need geno
ok thanks now back to DC
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:40 PM   #953
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Originally Posted by DeezNutz View Post
Holy ****ing shit. Smith is comparable to a second-year player and a n00b? Smith must be a complete sack of shit.
I don't know what the **** your problem is tonight, but I wasn't making a case of Smith vs those two at all. I was just posting that 6 seemed pretty high.

Excuse me.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:43 PM   #954
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Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 View Post
Putting up a lot of points fools a lot of people too.

It doesn't explain the Jets coming really damn close to a Super Bowl two years straight. Or the 49ers being a goat performance away from an NFC conference championship. Or a Jim Caldwell offense ripped on by this board for being too conservative winning a Super Bowl. Or an extremely efficient Eli Manning offense winning his first Super Bowl.

It also doesn't explain why many of the explosive QBs have had such mixed success in the playoffs.

Putting up points isn't the only pre-req for postseason success.
All of your examples include top 5 defenses, so that's the explanation. But, those elite defensive teams still need to put up points in the playoffs, and the easiest way to do that is with elite quarterback play.

A lot of explosive quarterbacks have mixed success in the playoffs because they're all playing each other in the playoffs every year, or they're playing top 5 defenses. If the Chiefs' efficient/game management offense can put up 35 points when it's needed, awesome, because they're going to need it as long as Peyton Manning is in the division and if they ever want to go deep into the playoffs.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:44 PM   #955
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Originally Posted by O.city View Post
I don't know what the **** your problem is tonight, but I wasn't making a case of Smith vs those two at all. I was just posting that 6 seemed pretty high.

Excuse me.
No offense meant your way, dude.

I'm totally ****ing done with reading any excuses and/or justifications for Smith's mediocrity, and the obfuscation of this fact by some is ridiculous. At this point, just own it: Smith might not be good enough, but he's good enough for me.

Your post was simply a starting place. I'm not saying you believe any of the above, necessarily.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:45 PM   #956
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It's pretty ****ing easy to see the stupidity:

How many of these game managers won the ****ing SB? OK. "Oh, but the Chiefs suck shit and winning in the playoffs would be good enough."

Yeah, no ****ing shit that it's an improvement. Is that the bar now? Or our the Chiefs actually expected to build to something? Accomplish something? If the goal is to replicate the "success" of the 90s, my bad.

If Alex ****ing Smith were a second-year player right now, we'd all be ecstatic. He's not. We're not. He's ****ing mediocre.

And don't ****ing compare him to E. Manning or Flacco again. Ridiculous, even in the most tangential sense.
Ben Roethlisberger and Tom Brady won their first Super Bowl as game managers. Eli Manning won his first Super Bowl as a game manager. Joe Flacco has won a ton of playoff games as a game manager and won a Super Bowl last year as a game manager.

I haven't compared Alex Smith to these guys. Again, I said the difference between these guys and Smith is they played largely game management, but made big plays in big situations. Smith hasn't proven he can do that, but he also hasn't proven he can't. Why couldn't he be a guy that has a knack for uninspiring play but comes up big in big games? If not for a complete goat performance by Kyle Williams, the 49ers could very well have been on their way to a 2011 Super Bowl. Mark Sanchez, who played pretty much Alex Smith football his first two seasons, was extremely close to getting there too.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:47 PM   #957
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Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501 View Post
Ben Roethlisberger and Tom Brady won their first Super Bowl as game managers. Eli Manning won his first Super Bowl as a game manager. Joe Flacco has won a ton of playoff games as a game manager and won a Super Bowl last year as a game manager.

I haven't compared Alex Smith to these guys. Again, I said the difference between these guys and Smith is they played largely game management, but made big plays in big situations. Smith hasn't proven he can do that, but he also hasn't proven he can't. Why couldn't he be a guy that has a knack for uninspiring play but comes up big in big games? If not for a complete goat performance by Kyle Williams, the 49ers could very well have been on their way to a 2011 Super Bowl. Mark Sanchez, who played pretty much Alex Smith football his first two seasons, was extremely close to getting there too.
And how old were these players in paragraph one when they accomplished said things? OK. (And Flacco won as a "game manager." lol.)

I don't want to hear it. That's standing in the basement, talking about Smith's ceiling, claiming that it's good enough.

I ****ing hate the acquisition of Alex Smith and everything that it represents for the price that the Chiefs paid.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:48 PM   #958
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Sorry but the intellectual dishonesty with Eli and Flacco's Super Bowls is embarrassing.

These guys were doing things that Alex flat out does not do during their SB runs.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:48 PM   #959
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I'm not really sure what the age of said players has to do with it. Zilla isn't saying anything about Smith being or having the same ceiling as said guys.
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Old 09-26-2013, 07:49 PM   #960
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Originally Posted by DeezNutz View Post
No offense meant your way, dude.

I'm totally ****ing done with reading any excuses and/or justifications for Smith's mediocrity, and the obfuscation of this fact by some is ridiculous. At this point, just own it: Smith might not be good enough, but he's good enough for me.

Your post was simply a starting place. I'm not saying you believe any of the above, necessarily.
I am not a fan of Alex Smith by any stretch. I am just saying the idea that a game managed team can't make a serious run at a Super Bowl is completely crazy talk. Or that they are any less of a contender than an explosive team like New Orleans or Green Bay, that are so explosive that they can't play defense, is crazy talk.
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